Anent the decision to select the Beretta 92FS to replace the M1911a, Persnickety recapitulates much of what I’d heard about the “contest,” and concludes: “Some excellent guns such as the Glock 17 and Ruger P85 came out just a few years too late to be in that contest, and possibly win it.”
It is INCONCEIVABLE that the firearms experts of the Department of Defense were unaware of the Glock 17 and the Ruger P85 as they were in development, so when they precipitated this “competition” in 1985 to select a new handgun for the U.S. military they likely did so to *avoid* consideration of alternatives – particularly from Glock – which would almost certainly prove superior to the Beretta design.
Had they waited a few years (and it’s entirely likely that they could’ve done so, correct?), is it reasonable to suppose that, considering the probability of one among the “just a few years too late” designs being capable of walking away with the win, the bureaucrats would’ve been obliged to select a weapon superior in reliability, accuracy, ease of use, flexibility and robustness?
Now as then, I’ve got to wonder which and how many officers of our federal government got “sweeteners” from Brescia, and of what dollar-denominated values.
Francis Marion
February 4, 2016 10:03 am
I don’t like Glocks ergonomically but I’ll admit that in terms of reliability they are one of if not ‘the’ king of the hill.
Regarding the Beretta it is the simplest pistol on the market to disassemble and clean. Anyone with an IQ over 75 can pull it apart in a second which means it passes the idiot test for military purposes. In terms of durability and reliability it is the perfect pistol for a government program as extensive use and abuse means lots of parts which keeps contractors and manufacturers busy and wealthy.
But since I am not an American this is all just speculation. Just trying to think like a corrupt bureaucrat whose brother-in -law works for the manufacturer. 🙂
Rdawg
February 4, 2016 10:04 am
Hands up, don’t fuck!
DRUD
February 4, 2016 11:18 am
llpoh, never heard of Simo Hayha, but he was definitely a badass. Reminded me instantly of Richard Harrow from Boardwalk Empire. He was by far the best character on that underrated show.
@Francis, the P226 and Glock 17 are both faster and easier to disassemble in my book, with fewer separate parts to worry about. Yes, I own examples of both and the Beretta.
Also, the Beretta 92 is known for cracking locking blocks at 10-20k rounds and often cracking frames at 30k. The locking block is an easy but not cheap ($60+) replacement, while the frame means the pistol is toast. Many people have P226’s and G17’s still going strong at 50k rounds and up. I’ve read personal reports of a Sig at 70k and a G17 at 100k with no major part breakages. (Of course springs need to be replaced regularly and small parts can break.)
The Beretta 92/M9 won the mud test in Army tests. Ironically the SEALs around the same time chose the Sig P226, and you would think that SEALs know something about mud. I expect that someone in the Army liked Beretta (make your own inferences) or the styling of the pistol better.
Anent the decision to select the Beretta 92FS to replace the M1911a, Persnickety recapitulates much of what I’d heard about the “contest,” and concludes: “Some excellent guns such as the Glock 17 and Ruger P85 came out just a few years too late to be in that contest, and possibly win it.”
It is INCONCEIVABLE that the firearms experts of the Department of Defense were unaware of the Glock 17 and the Ruger P85 as they were in development, so when they precipitated this “competition” in 1985 to select a new handgun for the U.S. military they likely did so to *avoid* consideration of alternatives – particularly from Glock – which would almost certainly prove superior to the Beretta design.
Had they waited a few years (and it’s entirely likely that they could’ve done so, correct?), is it reasonable to suppose that, considering the probability of one among the “just a few years too late” designs being capable of walking away with the win, the bureaucrats would’ve been obliged to select a weapon superior in reliability, accuracy, ease of use, flexibility and robustness?
Now as then, I’ve got to wonder which and how many officers of our federal government got “sweeteners” from Brescia, and of what dollar-denominated values.
I don’t like Glocks ergonomically but I’ll admit that in terms of reliability they are one of if not ‘the’ king of the hill.
Regarding the Beretta it is the simplest pistol on the market to disassemble and clean. Anyone with an IQ over 75 can pull it apart in a second which means it passes the idiot test for military purposes. In terms of durability and reliability it is the perfect pistol for a government program as extensive use and abuse means lots of parts which keeps contractors and manufacturers busy and wealthy.
But since I am not an American this is all just speculation. Just trying to think like a corrupt bureaucrat whose brother-in -law works for the manufacturer. 🙂
Hands up, don’t fuck!
llpoh, never heard of Simo Hayha, but he was definitely a badass. Reminded me instantly of Richard Harrow from Boardwalk Empire. He was by far the best character on that underrated show.
http://boardwalkempire.wikia.com/wiki/Richard_Harrow
@Francis, the P226 and Glock 17 are both faster and easier to disassemble in my book, with fewer separate parts to worry about. Yes, I own examples of both and the Beretta.
Also, the Beretta 92 is known for cracking locking blocks at 10-20k rounds and often cracking frames at 30k. The locking block is an easy but not cheap ($60+) replacement, while the frame means the pistol is toast. Many people have P226’s and G17’s still going strong at 50k rounds and up. I’ve read personal reports of a Sig at 70k and a G17 at 100k with no major part breakages. (Of course springs need to be replaced regularly and small parts can break.)
The Beretta 92/M9 won the mud test in Army tests. Ironically the SEALs around the same time chose the Sig P226, and you would think that SEALs know something about mud. I expect that someone in the Army liked Beretta (make your own inferences) or the styling of the pistol better.
http://pamelageller.com/2016/02/radicalized-muslim-migrants-gang-rape-unconscious-teen-she-has-nothing-to-complain-about-women-must-obey-men.html/