Illegal Immigration: How to control it
This may be the most hopeless Muck’s Minute you will see here on TBP.
The subject is, of course, illegal immigration and how to control it. Or do we want to control it? Or do we want to encourage it? Or do we just want to just limit it? Or a combination of several of the above?
There are ways to do any one of the above, some within our power to do and some without.
For example, Mexico has a near foolproof and civilized way of controlling those who wish to enter the country and want to stay there, The Mexican Government requires a bank statement showing a minimum of $1300.00 US a month from any means or total savings of a minimum of $260,000.00. For this you get a Residential Visa. How long? Probably as long as the money lasts. (tnx to Fred Reed for the facts)
Then, in Norway as of January 2016, the Government confiscated ( and continues to do so) all funds of would-be immigrants above $1500 (US eqiv.) to assist in feeding them. Switzerland already seizes any amount over 1,000 Sw. Fr. (700 Euros)
Netherlands, Denmark and Germany also confiscate any amount above a minimum (varies state to state) to assist their welfare state pay for three hots and a cot for their immigrants (they should be so lucky!).
First of all and agreed upon throughout the civilized (and uncivilized) world is that a country MUST control its borders (or a tribe must do the same). By building fences, walls, patrolling by vehicle or aircraft and with armed boots on the ground. You certainly can’t leave 2,500 miles of boarder wide open and not expect someone (a good guy or a bad guy) not to waltz across it to accomplish something (either bad or good) while our “Border Control” has hot cakes and coffee in the barracks.
Fifty five to thirty five years ago, all we had to worry about was illegal workers ( a “permitted” border jumping because they provided cheap agricultural labor and were low on crime and other things that would get them deported. These folk came to work their asses off and send money back to Mexico to support families). Then about Twenty Five years ago comes along serious drugs being smuggled across the Mexican border while most of the violence remained South of the Border.
Drugs being a more serious no-no (in our opinion), we tightened up a wee bit to slow it down, if never stopping it. Now we have it all, illegal labor; illegal drugs flow like water to all parts of North America via Mexico and points South; sex slavery in now firmly in place supplying houses of prostitution in in most every community from California to Florida.
Again, if such sex work were legalized, regulated and taxed, it would be a win-win in that poor women would have a way out of poverty and our far out of date and unworkable way of making criminals out of many women and the enrichment of many very cruel “owners” would stop.
Now for ways to stop illegal immigration. Real short list.
#1: Just lock down the border. Completely legal, not terribly expensive and quite efficient when done with no “loop holes”, bribed border patrol agents, compliance by the agriculture business who send trucks to the border to pick then up in the Monday AM and return them on Friday PM. Anyone picked up along the border are simply deported back across the border on the spot and the problem is solved.
#1A: Canada remains a enigma of sorts with the longest unguarded border (5,500 miles and not in anything considered a straight line) between the USA and Canada and nobody worries much about that– for now.. Perhaps in the future technology will improve to allow terrorists to infiltrate into Canada and therefore have a 5,500 mile unprotected border though which it can march 20,000 abreast (until it gets caught)..
#2: Now comes the very best way of solving illegal immigration problems.
It also happens to be the one way that is totally impossible because it relies on the politicians and citizens of countries that supply our illegal immigrants to get squared away and do what they’re supposed to.
The secret is to make the country as good as or better than the country where immigrants want to go to; or at least start making said country by giving it a future.
This is the simple reason no one piled into Switzerland 70 years ago.
The only problem is human nature. We, as a whole; want to run things; want to call the shots; want to shoot those who disagree with us (or in some way run them out of your particular chunk of jungle); we want to collect money or taxes from those who have found a way to turn a buck so we won’t have to work. My, it’s a wonderful world when you rape women of choice, shoot those who don’t hand over their hard earned money to you or vacate their homes – leaving their cattle and livestock behind for your use, of course.
And this is why it is impossible, in the world of today, to control borders by other means than force.( Therefore, Trump is correct; a wall or some sort!) There will always be men who prefer to kill or rob instead of buy. To rob instead of barter. To enslave instead of trying to mutually come to an agreement that would leave at least half the parties satisfied and the other half willing to go along with it.
If you come up with a way to do it, let me know and we’ll start a perfect country with honest banks, (no Central Banks!), a self-defense force, and all the freedoms guaranteed by an old beat up and ancient document called The Constitution.
Or do we want to control it?
We the people might want to see our borders secured, but our rulers love the cheap labor, money laundering, gun running, , sex trafficking and reasonable priced cocaine to the elite, bodies for the private prison industry on and on.
Nothing new here folks, throughout history, those in power always seek a ‘slave species’
Closing borders will not stop the bleeding off of American wealth to support third world immigration. A policy in funding i.e encouraging illegal invasion is in order as well.
From the You Can’t Make This Shit Up file.
U.S. Pays to Feed and Shelter Cuban Migrants Stranded in Costa Rica
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/05/world/americas/us-pays-to-feed-and-shelter-cuban-migrants-in-costa-rica.html?_r=0
Make immigrants, all immigrants not just illegals, ineligible for government benefits not paid for by their own taxes (i.e. they could receive SS or unemployment if they worked and paid in but not medicaid, food stamps, housing subsidy, etc. that weren’t directly paid by payroll taxes) and require all permanent residents of this country to learn English withing two years of coming here.
Get rid of all the foreign language government forms and translators for anything other than criminal prosecutions and get rid of public school classes other than English language instruction being taught in foreign languages, let them pay for their own translators if they need them.
In other words, make them come here because they want to become Americans, not foreigners from whatever country they originated in living in and benefiting from America without any allegiance to it.
Hold them to the same standards of legal compliance as an American citizen would be.
This would solve the mass immigration and migration problems we face.
“First of all and agreed upon throughout the civilized (and uncivilized) world is that a country MUST control its borders”
All one has to do is look at Europe to understand what happens when you Don’t control your borders.
The very concept that someone who is not an American citizen qualifying for ANY form of government assistance at all- whether it is a housing voucher, a direct payment or a block of cheese is unfathomable to me. The argument about being humanitarian or compassionate are utterly empty. There are more than 7 billion human beings on Earth and every last one of them has needs and wants. The citizens of United States of America have no obligation to provide for those needs and wants through any program or policy dictated by their government. Even if they were by offering to one the obligation would logically extend to all 7 billion and that simply would not be possible.
The reason we have this problem is because the people of the third world know that they can depend upon the benefits offered by the government as well as the fact that they will not be held accountable to the laws that define who is and is not a citizen and the protections and benefits that come with that classification. My next door neighbor is not entitled to a share of my estate because of his physical location and no one would expect you to open your door to anyone who needs a bed or a meal and happens to walk by your property. How we have come to accept this as the norm is impossible for me to believe. Make it impossible to subsidize them in any way whatsoever and the problem goes away.
Personally I think ALL immigration ought to end, for at least a hundred years, 100% cut off, all non citizens to be repatriated and visas for any reason other than tourism or business to end until such time as the budget is balanced.
HF- wow takes courage to put a position so contravened by politically correct dogma, thanks. Careful, sounds like you might want to Make America Great. America is not Great, to work to that end is futile, or so I have heard.
HSF – you are spot on. In addition to stopping ALL immigration, especially H1Bs, I’d implement tariffs on all foreign imports – physical and otherwise – especially services, support, and software.
Lock down our borders, bring ALL our military back home to protect those borders.
Isolationist? You bet! Not politically correct? Hell yes! Anti-diversity? You betcha!
Good comments all – perhaps the best from HSF – just stop all illegal immigration for a period of time. Lots of large industrial food production outfits would throw a fit and the price of food would go up too.
But the easiest way of doing it is to just enforce laws already on the books. Go after the employers of illegals and toss the book at them.
Take in and green card every skilled person that applies from car mechanic to engineer. Brain drain those countries now are now exporting their lower tiers of welfare bodies until they awaken to the fact that the productive segment of their population is vanishing into thin air, leaving the originating country with insufficient numbers of skilled people to get the job done.
What I seriously understand is that TPTB do not want controlled borders, don’t want the existing laws prosecuted and want the unskilled illegals to continue to be housed, fed and cared for by taxpayer money which gives those PTB cheap labor and the taxpayer picking up a big chunk of the bill.
Bad smells come from bad policy – but you must understand that lot of people benefit from those illegals or something would indeed be done to stop their inflow.
MA
Oh, and legalize all drugs. The war on drugs is obviously a total failure, unless you’re the one making the illegal profits.
HSF
+1000
“How we have come to accept this as the norm is impossible for me to believe.”
We have not come to accept this. It has been thrust upon us in schemes both stealthy and obvious for at least 50 years. The pace of the implementation of this plan has noticeably increased in the last 15 years. The collusion by the NWO crowd to foist vast crowds of illegal and inappropriate legal persons who are given generous benefits of every kind is a brilliant tactic. American citizens get to pay for the destruction of their own economy and culture.
Why do I find myself occasionally daydreaming about moving to Mexico?
flash says: Closing borders will not stop the bleeding off of American wealth to support third world immigration.
Your delusional. There is no American wealth. Last I heard, America was 14 – 80 Trillion in debt.
America is the great whore yelling ‘rape’. If you are going to complain about illegal immigration, stick to that argument and don’t throw in the red herring of American virginity.
Trump plays Americans for suckers because he plays to there delusions of power and exceptionally pristine state.
“And this is why it is impossible, in the world of today, to control borders by other means than force.( Therefore, Trump is correct; a wall or some sort!)” ——— article
Dumb Donald. Dumb Donald. Dumb Donald.
Because the Berlin Wall was so damned effective?
Because the biggest baddest wall of them all (China) was so damned effective?
http://gbtimes.com/life/failure-great-wall
Krist Almighty, the solution is painfully simple;
——–1) NO free shit to any illegal, ever.
——–2) Harsh fines for every employer employing them (including prison for repeat offenders)
Just those two will almost eliminate the problem. But, Amerika doesn’t have the will.
Even further actions can be taken. For example, confiscating all the assets an illegal has here AND in Mexico …. which seems possible since the RS can now tell Swiss banks what to do.
EC, old friend , if there’s no wealth left in these here United States , then why do they come…for the weather?
Eh, I said stick to one argument. Even an old whore still has something to offer.
Want to stop illegal immigration?
End benefits for illegals. No welfare, no education, no jobs, no rights, no citizenship for their offspring. No more bleeding heart Free Shit for infiltrators. Prison time for illegals – 5 years hard labor, building the Great Wall of Trump.
Imprison the assholes that hire the illegals – 5 years hard labor, also building the Great Wall of Trump, and forfeiture of all assets.
Very first line of the article…….and the only line I read:
“Illegal Immigration: How to control it”
Simple…………end the free shit. Take away the money, take away the fucking problem. One more thing, there is no need to build a wall either. Simply start deducting zeros from any and all “aid” packages being sent to Mejico. I’m quite confident the govt there would come up with solutions to control emigration from beanerville.
I have an equally elegant solution to cause Jose and Hose B to self deport (in addition to ending the free shit) that will make border areas to look like a 20,000,000 strong herd of buffalo crossed recently.
There are ways…………but it requires willpower. You could fix this same problem and hundreds of thousands of others by ending the fed.
We are not on the path to fixing problems in this country and there is no willpower to do so.
Stucky,
The Berlin Wall was designed to keep people in, not out, and it was actually quite effective at it.
FWIW, the illegals we are overwhelmed with have little in the way of “assets” to confiscate either here or in Mexico and we couldn’t confiscate their Mexican assets anyway. Why do you think they come here to get all the benefits we provide to them for doing so?
Anonymous says: Why do you think they come here to get all the benefits we provide to them for doing so?
It’s not ‘we’ bozo, it’s the government. If your going to take credit for the welfare, then take credit for the warfare as well. You are schizo to think that all generous things the government does includes you but you never say, we kill people in their homes, we shoot niggers in the street or we drone people in the middle east or we waterboard people…
I hate mother effers who wrap themselves in the flag like there some precious saints.
Uhmmm… Just out of curiosity.. Don’t we already have “government agencies” on the payroll to “handle” the illegal immigration issue?
Why do we have Border Patrol, DEA, Immigration, FBI, etc etc…?
Muck, hardscrabble didn’t say that. He said all immigration, and capitalized for emphasis.
I think you guys have solved the problem and I agree with the zero benefits and ban immigration for 100 years. Problem is, lots of people think Trump is some sorta immigration savior and he’s not. Last debate he already flip-flopped on the “need” for H1B Visa workers. Now he thinks that’s just peachy. How long before he admits the “wall” idea was just puffery?
You might be right westy. And it looks like he’s paying a price for it today
Mr Trump is paying for his can do no wrong hyper-ego, bad conversational manners, liberal transformation flip flopping and for creating more melodrama and doubts than most of us can bear. I hope he recovers his political common sense as fast as he recovers from his financial mistakes. He probably needs some extra sleep and a humble chat with The Boss of Bosses.
AndrewG. says: Uhmmm… Just out of curiosity.. Don’t we already have “government agencies” on the payroll to “handle” the illegal immigration issue? Why do we have Border Patrol,
They’ve been ordered to stand down, Andy. Where the fuck have you been?
1) no welfare to non-citizens, public or private
2) the the ever living shit out of anyone who employs an illegal. Say a million for the first offence, and make managers as well as owners liable.
Poof, no more illegal immigration.
First word second line is “fine” not “the”.
HSF says:
“Personally I think ALL immigration ought to end, for at least a hundred years, 100% cut off, all non citizens to be repatriated and visas for any reason other than tourism or business to end until such time as the budget is balanced.”
I’ve been preaching the same message here. I get starry eyed looks of disbelief. “But who will pay for our retirement?” is the response so often given (amongst others). My suggestion is that maybe folks should pay for their own fucking retirement. People look at me like I’m Mussolini. How dare I make people be responsible for themselves! As if I have the power.
Had an old guy in my facility a few days ago who asked if we discounted for seniors. I looked him straight in the eyes and told him “Nope. I charge you guys an extra 10% because I’m paying for your retirement.” He didn’t seem impressed but I’m passed the point of caring anymore. I am fed up with the entitlement mentality from everyone. Next week I am putting a sign on the door that says “Senior’s requesting a discount will be charged extra for being irresponsible when they were younger. Bad planning on your behalf does not constitute an emergency on mine. Have a nice day and thank you for shopping.”
The border/illegals thing is much simpler than many of you seem to realize. Muck says the only way is with force. It’s not. No mater how much force you apply, how big the wall is, how deep the most filled with alligators is, it won’t do anything as long as huge economic incentives exist to get here. Once they get passed trumps wall, they get free housing, healthcare, food, education, utilities, cash assistance, etc. take away those economic incentives, the flow shuts down. That is all. Turning the country into an even bigger police state will not solve the problem.
Do you guys really think the extra 10s of thousands of federal agents that would be required to implement all of this will really just stick to deporting illegals? It won’t. And that wall will be just as effective at keeping you in. Most of these problems can be solved by abolishing the welfare state.
I guess I’m old fashioned about this, but I have to ask; wouldn’t landmines and machineguns on the border put a dent in the rush? As far as the one’s already here, well, obviously they didn’t like where they came from, so there’s no sense shipping them back. So the answer is to just disappear them. They are of no positive use to our civilization and society, so get rid of them. We’ll have to trust the RAND corporation and other think tanks to come up with an efficient way of achieving this.
The German way would be appealing, but unfortunately for our research it never happened. The Genghis Khan way of making piles of skulls a hundred meters high would be impressive, but still not practical or hygienic.
Ground up into animal feed sounds good as it will both solve the problem and provide jobs, as well as finally discovering some use for these vermin.
I’m sure we’ll come up with something. We always do.
Oh, I’m sorry…….does all that sound a trifle harsh? I didn’t mean to upset the gentler ones among you.
You guys remind me of the old rush to Colorado. It became a byword that every new person to arrive wanted to close the door after them.
No doubt you will be the same way in heaven, trying to keep the niggers and chinks out of the celestial grounds because they aren’t ‘Muricans.
I’m aware that the floodgates have been opened, if only secondhand, I don’t see the flood of immigrants. Then again, they left LA for greener pastures back east. Therefore, you guys are seeing the shit. And suffering the scourge of heroine smuggling by the narcos from Mexico.
When you visit the old west museums in LA, Tucson or El Paso, you read of bandidos like Tiburcio Vasquez who would raid the towns and hide among the hispanic communities. And the time the white rangers rode into the hispanic town and entering a bar, shot and killed the bandit they were after with no protest from the rest of the bar patrons.
You will never find a more serious foe of the entitlement generation(s) than I. I busted my ass, earned everything I ever owned, have owed not a single soul as much as penny since 1973. I’d work a long day and then work a long night to accompany it.
If we didn’t have money in hand to buy something (necessary or not), we thumb tack a chart on the barn wall showing how much more was needed and what we had to do to acquire the item. We were homesteading 10 acres in the hoodoo valley of Northern Idaho. Almost broke but eventually the purse filled up sufficiently to let us move to Maui. Doing whatever I could From 1979 through 1994 I put in 8-14 hours a day, working fulltime atop Mt. Haleakkala on Maui tracking space junk for NAADC, bouncing lasers off the moon, doing science for for Nasa and JPL and as a sideline, rescuing Japanese and Americans from night time wrecks going down the Mountain on skate boards under a full moon!
I worked atop that volcano for almost 20 years, learned a huge amount I didn’t didn’t know about about alignment and focus of a “fly’s eye telescope” (128 separate lenses) and how to find a 4’x4′ reflector retro-reflector board placed on the moon by the Apollo astronauts. I also turned myself into a pretty fine laser engineeer over the six years working for the Univ. of Hawaii.
In the day time, I worked 10 – who knows what hours a day building a farm at 2,500 feet on the Western slopes of Haleakala which included the main dwelling (4,000 square feel under the eves – 1500 foot of deck), planted a lime grove with wonderful tasting Bearrs limes (bartenders limes – seedless – and sold every one I could grow to the local groceries or bars) ,grew pineapples and protea flowers and ran a B&B. We BUILT IT.. Sure I hired hanger swingers when things got to heavy. put out bid to wholesalers on the West coast and had the lumber shipped and hauled to the building side.
If you don’t think my sweetie (we are now married some 60 of the most satisfying, loving and sexy years that you can imagine!) worked just as hard as I did, you are seriously wrong.
We still write love notes to each other and stick them to the reefer and I lay out her tea and makings every mornings as way to say Yep! I still here an love you to pieces!
I suppose what I’m trying to explain here is that is you limit your work to that that provides a paycheck and are sadly limited to working alone over years and years to secure as successful a future as you’d like to have you have a tough row to hoe where if you a competent helpmate at your side pushing when necessary and carrying at time what seems to be an intolerable load, mixed with humor and love, you’ve got it made
Easy? Hell NO! Double HELL no. But when you stand holding hands surveying the acres and a home you’ve built with your own hands You realize there is absolutely NOTHING that you can’t do together and that’s the important.
MA
Muck,
I went to Maui for the first time 2 summers ago. I’m a northern boy so I was skeptical when my wife suggested we go with some friends. I’m not used to the heat and would rather head to the Yukon or Northern Vancouver Island for a vacation.
Long story short – I drink all my coffee out of a Maui mug now. We rented a condo in Kihei and I can honestly say it was two of the finest weeks I have ever spent anywhere. Maui is AMAZING! We saw almost all of it. I am already planning another trip – possibly for 2017. You are a lucky, lucky man to both live in such a place and to be so happily married. If I make it over again soon I will let you know and I’ll buy you and the missus dinner. Always enjoy your stuff here on the TBP.
@Francis: Thanks for invite and I’d take you up on it if I were still there! Annette and made an agreement when we started building the farm that if it ever got too hard (physically – as we ain’t spring chickens anymore, that we’d sell the place and downsize.
We ended up putting up the home and farm for rent and I put in another tour out in the Marshall Islands and retired from there as Optics Section Head for the Kwajalein Missile Range a few years later. If you want to see what we built, first go to Kula (on the West side of Haleakala. Drive down Naalai Road to Ahinhina place – turn right. The farm is on the left at the cul-de-sac.. A dentist eventually bought it from us and we relocated to Central Florida so from the Google Earth pictures it appears to be more overgrown than when we had it.
But it’s very true that “Maui no ka oi” “Maui is the best!” in English and we’d still be there is we could have afforded to retire there. We were land and house rich and money poor!!! So when we sold it we retired using the proceeds.. Enjoy your next trip!
MAA