We have at least one beloved poster here (SSS) who has no concerns about eating GMO Foods …. and says those who do are pussies. Lol
We have another beloved poster here (Muck About) who thinks genetic modification is a great idea … like modifying human genes so we can breath under water.
This really well written article (complex info explained plainly) should at least give all readers a reason to pause and reconsider.
I already eat zero soy. I never ever eat farmed salmon. I’ve probably reduced corn consumption by 90%. Corn, in some shape or form, is in almost all (processed) foods, so it’s hard to eliminate completely. However, this is the year I’m going to try damned hard to get closer to 100% avoidance.
I know we’ve beaten this topic to death here over the years, so I don’t expect many comments, and that’s OK. Maybe this rehash will cause one or two folk to reconsider what they eat … and thus save them from future health problems, and that will be worth it.
Justremember what I consider the Two Golden Rules Of Good Health.
#1 — You are what you eat.
#2 — You are what you eat ate.
RESEARCH EXPOSES NEW HEALTH RISKS OF GENETICALLY MODIFIED MOSQUITOES & SALMON
This article was written By Sayer Ji, Founder of Greenmedinfo.com. For more news from them, you can sign up for their newsletter here.
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Just when genetically modified (GM) mosquitoes got their approval by the Cayman Islands and the government of Canada’s Prince Edward Island is trying to approve GM salmon, new research reveals unexpected and potentially dangerous effects of genetic engineering.
Unfortunately, neither the makers of genetically modified organisms (GMOs) nor their regulators conduct the studies that are necessary to protect the public. Being bitten by GM mosquitoes and eating GM salmon remains a serious gamble.
The new discomfiting research published in Nature Methods examined the unintended impacts of gene editing on the DNA of mice. Gene editing is touted by its promoters as the safer, more precise version of genetic engineering. The earlier version that was used to create the GM crops we all know about (soy, corn, etc.) forced genetic material from bacteria or viruses into plant DNA. Gene editing, on the other hand, does not necessarily introduce genes from foreign species. Rather, it cuts the DNA in a predetermined location. The cell’s DNA repair mechanisms are then activated to repair the cut.
Of all the gene editing techniques, the one that is easiest, least expensive, and most popular is called CRISPR-Cas9. Proponents claim it is so safe and predictable, it should not be regulated. They want to put their gene-edited products on the market without informing governments or consumers. And they don’t even want it to be called genetic engineering, since consumers have largely weighed in against GMOs. That is why the recent research is so damning.
Gene Editing Creates Predictable Mutations
The tools used for gene editing are designed to recognize and make changes only on specific DNA sequences. In the Nature Methods research, for example, the engineers designed their tools to fix a defective DNA sequence that could restore sight to blind mice. But the defective DNA sequence that governs sight is also repeated in other places throughout the mouse genome—unrelated to vision. Therefore, the gene editing tools can also make unintended changes in these “off-target” locations.
The unwanted mutations do not come from cutting the DNA. Rather, they occur when the cut ends are rejoined by the cells’ repair mechanisms. It results in either the loss of some DNA base units or the insertion of a few base units at the cut site.
If the mutation occurs in the middle of a known gene (or in a portion of the DNA that controls a gene) it can severely disrupt its function. Gene editors, therefore, rely on computer models of the genome to identify where the similar sequences are that are likely to become mutated and to predict what level of collateral damage that could create. If the risk is considered low enough, they proceed with editing.
Widespread Unpredicted Mutations Discovered
There is a joke that says molecular biologists don’t understand just two things: molecules and biology. Too often, the complex 3-D world doesn’t cooperate with their computer model predictions. This was again confirmed by the work of Stamford’s Dr. Kellie Schaefer, along with her colleagues from Stamford, Columbia, and the University of Iowa.
Instead of letting the computer guess which off-target changes would take place, Schaefer’s team actually sequenced the genome of the two gene-edited mice after they had undergone CRISPR-Cas9. They did find insertions and deletions (indels), which is the type of mutation that the computer predicts. One mouse had 164 indels; the other 128. But of the top 50 sequences that a computer would identify as most likely to be mutated, none were changed at all. Far more importantly, however, the computer model would totally miss their other finding: point mutations throughout the genome. One mouse had 1,736; the other 1,696.
A point mutation is the replacement of a single nucleotide along the DNA. But don’t let its smallness fool you. These so-called single-nucleotide variants (SNV) can have huge consequences. They can lead to many types of changes, including disease.
According to Dr. Michael Antoniou, a London-based molecular geneticist who routinely uses genetic engineering in his research, “Many of the genome editing-induced off-target mutations [both the point mutations and the indels] . . . will no doubt be benign in terms of effects on gene function. However, many will not be benign and their effects can carry through to the final marketed product, whether it be plant or animal.” This could translate into possible toxins, allergens, carcinogens, or other changes that could affect those eating a GMO.
Dr. Michael Hansen, a Senior Scientist at Consumers Union, the policy arm of Consumer Reports, wrote, “While genome editing has been portrayed in the media as an incredibly precise process, where one can go in and literally only intentionally change one or a small number of nucleotide bases, the reality is that there can be large numbers of off-target effects.” He says, “This study raises troubling concerns.”
Another recently published study in Nature Communications used CRISPR/Cas9 to make 17 edits in the mouse genome. They too sequenced the genome and found unexpected insertions and deletions in all 17 places. Whereas deletions of approximately 9 base pairs are predicted, the actual size of the deletions was as high as 600 base pairs. No computer model predicts DNA damage this extensive.
A third study published this year also found deletions of more than 500 base units. The researchers also confirmed that proteins produced by these mutated sections were altered. Such changes could theoretically transform a beneficial protein to a harmful one.
Hansen says the long deletions of DNA material “may not be routinely identified without whole genome sequencing.” But whole genome sequencing is rarely done by gene editors. Instead, they rely on their computers.
Even if they did sequence the genome, science doesn’t yet have the capacity to predict what the real-life consequences of all the mutations would be. Therefore, according to Antoniou, “it is also essential to ascertain the effects of these unintended changes on global patterns of gene function.” For this, both Antoniou and Hansen (as well as the National Academy of Sciences and the international standard setting body Codex Alimentarius) agree that the scientists must also analyze the changes in RNA, proteins, and metabolites.
Armed with this data, certain problems would be obvious—an increase of a known allergen or toxin, for example. But even if no red flags are raised at this point, according to Antoniou, “it is still necessary to conduct long-term toxicity studies” using animals. That’s because, once again, science is still not competent to figure out the complex interactions and side effects that can occur.
Antoniou concludes, “In the absence of these analyses, to claim that genome editing is precise and predictable is based on faith rather than science.”
And it is mere faith that supports the claims that GM mosquitoes and salmon are safe. Although they were not produced by the CRISP-Cas9 technique, they are the product of earlier gene-insertion techniques, which are also fraught with unpredictable mutations and altered gene expressions.
Article copied and pasted from this web site:
As Nassim Taleb has repeatedly pointed out, GMO foods represent a large, unknown, potentially catastrophic risk in return for little benefit….Because we simply don’t know the long run consequences of putting fish genes in plants, etc, and no amount of (usually fraudulent) studies can give us the answer.
I don’t follow Taleb’s rule, but sure do appreciate it. He doesn’t eat or drink anything that humans haven’t consumed for at least 1000 years.
Why do we have so many with “chronic fatigue” or fibromyalgia or any of the other mystery problems modern medicine can’t help? Weird chemistry exposure and poor quality food? How do we know this GMO stuff is even remotely nutritious? Does it have an optimal assortment of nutrients, minerals, vitamins etc.? We don’t know! Even “organic” food may be deficient, depending on where it’s grown and how well the soil is kept. Modern agriculture has already depleted foods of many nutrients much less the entire gmo clusterf**k. Eat well, be well. Simple stuff.
Nature takes thousands of years to make miniscule modifications to the genetic code of plants and animals through a trial process that reaps a mulititude of failures. Humans believe they can control this process to come up with “instant answers” on demand. Imagine the hubris required to even think like this.
Check out the moths near Chernobyl.
They switched from black on white to white on black to mimic dying birch trees practically over night.
Sometimes evolutionary leaps occur overnight.
I am not a fan of GMO’s but ya know, just saying’,…
And another thing- Nature has tried all those modifications over millions of years and we think we can improve upon it? Baloney!
This one will be at 150 comments by tonight. I haven’t worried about GMO food yet. I’ll read it more carefully and see if I can gin up some anxiety. My general opinion has been that digesting stuff doesn’t usually cause that stuff’s genes to become incorporated into my genes. Otherwise I’d be a pig. Oh wait…
Stucky- Are you still boiling those damn banana peels every morning? 🙂
I have never thought that God’s creations were flawed except for liberals and I’m pretty sure satan did the R/D on that bunch of maroons. Our food was given to us in abundance to nourish our body and treat our ailments, yes food can heal. Tampering with nature can only bring horrific outcomes, maybe even the end of humanity.
Stucky, you can source clean organic corn but you are right to be VERY picky and research any corn products or fresh corn you consume. Something I notice that most here don’t seem to consider is enzymes which are derived from raw fruits and veggies and are most important to maintain the health of your body and to heal wounds/ fractures and a multitude of other processes such as digestion, etc. Eating more raw fruits and vegetables can make a HUGE difference in the way you look and feel. Pass anything up that is GMO’d and if you can, pass up processed foods for fresh whole foods.
we should eat gmo so we can go to pluto and live under water,,,,
Sure thing Anon, go to Pluto….live under water…..Uhh Huhh.
Don’t you know there ain’t no water on Pluto? your dumb.
I hear Uranus is wet.
Maybe stick your head there?
PS you’re vs. your, try an apostrophe next time if you really want a good zinger!
By the time Trump is done fucking up the environment even regyoulah food (non GMO) won’t be safe to eat.
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Really. He doesn’t give a rat’s ass about Da Earf as long as it produces jobs. The Cuyahoga River will burn again. I hope the EPA can stop him from his greedy ways.
“Justremember what I consider the Two Golden Rules Of Good Health.”
I would add this for a third:
“Let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food.”
― Hippocrates
Shit stirring on a master level O’ Powerful Stuckmeister.
Do you blame El Trump for GMO’s? I don’t.
Edit: And to think, YoBo pictures DT as godly with Jeebus wrapped around him. Two very different opinions, I must say.
Trump wasn’t POTUS when GMO shit started so, I don’t blame him. Yet. He’s done nothing to reverse the trend. I blame him from now on, and moving forward.
I could list the long list of his not giving fucks about the environment. But, I won’t … no one would read it, especially Trumpeteers, and you can search on your own. Except, here’s one quote;
“There’s no getting around it: at the federal level, 2017 was an unmitigated disaster for the environment and public health with President Trump and his Cabinet quickly becoming the most anti-environmental administration in our nation’s history,” read the report.”
http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/375782-president-congress-get-lowest-grades-in-annual-environment
You know who else doesn’t give a ratfuk about the environment? India and China. India is a shithole. China is an environmental basket case, and just like what happened at Easter Island, it will eventually destroy them.
And that’s what Trump’s policies will do …. turn America into a shithole basket case.
I am a Q autist, and my words are true.
The insertion of the BT (Bacillus Thuringiensis) gene into the corn genome has decreased the use of tons of insecticides being sprayed to control corn borer. The insertion of the glyphosate resistance into both corn and soybeans has decreased the use of tons of more toxic and ground water contaminating pesticides. These are both major accomplishments regarding the protection of our environment. The question will be, did we sacrifice our own health for the health of the environment? Organic would be nice but organic can’t compete with conventional farming practices yet, unless man hours are used to replace chemicals for insect and weed control. Man-hour labor, as of yet, will not replace fungicides, or other plant damage caused by plant diseases, inter planting will help. If chemicals are to be replaced, then farming will more resemble gardening. Inter planting of different crops, hand weeding, thinning and watering all need labor which adds to costs. One doesn’t have to agree with our current farming practices, but how do we change them once we know food cost will increase by two times and maybe more? Even if you feel organic grown and GMO free products are better, how do we deal with higher costs and less yield? GMO is brave new world stuff, Stucky. Consider yourself a guinea pig for future generations.
You seem to know your stuff. What about this?
Plants have defense mechanisms against bugs. They have a protein called lechtin which fucks bugs up. So, the GMO dicks design a plant with ever more powerful lechtins. Kills bugs. Unfortunately, lechtins also wreck havoc on humans in many many ways. Hence, more ? for the masses …. but ? that is literally making people sick, and dead.
I read this in a book called The Plant Paradox.
Haven’t seen it yet. Read an article by the dude that came up with the first test for carcinogens. After everything including the black stuff on your barbequed drumstick was determined to be causing cancer, he stepped back while crazies took over and blew the carcinogen horn. As he continued his research into the plant and critter cycle, he determined that the whole damn thing is based on a chemical warfare loop. Plants and bugs both producing pathogens that will slow the reproduction cycle or even kill those things that will feed off it. We humans adapt, have adapted to this process of chem warfare. He claims the longevity of cells in our digestive system are short and some cells survive in the acid environment of our gut for as little as 45 minutes. You got history on your side Stuck, go ahead, eat it. If food hasn’t killed you yet, chances are good it won’t be what kicks your ass in the end.
Penforce- The “Brave New World” of food may be void of humans to consume it. Stucky is correct, and never forget they (o.o1%)think there are about 6.5 billion too many of us schmucking up their space. Why give them blind trust?
Actually, that’s been proven false, Penforce. Suggest you read some of the articles on NaturalNews,com and other natural news sites.
Don’t eat corn, wheat, or any of that crap introduced by the farmers who once were hunter gatherers for tens of thousands of years beforehand. The human gut likes lard, eggs, bacon, mastodon, elk, berries, roots, fish, mussels, clams, beer, and like that. Early humans were healthy; agriculture made then much less so as bone examination studies have shown.
The real and potential downsides to GMOs make a list as long as your arm.
Real:
– drastically increased use of glyphosate (they don’t call the “RoundUp Ready” for nothing) which has led to:
– the evolution of superweeds, which has led to:
– stronger herbicides being used, such as dicamba and 2,4D;
– monopolization of the seed industry in the hands of very few vertically-integrated multinationals, which has accelerated the already existing trend in the loss of genetic diversity (fewer seed lines)
– farmers who don’t use GMO seeds (whether or not they’re organic) have been targeted and convicted of IP infringement for being s unlucky as having GMO seed or pollen make its way onto their farm
Potential : we have know way of knowing, and it could be ecologically disastrous on a global scale
2,4-D was developed in the 50s and along with Dowpon, a grass herbicide used on flax, was the only herbicide used for years. Dicamba, Trade name Banvel is also a growth regulator and developed in the 60’s. Resistance to glyphosate started years ago and growers have been adding old herbicides with glyphosate for some time. Dicamba’s current foofoo is that it vaporizes in hot weather and moves over to neighboring fields. Now, of course, they will attempt to create a Dicamba resistant soybean.
I see 270 million dead people by 2025.
+100 Wip………HaHaHaHaHaHa!!
It’s conspiracy week on TBP…..Love it!
I wonder how many will catch that.
I caught it, and, I am already dead.
To that world anyway.
I see 270 million stupid people…and they don’t even know they are stupid…
Unintended consequences abound that we will pay for. The mere reintroduction of wolves in Yellowstone had a rippling cascade felt throughout the Park. Let that sink in. The mere reintroduction of a natural native species had a huge dynamic effect on the whole ecology and we assholes are messing with the fundamental code of life itself. Astonishing hubris and astonishing stupidity.
Well, I’m learning that if you skip a day, it’s difficult to get back up to speed. You know, the guy that always comes late to the conversation and tries to sound like he knows what he’s talking about…. hello.
It is impossible to completely avoid GMO adulterated food without enforced labeling. The general public couldn’t care less and the mega producers are afraid to inform them. Only us geriatrics are concerned about what we put into our bodies. Trying to buy or improve the time we have left.
Grow your own !!!
“It is impossible to completely avoid GMO adulterated food”
Actually its quite simple – stop eating processed food. At present, the only GMO foods on the market are corn, soybeans, canola, and cotton (cottonseed oil is used in processed foods). To a very limited extent there is a bit of GM papaya, summer squash, apple and farmed Atlantic salmon.
You are what you eat that you assimilate. It’s the eating version of reading comprehension. And both vary all over the place, individual to individual, & over time. Equipment degrades, breaks. No such thing as a free comp, ‘prende?
For the flip-side of personally changeless immortality (surrounded by natural issue, constantly changing in you know what direction, people – hint), “The Age of Adaline” was pretty good. Even Connor McLeod’s reward, among others, was a return to mortality. Never leave Las Vegas, keep being dropped back into the karmic roulette wheel, variations on a careful what ya’ wish for theme. Cuz Vegas is a pit & roulette’s for suckers & nic cage blew all his dough & hasta make shite movies now just to keep the lights on.
Mendel modified peas. The AKC modifies, often over-modifies, dogs. Inbred plutos incestify the world. Taleb, others, talk of precautionary principles & asymmetries. Mercola & all the ‘loyal opposition marketers’ scare bejesus outta’ predisposed (or previously beaten down by conventional “medicine”) organic doompone eaters.
But, projecting “asymmetry” on an unknown unknowable future is implicitly setting the now variable to symmetrical & just extrapolating the can forward. It don’t work. Especially it don’t work in competition-free zones that uncompetitive losers love to shoot up. The hard right edge of charts & “tails” is hard because nobody knows what’ll happen out there until it gets here.
But safe to say the cartelized, “regulated” approach to this, or anything else, increases downside risk. Cartelized, regulated, “healthcare” is a disaster. Institutionalized via color of law rent extraction. Sadim services at midas “prices.” Prices? we don’ need no stinkin’ prices!
Gene editing to “solve” for “unintended consequences” – blowback – like weeds working their way ‘round herbicides, just gives the control-freak corkscrew another twist.
Genes, dna, are puzzle pieces. No one piece is any more important than any other piece. One piece does not capitulate extrapolate the whole. Plus, touch this piece & it changes not just it, but any number of other pieces. “You know my name.” ~ Heisenberg
So the makework within cartel-closed “systems” can, & does, go on forever. Obsolescence, constantly, is the plan. Arrival, never, is the plan. Homogenized milk cows & CAFO beef critters conveyor belts & suspenders is the treasure of the sierra madre fuckers.
Prose editing, or song editing for length\girth, to solve for marketing formula requirements, Flesch-Kincaid readability (comprehension) requirements, is analogous. Heinlein’s Stranger in a Strange Land, Wolfe’s O’ Lost (Look Homeward Angel) were better uncircumcised. But then what would all those foreskinners do for a living? Rhetorical. Same as muleskinners, they’d do something else. Locking it in is a loaded proposition, aimed at you, comrade citizen cartridge, civilian conservation corpsmen…cuz in the longrun we’re all corpses (if candy Keynes hadna’ been there to apologize, someone else woulda’ been invented for it).
See it? The conservative compulsion to status quo control everything, via legality, is the epitome of waste. Schizoid. Mongoloid. 1st rule of conservative club: smash your own face in. It may be like fat comedians who butt themselves, too. Get out in front of it so it can run you over. The nasty business of self-loathing. Lookin’ for love in all the wrong box canyons. Donner partying.
Crichton’s “Next,” was a fun read on this stuff.
Anarchy. Yes, please.
Organic corn, which for now means non-gmo, is available. I use organic blue corn to make cornbread. A lot of the old yeller stuff has gone rabid. Damn dogs bitin’ the hand that feeds, killin’ the golden goose, & beatin’ friendly jessicaalbatross to death. Freakin’ hydrophoby psychos.
So #1 means I’m a pussy, but #2 means I’m a dick?
Stucky- I have faced CHF with my family and I found in research that they were in need of CoEnzyme Q10 (I call it by the old name Ubiquinone) or you may have heard of it as CoQ10. This CoEnzyme is in every cell in a healthy body and is the driver to help the cell receive the molecules of vitamins(A,B, C, D etc.) to keep the cells working properly. A shortage of this CoEnzyme is prevalent in CHF patients.
That was a very long time ago and I have forgotten most of the info but you might want to look into that as doctors are clueless about supplements and nutrition. Also, one would not want to source CoQ10 from a drugstore or grocery, find top quality form. I hope I am not out of line, just thought it could help.
Anybody with heart problems would do well to read “Human Heart, Cosmic Heart” by Thomas Cowen.
Incredible information.
And subscribe to Dr. West’s newsletter and take his Standard Process supplements as he suggests. Expensive but made from food instead of petroleum like most of the other producers everywhere do and which are a waste of money and often harm you.
http://www.healthalert.com/
Taleb is a smooth talking moron.
If he says something about finance, worth listening to.
His other opinions require toilet paper.
This GMO business is just one example.
OK, CRISPR introduces unexpected mutations. But so does every other mutation process up to and including natural ones.
The most popular organic barley is … radiation mutated. Do you think radiation methods introduce more or less mutations than CRISPR? More importantly, what are the potential types of mutations?
Every single food we eat today bears zero resemblance to “natural”. The animals and plants both have been modified through various means for literally tens of thousands of years.
None of them are “natural” in any sense.
Furthermore, the focus in natural is completely unscientific. We aren’t made up of corn or farmed salmon. We eat various things and our digestive systems break those down and extract what we need.
Why then goes the pre-breakdown nature matter? Yes, there are exceptions like mad cow disease, but those are the exceptions.
And yes, there are some approaches that do have some promise: the “exercise” of various genes interacting in the breakdown and reassembly process of digestion and metabolism, but it is far from clear what “natural” is or should be.
Naturally, we should not have health care.
Naturally we should not be contracepting.
Naturally we should be living an average lifespan in the 40s and 50s due to diseases.
Natural my ass.
All of it, incl your ass, is natural. The nature container holds it all. Incl man, everything done by man. & each person’s pre-perforated nature is the slice of nature’s pie that s\he likes, wants, needs. & often likes, wants, needs to impose on as many other natures as possible.
Can I yell??
GMO foods and glyphosate contribute to Leaky Gut. Which in turn causes a whole array of other problems. I believe the Russian (I think it was them) study proved that rats fed a GMO diet produced huge tumors. Monsanto said they lied, but Monsanto’s bullshit study to prove GMO safety was conducted in a shorter time frame, thus different results.
Most illnesses are environmentally caused – which means what you eat, where you live, what relationships are like and many other things.
I spend a hug amount of time reading about this stuff – and treating my patients by encouraging them to eat better food, get off processed foods, reduce stress and walk.
As stated by another poster: organic food ain’t necessarily that great due to soil degradation. It’s why I take so many vitamins and herbs.
Think logically – why is there so much cancer in our pets and also food livestock?
Beuller? Beuller?
It’s because we feed them crap. I could go on an on about how they feed cattle dead animal by products; dog and cat foods come from all kinds of dead animal: products including euthanized pets.
Go visit a rendering plant if you want to see it up close. Mike Rowe did an episode on them for “Dirty Jobs.”
Fish farming – the worst environmental POS ever. Fish on antibiotics because they’re stressed and have open sores.
CoQ10 – yes if you’re on bullshit statins which actually don’t do anything but give you more problems. Just read “The Great Cholesterol Myth.”
Oh wait! Let’s just edit our genes – that’s the answer to everything. Morons. Idiots.
Now they’re injecting human DNA into sheep and cows so everybody can have a new organ.
PEOPLE…..really?
Our wheat and corn are being rejected by other countries. Ever wonder why?
Japan banned the HPV vaccine. Ever wonder why?
I could rant more – but I have patients to treat.