We’re 25th!!! We’re 25th!!! Let’s celebrate. Pat Buchanan contends that there is nothing wrong with our schools. The problem is the students. We spend more than any other country per student except Luxemburg. My guess is that 50% of the problem is the students/parents, 30% the teachers, and 20% the curriculum. The simple truth is that Asians work harder than Americans because they have a drive to succeed. If you work harder, study longer, and have parents who value education, you will do well in life.
Any country that buys 2 million copies of the ghost written autobiography of a clueless dolt, proves that it is in decline.
Who Owns the Future?
“That speaks about who is going to be leading tomorrow.”
So said Angel Gurria, secretary-general of the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development.
Every three years, the Paris-based OECD holds its Programme for International Student Assessment (PISA) tests of the reading, math and science skills of 15-year-olds in developing and developed countries. Gurria was talking of the results of the 2009 tests.
Sixty-five nations competed. The Chinese swept the board.
The schools of Shanghai-China finished first in math, reading and science. Hong Kong-China was third in math and science. Singapore, a city-state dominated by overseas Chinese, was second in math, fourth in science.
Only Korea, Japan and Finland were in the hunt.
And the U.S.A.? America ranked 14th in reading, 17th in science and 25th in math, producing the familiar quack-quack.
“This is an absolute wake-up call for America,” said Education Secretary Arne Duncan. “We have to face the brutal truth. We have to get much more serious about investment in education.”
But the “brutal truth” is that we invest more per pupil than any other country save Luxembourg, and we are broke. And a closer look at the PISA scores reveals some unacknowledged truths.
True, East Asians — Chinese, Koreans, Japanese — are turning in the top scores in all three categories, followed by the Europeans, Canadians, Australians and New Zealanders.
But, looking down the New York Times list of the top 30 nations, one finds not a single Latin American nation, not a single African nation, not a single Muslim nation, not a single South or Southeast Asian nation (save Singapore), not a single nation of the old Soviet Union except Latvia and Estonia.
And in Europe as in Asia, the northern countries (Finland, Norway, Belgium, Iceland, Austria, Germany) outscore the southern (Greece, Italy, Portugal). Slovenia and Croatia, formerly of the Habsburg Empire, outperformed Albania and Serbia, which spent centuries under Turkish rule.
Among the OECD members, the most developed 34 nations on earth, Mexico, principal feeder nation for U.S. schools, came in dead last in reading.
Steve Sailer of VDARE.com got the full list of 65 nations, broke down U.S. reading scores by race, then measured Americans with the countries and continents whence their families originated. What he found was surprising.
Asian-Americans outperform all Asian students except for Shanghai-Chinese. White Americans outperform students from all 37 predominantly white nations except Finns, and U.S. Hispanics outperformed the students of all eight Latin American countries that participated in the tests.
African-American kids would have outscored the students of any sub-Saharan African country that took the test (none did) and did outperform the only black country to participate, Trinidad and Tobago, by 25 points.
America’s public schools, then, are not abject failures.
They are educating immigrants and their descendants to outperform the kinfolk their parents or ancestors left behind when they came to America. America’s schools are improving the academic performance of all Americans above what it would have been had they not come to America.
What American schools are failing at, despite the trillions poured into schools since the 1965 Elementary and Secondary Education Act, is closing the racial divide.
We do not know how to close the gap in reading, science and math between Anglo and Asian students and black and Hispanic students.
And from the PISA tests, neither does any other country on earth.
The gap between the test scores of East Asian and European nations and those of Latin America and African nations mirrors the gap between Asian and white students in the U.S. and black and Hispanic students in the U.S.
Which brings us to “Bad Students, Not Bad Schools,” a new book in which Dr. Robert Weissberg contends that U.S. educational experts deliberately “refuse to confront the obvious truth.”
“America’s educational woes reflect our demographic mix of students. Today’s schools are filled with millions of youngsters, many of whom are Hispanic immigrants struggling with English plus millions of others of mediocre intellectual ability disdaining academic achievement.”
In the public and parochial schools of the 1940s and 1950s, kids were pushed to the limits of their ability, then pushed harder. And when they stopped learning, they were pushed out the door.
Writes Weissberg: “To be grossly politically incorrect, most of America’s educational woes vanish if these indifferent, troublesome students left when they had absorbed as much as they were going to learn and were replaced by learning-hungry students from Korea, Japan, India, Russia, Africa and the Caribbean.”
Weissberg contends that 80 percent of a school’s success depends on two factors: the cognitive ability of the child and the disposition he brings to class — not on texts, teachers or classroom size.
If the brains and the will to learn are absent, no amount of spending on schools, teacher salaries, educational consultants or new texts will matter.
A nation weary of wasting billions on unctuous educators who never deliver what they promise may be ready to hear some hard truths.
Related posts:
- Is Protectionism America’s Future?by Patrick J. Buchanan – July 29, 2002 “For the first time in more than…
- Corruption in the Schoolsby Patrick J. Buchanan – March 6, 2007 Fifty years ago this October, Americans were…
- The Myth of EqualityBy Patrick J. Buchanan In 21st century America, institutional racism and sexism remain great twin…
- Dumbo UniversityBy Patrick J. Buchanan As George W. Bush famously asked, “Is our children learning?” Apparently…
- Jefferson vs. the Nashville Schoolsby Patrick J Buchanan – January 28, 2004 At the Catholic school we attended long…
- Spiro Agnew: Prophet Without Honorby Patrick J. Buchanan – May 29, 1998 In an era when professors were surrendering…
From Charles Hugh Smith:
“Even if the U.S. were to pump out 10 million PhD-level researchers, there wouldn’t be 10 million new jobs waiting for them. The ugly truth is the number of positions available for high-end researchers, designers, etc. is intrinsically small. Post-doctorate researchers from the top research universities in the world still have to fight to secure a job.
In other words, there are very few $50 to $100 an hour jobs in the value chain, and many $10 an hour jobs. While it may well be possible to tax the $100/hour workers enough to pay for food stamps and other welfare so 100 million people can sit at home watching TV, borrowing trillions of dollars to prop up the current status quo is simply a criminal theft from future taxpayers to fund our current consumption. ”
Currently in China, many if not most of their recently graduated Ph.D.s are working in low level retail jobs, if they have a job at all. There aren’t enough high paying, high value jobs in that economy either for all the geniuses their school system purportedly churns out each year.
It is as much a myth that improving our education system by graduating more Science & Math geniuses will bring Prosperity back to FSofA shores as it is a myth that bringing Factory Jobs and Manufacturing will bring Prosperity back. This is narrow thinking which does not reflect a true understanding of the nature of the Peak Oil phenomenon.
We do need to prepare our children better for the future to come, but that education must be centered around developing self sufficiency and self reliance, not so much the abstract concepts of science and mathematics. Basic concepts still have their place of course, but Ph.D. level education in Physics or Engineering or Economics? Waste of time.
RE
It is probably too late to overcome defficiencies that exist as a whole. However, individuals can help themselves to no end by getting a better education.
Of course kids are lazy these days. Why would they be any different than their parents.
in truth an education need do no more then teach a child HOW to learn. once you know how, learning doesn’t require a school house. the world is a school, life is a school. what you need is the desire, a lot of that desire blooms once you know HOW to learn.
Buchanan didnt write about Germany and WWII for once. Shocker.
RE,
There is an Discovery Channel show, called ” Ice Road Truckers ” . An driver, Jack Jesse,
holds an university degree and still he hauls goods across Alaska. For monies.
Time spent reading / learning is not wasted time. OTOH, physics instead of arts, geography,
may prepare you for what life holds for you.
Let people try to be smart, even history may help. I hope that going forward is an better choice
than pulling backwards.
The cost benifit of a higher education is out the window. If your smart enought to get a Phd. then your smart enough to start a business, create jobs and be productive. There is something wrong with someone who can get a higher education but lack the imagination and drive to do something productive. I think the Brit rocker Traffic coined it well with their song the “Low Spark of High Heeled Boys” . A certain underlying laziness creeps into an empire that reaches its peak. WFS unless the Fourth Turning wipes the slate clean. But I’m not sure that will work since we have pretty much halted survival of the fittest with laws to protect the stupid. Our gene pool has been trashed.
“If the brains and the will to learn are absent, no amount of spending on schools, teachers salaries, educational consultants or new texts will matter.”
What an absurd conclusion that bespeaks the clueless writer of this article. All people are born into this world with the same faculties of mind. The two problems facing educators in the american school systems to educating is 1. lack of interest in the subjects, 2. lack of discipline. Now who do you think is responsible for that? How about the social engineers that write the subjects to be taught, the teachers, and the educational consultants. Did it ever occur to them that they may not be fit to teach?
Children are born with a natural curiosity. Our public school system, instead of tapping into the childs natural curiousity and guiding this curiority into the learning process; force children to put their attention on a dull script fabricated by a social engineer of the government. Our children are not being educated, they are being programmed; and they don’t like it so they lose interest.
Government needs to get out of the education racket; except for the basics like reading, writing, and arithmatic and leave the rest to private schools and universities for those that want to go further.
The writer of this article should stick to subjects he knows something about rather than filling the world of writing with more garbage.
Like millions of others Ms Freud and I watched the New Years Celebration … mostly the Dick Clark show but changed channels during commercials.
What a cultural wasteland, IMHO.
Lada Gaga with her green hair, blue lipstick, miniskirt … that’s one entertaining slut, there. Of all the musicians … I had no clue who they were except for one or two. So many black “artists” pounding out the same old shit rythem, doing the same old retarded gesturing, inane lyrics, each trying to outdo the other in an endless blather of just noise.
Then we saw thousands of young people (mostly white) jumping up an down in some kind of faux ecstasy, pumping fists, acting stupid, pretending they can dance, and like Nero fiddling totally oblivious to the impending doom. It all seemed so surreal. If these are our future leaders we’re probably fucked.
I turned to Ms Freud and said, “I feel so old and out of it .. like I’m no longer part of this culture.” She felt the same.
And by 12:15 we turned off the TV.
Stuck
We were asleep by 11:30. I don’t have time for all that crap.
RE: There are lots of $50 to $100 dollar jobs in the value chain all across this country but the incentive to go after them has been eliminated by government and the large corporations in cahoots with government. These jobs have to do with maintaining all the mechanical and electrical systems across this land that are fast deteriorating from lack of maintenance.
Let’s say I want to offer my services as an experienced technician to repair water well pumps, air conditioning systems, stand-by generators, booster pump systems, air compressors, water distribution systems & valves, and so and so on, and charge $100 an hour for my services; which is the going rate. What happens? First of all reliable and verifiable references don’t count anymore. To the companies that have these systems I would be asked for a copy of my liability insurance (for some this amount would have to be $5 million), then I would have to provide a W9. To the State I would have to pay for various business licenses and obtain certifications of all types, then if I had employees I would have to pay workmans comp. insurance payments per hour that are highly expensive, expensive liability insurance, unemployment insurance, and other misc. insurance payments for all types of purposes, then provide paperwork on all types of requests, and have my books audited on their request, among all types of harrassment into my business.
So after complying to all the requirements of the state and federal government, covering my insurance, expenses like truck, tools, gas, acconting, rentals, etc. I make $20 an hour for my time if I am lucky and something else does not come up to lower that amount.
Do you get the picture what is wrong with this?
The infrastucture across this country is deteriorating rapidly from a lack of maintenance providing opportunities for private business that has the vocational training and expertise to do the repairs, but government regulations at both the state and federal levels are keeping this from happening.
So what is coming upon us rapidly is massive failures of infrastructure, including public utilites such as water and sewer systems, roads, bridges, air conditioning & refrigeration systems, and all types of mechanical & electrical systems. All these public systems; managed under public unions, have been neglected while public monies to maintain these systems were spent elsewhere; like public salaries, health, and pension benefits high above the private sector.
What I see coming is going to be spectacular. While our most highly paid CEOs, administrators, bankers, and public officials are sitting in their McMansions enjoying their lavish lifestyles, a funny thing is going to happen, (not all at once but systematically) their toilets are going to back up because the public sewer system failed, then the electricity is going to go out because the power generation plant experienced a massive equipment failure, then the water facets are not going to work because the booster pumps at the water plant broke down; all these things due to lack of maintenance. And guess what; the municiple government workers had a payless payday so they went home.
In conclusion, the rich are not going to get out of the massive financial and infrastructure collapse that is coming across america. Their s*#t stinks just like ours.
Thunderbird
Excellent comments on infrastructure. Concur.
Stuck—–Please do not construe my following comments to be unkind or insensitive. But Dick Clark’s appeal as a New Year’s Eve host expired the instant that stroke fried his brain. I mean, who wants to listen to that slobbering, mumbling fool on New Year’s Eve? I mean, I watch him out of morbid curiosity, just for the brief thrill of trying to determine why a national network would deliberately ruin their ratings on New Year’s Eve, and then I turn the channel like most everybody else does. They may as well turn the celebration into a charity event for Downs Syndrome.
Old habits die hard Smokey.
I give the guy credit for appearing on national TV. He KNOWS his speech his slurred but he appeared anyway … he surely didn’t need the money. I am also encouraged by his example that one can recover from such a disasterous stroke. Ms. Freud said he had to LEARN TO SPEAK all over again. Kudos to Dick Clark for sticking with it.
Do you fucking hate everybody??
Stuck: no Tv for us last night. We went to my brother-in-laws for the festivities. We had a local guy and girl band and they were superb. Lots of ’70s stuff, Judy Collins, Creedance, &tc. No shuckin’ and jivin’. No white folks tryin’ to be black. 68F with a light breeze…all-in-all a very nice evening.
Another classic TBP thread. From dumb and lazy kids to Dick Clark to bedtime advisories. Don’t miss the popcorn feature between Smokey and Punk over on the War with China post. All this while ‘Bama is kicking Michigan State’s ass.
We had a few friends over, everyone that came over showed up with a toddler. Good food, champagne drinks, no TV. Our house is not exactly kid safe. Made for a fun first hour. All the kids knew not to go near the wood stove though, HOT is learned at an incredibly early age…
We watched Dick Clark last year or the year before, it just made us sad. He has gone through a lot and I do admire it, but he just seems to be unable to let go of the past, or maybe its the networks.
There is no difference in how a kid is brought into this world now as any time in history, it’s what happens after that which has changed. Kids soon realize that they can be taken care of without putting out much effort They stand a good chance of not being held responsible for their actions either. What has changed is the social framework we all live in. You can give the credit for failure to the adults who make the rules. They really believe they know whats best and have made a really big mess of everything. You can apply this thinking to just anything. Look what lawyers have done! And the politicans are possibility the worst bunch on the planet.
“Another classic TBP thread…”
You’re right, SSS, right down to the fact that no one (Thunderbird’s first post excluded) bothered to address the very provocative thesis of the article that initiated it, which is that, crudely speaking, Buchanan suggests that race rules (or at least large gene pools do).
Administrator dismisses it without comment, except for his usual old fogey, those-damed-lazy-kids schtick. And then the rest of the “discussion” meanders into PHD’s and fry cooks, past infrastructure, and to a final destination of stroke-ravaged Dick Clark and New Year’s Eve.
I mean, why reprint the article if everyone just wants to ride their own little hobby horses?
Buchanan says that American schools are doing a fine job with the material they receive, and that the group performance in the US mirrors the performance of the nations/ethnicities they came from. The clear inference is that it is useless to waste time and resources trying to make the intellectually short-changed academically proficient.
If you accept that, it is a thesis which has a lot of implications for US education, immigration and a host of other issues.
If you don’t accept that, what are your facts and your reasons, besides the worrisome truth that believing it isn’t very nice?
I think that discussion would be an interesting one to follow, SSS – don’t you?
Then again – that Ryan Seacrest is such a queer.
Freesmith
Instead of bitching like an old lady, why don’t you give us your view. Grow a pair and say what you mean.
We really are #1 if we interpret the data the way we want to. Now China isn’t really kicking our asses. Right?
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China kicking our asses? The same China facing the horrific collapse because they are a house of cards building ghost cities through fraud?
Yeah. That China. You still can’t process more than one concept simultaneously through that pea brain. Countries can experience bubbles and still move ahead educationally, technologically, militarily, and economically. I notice you didn’t comment on Andy Xie’s article. He stated that China is experiencing a real estate bubble.
Freesmith
Of course, I would have preferred a serious discussion on America’s public education. I am well prepared to do so. So are Admin and most other members who visit this site. That is not how many of Admin’s provocative posts turn out, however. Many of the threads head out into the vast, endless prairie.
We here would welcome your thoughts on education, immigration, and other important issues which our society faces. Ask Admin for “contributor status.” I have read your previous thoughtful comments on the old TBP forums. I hope you continue to contribute to the dialogue and look forward to your future comments.
Freesmith already has contributor status, but he thinks TBP is defeatist. Since we don’t fall lockstep into line with the Neo-con Republican Party, Freesmith boycotts the site. He occasionally chimes in with a snide shot and then disappears for another month or so. His sidekick Daniel jumps in to support him.
I did give you my view – Ryan Seacrest is such a queer.
What’s wrong with that?
Here, I’ll give you another – How about those Horned Frogs!
I mean, why should I be expected to comment on Buchanan’s actual article when no one else does?
However, I will say this: the Chinese students that were tested in Shanghai are the IQ creme de la creme drawn from the entire country. It’s like testing Germantown Academy to get a representative sample of Philadelphia-area schools. The same is true in many Asian nations, where intellectual tracking is a rigorous and long-standing practice designed to weed out the “less fortunate.”
That was one of Buchanan’s asides, which you did not mention.
“In the public and parochial schools of the 1940s and 1950s, kids were pushed to the limits of their ability, then pushed harder. And when they stopped learning, they were pushed out the door.”
This was the system, still in use in parts of Asia today, in which I was raised, but which has fallen into disfavor. Was it really faulty, or was the way of the 1940’s and 1950’s displaced for mostly political reasons?
I think it was the latter and that the decision ought to be re-thought.
But enough of that – Brett Favre is an ass!
Admin
I’m well aware of your views on Freesmith. And Freesmith’s general (emphasis on general) political views. Was your “grow a pair” comment necessary? Is your New Year’s resolution to slam dunk, up front, everyone who rubs you the wrong way?
Look, this is your site, and I wouldn’t blame you for frosting my ass for implying how to run it. I would deserve it. But maybe letting Freesmith and others run with a few comments before visiting your wrath upon them may be a start to getting some fresh blood into the battle.
I’m running for cover as fast as I can.
SSS
Freesmith is free to post whatever he likes. His initial remark was his usual snide shot at TBP because he doesn’t like the message. If he wants to lead with a snide remark, I’ll take a shot back. He chose to take a shot rather than post something of substance. That is how it rolls on TBP.
Smokey and I have been going at it for two days with no hard feelings.
Is Andy Xie Jim Rogers? Is he Warren Buffett? Is he Bill Gates? Is he Smokey ? What would compel me to comment on remarks made by a deluded former Morgan Stanley underling? I promise you, I know more about China’s future than that douchebag can fathom. If that slant eyed faggot had the brains of a fucking insect, he’d pay me big bucks for financial advice.
Smokey
How could Freesmith think that our discussions aren’t worthy of his intelligence when you can provide such wisdom.
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“The inevitable progress of the Saeculum?” — Freesmith
OK, I’ll admit it …. I had to look up “Saeculum”. Anybody else?
Those damn Etruscans used the word first back in 8756 B.C. Some high brow stuff there! Anybody want to discuss Dick Clark??
Stuck
The Saeculum remark is Freesmith’s usual smug know it all reference to the Fourth Turning. He reads many books, but comprehension is not his strong point. He actually thinks Rush Limbaugh is a noble intellectual warrior. That should tell you everything you need to know.
Kids these days … uh huh.
I remember reading somewhere of an inscription in an Egyptian pyramid, along the lines of “the youth are going to the dogs.”
In musing over “Generations”, it seems the ‘lazy’ young today are in the same place as the Lost generation. When you’re three strikes and yer out before you even pick up the bat, well, just maybe, the cynical response has to be “who gives a fuck?”
What passes for an education in government schools these days is a joke — but the joke is on the next-elder generation while the kids can see the bullshit for what it is. And what they see ahead of them is grim reality in which little opportunity exists for them. Ask yourself i you would trade places?
StuckinNJ
Nice to see you.
“Saeculum?” No so highbrow, really. I just assumed that everybody on TBP had read “The Fourth Turning,” after the way Administrator so often references it in his featured articles.
By the way, who controls education and the schools in America today? Which entities and groups exert the greatest influence on contemporary pedagogy?
Is it Wall Street and the evil “banksters?” I’m not aware of the Goldman Sachs position on teaching 8th grade history.
Is it the Catholic Church, whose school system is slowly imploding nationwide?
Is it the “neo-cons,” the bete noire of Administrator and his intellectual ilk?
Or is it – could it be? – the activist, progressive wing of the Democrat Party and its allies in the universities, the teaching professions and the public sector unions?
Uh, oh – there goes that Freesmith again, insisting on his conservative political worldview, and telling us that we’ve got to engage in politics if we want to affect change.
And there he is, pointing the finger as usual at the organized criminal conspiracy known as the Democrats, even though everybody knows there’s absolutely no difference at all between the two political parties.
What a bore! Let’s get back to serious things.
That George W. Bush is a dummy!
Is single-malt Scotch all it’s cracked up to be?
Stuck
As soon as the Republicans can regain control of the schools, our children will all be as smart as George Bush, Sarah Palin and Rush Limbaugh. I can’t wait.
Unbelievable. Another moron.
RE
Administrator
People who believe that one thing tells you everything you need to know about a person usually have a lot to learn.
People who believe only standard issue Republicans have the answers have a lot to learn.
So your book list is there because it is profit-making. Surely not solely.
Perhaps you’d be open to some recommendations for additions to your list – wait, I think I already did that, and for free. How arrogant of me!
“People who believe only standard issue Republicans have the answers have a lot to learn.”
When I find one of those people I’ll let him know. 🙂
I know what books would be of interest to the people drawn to this site. Pure capitalism. Isn’t it wonderful? Maybe you can put your book list on your website.
There is much to learn and so little time.
“By the way, who controls education and the schools in America today?” — Freesmith
I guess in some districts Democrats. In others, Republicans. Seriously, how can you blame America’s education woes on just one party?? Haven’t Republicans and Democrats basically alternated control over the past umpteen years?
One must go back to the SOURCE of the problem.
I say it was Abraham Lincoln.
A Republican.
Born in Illinois.
Raised as a hillbilly in Kentucky.
Who had no formal education.
But became President.
He set the standard and lowered the bar.
And things haven’t been the same since.
And as proof I offer you another dumb fucker from Illinois.
Barack Hussain Obama.
Case closed.
Stucky wins.
Again.
Stuck
You are truly the Sage of TBP.
Stuck and Admin –
Wow! Hard to argue with that kind of logic.
So penetrating. So wise.
Not even the Etruscans could have said it better.
Well, let’s call that the last word on the subjects of American education, intellectual achievement by race and the two-party system.
Toodle-loo!
Note to self: NEVER respond to Freesmith again. What a humorless and arrogant SOB. Not the sharpest tool in the shed either.
We are a society that no longer listens to the wisdon of it’s elders. So we are now on the road to societal ruin. Why is it so difficult to see why our education system is failing us and the high school drop out rate is increasing? It is simple; we have departed from our old workable way and will not admit it. Instead of accepting our failure we continue to deny it and seek other hair brained ideas from people that have no clue about the art of educating and why we are educating.
My education in the school system was during the 50s and 60s. From K to 5th grade I got the basics of read, writing, arithmatic. In the 6th grade science was introduced and I did my first science project. During the 7th and 8th grades is when I was able to choose my electives that would lead me to my career choices. My choice was toward the vocational so I took mechanical drawing, metal shop, and music aside from the required topics. By the time I got into high school my education in those grades were directed toward the vocations so all my electives were the different vocational shops that were available. Others decided to gear their education toward college so their elective subjects and format was taylored toward collage. I had a great education. One element for learning we had back then was disipline; attention to the teacher was a must along with respect for your elders. This has been lost in our public school system today.
Vocational training has been taken out of our school systems of today. This probably was the result of social engineers that followed the trend our government was creating along with the large corporations of the globalization of our economy.
What our social engineers have failed to recognize in young people they are charged with educating for the future, is their predilections. Our social engineers are trying to gear education to what they think the country needs rather than what these young folks want and need. Young people forced to learn about subjects that don’t agree, or build, with their predilections lose interest. Introduce cellphones in the classroom and you have an escape mechanism.
Educators and social engineers have to recognize that young people have different predilections that need to be recognized and developed by our educational system. Our present education system is trying to educate according to what the federal government wants. Who are they to set the agenda for education? Our entire education system is a sham not geared to educate young minds but rather to brainwash them for political purposes.
Let’s go back to what worked for us in the 50s and 60s and I would bet the high school drop out rate would really fall.
I was born in a time when people had control of their own future. What has happened during my lifetime is the focus of self development has changed to what the government wants for us. This mindset has to change if our educational system is to be saved.
Well said, Thunderbird. Well said!!!
Us old farts grew up in a different era, a better era. Remember dress codes? Gasp!! Mouthing off to a teacher got you 5 days suspension. There was detention for chewing gum. The horrors!
Let’s go BACK to what worked? Nah!!! Makes too much sense ……
“Is it the Catholic Church, whose school system is slowly imploding nationwide?
—-Freesmith
Admin is much more qualified to comment on Catholic schools than I am, but here in Tucson, people trample all over each other to get their kids into Salpointe Catholic High School, which my grandaughter attends and takes college-level science courses (she’s a straight A student and just got a full 4 yr. scholarship to any of Arizona’s public universities). It is far and away the best high school in the city, perhaps the state. 100% of its grads go to college. It is a no nonsense school with stuff like dress codes and random drug testing. Kids who fail academically are…….gone. The faculty is the most highly qualified in the city and is paid on average LESS than public school teachers. Vacancies for teachers positions remain unfilled an average of 5 seconds. Maybe less.
Don’t know whether that’s typical of Catholic schools. Hopefully, it is.
SSS
I know that 98% of Lansdale Catholic seniors go to college. This is much higher than our local public high school that needs to have a police presence in the school on a daily basis.
I know that the Catholic Church is closing a lot of schools due to declining enrollment. People either can’t or aren’t willing to spend $6,000 per year to send their kids to Catholic HS. Payouts for priest abuse is also part of it.
Thunderbird
You’re starting to impress me with your sagacious comments. Don’t let that inflate your ego, because you have to keep in mind that it came from me, who, as you have undoubtedly noted, has become this site’s Rented Mule.
SSS
Your not the site’s rented mule, just our oldest mule.
Very good accurate observation RE. Two things are working against further commentary on this topic.
First, the thread s about to fall off the right side of page, “Latests Posts”. Once that happens, it’s Oblivion. Second, Jim has a new Featured article that will continually push this thread off the Recent Comments. Deeper Oblivion.
But I can assist you. This post will push it back on top. Then you can say ‘Thanks, Stucky” … preferably in under 10,000 words. Then I can ‘You’re welcome. Did it snow in Alaska today?”. Etc. Etc.
You should have waited until my comment was down at the bottom before responding. I should also have waited for your comment to drop down.
Jim really needs to get some new software driving this board. It sucks for real debate.
RE
RE
I actually read your last post above. Not bad, not bad at all, until I got to “The failure lies in the economic model of Capitalism. It lies in how value gets assigned to various jobs, and how many high value jobs a society can support at any given time. A society with vast quantities of cheap energy can support more high value jobs then a low energy agrarian society. The less cheap energy available, the fewer high value jobs you can support. It has less to do with the success of the education system than it does with the availability of cheap energy.” Groan.
Ok, you may be aware that I am a huge supporter of nuclear energy and have written one article on same here on TBP plus numerous comments. If we as a society get serious about a national nuclear energy program, it will not only save our capitalist economy (I realize you cringe at that thought), but our country itself. We don’t have much time left.
RE—-I’m going to ask you two sincere questions and I’d like honest answers. (1) Is there no fucking topic in existence that you don’t consider yourself an authority on? (2) Do you ever envision yourself, during this lifetime, being able to make a point in less than 3/4 of a page? Thank-you.
@SSS
🙂 I always throw in one of my trademark Anti-Capitalist arguments just to piss off the Capitalists on the board. It invariably gets me a response and keeps the thread active.
Far as Nukes rolling in to Save the Day, this is highly unlikely. It isn’t only the power generation problem anyhow, its the transmission line problem and the portability problem. I suggest you read Stoneleigh’s analysis of the Energy problem on Automatic Earth.
http://theautomaticearth.blogspot.com/2009/07/july-1-2009-renewable-power-not-in-your.html
She doesn’t treat Nuke power specifically in the article, but the power grid problems are there whether your source power is renewables or Nukes.
Beyond this you just have to look at France. France generates most of their electric power via Nukes, and they are the largest exporter of electric power in the world as well. This is not stopping France from going down the economic toilet with everybody else.
Its not a simple question of power generation facilities. Many of the systems we use for transportation and mining aren’t amenable to electric power as the motive force. Battery technologies do not exist to store the kind of power that a gallon of gas will store. Even the battery technologies that do exist are highly dependent on rare earth metal mining, which itself is highly dependent on Oil.
Nukes will not save Capitalism. So sorry.
RE
@Smokey
1) No
2) No
RE
1) Is there no fucking topic in existence that you don’t consider yourself an authority on? -Smokey
This from a guy who claims to win every debate due to his never being wrong [IE authority on every subject] ?
I cant believe you have the gall to even ask such a hypocritical question Smokey
When I went to public school here in Texas, back in 1968 thru about 1975 the school teacher could send you to the principals office and you would get beaten. I say beaten because the principal used a wood or plexiglass paddle, 1/2 thick two feet long and about 8 inches wide with holes drilled in it. You would be told to bend over and grab your ankles. You would get anywhere from one to three good hard ‘licks’ without every notifying your parent or asking permission and the parents sided with the school system.
RE
In my model, power grids are NOT the problem. The problem is solving the increasing demand for electrical power that we face. Power grids come with that issue. This is not France, which you claim exports nuclear power. Who do WE export power to? Canada or Mexico, awash in their ability to generate power? No. We, and only we, need that power. And only we can solve that problem. Power grids are a key, yes. First, we have to get the power to those grids. How?
We can solve the transmission problems with giant reactor plants colocated with current plants, or, as Admin has suggested, smaller reactors where needed in rural areas. Nuclear power is the only currently available answer. So sorry.
Some big wind farms here in Tejas.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_Texas
Wind power in Texas consists of many wind farms with a total installed nameplate capacity of 9,410 MW[1] from over 40 different projects
Not my claim SSS, comes from Wikipedia:
“France is also the world’s largest net exporter of electric power, exporting 18% of its total production (about 100 TWh) to Italy, the Netherlands, Belgium, Britain, and Germany, and its electricity cost is among the lowest in Europe.[1][2] France’s nuclear power industry has been called “a success story” that has put the nation “ahead of the world” in terms of providing cheap, CO2-free energy.[3] However, France’s nuclear reactors are mainly used in load-following mode and some reactors close on weekends because there is no market for the electricity.[4][5] This means that the capacity factor is low by world standards, which is not an ideal economic situation for nuclear plants.[4]”
How do you propose to finance the small plants in rural areas? How do you resolve the problems of overcapacity necessary for maximum load times? These locations cannot maintain the tax bill they have just to do maintenance on their old infrastructure, much less build all the new stuff you propose here. You gonna have Helicopter Ben conjure the money up out of thin air? What?
RE
Kill Bill——-Those wind farms you provided a link to are potentially an excellent source of energy. When I was in grad school in Texas in the mid eighties, one of my buddies did his thesis on the feasibility of wind farms for power generation. The study concluded that the wind farms were not economically feasible AT THAT TIME. I think you can see where I’m going with this. With the price of energy much higher now and peak oil here, wind may be the most economically viable solution. And the way to get the MOST energy from the wind source, in my opinion, is for you and RE to keep several generators nearby when you suck each other off. Convert all that massive blowjob wind into energy and we may not have to attack China and kill their citizens for their oil, after all.
Smokey – if we could attach a generator to RE’s typing finger we could power the lower forty- eight.