I find it absolutely stunning whenever a government official tells the unvarnished blunt truth. Do you loan someone more money when they don’t have the means to repay what they have borrowed already? The evilness of central bankers is revealed in this short exchange. It’s time to end Wimpy economics.
Greece’s New FinMin Explains “This Is What Happens When You Humiliate A Nation & Give It No Hope”
Submitted by Tyler Durden on 01/27/2015 13:19 -0500
“This is not blackmail,” explains new Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis, “we simply want to end this seemingly never-ending Greek Crisis.” In what must be worryingly calm and simple to comprehend words for Brussels, Varoufakis tells CNBC’s Michelle Caruso-Cabrera, “this is what happens when you humiliate a nation and don’t give it any hope.” Carefully noting that membership in the Euro is not imperative, Varoufakis concludes “bankruptcy cannot be dealt with by borrowing more,” asking rhetorically, “how can I look the German and Finnish taxpayer in the eye and tell them you know I can’t really pay you the money I have already borrowed from you…” but lend me more so I can pay back the ECB?
As Varoufakis explains, he believes Europe is willing to negotiate haircuts – anything else appears a waste of time.
(our apologies for the audio quality)
Bankruptcy, default and repudiation…coming to an economy near you!
What do they make in that country? Besides olives and olive oil? Grapevine leaves?
They have defaulted several other times – fuck’em.
Can you imagine the excoriation this guy would get from the press and ‘economists’ if he were a politician here?
There are signs that the tide is turning, even if it’s one little piece at a time.
“First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, and then you win.”
I second Dutchman’s comment. Stupid fucks have not even made a decent attempt to fix their basic issues.
I haven’t been to Greece in many years, but I remember it as a wonderful place with great people. Just like every other nation, they’ve been screwed by their politicians, corporations, and financial industry. America is in the same boat–we just don’t realize it yet.
This guy may be fish food soon.As John Perkins said in Confessions Of An Economic Hitman….now they’ll send in the jackals.
I’m not so hard on the Greeks, they have one of the weakest economies, so they will be one of the first ones to fall on the knife. But ECB central banker and the Euro Zone let this happen.
One example: The German went to the Greek Navy and talked them into buying 3 or 4 of these really expensive coastal submarine that run on hydrogen and are hugely costly to maintain. Of course they were bought on credit that Greece could ill afford. Here is a tourist economy country buying over priced shit that they cannot afford, and Germany know this, but treats most of Europe as her colonies.
Spain, Portugal, Italy will be the next three to default, and then France and Belgium. This debt tidal wave will one day wash up on our shores also. Debt slavery is all about control and bankers are only too happy to give credit and let you fall into slavery.
Again, GOOD for the Greek people !!!
Some people say the Greeks have it coming to them, and go on to characterize them as lazy and corrupt bums. Bullshit. No doubt, some are …. but, imho, most are not.
Imagine some foreigners commenting after we collapse — “those fucking Americans had it coming to them, creating money out of thin air, spending like crazy, and getting all kinds of free shit” —– which is true for some, but not all, and certainly not you or I. Same goes for the Greeks. Characterizing an entire nation’s problems to people being lazy-and-corrupt is an incredibly lame/weak argument.
HERE is the real source of the problem. It IS the policies of the troika ((the European Central bank, the IMF, the European Commission) which has caused massive economic damage that will take decades to repair, and has produced untold social pain and misery. Fuck THEM.
Their bailout packages ensured the repayment of loans to Europe’s banks ….. at the expense of Greek people, all of them. The austerity measures were EXTREMELY harsh … look it up ….. destroying the very dignity and hope of a people …. and that by non-elected and unaccountable officials, greedy neoliberal barbarian cockfuks in the EU/IMF working for whom? ….. the banks and financial elite. Anyone taking their side should reexamine their priorities.
HOW much more austerity is needed? HOW can they possibly repay? Should they start selling body parts?
Austerity has ruined the economy. About 100,000 companies have been driven out of business … a huge huge number for such a small country. Employment is officially at 25% … but they fuckin lie just like our own BLS, so the number is likely much higher. Public companies have been sold to multinationals … who strip it of every asset as they bleed it out. Pension funds are gone. They impoverished a nation … and now they want to humiliate every last peon alive.
And still, it’s not enough. It doesn’t appear – at this point – that the ravenous Troika is willing to bend an inch. The German Finance Minister, Wolfgang Schaüble (German for ‘cockfuk banker’) basically just said yesterday the Greeks just have to accept austerity, the Troika’s control, and work harder. Unfuckingbelievable.
God only knows how this stalemate will end, but it doesn’t look pretty at this point.
Another example I have heard about is the derivatives that were foisted on them 10-15 years ago by Goldman-Sachs which ballooned their debt massively when it was supposed to provide them some protection(!), similar to what happened to Jefferson County, Alabama.
You nailed it Stucky.
Stucky and Didius – bull-fucking-shit.
“In the last quarter of 2005, participation in tax evasion reached an estimated 49% of the population,[2] while in January 2006 it fell to 41.6%”.
“A study by researchers from the University of Chicago concluded that tax evasion in 2009 by self-employed professionals alone in Greece (accountants, dentists, lawyers, doctors, personal tutors and independent financial advisers) was €28 billion or 31% of the budget deficit that year”
The Greeks are world-class tax evaders. The only folk who pay taxes are the govt employees – who make up a huge percent of the workforce, owing to the rampant corruption and crony-ism. The rest evade taxes. Taxes are considered optional.
$28 billion Euros would service the fucking debt everyone is talking about. Probably even half that would.
If by good people you mean tax evaders, then, yep, Greeks are good people.
You say it is the fault of the banks. Bullshit again. Who borrowed the money and what was it used for? Here is a clue – it was spent on govt employees and social welfare by and large.
Germany has around 11% of its workforce as government employees. Greece – the country sucking at Germany’s tit – has around 17% of its workforce on the govt tit. Gee, isn’t that special. But I guess that is the fucking bank’s fault, right? No way that is the fault of the Greek people, now is it? (Anyone remember the riots when it was suggested that number be cut? No-o-o-o. It was the bank’s fault).
Did the bank’s falsify the financial position of Greece? (Goldman did, but they are not the ones we are talking about).
What about the Greeks being able to take early retirement at age 58? Gee, I guess that is the fucking bank’s fault too. Germans get to retire at 65, while subsidizing early Greek retirement.
The loss of 100,000 businesses? Gee, I wonder if any of them were reliant on the flow of borrowed money?
Did the banks create the system where certain industries are 100% protected by law, and no competition was allowed? Hell no – the Greeks did that, and it has not changed.
So, let me sum it up this way:
– the Greeks public service is bloated beyond all reason
– they give early retirement at 58
– they evade around 35 Billion Euro in taxes each year
– they have rampant corruption in industry
– they spent the borrowed money inflating govt salaries, pensions, and welfare
– the Greek govt spends 60% – 60%!!!!! – of GDP. Are you fucking kidding me!!!!
And it is the bank’s fault? Are you fucking shitting me?
The debt stopped flowing. So they Greeks could no longer pay for all the free shit.
And get this you Einsteins – GREECE HAS NOT REPAID ANY DEBT WHATSOEVER as of yet.
THEY ARE STILL BORROWING MONEY. The money borrowed allows them to roll-over the debt they already owe.
Greece’s problem is that they are being asked to live within their means. Austerity my ass – they are simply not being allowed to keep borrowing money to fund social welfare.
Greece wants to continue to run budget deficits. It wants the debt written off so it can return to running deficits. It is that fucking simple.
By austerity thy mean “living within their means”.
The current unemployment levels, etc., reflect the fact that their fucking entire economy was over-inflated by borrowed money, which has dried up. Their current status simply reflects what the real status of the economy is.
And the fucking stupid ass Greeks still have not addressed their basic issues – rampant tax avoidance, corruption, protectionist policies, welfare spending, early retirement, etc.
The banks should not have originally lent them the money. But the Greeks bear the responsibility for having spent the money like drunken sailors on perishable expenditures.
And the fucking Greeks still have not fixed a damn thing. They are right where they deserve to be. Their “economy” depended on the flow of borrowed money. That is gone. And so now they have reached their real position – they have an economy that is fucked, and essentially non-existent. And it will remain so until it addresses its core issues.
You guys really should use facts, and not assume everything is the bank’s fault.
Even if the debt is written off, unless the Greeks are allowed to borrow money again, nothing will change. And there is no one who will lend them money until they fix their issues.
Those Greek fucks
Llpoh
What bank in their right mind would loan money to Greece?
Everything you say about Greece is correct. So what legitimate highly educated banker would loan them a dime?
And not only did they lend them a dime, they loaned them billions of dimes.
Goldman Sachs taught their government how to fake their fiscal situation to get into the EU. Goldman Sachs knowingly helped them commit fraud.
They owe the most money to German banks. Their bailout was giving them more debt to pay the interest on existing debt. It has all been a sham to keep the European banks from taking the losses that are absolutely inevitable. The Greeks spent all the money on welfare shit, as you declare.
It’s time to end the charade. The new Greek government should default on the debt, because there is no way they can’t. Then we can see who was really swimming naked.
If Greece leaves the EU, they devalue their currency and start over with no debt. They go back to being a backwards resort country and no one will lend them money, so they will have to live within their means.
Greece is currently paying 2% interest on the debt owed. So they have an interest bill of Euro 6 – 7 billion per year. They are being allowed to roll over the debt as it comes due, if they control their budget – which they are not doing.
The new govt wants to trim the payments even further – even to the point of having it written off – so as to allow the Greek poor to receive “free” electricity, which was promised in the election.
You cannot make this shit up.
And people think it is the bank’s fault. Unreal.
“The Greeks are world-class tax evaders.” ————- Llpoh
Yes. That is true.
============================================
“There are two sides of the public finance coin: expenditure and revenue. What is left out is that while Greek public spending and debt crept up, government revenue fell or remained constant in the years after Greece adopted the euro. Between 2001 and 2007 Greece’s average government revenues totaled 39.4% of GDP, whereas the EU average was 44.4%. Taxes are by far the largest component of government revenue. The issue is not unique to Greece. Declining tax revenues were observed in Ireland, Spain, and in the U.S. after the Bush tax cuts kicked in.
In Greece the culprit has been rampant tax evasion by corporations owing millions in taxes and self-employed professionals who can hide their earnings, unlike salaried employees and pensioners. Under international pressure to balance its budget, the outgoing Greek government axed salaries and pensions and slapped new taxes on the bulk of citizens who were not tax-delinquent. This only drove the country deeper into recession and insolvency, making it necessary for EU leaders to write off part of Greece’s debt in July and then again in October.”
.
http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2011/11/20/what-really-went-wrong-in-greece/
Greece govt spends about 110 billion Euro per year, 60% of GDP, has a deficit of around $20 billion Euro a year, and the interest bill is around 7 billion a year.
So even if the EU writes of ALL the debt, Greece is facing a deficit of 13 billion Euro a year, plus current promises of some extra billions for free electricity and such.
The Greeks simply cannot fund the deficit if they leave the Euro, as no one will lend them money – so in that situation they are TRULY fucked.
And they cannot fund the deficit if they stay in the Euro and the debt is written off, if the EU does not loan them more money. Which will not happen.
Do you really think Germany and the Finns are going to say – “hell, we forgive the debt, plus here is another 20 billion Euros each year to cover your deficit because we love you so much, and because we just know you will pay this loan off because you pinkie swear . Plus, you can keep your early retirement, your bloated govt service, your protected industries, your tax evasion, and hey, sure, go ahead and give folks free electricity. No problemo. Sure, we will loan you 20 billion a year for as long as you want it.”
Not. Going. To. Happen.
“And it is the bank’s fault? Are you fucking shitting me?” ———- Llpoh
Yes. For the very reasons you stated just previous to asking that question.
You didn’t answer this before when I posted it — perhaps you just missed it — so I will state it again.
Suppose Bank Of America makes a $500,000 shitty Option ARM loan to a borrower who they know by EVERY CONCEIVABLE METRIC either is not able to pay, or won’t if if he could, or even both. Yet, the bank lends him the money anyway, and then the schmuck defaults. Who is really at fault here; the borrower or lender? It’s the lender, of course, for not practicing Due Diligence.
The EU probably never should have approved Greece’s entry in the first place. But, by doing so, they made it incredibly easy for the country to borrow money …. cuz bankers and their countries love debt slaves. Again, it’s on the banks and the EU.
“…. as no one will lend them money ” ——- Llpoh
We heard the same refrain when Argentina completely defaulted on their debt. Within a few short years bankers were beating a path to Argentina making them more loans.
“You’ll never be able to borrow again!!!” …. that’s the Cry Of Desperation from currently fucked Creditors. This too shall pass.
Stuck – your last post also shows the real issue – the Greeks were taking in 40% of GDP, and spending 60% of GDP. The difference of 20% was the amount funded by borrowing. Which has dried up.
32 per cent of Greeks are self-employed (around 25%+ of all employee are govt employees!), which is one reason for the ability of the Greeks to get away with massive tax evasion. That 32% do not pay taxes. In the US, the Clammy’s of the world are reasonably few. In Greece, they are a huge percent of the economy.
And yet Greece steadfastly refuses to drop their spending to appropriate levels, and even wants to start giving away even more fee shit like free electricity.
It is fucked up and bullshit.
IIoph- That was quite the dissertation, your portrayal of the Greeks chronic spending habits was spot on. That said if you have casually watched the Greeks fall into this Pit of Insolvency over the years, have not the banks as well?
Yes, you know they have, they damn well better have, where is their due diligence in the transaction?
If your fucking asking me to shed a tear for the Bansters, who did absolutely nothing but punch some fucking keys and wink the money into the Greek accounts, your gonna have to try again.
Fuck the Banksters they need to get burned in this just as bad if not worse for enabling this obvious clusterfuck, and that is exactly what this is: a Grade A Clusterfuck, you know it, I know it, and the fuckin banks knew it all along.
Both parties need to share in the flames, not just the underepresented Greek’s, the Banksters dont get a pass, their innocence is pure satire.
Stuck – no one will lend them money for a few short years. Is that better? And how dow you think Greece will do with a massive deficit for a few short years? Until that is brought under control, no one will lend them money.
I would guess that unemployment would hit 40% if they leave the EU, as they will have to balance their budget in the short term, so as to later be able to convince some sucker to loan them money again.
“The new govt wants to trim the payments even further – even to the point of having it written off” ———–Llpoh
Absolutely untrue. You are just making stuff up.
The new Leftist government ran on a platform to end austerity by renegotiating the debt towards more favorable terms. There is no statement you can find where they said “Default”. Defaulting would mean exiting the Euro … and the still overwhelming majority of Greeks want to keep the Euro … and not print Drachmas.
Otto – I am not crying a tear for the banksters.
One thing, though. The Greeks falsified their books, which in turn lead to banks having some confidence in loaning them money. The Greeks committed a giant fraud on the banks, make no mistake. The fraud was not caught early enough. And yes, the banks have some responsibility for due diligence.
But to let fraudsters off the hook? That is some serious bullshit there. The Greek people did not do the fraud, but contributed to the fuck up in so many other ways.
Goldman Sachs showed the Greeks how to falsify their books. Any banker worth their weight could have figured out they falsified their books. Greece is only the first domino. Spain, Italy, Portugal and Ireland are all insolvent. It’s time to fuck the bankers and force this issue to be resolved. You cannot solve a problem of unpayable debt by providing more debt to governments that can’t pay.
Ok, which financial institution will be crushed by those CDS contracts they issued on the defaulting Greek bonds, first?
I’m guessing AIG.
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“And how do you think Greece will do with a massive deficit for a few short years?” —–Llpoh
Much better than the draconian austerity programs they’re facing right now. Do you even know the situation? The bankers are absolutely raping and bleeding the country. If this keeps up unborn Greeks a hundred years from now will still be in debt. Better to bite the bullet NOW, suffer, and rebuild.
The USA!USA!USA! will be in the same boat in the near future. Will you be defending the banks here in America?
Stuck – seriously? Again that is bullshit. You are mistaken. Of course Syriza called for right-offs. That was their fucking platform.
From the BBC “That could create a big dilemma for Syriza, which has campaigned on a platform of writing off of a sizeable part of Greece’s enormous debt”
From the Telegraph: ” Syriza would like to secure forgiveness of a large chunck of the debt Greece owes to its eurozone partners.”
” “More than 50 percent of Greek debt needs to be written off,” says top Syriza economist John Milios.
So, big boy, what you got? I can continue pasting quotes that show you are “mistaken”.
Even if the interest rate on the debt was ZERO, Greece is in problems. They still need to fund the 13 billion Euro deficit that would exist (plus free electricity of course), and the only way that is going to happen is if they agree to cut the deficit and stop spending money they do not have.
llpoh, most excellent observation. You have actually to one degree or another outlined the situation or developing situation for most all nations in the western world. And you are correct it is not always the Bankers fault. But we should still kill them all anyway.
Stuck – how are they bleeding the country? What austerity programs are you talking about? You mean the govt spending “only” 60% of GDP? The early retirement? Having 40% more Govt employees than well run countries?
They are running a deficit net of interest payments. The banks are loaning them money steadily (rolling over the debt).
What austerity are you talking about? Really, what are you talking about? The banks are making them stop spending so much money they do not have. What should they be doing – just giving them money with no conditions so the debt can blow out further? The 6 or 7 billion in interest is neither here nor there to the banks. They hope to preserve their capital.
But re austerity, the Greeks ain’t seen nothing yet. If they leave the Euro, and cannot fund their deficit – then they will see some real austerity. They will have to cut another 20% of govt spending immediately. That will hurt, let me tell you.
Stucky – yes, banks need to suffer the losses when they make bad loans. I fully agree.
But in this instance, 1) Greece committed massive fraud in order to get into the EU, which “tricked” banks on their financial position, and need to pay one hell of a penalty for said fraud, 2) they STILL have not addressed their spending issues, and 3) the “austerity” being “forced” on them is NOTHING compared to the austerity that will hit them if the leave the EU, and are unable to fund their budget deficit.
Personally, I agree with Admin. They should default. And they should accept the massive fucking they will get. Get the fucking over with. It will take 5 years of 40% unemployment, and probably a further 10 years of crawling out of the gutter to 2nd world status. They will then have paid a massive penalty for their sins. I doubt, them being Greeks and all, whether they will learn a damn thing from it, though.
And we will see if the asshole banks do in fact change their ways any.
Admin – you forgot France. France is on the list, too.
Sweden, Belgium and the UK are also on the list. Europe has proven that socialism is great until you run out of other people’s money to spend. Norway will now get fucked with crashing oil prices. They lived high on the hog at $120 oil.
Bruce- ” But we should still kill them all anyway. ” That’s funny shit.
Clearly extremist speech, but damn funny.
Llpoh
What’s the difference between Greek Debt and USA Debt?
A: The USA!USA!USA! can print it’s own money. Too bad Greece can’t print it’s way out of this mess. The ECB — their version of The Fed — won’t allow it. Bastards.
Hey, here’s a really decent write-up (probably making more of your points) about Greece and the Euro. Really, I generally get bored to death with financial articles, but this one lays it out nicely and simply;
http://www.indiana.edu/~eucenter/documents/Euro-and-Greece-Explained.pdf
The base problem is that banks in Germany are leveraged at, by memory, way over 50 to 1. Might as well be 1 million to one.
And so if the Greeks default, it wipes hundreds of billions in assets of the balance sheets, and the banks are likely to go negative equity. Negative equity in the real world = bankrupt. I am unsure what it means in the fake world of money printing – I suspect money will be printed to recapitalize the banks.
But whatever, it will be a massive hit to the financial system which has effectively zero reserves.
Admins, Lord Acton quote is showing signs of percipience.
“The issue which has swept down the centuries and which will have to be fought sooner or later is the people versus the banks.”
John Emerich Edward Dalberg-Acton
Stuck – the problem the southern countries in the EU have is largely that – they do not control their own currency and cannot devalue their currency (ie print, baby, print).
If Greece goes on the drachma, they will be able to print. But they will not be able to afford to buy in anything for some long time, as the drachma will be more or less worthless for quite a while. Inflation could be a pretty severe issue as they print away.
The Chinese are positively drooling about the likely garage sale.
Stuck – good article you posted, simple in explaining things.
I’m leaning more toward Stuck & Otto than Lipoh, but gotta say, where else are you going to find this much fun on a boring Tuesday night.
I’m thinking this is much like the Icelanders and before you say “different” let me please point out Icelanders get their juice for free due to all the geo-thermal. Plus lots of free public spas. I say good for the Greeks. Let them work out their own problems without these greasy, makes a used-car-salesman-look-honest Banksters and their “solutions”.
Westcoaster – this has been downright civil. I thought for sure the “stupid motherfucker” and “blow me, asshole” comments would be flying by now.
Westcoaster – BTW – blow me, asshole. 🙂
You are on the wrong side of this. Facts trump visceral hatred of banks (not that there is anything wrong with that).
“Stuck – seriously? Again that is bullshit. You are mistaken. Of course Syriza called for right-offs. That was their fucking platform.” —————– Llpoh
First of all, for your own benefit and well being, please stop quoting BRITISH NEWSPAPERS!! They are like Fux and CuNNt … wouldn’t know the truth if it crawled up their asses and made residence for a year. Hell, they still think the Russians shot down flight MH17.
They are looking at the OLD platform. Here is how they had to change, in order to win;
================================================================
“Syriza retreated from its early, openly confrontational stance toward Greece’s international creditors, which called for a unilateral end of the bailout agreement; instead, the party opted for a POLICY OF RENEGOTIATION of Greece’s debt, with an emphasis on the need for a significant write-down of Greek public debt, which has increased substantially since the introduction of the bailout agreement and most of it is held by European institutions.”
http://truth-out.org/news/item/28773-paint-the-town-red-syriza-s-historic-victory-and-the-steep-road-to-greek-recovery
(Now, technically, any modification of a debt is a default. But, I think you and I are using default to mean Total Repudiation.)
Also, lengthy article here from the NYT … only talks about renegotiating the debt, not repudiating it ———— http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/26/world/europe/greek-election-syriza.html?_r=0
Westcoaster – I am just sure the Icelanders LOVED the 33% drop in their GDP.
The Greeks would likely take that hit and perhaps more (not counting the drop they already took) if they drop out of the EU.
Still, it is what needs to happen. Gotta pay the piper sooner or later.
Here is one of those “Debts Visualized” info-graphics. Pretty cool … but waay to huge to copy here.
Titled “Who Loaned Greece The Money”
Looks like a LOT of banks are fucked. heh heh
http://demonocracy.info/infographics/eu/debt_greek/debt_greek.html
Stuck – I think perhaps you misread what I said, or I said it poorly. I think we are actually saying the same thing.
Your quote above says that they want the debt written down. That is what I said, too (actually I said written off – write down/write off: po-tay-to/po-tah-to). Syriza wants the debt written down. Ie. it wants the debt reduced, by at least half.
Right-offs = write down = write off. They want the debt reduced. Lower interest rates will do them little or no good, as they still need to roll the debt over regularly, and banks want trade-offs to do that.
Default on the debt would mean leaving the EU. And that means they would take one hell of a short to mid-term spanking. Still, best to get it over with.
And if you get to quote that turd of a newspaper the NYT, I get to use the BBC. I will stop if you do!
Banks have found Free Shitters in Greece and let them drown their profligate selves. banks knew all along it would happen. They were counting on the EuroZone to make them whole.they were playing musical chairs and figured the music would stop when they had the advantage. Greece isn’t cooperating, we’ll se how it works out.
Llpoh
OK, yeah, we’re saying the same thing …. I mostly misunderstood.
I just KNEW you would nail me for referencing the NYT. I’ll stop now!
Did you check out that Debt Visualized link? We’ll also agree on this; regardless of how it gets resolved, it’s a MASSIVE CLUSTERFUK for everyone involved, people, banks, nations …
Yep it is a clusterfuck. Aand this is just the tip of the tip of the tip-top of the iceberg.
I love those graphics, Stuck. I want the Empire State sized pile.
Do we have any folks of Greek origin here on TBP?
I spent 18 months in Athens. Generally, really really nice people. Nice looking women, even if they don’t shave their armpits.
Also, here in the USA …. generally very hard working …. large population in NJ … lots of diners, bakeries, cleaners, beauty salons … they seem to gravitate to business ownership …. I’ve known a lot of Greeks here in the USA, never known one to be a lazy SOB.
In manufacturing, in my experience, we generally try to avoid hiring Greeks.
They frequently get what is referred to as the Greek back. We would find a poor old (or young) Greek (sarcasm on), sitting on the floor, squealing like a pig, claiming his back gave out. No witnesses, ever. Have seen it many times.
They have a rep for back “injuries”. Great little earner for them.
Best to avoid hiring them, in my experience.
Admin thanks for putting the quote out there, ill commit it to memory, for our place and time, it is certainly worthy.