BITCOIN: Can’t hold it in my hand, don’t want it, ever.
When the lights finally go out for extended periods ( see North
Korea Electrification post just below ) JUST HOW WILL BIT-
COIN MANAGE TO FUNCTION ?
After a huge solar flare that lands on New York, Zurich and
London – – and which knocks out the bankster tribe’s computer
systems of world domination, JUST HOW WILL BITCOIN MAN-
AGE TO FUNCTION ?
After the Chinese set off an EMP shockwave just over Omaha,
knocking out Berkshire Hathaway and all other North American
financial computer systems used by the top 1% of the top 1% ,
JUST HOW WILL BITCOIN MANAGE TO FUNCTION AT ALL ?
Just thinking out loud .
SnowieGeorgie
Chicago999444
September 30, 2015 2:54 pm
Echo “snowiegeorgie”- I tend to be very distrustful of a “currency” that can only be accessed electronically- we’re already dependent enough on brittle, delicate, complex information systems that are extremely vulnerable to events out of our control. It would take an EMP to lose access to anything you have to get on the web to get at.
Seems to me to be the opposite of what you try to accomplish with all your preps, which is to be as resilient and independent as possible, and to have what you need in your hands. If things were to come to such a pass as the cash in your hand is worthless, what will anything that can only be accessed electronically be worth?
ASIG
September 30, 2015 3:01 pm
Bit coin is a fiat currency totally dependent on the internet and some complex accounting structure. If that accounting is compromised by some bug or virus or the internet itself fails in any way then there’s nothing.
AND—- IT”S GONE!!!
IndenturedServant
September 30, 2015 4:55 pm
Nope!
Stephanie Shepard
September 30, 2015 5:20 pm
Oh, the naysayers! I will stick with my Bitcoin and altcoins. Cryptocurrencies are too fascinating to me to follow the crowd.
Stephanie Shepard
September 30, 2015 6:10 pm
T4C- Let me wax metaphysically to you a moment. Everything in the Universe is bound by natural law. This includes money, because it exists it must also act within the laws of physics. Money isn’t an object and you can’t own it. You can use it, but you will never own it. You can hold it, but you can never own it. Because it is a representation of energy and its purpose is to exchange the value of energy peer-to-peer.
When the founding fathers drafted the constitution is was based on the natural rights of man. Where the founders came up short was when it came to money. They could never quite figure out how to create a separation between money and state. BTC/cryptos are the very first type money to be issued for the people by the people. There are corporations/banks trying to separate BTC from the Blockchain in order to solely use the Blockchain technology But they are coming up short because “form follows function”.
bb
September 30, 2015 10:15 pm
Wonder Boy ….what do you mean by nope ?
EL Coyote
September 30, 2015 10:18 pm
bb, let’s not offend Inter-Stellar, I want to read his thorough review of The Martian as soon as he posts it.
EL Coyote
September 30, 2015 11:02 pm
Snowey Georgie takes a leap into the Abyss, be sure to post a selfie!
If computers go down, more than bitcoins will disappear. Civilization as we know it will cease. Bitcoins will be the least of your worries.
If you can strip away the infrastructure upon which trade and currencies depend, you have bitcoin, a digital credit in the most convenient accounting method you may choose, not inflatable, not traceable, not taxable directly or easily devalued by the manipulation of external bases of value such as stocks or precious metals.
My bank card already rewards me with credits also called points that are convertible into cash or material rewards. I can’t hold these points or transfer them to a separate bank account without converting them into cash. If I break the terms of the card agreement, I forfeit my paper gains.
BEA LEVER
September 30, 2015 11:20 pm
Shitcoin- Because a sucker is born every minute.
Shitcoin- Because the electricity never goes down and EMP is just a scare tactic.
Shitcoin- Because you can never be robbed of your money…Oh wait………Right.
No Way….No How…No Time……..NO THANKS………Period.
Gold is money………you CAN own gold……..some minnies here are very confused. That includes silver. Get a clue.
Chris Webb
October 1, 2015 1:58 am
Unless the entire global internet goes down, an EMP won’t take down bitcoin since the blockchain is globally decentralized. If you’ve got your keys you’ll still have your bitcoins once your local access to the internet is re-established. Also, those of you saying that if you can’t hold it in your hand, it’s not real, don’t understand the nature of value. Gold doesn’t have value because it’s a physical rock, it has value because people believe it has value. Saying that bitcoin doesn’t have value because you can’t hold it is like saying that an email doesn’t have value compared to a ‘real’ letter because you can’t hold it. The value of a letter is not its format but rather its message. Same thing for bitcoin. You guys are limiting yourself to an analog mindset in a digital world.
Winston
October 1, 2015 7:27 am
I always think of Hitler when thinking of bitcoin
“How fortunate for leaders that men do not think.”
If you think for a moment that the government does not have COMPLETE control over bitcoin, you are truly fooling yourself. Look at what the government works hard to suppress. It is not bitcoin. Gold and silver. If you can’t hold it, you don’t own it. Simple as that.
Anonymous
October 1, 2015 10:38 am
“Everything in the Universe is bound by natural law. This includes money, because it exists it must also act within the laws of physics.”
Interesting thought from a deterministic POV, but I don’t buy it. Energy (the laws of physics in general) exist whether humans (or any theoretical sentient species) are there to observe it or not. Not true with money. Money is an ENTIRELY human construct. Carrying the thought further, money (as a concept) no matter what form, only has value when people desire it, which only happens when they believe it has value. This includes all fiat, gold, silver, cryptocurrencies…everything.
In pre-Colombian South America, the natives around Bogota used salt as money. They had a tremendous amount of gold and emeralds, but they used them only in religious ceremonies. Salt was used for commerce.
Now, moving specifically towards Bitcoin: it has a lot of great qualities. The number in existence is capped mathematically and cannot be changed, it is infinitely divisible and so would be a deflationary currency–benefiting savers and producers rather than lenders, money-changers and speculators like debt-based fiat. Most importantly, Blockchain technology allows for confidence without authority–in other words, disputes do not need to be ruled upon by courts or any government agents. From this it would seem a perfect libertarian currency.
BUT…I think there are HUGE drawbacks, as well. First, like everyone mentions it doesn’t work without power, without the internet. Second, it is incredibly complex system and its complexity is ever increasing. Systems with increasing complexity tend to collapse catastrophically. Also, it is very complex from a individual POV…most find it intimidating (which does not exactly inspire confidence..again the ONLY thing that gives any currency value). Finally, the biggest drawback of all, the Bitcoins in existence are already concentrated in that hands of just a few people. If it were to be a major currency that everyone needed to survive…well, these people would simply become our new rulers.
Chris Webb
October 1, 2015 10:44 am
If the electrical system goes down, the entire financial system will down with it, not just bitcoin. Nobody is advocating that you only own bitcoin, but rather use it for daily transactions and continue using precious metals and whatnot as your long term store of wealth. As in all things, diversify.
DRUD
October 1, 2015 11:22 am
Above Anon was I.
DRUD
October 1, 2015 11:24 am
@Chris Webb- You are right of course…just taking a high-level pass at BC and crypto-currencies in general.
Anonymous
October 1, 2015 11:43 am
TPTB are jacking off in great anticipation of a whole generation of fuknuts like CW and SS who will be much easier prey than those who had NO trust in banks and dealt in paper currency. Most do not understand that when there is only electronic currency there will come a time when critical words against Dear Leader will be cause for TPTB to clean out your account and you will be shit out of luck.
Good luck with that maroons.
Chris Webb
October 1, 2015 11:54 am
If you think that the banks or government can clear out your bitcoin accounts, you obviously have no fucking idea what you are talking about.
AnarchoPagan
October 1, 2015 12:03 pm
Feel free to criticize or reject Bitcoin, but don’t do it for the wrong reasons. Your coins really can’t be stolen or your account “cleaned out” unless someone can get hold of your cryptographic keys. In the event of a power outage, a Bitcoin account is much safer than other electronic accounts, e.g. bank accounts, because it is decentralized. I would use it for transactions, but not as a store of value, because in a SHTF condition, confidence in it could go instantly to zero.
TPC
October 1, 2015 12:07 pm
Just because it can’t be hacked right now doesn’t mean it won’t be able to be hacked in the future.
If I’m going to invest my cash in alternate currencies I’ll look to tangible items first and foremost.
Bitcoin has never been hacked; those were exchanges and online wallets that were compromised. Would you denounce gold if Fort Knox was robbed? It’s the same thing. If you keep your bitcoins in your own offline wallet, they cannot be stolen unless you’re a retard and give your key out.
http://alphabaymarket.tumblr.com
October 2, 2015 3:49 am
Restricting OPSEC leakages is a secret for dark net market customers given that threat is intrinsic.
Winston
October 2, 2015 7:11 am
Please fucking please tell me the difference between bitcoin and the fucking system we are under now? Just because it has a fixed amount now, does not mean it can’t be changed in the future.
If the NSA CIA and all the other alphabet agencies could take control of shitcoin (Which I am positive they can) do you think they would ring a bell and tell you. Hell, they probably created it, since no one really knows where the fuck it came from. Oh yea, that’s a great idea. I am backing up the truck on shitcoin!
The mere existence of shitcoin, means it is no threat to the current system. Now look at the dude who made silver liberty dollars and even inferred they were real money. He is on ice for a long time.
Winston
October 2, 2015 7:25 am
Oh and another thing. For you people who insist that shitcoin can’t be hacked I have two words for you.
Quantum computers
They are real, and take a guess who has them. As far as being offline, the NSA can, thanks to your friends at Intel, connect to you computer ANYTIME with no TCP/IP connection. They can do it will RF that is built into every Intel CPU, or they can do it through the power lines of the computer when it is plugged in to a power outlet.
A quantum computer can rip ANY current crypto key to shreds in a matter of, hours, sometimes minutes.
The problem is, our friends at the NSA have this, we do not. Don’t look for this to change for a long time. So please, buy your shitcoins and one day when you wake up and every shitcoin in every wallet is gone, now you will know how it was done.
As far as I know, the NSA cannot beam gold or silver out of a home, or business, (I think). Now you can see the fundamental difference.
Chris Webb
October 2, 2015 7:33 am
How do you plan on buying anything online with gold while not using a clearing house, which I guaranfuckingtee you will work hand in hand with the government? Bitcoin is the first technology in history that allows us global trade without an intermediary. So your options are: give up on a digital transactions and relegate yourself to person-to-person barter; use the existing system which we know for a fact is controlled by the banksters and government; or use a crypto currency which at this time is not being controlled by anyone and very unlikely to be hacked. Also, if they do develop quantum computers that can hack bitcoin, we’re fucked anyway.
Winston
October 2, 2015 9:38 am
What makes shitcoin valuable Chris? Because people have faith in it. People had faith in Pets.com too. 10100111011 FFFF There. Those are the only binary/HEX numbers typed by yours truly. Lets start a fucking Currency.
That is the problem with FED notes/shitcoin and all the rest. There is a ENDLESS supply of 1010101011010101010101001 FFFF FFFF FFFF. Shitcoin is only limited supply because of the math. Change the math change the supply. Any math can be changed.
Go outside and pick up some gold or silver. What you say? You can’t find any? No shit, because it is valuable. It can only come into existence through LABOR. Any monetary system, based on anything else is utter bullshit.
We based money systems on this for thousands of years. It can be done again and it will be. So any money system is a matter of trust;
Trust a system based on real items that have been valuable for thousands of years. The government despises for its ability to complete transactions in total anonymity.
Trust a system that came into existence from parts unknown, that’s been around for 4 years that our government seems to fully support and embrace and that in reality has no anonymity.
I go back to my original post
“How fortunate for leaders that men do not think.”
Winston
October 2, 2015 9:47 am
I do agree with you on one point
We are fucked anyway.
I would love to believe we are heading into a “Star Trek Universe” and bitcoin is the brave new frontier.
More than likely, we are heading into a “Mad Max Universe” , or at best a “1984 Universe”
As long as we live under the current political system, where psycopaths are allowed to freely rise to power, we are fucked.
People that seek political office are usually the same people that are not qualified to possess it.
All bullshit aside, until that changes, the masses will always be fucked. Yours truly included…
BITCOIN: Can’t hold it in my hand, don’t want it, ever.
When the lights finally go out for extended periods ( see North
Korea Electrification post just below ) JUST HOW WILL BIT-
COIN MANAGE TO FUNCTION ?
After a huge solar flare that lands on New York, Zurich and
London – – and which knocks out the bankster tribe’s computer
systems of world domination, JUST HOW WILL BITCOIN MAN-
AGE TO FUNCTION ?
After the Chinese set off an EMP shockwave just over Omaha,
knocking out Berkshire Hathaway and all other North American
financial computer systems used by the top 1% of the top 1% ,
JUST HOW WILL BITCOIN MANAGE TO FUNCTION AT ALL ?
Just thinking out loud .
SnowieGeorgie
Echo “snowiegeorgie”- I tend to be very distrustful of a “currency” that can only be accessed electronically- we’re already dependent enough on brittle, delicate, complex information systems that are extremely vulnerable to events out of our control. It would take an EMP to lose access to anything you have to get on the web to get at.
Seems to me to be the opposite of what you try to accomplish with all your preps, which is to be as resilient and independent as possible, and to have what you need in your hands. If things were to come to such a pass as the cash in your hand is worthless, what will anything that can only be accessed electronically be worth?
Bit coin is a fiat currency totally dependent on the internet and some complex accounting structure. If that accounting is compromised by some bug or virus or the internet itself fails in any way then there’s nothing.
AND—- IT”S GONE!!!
Nope!
Oh, the naysayers! I will stick with my Bitcoin and altcoins. Cryptocurrencies are too fascinating to me to follow the crowd.
T4C- Let me wax metaphysically to you a moment. Everything in the Universe is bound by natural law. This includes money, because it exists it must also act within the laws of physics. Money isn’t an object and you can’t own it. You can use it, but you will never own it. You can hold it, but you can never own it. Because it is a representation of energy and its purpose is to exchange the value of energy peer-to-peer.
When the founding fathers drafted the constitution is was based on the natural rights of man. Where the founders came up short was when it came to money. They could never quite figure out how to create a separation between money and state. BTC/cryptos are the very first type money to be issued for the people by the people. There are corporations/banks trying to separate BTC from the Blockchain in order to solely use the Blockchain technology But they are coming up short because “form follows function”.
Wonder Boy ….what do you mean by nope ?
bb, let’s not offend Inter-Stellar, I want to read his thorough review of The Martian as soon as he posts it.
Snowey Georgie takes a leap into the Abyss, be sure to post a selfie!
If computers go down, more than bitcoins will disappear. Civilization as we know it will cease. Bitcoins will be the least of your worries.
If you can strip away the infrastructure upon which trade and currencies depend, you have bitcoin, a digital credit in the most convenient accounting method you may choose, not inflatable, not traceable, not taxable directly or easily devalued by the manipulation of external bases of value such as stocks or precious metals.
My bank card already rewards me with credits also called points that are convertible into cash or material rewards. I can’t hold these points or transfer them to a separate bank account without converting them into cash. If I break the terms of the card agreement, I forfeit my paper gains.
Shitcoin- Because a sucker is born every minute.
Shitcoin- Because the electricity never goes down and EMP is just a scare tactic.
Shitcoin- Because you can never be robbed of your money…Oh wait………Right.
No Way….No How…No Time……..NO THANKS………Period.
Gold is money………you CAN own gold……..some minnies here are very confused. That includes silver. Get a clue.
Unless the entire global internet goes down, an EMP won’t take down bitcoin since the blockchain is globally decentralized. If you’ve got your keys you’ll still have your bitcoins once your local access to the internet is re-established. Also, those of you saying that if you can’t hold it in your hand, it’s not real, don’t understand the nature of value. Gold doesn’t have value because it’s a physical rock, it has value because people believe it has value. Saying that bitcoin doesn’t have value because you can’t hold it is like saying that an email doesn’t have value compared to a ‘real’ letter because you can’t hold it. The value of a letter is not its format but rather its message. Same thing for bitcoin. You guys are limiting yourself to an analog mindset in a digital world.
I always think of Hitler when thinking of bitcoin
“How fortunate for leaders that men do not think.”
If you think for a moment that the government does not have COMPLETE control over bitcoin, you are truly fooling yourself. Look at what the government works hard to suppress. It is not bitcoin. Gold and silver. If you can’t hold it, you don’t own it. Simple as that.
“Everything in the Universe is bound by natural law. This includes money, because it exists it must also act within the laws of physics.”
Interesting thought from a deterministic POV, but I don’t buy it. Energy (the laws of physics in general) exist whether humans (or any theoretical sentient species) are there to observe it or not. Not true with money. Money is an ENTIRELY human construct. Carrying the thought further, money (as a concept) no matter what form, only has value when people desire it, which only happens when they believe it has value. This includes all fiat, gold, silver, cryptocurrencies…everything.
In pre-Colombian South America, the natives around Bogota used salt as money. They had a tremendous amount of gold and emeralds, but they used them only in religious ceremonies. Salt was used for commerce.
Now, moving specifically towards Bitcoin: it has a lot of great qualities. The number in existence is capped mathematically and cannot be changed, it is infinitely divisible and so would be a deflationary currency–benefiting savers and producers rather than lenders, money-changers and speculators like debt-based fiat. Most importantly, Blockchain technology allows for confidence without authority–in other words, disputes do not need to be ruled upon by courts or any government agents. From this it would seem a perfect libertarian currency.
BUT…I think there are HUGE drawbacks, as well. First, like everyone mentions it doesn’t work without power, without the internet. Second, it is incredibly complex system and its complexity is ever increasing. Systems with increasing complexity tend to collapse catastrophically. Also, it is very complex from a individual POV…most find it intimidating (which does not exactly inspire confidence..again the ONLY thing that gives any currency value). Finally, the biggest drawback of all, the Bitcoins in existence are already concentrated in that hands of just a few people. If it were to be a major currency that everyone needed to survive…well, these people would simply become our new rulers.
If the electrical system goes down, the entire financial system will down with it, not just bitcoin. Nobody is advocating that you only own bitcoin, but rather use it for daily transactions and continue using precious metals and whatnot as your long term store of wealth. As in all things, diversify.
Above Anon was I.
@Chris Webb- You are right of course…just taking a high-level pass at BC and crypto-currencies in general.
TPTB are jacking off in great anticipation of a whole generation of fuknuts like CW and SS who will be much easier prey than those who had NO trust in banks and dealt in paper currency. Most do not understand that when there is only electronic currency there will come a time when critical words against Dear Leader will be cause for TPTB to clean out your account and you will be shit out of luck.
Good luck with that maroons.
If you think that the banks or government can clear out your bitcoin accounts, you obviously have no fucking idea what you are talking about.
Feel free to criticize or reject Bitcoin, but don’t do it for the wrong reasons. Your coins really can’t be stolen or your account “cleaned out” unless someone can get hold of your cryptographic keys. In the event of a power outage, a Bitcoin account is much safer than other electronic accounts, e.g. bank accounts, because it is decentralized. I would use it for transactions, but not as a store of value, because in a SHTF condition, confidence in it could go instantly to zero.
Just because it can’t be hacked right now doesn’t mean it won’t be able to be hacked in the future.
If I’m going to invest my cash in alternate currencies I’ll look to tangible items first and foremost.
Personal skillsets next.
And last? …..arable land.
Who says Bitcoin has not been hacked?
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/mar/18/history-of-bitcoin-hacks-alternative-currency
Bitcoin has never been hacked; those were exchanges and online wallets that were compromised. Would you denounce gold if Fort Knox was robbed? It’s the same thing. If you keep your bitcoins in your own offline wallet, they cannot be stolen unless you’re a retard and give your key out.
Restricting OPSEC leakages is a secret for dark net market customers given that threat is intrinsic.
Please fucking please tell me the difference between bitcoin and the fucking system we are under now? Just because it has a fixed amount now, does not mean it can’t be changed in the future.
If the NSA CIA and all the other alphabet agencies could take control of shitcoin (Which I am positive they can) do you think they would ring a bell and tell you. Hell, they probably created it, since no one really knows where the fuck it came from. Oh yea, that’s a great idea. I am backing up the truck on shitcoin!
The mere existence of shitcoin, means it is no threat to the current system. Now look at the dude who made silver liberty dollars and even inferred they were real money. He is on ice for a long time.
Oh and another thing. For you people who insist that shitcoin can’t be hacked I have two words for you.
Quantum computers
They are real, and take a guess who has them. As far as being offline, the NSA can, thanks to your friends at Intel, connect to you computer ANYTIME with no TCP/IP connection. They can do it will RF that is built into every Intel CPU, or they can do it through the power lines of the computer when it is plugged in to a power outlet.
A quantum computer can rip ANY current crypto key to shreds in a matter of, hours, sometimes minutes.
http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/quantum-computers-end-cryptography/
The problem is, our friends at the NSA have this, we do not. Don’t look for this to change for a long time. So please, buy your shitcoins and one day when you wake up and every shitcoin in every wallet is gone, now you will know how it was done.
As far as I know, the NSA cannot beam gold or silver out of a home, or business, (I think). Now you can see the fundamental difference.
How do you plan on buying anything online with gold while not using a clearing house, which I guaranfuckingtee you will work hand in hand with the government? Bitcoin is the first technology in history that allows us global trade without an intermediary. So your options are: give up on a digital transactions and relegate yourself to person-to-person barter; use the existing system which we know for a fact is controlled by the banksters and government; or use a crypto currency which at this time is not being controlled by anyone and very unlikely to be hacked. Also, if they do develop quantum computers that can hack bitcoin, we’re fucked anyway.
What makes shitcoin valuable Chris? Because people have faith in it. People had faith in Pets.com too. 10100111011 FFFF There. Those are the only binary/HEX numbers typed by yours truly. Lets start a fucking Currency.
That is the problem with FED notes/shitcoin and all the rest. There is a ENDLESS supply of 1010101011010101010101001 FFFF FFFF FFFF. Shitcoin is only limited supply because of the math. Change the math change the supply. Any math can be changed.
Go outside and pick up some gold or silver. What you say? You can’t find any? No shit, because it is valuable. It can only come into existence through LABOR. Any monetary system, based on anything else is utter bullshit.
We based money systems on this for thousands of years. It can be done again and it will be. So any money system is a matter of trust;
Trust a system based on real items that have been valuable for thousands of years. The government despises for its ability to complete transactions in total anonymity.
Trust a system that came into existence from parts unknown, that’s been around for 4 years that our government seems to fully support and embrace and that in reality has no anonymity.
I go back to my original post
“How fortunate for leaders that men do not think.”
I do agree with you on one point
We are fucked anyway.
I would love to believe we are heading into a “Star Trek Universe” and bitcoin is the brave new frontier.
More than likely, we are heading into a “Mad Max Universe” , or at best a “1984 Universe”
As long as we live under the current political system, where psycopaths are allowed to freely rise to power, we are fucked.
People that seek political office are usually the same people that are not qualified to possess it.
All bullshit aside, until that changes, the masses will always be fucked. Yours truly included…