This is a two part question:
Since the last US federal election the issue of child abuse, sexual assault and general sexual scumbaggery amongst our elites keeps surfacing. It seems to be an issue that is somewhere near the core of the rot that is eating at our civilization and it is indeed an issue that affects some of the most innocent among us, specifically with regards to children and pedophillia.
Question #1
In light of this would you support the DEATH PENALTY for convicted pedophiles?
Question #2
If NO what do you believe an appropriate punishment for this sort of behavior to be?
If YES do you believe that making an example of these criminals publicly, in this manner, would deter or reduce the chance that this type of behavior would be replicated among the general population or other more public individuals? Would it act as a deterent at all?
Q1: No, let them get abused by the other prisoners for a long period of time.
Q2: See answer above.
We can’t have it both ways: on one hand arguing “Government is totally incompetent” but then trusting government and government employees with capital punishment.
Christ, I just agreed with Marsh Rabbit.
Me too…. Slippery slope when the government has the capability to download anything they want into our hard drive.
Agreed. The government is not infallible. It should never be entrusted with the ability to execute the populace.
This assumes .gov or .gov-employees are not complicit, nicht war?
No, it’s a terrible crime but not a capital offense IMO. Further, long prison sentences would not seem to be a deterrent as this is some weird mental health problem. IOW, any kind of therapy is a fucking waste of resources. Of course it doesn’t mean I’m against locking them up. Keep the fuckers off the streets is step 1.
I’d determine the most effective biological solution like mandatory castration/implants of any effective drugs and couple it with incarceration. Like Diogenes referred, prisoners have little use for pedos.
Send them is ISIS.
Life in prison is far worse than death.
Of course I prefer community punishments, like the stocks. But I’m old school, like 1715.
We should adopt a Roman style punishment regimen. You would be fined and or whipped for less serious transgressions and executed for the more serious ones. They didn’t even bother with prisons for the most part.
I can see where a good caning or being whipped with a flagellum would be as bad or worse than 18 months in prison and more likely to reduce recidivism. The savings would be massive as well.
RESTITUTION is the ONLY answer. This government/societal RETRIBUTION has NEVER worked. Until the perpetrator is FORCED to compensate the VICTIM (remember them?) for the harm they have done and to make them “whole” again, NOBODY will truly be healed, including society.
That’s one of the best solutions I’ve ever heard. If you have to pay someone 1/4 or 1/2 of your income for the rest of your life (I’d tie in that you lose all benefits in perpetuity) that might be a fair deterrent.
Probably not, but it might.
Trust me,there is nothing the pedophile could/can do to help the victim except the victim knowing this person will never offend again!
But isn’t that up to the VICTIM to decide? Not you or “society” or the DA, or the “justice system” or similar. That is where we have had the disconnect all along – its always been up to someone else and so long as “society” was satisfied with the punishment, who cares about the victim.
Justice has become too centralized. Villages used to run people out of town or other things.
Liberty,guess will let the survivor decide,unless they decide to let the person free in society,then no,I believe they have lost the choice when risking yet other victims.
I have spoken with well over a 100 survivors,my original post comes from experience of surviving/survivors,that said,as long as no risk to more ,sure,let survivors decide.
If they weren’t already unemployable after a conviction on counts of pedophilia I think they’d just find ways of not earning a traceable income. If the many deadbeat dads go through such hoops to deny their own offspring support, what makes you think pedos are going to put their shoulder to the wheel to support their victims?
Plus the fact that 90% of Americans’ wages don’t really allow for generous income-sharing schemes. One $36k income divided in half = $18k income which would put the person in line for public assistance, food stamps, Medicaid, Section 8, etc. Let’s say you could deny them those benefits.. then you still have a random now-homeless pedophile roaming around. But they’re supposed to be holding down a job in somebody’s workplace, next to your cousin Ginny at Fidelity, or down at Wal*Mart or something? Maybe they’ll take up taxi driving! These people are still dangerous no matter their material circumstances. I don’t think effecting material punishments can be a solution.
Bring technology to bear. Well, let tech bear fruits as necessary to solution of enforcing restitution – the only “solution” that matters. The “incarcerations” could, should, be decentralized all the way down to the applicable locale – the individual\s harmed. No “roaming around.”
Honestly, I like this idea. Of course then you might run into problems with poor idiots serving up their children to perverts for remuneration, but thats pretty much what hollywood is already.
Wow, great comment. Not being sarcastic.
Capital punishments don’t seem to deter the offenders of capital crimes.
If a conviction is based on accusations and circumstantial evidence, that’s too unsure to put someone away for life. If based on solid evidence, get them off the streets for life.
But who can trust the courts? It’s a problem that won’t go away so society muddles along.
Rooting out the peds in high places would likely do a lot more to reduce the total violations than anything else.
Yep, make examples of high society. The elites. That would help quite a bit imo.
There’s no “crime” more prone to witch-huntery than child molestation. I assume that most accused are guilty, but a sizable minority aren’t. Take a feminazi prosecutor, add a feminazi judge, throw in some manipulable toddlers as your witnesses. What could possibly go wrong? Jeezus. Imagine your own son caught up in this Kafkaesque scenario. And people are asking about the death penalty or – worse – castration? What the fuck? Then there’s the illogic of incenting people to kill their victims. This goes for rape in general, too. If the penalty for rape is death, the logical thing to do – if you’ve just raped someone – is to kill them. Dramatic protestations to the contrary notwithstanding, being killed is worse than being raped. Which would be worse – that your daughter be raped or that she be raped and killed?
I was thinking this whole debacle will push the feminist agenda in to warp drive.
Read up on the infamous McMartin trial from Los Angeles (numerous accusation of child molestation). Simply disgusting what the prosecutors did to the children to get them to say whatever they wanted. But the DA got big points, re-elected, etc. and THAT is fundamentally why the government should have NO role in “justice” either.
#1 – No, but I understand how victims and their families would be in favor of it.
#2 – If found guilty beyond a SHADOW of a doubt, a decent slave life on an island growing food. For life.
Wip,
It’s interesting you say this. Had a conversation with a cop to this effect as we were talking about the issue a few months back.
There is no death penalty here anyways, so what is the solution?
The northern half of our country is so roadless and remote why not pick one of the giant lakes in the far north, thousands of miles from nowhere, and dump them on one of the islands there with nothing but a knife and a pack of matches. In fact, dump them all on the same island. Survive or die.
Escape would be virtually impossible since the far north is impassible even on foot. Shoot down any aircraft coming near the area below a specific elevation without clearance and presto. Low cost to tax payers and they are out of societies way. Hope they know how to fish, forage and build shelter. Good luck and have a nice (or not so nice) life.
Have you seen Escape from New York with Kurt Russell?
My answers mirror WIP’s. Both seem reasonable and humane.
As to your addendum’s that would be a death sentence. Most folks can’t make it through the night in woods of Nova Scotia let lone some far away place North of Sixty.
I agree, WIP, to a point. No death penalty. There have been too many mistaken guilty verdicts. I think, if found guilty, life in prison. That way if a mistake is found and something wasn’t done right, such as corrupt people interpreting DNA, they have a chance for retrial, as is happening so much now with rapists.
I agree with Mr. Liberty that punishments for the most part must be meted out to compensate the victims of crime in proportion to the injury. But pedophiles outside of prison working to repay their victims is not a good solution for obvious reason.
There is no reason to only think inside the current box. The more I read on the subject, the more amazed I am with the broad and creative diversity of ideas on the subject of “justice” and keeping the government completely out of the picture.
If we want to ‘protect’ children then the only way to do that is identify and cure paedophiles. You could execute or imprison every paedophile on the planet and the problem would keep cropping up as new paedophiles take the place of the old ones.
The sanctions, both criminal and social, are already about as strong as they can be. Offenders must be kept in protective custody and be registered as a sex offender if they get out of prison.
No one ‘chooses’ to be a child molester. The penalties are too high yet they still exist. If we want to stop it someway will have to be found to regulate and control the human libido.
“No one ‘chooses’ to be a child molester.”
Wrong. We do not currently know what causes pedophilia. Creating blanket statements like this is just as asinine as the people say “kill em all and let god sort em out!”
Pedobears breed more pedos/faggots through their very act.
If one is caught by two witnesses, a $0.03 22lr behind the ear.
If on video, and corroborated, 3 weeks beating any known pedo-ring associates out of him/her and the same treatment as one caught in the act.
If works with children (schools, scouts, coach etc.) castration with a dull hatchet, prison time for those responsible for background checks, exile to Isle Royale in November.
I would definitely kill with absolute proof pedophiles,but then,I was abused as a kid and thus have a hard lesson learned motive.I will also say while I support the prosecution and death of pedophiles do not want the witch hunts have seen in the name of protecting kids.I will say while certainly most victims do not become pedophiles most pedophiles themselves were victims,seems fuck up but also the truth.Thus,kids who have been molested need a lot of help,give them this help and you break for most part the cycle.There will always be a few pedophiles no matter what a society does,but,there can be a lot less.I will not take the risk of prison and them getting out one day to offend again,am also a bit disgusted as much as I hate pedophiles(have legit reason)I do not think them getting raped in prison ok,just creating more rapists and some of them will get out of prison,I see rape in ANY form unacceptable.
MM has the right idea. Castration or biochemical neutering. THEN drop ’em all on an island.
YES and YES.
I support the death penalty, period.
Yes, there are mistakes and corruption – accept it for the greater good.
Do you Remember Saddam Hussein?
Do you know the two major warring factions of Islam?
Do you know Islam is a religion that is based on 7th century stupidity and barbarism?
Do you know how Saddam kept Iraq stable for many decades in spite of the two Islamic factions:
Brutality, force, and death to those that didn’t follow the rules.
Without harsh rules, you can see how Europe is regressing with the immigration of the Islamic migrants.
Proof and then a life sentence on a High Security Parchment Farm. Ted Gundersen was lecturing (ref Youtube) about the Elite, Politicians and Priests etc doing this on a huge scale 30 years ago; they run orphanages, they kidnap kids, run huge sex rings, then sacrifice many of them to Satan. They run the World and are never punished in this life.
I don’t think it’s an issue near the core of the rot. I think it is a symptom, in a constellation of symptoms.
1 – In light of how twisted, incompetent, the “justice system” is, & how error prone people are generally, no.
2 – Appropriate punishment, in a reasonable, logical, factual world would be tied directly to damages case by case – not homogenized across an emotional•mythical cohort that does not exist. And damages are owed to the damaged, so various forms & terms of indentured servitude, working off of debts owed, are sensible, logical, appropriate. But if the damages are severe, old testament ideas apply.
I saw last week that a child rapist in Michigan raped and impregnated a 12 year old girl. She had a baby and now after getting out of prison a Progtard judge ruled this asshole can have visitation rights. He is also a recidivist with another conviction.
In my town a few weeks ago a guy who was a convicted pedo murdered his five year old son during a “supervised visit” in order to commit the most grievous possible harm to his wife who was divorcing him and taking the boy because of his conviction for molesting children.
I shit you not I believe these people should be fed feet first into a great big Vermeer chipper. In addition to the trail of destruction and murder there is an entire kindergarten class mind-fuqued because their little buddy “disappeared.”
jake,i read about that michigan case–unbelievable–
a guy in my neighborhood got pulled into a chipper a few years ago–
a rope that was used to tie down something on the machine when it was being pulled came loose and got sucked into the machine–it wrapped around his head and pulled him into the machine w/such force that it decapitated him and his body was stuck in the chute–
I remember Peter Stormare running Steve Buscemi through one in “Fargo.”
#1 No.
#2 hard to say. I met a guy once, nice enough person. Later found out that he was in prison for 30 years. Reason? When he was in his 20s a girl (13 or 14?) lived with him because her mother couldn’t deal with her at the time and he was doing the mother a favor. The girl kept pressuring him, she loved him, they were in love, expressing their love wasn’t a crime, etc. and he finally gave in because he really had fallen in love with her. About 10 years later she pressed charges. Why? I don’t know. 30 years in prison because he was in love. Was he stupid? Absolutely. Did the punishment fit the “crime” of being in love with a 13 year old going on 25 who manipulated him into sex? You tell me.
annie,that’s not the same as pedophalia-
however,he still should have had sense enough not to touch her–
I agree that the story I presented is not pedophilia, but my point is where we draw the line and where they draw the line differs. We’re not the ones who make and enforce the laws. What happens when they broaden the definition to the point where they’re prosecuting 18 year olds with 16 year old girlfriends as pedophiles?
GOVERNMENTS write laws, NOT VICTIMS. Keep that in mind. No victim, no crime. Consent = no victim.
“No victim, no crime.” In the best of all libertarian worlds, certainly. Not where I live.
A hundred years ago (and in some places much less) it was legal for girls to get married at 13/14. This man is in prison for the best part of his productive life because of a consensual relationship with a girl of marriageable age because the government likes to throw it’s weight around. If the government would do that to him, what will they do to the rest of us?
Agreed. Just another reason for little to no government and most certainly a reason to take away their monopoly on “justice.”
What happens when 18 year olds have sexual intercourse with a 16 year old?
Excellent question as broadening the pedo definition is most likely going to happen. It seems to me the online sex registry is more about setting an internal government system up that can easily become used on everyone. The pedophile has been a perfect lab rat for such a system.
Who hacked Humana? Perfectly good health records of millions now owned by those who can mimic other nations hacking signatures. Dot Gov did.
Who knows where you shop? Who you befriended? What you wrote or said? Dot Gov does.
Who hacked the Credit Rating company?
People need to be very very careful as to what they wish upon others.
We need to remember that we treat ourselves as we treat the prisoner.
My answer to question one and two is No.
If no for two the question asks, what then for justice.
Answer; Public shame within the community is primary. Shame is too easily bought away (aka Clinton,Weinstein et al) in the current state of affairs. Lastly, a punishment to fit the crime agreed upon by all concerted parties.
FM … first of all, you asked THREE questions. For fuksakes, even I can count to five.
I find it loathsome to trust the State to kill people. They are liars and corrupt to the bone.
Capital punishment doesn’t seem to deter murder. Why should we expect it to deter paedophiles?
In fact, it seems NO crimes are deterred by ANY punishments … as we have the highest incarceration percentage in the world. I say “seems” because we’ll never know what people don’t know. For example, I can think of one or two people I would have killed, except I don’t like prison or being put to death.
So, there’s a conundrum, as paedophiles are extremely loathsome to society.
Paedophiles are incurable, or so I am told. Regardless, they MUST be removed from society. Permanently.
So, I favor castration for men. And plug the hole with super glue for women. Then send them to a supermax prison in Alaska, near the North Pole (just build the damned thing!!) for the rest of their natural life.
You’re such a disagreeable old fart. Why do you have to be that way?
Technically it is a two ‘part’ question in a choose your own adventure type format.
It’s three if you suffer from multiple personality disorder or just can’t make up your mind. 🙂
I agree with restitution, but I would like to add castration and public stoning to the mix.
when did this place get so wussified–
if there is no doubt about his guilt,not only should he be executed,but the kid’s parents should be allowed to choose the method and to be the executioner–either that or have a $100/ticket 50/50,half to the victim and half to the state for costs–
There’s almost never “no doubt about his guilt”.
All it should take to dispel the ‘there is no doubt’ is one execution of an innocent. There has been more than one.
But what it really takes to dispel “justice” system infallibility is an actual understanding of the state, & monopoly on use of force. Monopoly is always a synonym for corruption, criminality…states are fallibility institutionalized – alchemy via magical legal words, & true-believers in such magic.
prove that an innocent has been executed within the last 100 years–50–25–
Conviction of innocents is a very low bar. That happens regularly. And could easily happen even more regularly : what’s the per capita “felony” rate, 3 per day? Any who ask for proof of this would likely not recognize proof of this.
Execution of innocents is the subject that none should be subject to. But what’s should got to do with anything, ever? Most everybody in the open air CAFO’s that are countries are subject to the rules blizzards from on high, including hang ‘em high.
“…a prosecuting attorney argued in court in 1998 that if posthumous DNA results exonerated O’Dell, “it would be shouted from the rooftops that … Virginia executed an innocent man.” The state prevailed, and the evidence was destroyed.[21]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrongful_execution#United_States
VA is also the state that went after the interracial Lovings couple. Made their lives hell, all according to statute, then eventually rolled over via SC…as if validation of the obvious needs be authenticated by a star chamber of robed goons. Now that pen’s license plates read “VA is for lovers.” Yeah, the sado-masochist kind.
The legal system is nothing more than a color of law regime. A junta. War by other means. And co-dependence is a faulty idea before it is ever a faulty personal relationship. Rah-rah the “justice system” is one such co-dependent idea.
One day a plaintive co-dependent plaintiff, the next day a co-dependent co-defendant. And the thought-question bubbles up, “what happened?” Nothing happened. Attention was not paid before, is all. All too often it’s not paid after, either. Failure to learn history, doom-repetition, all that.
I’m already OK with the summary execution of pedophiles. At some point, the only thing that matters is their destructive nature, and the absolute need to permanently remove it from society. The only pedophile that isn’t trying to molest children, is a dead pedophile.
But, if not death, then the old solution of putting them in isolated monasteries, on remote islands, might still be viable. Realistically, they will forever be attempting to get out and rape more children – so why waste resources preserving their lives?
Once initial sentence is completed, pedophile has to agree to be dyed blaze orange head to toe. To remain outside prison pedo has to recolor monthly. Parents can then teach children to stay clear of the orange man. Rape of another adult, same deal, different color. Girls, stay clear of the green guy. After twenty years of color and no incidents, will tone down color to a nice pastel.
Not too shabby of an original idea. I like it. Of course there needs to be a punishment or some type of restitution first.
pen,
it won’t work-these guys are too impulsive and too convincing–
if they are guilty,they need to die–
I married into this mess. The father-in-law was molested by the G father who raised him. He molested his children, my wife and eventually my children. He also molested his children; his son who in-tern molested his son, now my nephew, who was the only one of the family who did prison time.
I didn’t know about how this works until I’m dealing with messed up kids and a messed up wife, who was more devoted to her predator than to me.
I don’t know how to deal with equity but believe the rest of society shouldn’t have to deal with this crap. I’d vote to kill them all. I had not considered the ‘chipper’ idea but I’d go for it if it’s possible.
The idea I liked best, is to nail their dick to a tree, hand him a better knife then tell him if he cuts himself loose he is free. Then light the fire .
It is an incurable mental illness. What do you expect when boys learn their sexuality at age 10 ,or so, and aren’t allowed an adult female body until age 17 ( give or take ). Give them robotic dolls on an Aleutian Island with no return to society. Some labor will be required from them.
I would like to know that pederasses were being offed but i have less faith that govt can effectively define what the crime is effectively and administer justice than they can make obamacare work.
A more effective solution is restitution like others have said and in rare occassions jury nulification when a dad/brother/mother etc offs the mofo with extreme prejudice.
CANING
i have heard and read, but have no proof that:
in countries where caning is permitted and or mandated by the judge at sentencing, as a first day experience to a prison sentence. it is done to the bottoms of the feet. they can not walk for 1 to 4 weeks depending upon the sentenced number of strokes. when their sentence is over and they are released, they will do anything to avoid getting in trouble and possibly returned to prison as a second offender. Pain does get your attention.
i also liked the idea above about caning or whipping then released, for minor offenses,or the death sentence, for capital crimes. no prisons.