There seems to be a notion among intellectuals that the U.S. Military would never conduct military operations against the citizens of the United States. I find that laughable, as the list below proves. American troops have been used against civilians since the inception of our country. Those in power will use everything at their disposal to retain that power, including using troops to slaughter Americans that choose to dissent. The persistent “training exercises” taking place in and around U.S. cities is not a coincidence. Those in power know our economic situation is tenuous and a collapse is on the horizon. I believe that National Guard and Federal troops will fire on Americans when ordered to do so. What do you think?
- The Whiskey Rebellion, or Whiskey Insurrection, was a tax protest in the United States beginning in 1791, during the presidency of George Washington. Farmers who sold their grain in the form of whiskey had to pay a new tax which they strongly resented. The tax was a part of treasury secretary Alexander Hamilton‘s program to pay off the national debt. On the western frontier, protesters used violence and intimidation to prevent federal officials from collecting the tax. Resistance came to a climax in July 1794, when a U.S. marshal arrived in western Pennsylvania to serve writs to distillers who had not paid the excise. The alarm was raised, and more than 500 armed men attacked the fortified home of tax inspector General John Neville. Washington responded by sending peace commissioners to western Pennsylvania to negotiate with the rebels, while at the same time calling on governors to send a militia force to suppress the violence. With 15,000 militia provided by the governors of Virginia, Maryland, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania, Washington rode at the head of an army to suppress the insurgency. The rebels all went home before the arrival of the army, and there was no confrontation. About 20 men were arrested, but all were later acquitted or pardoned. The issue fueled support for the new opposition Democratic Republican Party, which repealed the tax when it came to power in Washington in 1801.
- The New York City draft riots (July 13 to July 16, 1863; known at the time as Draft Week[2]) were violent disturbances in New York City that were the culmination of working-class discontent with new laws passed by Congress that year to draft men to fight in the ongoing American Civil War. The riots were the largest civil insurrection in American history.[3] President Abraham Lincoln diverted several regiments of militia and volunteer troops from following up after the Battle of Gettysburg to control the city. The rioters were overwhelmingly working-class men, primarily ethnic Irish, resenting particularly that wealthier men, who could afford to pay a $300 commutation fee to hire a substitute, were spared the draft.[4][5] Initially intended to express anger at the draft, the protests turned into an ugly race riot, with the white rioters attacking blacks wherever they could be found. At least 100 black people were estimated to have been killed. The conditions in the city were such that Major General John E. Wool, commander of the Department of the East, stated on July 16, “Martial law ought to be proclaimed, but I have not a sufficient force to enforce it.”[6] The military did not reach the city until after the first day of rioting, when mobs had already ransacked or destroyed numerous buildings, including public buildings and homes of abolitionist sympathizers, many black homes, and the Colored Orphan Asylum at 44th Street and Fifth Avenue, which was burned to the ground. The children were not harmed.[7] The exact death toll during the New York Draft Riots is unknown, but according to historian James M. McPherson (2001), at least 120 civilians were killed. At least eleven black men were lynched.[20] Violence by longshoremen against black men was especially fierce in the docks area.[7]
- The Great Railroad Strike of 1877, sometimes referred to as the Great Upheaval, began on July 14 in Martinsburg, West Virginia, United States and ended some 45 days later after it was put down by local and state militias, and federal troops.
- The Pullman Strike was a nationwide conflict between the new American Railway Union (ARU) and railroads that occurred in the United States in summer 1894. It shut down much of the nation’s freight and passenger traffic west of Detroit. The conflict began in the town of Pullman, Illinois, on May 11 when nearly 4,000 employees of the Pullman Palace Car Company began a wildcat strike in response to recent reductions in wages. Under instruction from President Grover Cleveland, a Democrat, US Attorney General Richard Olney (formerly a lawyer for a railroad) dealt with the strike. Olney obtained an injunction in federal court barring union leaders from supporting the strike and demanding that the strikers cease their activities or face being fired. Debs and other leaders of the ARU ignored the injunction, and federal troops were called up to enforce it.[9] While Debs had been reluctant to start the strike he now threw his energies into organizing it. Debs not only ignored the federal court injunction he instead called a general strike of all union members in Chicago, but it was opposed by Samuel Gompers, head of American Federation of Labor, and other established unions, and failed.[10] City by city the federal forces broke the ARU efforts to shut down the national transportation system Thousands of United States Marshals and some 12,000 United States Army troops, commanded by Nelson Miles took action. President Cleveland wanted the trains moving again and his legal basis was his constitutional responsibility for the mails. His lawyers also argued that the boycott violated the Sherman Antitrust Act, and represented a threat to public safety. The arrival of the military and subsequent deaths of workers led to further outbreaks of violence. During the course of the strike, 13 strikers were killed and 57 were wounded. Property damage exceeded $80 million.
- The Bonus Army was the popular name of an assemblage of some 43,000 marchers—17,000 World War I veterans, their families, and affiliated groups—who gathered in Washington, D.C., in the spring and summer of 1932 to demand immediate cash-payment redemption of their service certificates. Its organizers called it the Bonus Expeditionary Force to echo the name of World War I‘s American Expeditionary Force, while the media called it the Bonus March. It was led by Walter W. Waters, a former Army sergeant. Many of the war veterans had been out of work since the beginning of the Great Depression. The World War Adjusted Compensation Act of 1924 had awarded them bonuses in the form of certificates they could not redeem until 1945. Each service certificate, issued to a qualified veteran soldier, bore a face value equal to the soldier’s promised payment plus compound interest. The principal demand of the Bonus Army was the immediate cash payment of their certificates. Retired Marine Corps Major General Smedley Butler, one of the most popular military figures of the time, visited their camp to back the effort and encourage them.[1] On July 28, U.S. Attorney General William D. Mitchell ordered the veterans removed from all government property. Washington police met with resistance, shots were fired and two veterans were wounded and later died. Veterans were also shot dead at other locations during the demonstration. President Herbert Hoover then ordered the army to clear the veterans’ campsite. Army Chief of Staff General Douglas MacArthur commanded the infantry and cavalry supported by six tanks. The Bonus Army marchers with their wives and children were driven out, and their shelters and belongings burned.
- The 1967 Detroit riot, also known as the 12th Street riot, was a civil disturbance in Detroit, Michigan, US that began in the early morning hours of Sunday, July 23, 1967. The precipitating event was a police raid of an unlicensed, after-hours bar then known as a blind pig, on the corner of 12th (today Rosa Parks Boulevard) and Clairmount streets on the city’s Near West Side. Police confrontations with patrons and observers on the street evolved into one of the deadliest and most destructive riots in United States history, lasting five days and surpassing the violence and property destruction of Detroit’s 1943 race riot. To help end the disturbance, Governor George W. Romney ordered the Michigan National Guard into Detroit, and President Lyndon B. Johnson sent in Army troops. The result was 43 dead, 467 injured, over 7,200 arrests, and more than 2,000 buildings destroyed.
- The Kent State shootings—also known as the May 4 massacre or the Kent State massacre[2][3][4]—occurred at Kent State University in the U.S. city of Kent, Ohio, and involved the shooting of unarmed college students by the Ohio National Guard on Monday, May 4, 1970. The guardsmen fired 67 rounds over a period of 13 seconds, killing four students and wounding nine others, one of whom suffered permanent paralysis.[5] Some of the students who were shot had been protesting against the American invasion of Cambodia, which President Richard Nixon announced in a television address on April 30. Other students who were shot had been walking nearby or observing the protest from a distance.[6][7]
Speaking as a vet, I would not have been able to turn my rifle on my own countrymen, but given all of the constant brainwashing both in the military and civilian world, I’m sure there are some that would. One of the scariest things about war to me is seeing the desensitization/dehumanization machine in action.
I was six years old and four miles away from the KSU shootings. All I remember hearing about it at the time was how bad the kids were and how they (more or less) deserved to be shot (yet another reason to put as much distance between oneself and Ohio as possible.)
The short answer to your question: yes, the troops will shoot us down like dogs. And, yes, people will LOVE them for it (as long as the bullet bites the next person in line.) If there is a hope, it’s that some of those being shot at by the army and police will provide temporary shielding for those with the will to strike back.
Be on it.
Disrespect for the life of one is disrespect for the life of all.
No, I do not believe the US military will fire on Americans or at least for very long.
#1) Except for the political hacks that make up the General ranks in the Pentagon, the vast majority of the US military has no love for Obama. Especially since he sends home fucking FORM letters signed with the FUCKING electric pen to the families of fallen soldiers FUCKING months late, as just one of a number of FUs by Obama to the troops.
#2) Active duty military takes an oath to the CONSTITUTION, NOT to the President. The National Guard oath is to the state governer. I doubt if Mr. Consitutional Scholar even knows that. Soldiers are also taught to distinguish between legal and illegal orders. They are also taught to defend themselves so if protestors get violent, yes, troops will act to defend their lives.
#3) The US military is well aware of the 125 MILLION registered gun owners in tne US as well as the unprecedented ammo sales over the last few years. They are outnumber and outgunned.
#4) Combat operations require a long and thus vulnerable supply chain. The US is a pretty big place. It would be soooo easy to disrupt that chain by civilians. The US military has been down that road in Iraq/Afghani.
#5) US troops have more in common with US civilians than they do with the US fed.gov. They are more likely to act to defend their local families and communities than obey orders from some political pukes in far off DC.
I actually was in the Army Reserves fo 11 years to help pay for medical school. I saw only a tiny fraction of it even through our unit was based out of Ft. Hood. Yeah, there are some crazy Mofo’s that would kill anybody but most of the troops are just average folks trying to get along. Based on the people I knew, no, I don’t think you are going to see US troops firing willy nilly on civilians. They will defend themselves if attacked, so if a collapse occurs, I recommend befriending every soldier you see. You just might need that guy to cover your back.
NO !!!!! Not the CURRENT BATCH of troops. No.
I was in the USAF, although in a non-combat role. Court-martial me, jail me, ruin me .. whatever .. had they ordered me to fire I would have disobeyed. (Well, maybe not if the target was SAH, Colma, or AWD.) I can’t imagine any of my buddies would have either.
It’s the NEXT BATCH you have to worry about. And the Next Batch can be recruited, trained, and shooting you within months. They can simply recruit the six million either in prison or on parole. Many of them are psychos. There is never a shortage of psychos the government can call upon to do its bidding.
Yes, but only after they tap the police on the shoulder and say “our turn.”
By and large the military will shoot on civilians without much hesitation. They will be given weeks or months of lectures about the problem with hippies, Occupy, Tea Partiers, militias, tax cheats, communists, Chinese infiltrators, Jihadis, religious extremists, or whatever that particular unit’s CO and XO think will keep them in line, and then just be given orders that most of them will follow. The ones who don’t follow will be ignored or quietly mocked, and any few who make a big display of disobedience will be court martialed or simply shot on sight.
From the range of military people I’ve known, I think that most navy and air force will follow almost any orders without much question; much of the big army will follow orders while feeling slightly guilty; and only in the USMC would you find really active resistance among a significant proportion of both officers and enlisted. For that reason I expect USMC will be kept far away from any civil policing actions, but they may ultimately provide the coup that Kunstler seems to keep hoping for.
if you have a 1,000$ to spare, get a good AR15, in most states you don’t need any permits to get a rifle/shotgun, look into Colt, Noveske, Sabre Defense and Lewis Machine and Tool Company
1861 anyone? all that’s needed is a trumped up reason for the wholesale slaughter of civilians to commence.
The Warrior Song
It has been done before and it will happen again.
I agree on the cops first. There are SWAT/riot teams across the country, highly and over-trained, used to busting in doors and terrorizing families. They will come first.
Then, if anyone accidentally – or on purpose – kills a cop, the military will descend and all the good feelings about neighbors will fly right out of their minds.
Multiple experiments prove, time and time again, it does not take much goading – especially in a group/team environment – to turn us into sadistic freaks.
But, we will know the shit is really hitting the fan when the Mexican and Canadian troops are brought in. That is a pretty big sign that Americans will be dying at the governments bidding.
Avoid, lay low, do the bare minimum needed to interact with the PTB. No provisions means you will be meeting Johnny Law & Order a lot quicker than the prepared.
What a freaking mess, heh?
Absolutely yes.
Look what’s happened since the “war on drugs”. The number of police has grown 8-fold. The number of people in prison has passed 2 million, more than any other country in the world, including Russia and N. Korea.
Sorry, but you’re a deluded imbecile if you think we live in anything but a fascist police state. NDAA was the last nail in the coffin. OWS was put down by police thugs. You may have the right to protest, but you also have the obligation to be taken away as a terrorist and never be seen or heard from again. You can be murdered for no cause, by the president himself, if he sees fit.
They aren’t going to run out of cops anytime soon, but let’s say doctors go on strike. They will be smashing doctor’s faces, arms and legs forcing them back to work. Wyoming is also getting to be a problem, with their plans. Anyone who dissents in any way can and will be crushed, including using the military. We have a military-police force now, WTF is the difference?
The military will be used against the citizens in limited engagements such as those mentioned by admin. There “may” be a larger engagement but it will be short lived and will result in such an outcry that the people will not stand for it. I believe that will be the “come to God moment” for the govt.
I do not believe the military will be used against us in a wholesale manner. One thing you have to keep in mind about our individual military members is that they rarely, if ever serve anywhere near their hometown. They might be ordered to fire on Americans in one place but in the back of their mind they will have to be wondering who is firing on their family and friends back home.
I firmly believe there are more than enough officers that will refuse to give the order and far more enlisted men who will refuse to follow such an order. It will take one hell of a mental leap to fire on their fellow Americans and doubly so against unarmed Americans. If TPTB give that order, it will end up being they that will need to watch their backs in short order.
I_S
“But, we will know the shit is really hitting the fan when the Mexican and Canadian troops are brought in.” —- TeresaE
Jesus Fuckin Christ. They’re outsourcing that too?? I can’t even be killed by a real Amurican?
The ones we will have to worry about are the “secret police” and LE contractors. I believe admin or someone posted images here of an armed force in NYC that was riding herd on the OWS crowd. These guys wore uniforms but did not display any badges, name tags, rank, USA flags or any other identifying features except for POLICE on their backs.
These will be the assholes we will have to worry about PLUS the alphabet soup agencies on the receiving end of all this recently ordered ammo.
I_S
A point of fact: the FBI was caught hacking 12 million Apple devices. If you own an Apple device, I recommend you check to see if you’re on the list. I’m sure they’ve hacked computers, droid devices, and just about everything else. I believe they are monitoring this blog. They gather evidence, and then they come after you (not that they need any evidence). I don’t think any group or uprising could possibly get big enough to cause the use of the military, when they are using such tactics. They will crush you immediately, not wait for you to form a group.
Find Out If Your Apple Device Was Among The 12 Million Units Hacked And Tracked By The FBI
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/find-out-if-your-apple-device-was-among-12-million-units-hacked-and-tracked-fbi
Hmmm. Been reading these posts where most og you think the current crop of military boys would fire on Americans. I said “no”, but I might have to reconsider.
I think it has to do with the REASON a person enlists. I joined the Air Force for one primary reason … to save money for college as well as take advantage of the GI Bill. No fucking way in hell would I shoot a fellow citizen over that.
But, military recruiters are meeting their enlistment quotas quite easily due, of course, to the economy. I can see where these types would shoot first, ask question later. After all, they will fall back on that all so popular excuse used by psycho thugs everywhere; “I was just doing my job.”
Armed State thugs had no problem beating the living shit out of unarmed peaceful OWS protestors in cities across America. Why does anyone think there aren’t just as many armed thugs in the military willing to fire on protestors or “insurgents” or “domestic terrorists” or Ron Paul followers?
They will fire when ordered to by their commanders without question. They are paid to and trained to follow orders.
AWD
What is an Apple device?
i think most will, some won’t and then they’ll be shot too.
the majority will shoot people they don’t know if ordered. those in power will be sure to keep soldiers away from their hometowns for this very reason.
what will stop them? when the food rations run out or the checks they are getting paid with start to bounce (or simply aren’t worth anything).
having an ar and some 556 or 223 might make you feel better, an ar might help in a chaos situation where you are dealing with other citizens but in martial law it won’t, whether it is a drone, a barrett 50, lupia from a mile away or even an aa-12, whatever they will have will trump what you got 100 fold.
the key is the dehumanization, do that and it won’t be viewed as “killing”, it will be seen as a “cleansing”
What is an Apple device? -Stuck
What Satan called Eve.
Your computers and devices will kill you.
16,000 dead from texting while driving last three years alone.
thousands dead from texting and walking into moving cars and other shit.
tens of thousands dead from eating and blogging, internet porn, video games etc. (obesity deaths) and not exercising.
Acoustic neuromas and other brain tumors from using cell phones.
Suicide from the your empty life of “social networking” on facebook, chat rooms, and other internet diversions.
Then the day they smash your door down and haul you off to a FEMA camp…
Your computer can kill you….
[/img]
[img
I dunno.
Who is more likely to shoot me a member of the military or Walmart shopper with a useless SNAP card?
I plan on wearing a uniform that says “Property of Bernanke Federally Chartered Prison Asset # 1391-3”
Lobster Bisque and Champagne for me!
KB:
The Wal Mart shopper for sure, then they’d try and eat you.
BTW, the military doesn’t shoot dogs, only people.
[img]http://ourfounder.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341cdbc253ef0105364e0d5f970c-pi[/img]
I believe if it comes to massive civil unrest we will have some military firing on civilians, and civilians granting approval like at Kent State. So many people, my mother in law is one, who believe every fucking thing the news tells her is the truth. So if the news tells her that these civilians were trouble makers and they were shot because they didn’t obey, then they deserved to die.
Like admin said, they will be labeled as domestic terrorist, anarchist, or anti Americans because they fill in the blank. It will all be made up on the spot.
I also believe this will be short lived as more shootings will turn the stomachs of those in the volunteer military, then it could come down to battles between the average grunt, and those secret military types we keep hearing about.
“BTW, the military doesn’t shoot dogs, only people.”
Maybe, but SWAT teams and plenty of cops have been shooting people’s dogs unnecessarily the last several years. Not just the NYC story I linked to a couple of weeks ago, just google “cop shoots dog” or similar and check out all the stories. In many cases the dog was tethered or harmless, and the cop’s excuse is usually that he thought the dog was a pit bull.
Even the Mayor isn’t immune, just ask Md’s Cheye Calvo:
http://www.gazette.net/article/20120726/NEWS/707269908/1077/years-after-mayor-s-dogs-were-shot-in-raid-training-on-confronting&template=gazette
Anyone else think that this is subtly encouraged, another intimidation tactic? What better way to show us what will happen if we step out of line, by shooting and killing without having to face a murder charge?
Stucky, very, very, very quietly, in ’08 (I believe), our military signed “agreements” with the Canadian and Mexican military.
Now we are all one big family and our troops can be used across borders, as can theirs.
Seems Georgie signed a couple like-minded agreements with the leaders too.
I knew then just how FUBAR we were. And that was before O’s blatant disregard for our rights.
Admin:
It goes back to the desensitization/dehumanization aspect of warfare. Soldiers overseas hear all about killing “Hajji” well before they get over there. By the time you’re in the sandbox you really don’t give a shit about it. Plus since they are legitimately trying to blow you up all the damn time it really becomes “us or them”. Conversely, our homegrown shithead cops already desensitize/dehumanize the enemy. US. Isn’t it obvoius? Look at all of the tazings, pepper spray incidents, cops shooting unarmed people (sometimes face down). Those cocksuckers don’t protect and serve shit, other than protecting eachother and serving their superiors. Add all of the post 9/11 militarization and increased “legal” infringement on our rights. That’s why you don’t hear anyone in the law enforcement community whistleblowing their increased surveillance using the PATRIOT Act or soon-to-be widespread deplioyment of drones on their own countrymen. It’s because they’ve already dehumanized other Americans in their daily duty as the “enemy” that must be contained.
The opposite is true of the military. The boots on the ground/door kickers are generally in their early 20’s and they love their country. This is especially reenforced by the constant deployment rotations and being sent to god forsaken hellholes around the globe to fight stupid, pointless wars. If the powers-that-be hope to convert the vast majority of the American military to terminators of liberty/Americans than they have another thing coming. It’s not a coincidence such a vast number of active and former military support Ron Paul and the liberty movement.
“Maybe, but SWAT teams and plenty of cops have been shooting people’s dogs unnecessarily the last several years.”
Shooting dogs is a travesty, a sin, and will not go unpunished. PETA will send feminazis to the scene, armed to the teeth. This cannot be allowed to happen, it must not. Animals cannot be harmed. Protests will spring up across the land, there will be rioting.
If people are killed, who cares?
Dear Mr. or Ms. Cynical30
What you say is not true. We are here to serve and protect.
Just ask your own StuckInNJ. We did not tazer, pepper spray, or beat him up. We did stick a poker up his ass, but it wasn’t all that hot, and he seemed to enjoy it.
It amazes us that you continue to spew this tripe despite the fact that you all know we closely monitor this site. Thank you for making our jobs easier.
You are now in our database under “MALCONTENT”. One more outburst from you and we’ll move you to the “TERRORIST” file.
Live long and prosper,
Chief of Police
Swat teams already shot American’s, what’s the difference? John
Adminstrator’s right, our troops are trained to follow orders. They’ll shoot whoever they’re commanded to shoot.
As as for obeying the Constitution, Hope, you’re right. Our troops will obey the Constitution, that is the Living Constitution, which means whatever our leaders say it means. Remember modern America is progressive America where our leaders, who know best, know better what the law is than what you and I think the law says.
I would like to say that using American soldiers to shoot American citizens is a very low probability.
Especially if the problem is one of peaceful demonstration.
If it does happen, there will be one hell of a lot of conflicted American troops. Of course that won’t make the dead any happier, now will it.
Ghandi peacefully demonstrated millions until the Brits gave in (being a moral sort of people back then) and allowed him to form a new country. Of course, the poor bastard had to put up with four assassination attempts over 10 years – not from the Brits but from Hindus, Sikhs and Muslims in the process.
My cynical side says “Sure, one shot fired at a guy in a platoon situation, his buddies are going to blow you away.” Our soldiers today have one overhanging important loyalty: EACH OTHER. They will go to any lengths to bring everybody back and if an American Citizen offers armed resistance, that citizen is a dead duck..
A peaceful demonstration, however, no threat to the soldiers or their buddies, no, I don’t think they’d just go and rip off a clip into a crowd.
That doesn’t mean that an SSS type, on top of a building nearby, might not initiate a fire fight by popping a trooper in the noggin just to heat things up. (Nothing personal SSS – you know what I’m trying to illustrate here.)
MA
NDAA signed by Obama 12/31/11. No more meaningful Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 exists anymore, and the President as Commander in Cheif can now legally use US Troops in police actions against American Citizens. It was actually Bush2 that first openly suggested it, right after Hurricane Katrina – but he was so unpopular and had aroused so many suspicions increasing the power of the Executive Branch that he couldn’t get it done. So, Obama did it nice and quietly.
Admin gives examples of times when doing this was not allowable under US law and it happened anyway. Now it is allowable – what you thinks gonna happen?
Soldiers follow orders from the top – the CIF on down. They will even tend to follow unlawful orders given by a superior (see admins examples) because it isn’t their job to think, but obey. It’s even harder for a soldier to not obey a lawful order given by their superior. For US troops to be used against US citizens has no legal barrier anymore. The only thing that could stop it now is massive disobedience, refusing to follow orders, and essentially a coup in the military. That’s not good either. President has more power than ever, and it’s only growing.
God bless Noam Chomsky – that progressive, left wing, liberal freak – he did try to stop it in court and got denied. It’s the law. Welcome to Obama-world 2012.
I side with the naysayers. Cops will be used first, as they are accustomed to persecuting civilians. That is how it generally works.
The army might react if they feel threatened, or in semi- isolated incidents, especially given that they are no smarter or enlightened than the general populous. But I think that the leaders will be generally – tho not totally restrained.
A good example is Tianemen (sp.?)Square, where the government had to bring in forces from distance provinces to do their bidding, as local forces wouldn’t. Armies are hesitant to shoot their own, but doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.
Cops are the ones that are used. Count on it.
“Government can’t do anything for you except in proportion as it can do something to you.”
— William F. Buckley jr
Whether it is used or not, I am offended by any further expansion of what government *can* do to us.
Will us troops shoot americans? I sure hope so. Now before you jump down my throat let me explain. Who is going to be rioting and wilding. The fuckin free shit army! It is going to be the folks who supped at the teat of washington and now when the money stops they will revert to the savages they are. Are you going to see preppers and indipendants marching for more free shit. No we are going to be in our bunkers protecting what is ours. Most of the big shitties are 9 meals from a riot. Good luck with that. I live out in the cornfields and have a deep water well and a pond. If right now the power went out and cars did not work my family is set for the next year. By then fsa will be a memory and we can see what a reset looks like.
The Afghan/Pakistani civilians our military is currently murdering on a daily basis deserve it.
The Iraqi civilians deserved it.
The subhuman Palestinians deserve it.
The Vietnamese peasants deserved it.
The disloyal, unappreciative Vietnam War protesters deserved it.
The worthless OWS bums deserved it.
When they come for you, you will deserve it as well.
Holy fuck, Zara. Now HZK deserves to die.
Holy fuckity fuck fuck. Jesus fuckin Krist. Fuck. Holy goddamn fuck. Fuckity motherfuck fuck fuck.
The level of discourse here is sinking to all time low levels. Cool. That’s what happens when you let/approve a skank cunt ho like SAH spew her shit. Pretty soon it spreads like wildfire. What was once done in fun and good nature now turns into deep personal attacks. Very cool! Not that I have room to talk .. having wished SAH would have been aborted.
I’m all in. Fuck Anyone who doesn’t agree with Someone. Fuck that cocksucker for disagreeing with us. Wish em dead! And their kids too! Why should family be excluded? Fuck you. Fuck them Fuckem all to hell. Hate, baby. Feed on hate you lowlife cocksuckers …an apt desrciption for more and more of you.
Holy Shit! SAH thinks there is a smart Boomer!
In 1992 Charles J. Dunlap jr wrote an essay titled “The Origins of the American Military Coup of 2012”.
I leave anyone who wishes to read his perspective from 20 years ago to do so and make their own judgement about it’s worth. Dunlap wrote it as an excercise in “worst case scenario” thinking, and emphatically said it was not a prediction for the future. Has the government headed his warning? Or has it been used as a template for how the government can seize ultimate power? Or has it been wholesale ignored? If you choose to read it, I’d be interested in hearing what the Boomers and ex-military here think of it.
Link to the Charles Dunlap essay on the American Coup of 2012:
http://www.uwec.edu/sfpj/Origins.pdf
Your Taxpayer Dollars At Work: The Police Get An Upgrade For Close “Restless Native” Encounters
Submitted by Tyler Durden on 09/04/2012 17:28 -0400
Just in case America’s debt slaves, who as of today can congratulate themselves on a brand spanking new 16 handle in front of the 12 zeroes that frame their public debt obligation, did not have enough to celebrate, here is what happens when the local Police station also wants to celebrate something brand spanking new: in this case the new and improved SWAT-H vehicle. This is merely the latest and greatest entrant in the “gentrification”-vehicles that taxpayer dollars are buying in order to be more effectively suppressed as one after another pillar of this country’s democracy is taken down. And, for your viewing pleasure, here are the highest crime rate regions that will likely get their ‘fair’ share of attention from this perriwinkle-blue camper-van of enforced docility.
The Heat-Armor SWAT-H in all its glory…
SAH the lazy shit Millenial wants you to read a 20 page article and then doesn’t supply a link. Douchebag.
here
http://www.carlisle.army.mil/usawc/parameters/Articles/2010winter/Dunlap_Jr.pdf
We are so fractured, detached or flat out of the loop that when one segment of the population or movement gets “the Military Treatment” a majority will either support the Feds, not care or even know about it.
Unless we have something happen that causes the left, the right and middle to stand together nationally in a common cause the military will only have to be used in a limited fashion if at all and the story can be spun in the MSM how ever the owners see fit or ignore it altogether.
The divisive nature of our leadership, the media both mainstream and alternative and general population seem to have insured that no one group large enough to be a real force can form behind a common idea. The Federal government may never have to deploy the Military in a really big way to suppress or disrupt us. We do that to ourselves very well.
This nation is so dependent, so ignorant by design, and so desensitized that it can’t function with out it’s government on even the most basic levels. If the SHTF and things get really tough the people will beg for more government, more assistance, more authority and more tyranny not less. The Military won’t have to shoot them except for the occasional few who get out of hand as we have historical support for.
The best alternative outcome in the long run is that things get so bad and break down to such an extreme that the Federal Government and it’s domestic military police state machine become so overwhelmed it is of no use, help or value, total faith is lost, it becomes widely ignored and dissolves into nothing never to darken our lives again.
I think they imported that vehicle from S. Africa. They used to drive those things into black neighborhoods and terrorize the natives.
I interviewed for a residency position in the Bronx. The police had armored cars back then, but nothing like that sweet machine. That’s the only vehicle you’ll be safe in Detroit, Chicago, S. central LA, Oakland, Philly, E. St. Louis, and every other hellhole in the U.S. When they start sending them into your neighborhood, it’s time to start worrying.
I read the whole damn article SAH posted. I should have stopped at the first two sentences which reads as follows;
—————–
“The letter that follows takes us on a darkly imagined excursion into the future. A military coup has taken place in the United States—the year is 2012”
—————–
The premise is beyond retarded. It is impossible for a renegade group of military officers to plot and carry out a coup in the United States.
Sure it’s been done elsewhere. BFD. Other intelligent countries legalize pot and prostitution without problems. But, SSS says it’ll never work here.
A coup won’t work in the USA. You could go down the list and take over this headquarters, that headquarters, the White House, the Defense Department, the television, the radio, and so on. You could arrest all the leaders, detain or kill off their families. And you would have accomplished nothing. What are you going to seize that, having seized it, gives you control of the country?
You might sit in the office of the Secretary of Defense, and the first place where you wouldn’t be obeyed would be inside your office. If they did follow orders inside the office, then people in the rest of the Pentagon wouldn’t. If everybody in the Pentagon followed orders, people out in the military bases wouldn’t. If they did, as well, American citizens would still not accept your legitimacy.
You can’t shut down the media because it’s too dispersed. Even if you did shut it down, you still wouldn’t be able to rule. In order to actually rule, you have to have acceptance … at least by a large enough group that can impose its will.
For example, Saddam Hussein was not a popular leader. He was hated by almost the entire country. BUT he was obeyed by his security forces, the Republican Guards. The Army, in turn, obeyed them. The people in turn obeyed the Army. So there is a minimum group, like the Republican Army, that must exist in order to control any country. In America, you could never control such a minimum group.
Another reason the military won’t start a coup. The US government is already run by the military, by and large. Why would they revolt?
Who determines the Defense Budget? The military! They determine what weapons, troops,etc they need. And they get it. They ask for $1.5 billion for this new tank, and they only get $1 billion. Bullshit if you think this is a negotiation, a loss, or a compromise. They only really needed $500 million. They win, you lose.
The State Department and Justice Department vastly underfunded civilian police forces in Afghan and Iraq. In Baghdad they needed 6,000 (or whatever) and eventually wound up with vastly less than that number.
After that fuckup was allowed to percolate, policymakers had no choice but to resort to civilian outfits like Blackwater. The local Iraq police forces now look like complete militarized forces, not beat cops.
That plan worked so well overseas, it was soon marched on Washington itself.
Military officers came back from overseas and got cushy jobs in Washington They usurped the role played by civilian development experts. Pentagon bureaucrats quietly populated the National Security Council and the State Department and every other agency that likes guns&toys with their own personnel.
Along with them came all the usual assortment of hangers on, lobbyists, lawyers, consultants, and Big Corporations. All needing to sell their shit … armored assault vehicles, drones, weapons, ammo, blah blah — upon the American public, and rewarding the military goons their lousy 30 shekels of silver to help fuck over …. err, give police more needed capabilities. Overkill capabilities that amount to using a shotgun to kill a fly, for since when has it been necessary to send a fully armored SWAT team to issue a goddamn arrest warrant?
There’s your military. The ones that might start a coup. The ones the GOP and Dems tout as “heroes” making “sacrifices” for their country. YOU will be the sacrifice!
Who is the asshat that thumbed down the Admin? Unbelievable.
Maybe the same asshat(s) who thumbed down my two posts literally within seconds after it was posted?
Stuff that took me half an hour to write? Stuff without a shred of flaming or trolling? Stuff that is at least reasonably thought out? Why would that get an immediate thumb down?
Because there are asshats like AWD, SAH, Colma, Zara etc who don’t give a shit about the content of a post, but focus on their love or hate for the writer? Maybe that kind of asshat?
NOT THAT IT MATTERS. Thumbs down or up mean you are noticed. The far worse outcome is being ignored. Like writing a long article and then no one comments. Thumbs down are good!
Too bad most of the jerkoffs on this site sit on their thumbs anyway. The same jerkoffs that won’t vote in a national election won’t even vote on a comment. Not talking about you or the other regs here. I’m talking mostly about those lazy facebook freak Millennials.
That article was dumb but nobody cares what I think. This is no fun.
Surely the Boomers would appreciate a link to Rolling Stone
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/another-runaway-general-army-deploys-psy-ops-on-u-s-senators-20110223
The question isn’t just whether the Government will use the Military on the Citizens. An equally valid question is, will the Military become the Government?
Everyone better hope that GenX and the Millennials are smarter, better people than they are often given credit for around here. The Boomers and remaining Silents dominate Politics, but GenX and Millennials dominate the Military.
The stage has been set. Power has been concentrated in the hands of the few. The 3 separate branches of government have been merged into 1 giant executive branch. That executive branch has now seized the Military as a force of henchmen to be used in policing civil affairs. Will the Millennial Military decide to act as Boomer Politicians little bitches forever – getting killed for oil, and shooting down their own fellow citizens? That is what the politicians are asking of them – actually commanding them to do by force of law.
Sticky brought up General Patton on a different thread. I’ll throw in some of The Old Man’s words of wisdom:
“There’s a great deal of talk about loyalty from the bottom to the top. Loyalty from the top down is even more necessary and is much less prevalent. One of the most frequently noted characteristics of great men who have remained great is loyalty to their subordinates.”
– General George S. Patton, Jr
Have the politicians shown any loyalty to the Millennial boots-on-the-ground and their future? Have the Generals shown them more loyalty and tried to save their lives in combat? I honestly hope and pray that this isn’t the choice the Millennials are faced with going forward. I really do. Either way, it’s the Millennials who will be the vote on this one, and the Millennials with tanks, humvees, guns, and frustration with the system will have a hell of a lot more votes than the FSA Millennials.
The Millennials havent been given any clean option of restoring a Constitutional America that I can figure out. Hard for anyone to see how that can be done at this point. What they do have, is a clear choice between 2 dictatorships: a Political Dictatorship, or a Military One. They’ve also been saddled with the crushing responsibility of fixing this mess and restoring order. Would have been nice of the rest of us to have left them with more options.
Patton was a great war time General. But he, as a major, was involved in the attack on the Bonus Army. Not much of a recommendation there, is it?
LMAO, John Bomb Bomb Bomb, Bomn Bomb Iran, or Lieberman, doesnt need to be manipulated to spend more money on war. [in response to RS article)