BC VI: What is the Circle of the Earth?

Originally posted at Dispatches from Reality, by Scipio Eruditusdfreality.substack.com


 18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

— Epistle to the Romans 1:18-22 KJV



Previous Entry


 

The Earth is described in Holy Scripture some 49 different times as having a “face”. In geometric terms, the face of an object is a flat, planar surface that forms the boundaries of one side of an object. While the vast majority of these verses are found in the Old Testament, I believe it crucial to note that Christ describes the Earth in this same fashion not once, but twice in the Gospel of Luke (12:56, 21:35). For all the corrections of the Pharisees’ doctrine that Christ made, He quite conspicuously affirms their understanding of cosmology throughout His earthly ministry.

The last time in the Holy Bible that we see the Earth described in this fashion, the Apostle Paul is seen debating the nature of creation with the Stoics and Epicureans of Athens (all emphasis below is mine):

22 Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars’ hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.

23 For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, To The Unknown God. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.

24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

25 Neither is worshipped with men’s hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;

26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:

28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

— The Acts of the Apostles 17:22-28 KJV

What the Apostle Paul states here is extraordinarily profound on multiple levels. Not only have the bounds of our habitation on Earth been determined by the LORD, but the very essence of Creation is itself a direct physical manifestation of Christ. We can not escape the physical bounds of the cosmos, and it is through His creation — and the limitations placed upon it — that the reality of our Creator is made known to us.

In Epiphanius’ seminal work on heresy, the Panarion, he describes the beliefs of the Greek Stoics “who held that the universe is a body and believed that this visible world is God”. It is this startling truth that Paul alludes to in Acts 17:28 — a truth which even the pagan philosophers were able to deduce through their observance of creation. As Paul reiterates in so many of his epistles, it is through Jesus Christ that all of creation was formed:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

— Epistle to the Colossians 1:16-17 KJV

This point is once again echoed nearly verbatim in Paul’s epistle to the church at Rome:

For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.

— Epistle to the Romans 11:36 KJV

Paul makes this yet even more plain in the opening verses of Hebrews:

God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

— Hebrews 1:1-3 KJV

Christ truly knows His cosmos in an intimate fashion since it is through Him, and by Him, that all of creation is sustained. When Jesus Christ states that the Earth has a face; when He consistently affirms the ancient Hebrew understanding of cosmology, we as His subjects should contemplate the profundity of His proclamations.

 

— An Arctic aurora. Source: Sigurdur William Brynjarsson.

 

So what is the Circle of the Earth? Let us first turn to Strong’s Concordance to define our terms:

H2329 chug: vault, horizon

Original Word: חוּג
Part of Speech: Noun Masculine
Transliteration: chug
Phonetic Spelling: (khoog)
Definition: vault, horizon

That word for vault or horizon is derived from a similar Hebrew word:

H2328 chug: to draw around, make a circle

Original Word: חוּג
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: chug
Phonetic Spelling: (khoog)
Definition: to draw around, make a circle

 

It is H2328 that is used to describe the boundaries of the waters in Job:

10 He hath compassed the waters with bounds, until the day and night come to an end.

— Job 26:10 KJV

That term compass is not referring to the navigation tool, but rather, the mathematical tool used to draw a circle.

 

— A compass, a mathematical tool used to draw a circle.

 

Chug is used consistently to describe the physical boundaries of the LORD’s creation:

14 Thick clouds are a covering to him, that he seeth not; and he walketh in the circuit of heaven.

— Job 22:14 KJV

Not just in the heavens, but the Earth as well:

22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

— Isaiah 40:22 KJV

Additionally, the Great Deep is also described as being compassed about:

27 When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:

— Proverbs 8:27 KJV

Every layer of creation — from the heavens above, to the neverending depths of Sheol — is compassed about by the boundaries the LORD has set forth.

 

— This is a photoshopped image of a ball — not a circle.

 

Now the above verse from Isaiah is admittedly a controversial one, often being cited by both Biblical cosmologists and heliocentric creationists as a prooftext for their belief in the flat plane and globe models, respectively. So who is correct?

In Isaiah 22:18, the Hebrew word dur, or ball, is used — so we know that the prophet clearly knows what that word is. Isaiah, under divine inspiration, importantly does not use the word for ball to describe the shape of the Earth some eighteen chapters later in Isaiah 40:22. Definitionally, a circle must be a flat plane. Beyond facile similitudes, the difference between a circle and a ball is as vast as the difference between wet and dry. From a geometric and logical standpoint, these terms are simply not interchangeable.

The physical dimensions of the Earth being described by Job, Solomon, Isaiah, Paul and Jesus Christ quite clearly describe a flat, topographical plane — not a globe.

 


“God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.”

— Epistle to the Romans 3:4 KJV


 

What you are about to see should not be physically possible according to the globe model.

It is, however, perfectly in line with the Biblical description of the Earth.

 

— 9.51 miles laser test over Tampa Bay. February 4th, 2024.

 

The globe model claims a specific circumference of the Earth and a fairly uniform rate of curvature:

A globally-average value is usually considered to be 6,371 kilometres (3,959 mi) with a 0.3% variability (±10 km) for the following reasons. The International Union of Geodesy and Geophysics (IUGG) provides three reference values: the mean radius (R1) of three radii measured at two equator points and a pole; the authalic radius, which is the radius of a sphere with the same surface area (R2); and the volumetric radius, which is the radius of a sphere having the same volume as the ellipsoid (R3). All three values are about 6,371 kilometres (3,959 mi).

Wikipedia

The horizon is not simply an optical effect on the globe model — it is, allegedly, a physical location that can be observed over large bodies of water (emphasis mine):

The horizon is the apparent curve that separates the surface of a celestial body from its sky when viewed from the perspective of an observer on or near the surface of the relevant body. This curve divides all viewing directions based on whether it intersects the relevant body’s surface or not.

The true horizon is a theoretical line, which can only be observed to any degree of accuracy when it lies along a relatively smooth surface such as that of Earth’s oceans.

Wikipedia

The math used to derive the horizon distance is fairly straightforward, resulting in the following formula: the observable distance in miles should be equal to 1.22459 miles multiplied by the square root of the observer’s height in feet.

 

— Source: How far away is the horizon? Washington University.

 

In order to falsify the curvature of the Earth, myself and a small team of Christian scientists decided to replicate an optical laser test that many other “flat Earthers” and Biblical cosmologists have performed. In my eyes, the FE Core laser test is the gold standard for experiments of this nature. Our experiment is truly a meagre addendum to the incredible work of the FE Core team.

For our experiment we picked the following two locations situated across Tampa Bay, Florida: Point A was located at the shoreline of Bahai Beach, and Point B was located on the shoreline of Lassing Park. According to our GPS measurements, the distance between Point A and Point B was 9.51 miles. The camera team was at Point A, with both cameras approximately five feet above sea level. Point B was the laser team, with our high-powered blue laser placed approx. three feet above sea level. Both the laser and the Nikon P900 we used to capture this footage were leveled.

Using the curvature formula above — and given that the laser used for this experiment was placed on a tripod three feet above sea level — our laser should have intersected with the horizon at ~2.12 miles, with a hidden height of ~36.4 feet (depending on the varying circumference measurements used).

 

— Bahai Beach to Lassing Park, a distance of 9.51 miles.

— Source: OMNI Calculator.

— Horizon distance in miles given an observer height of three feet. Source: Desmos.

 

I can already predict the globers response to all of these calculations so far: “But what about refraction?”

I’m glad you asked, let’s discuss that (emphasis mine):

The refraction of light is the bending of light rays as they pass from one medium to another, thereby changing the path of the rays. Refraction occurs due to a change in the speed of the light ray or wave. The speed of light is greatest in a vacuum. When the light rays travel from a rarer to a denser medium, they bend towards the normal. If the light rays travel from a denser to a rarer medium, they bend away from the normal. The greater the density of the media, the higher the refractive index. Snell’s law, or the law of refraction, quantitatively defines the amount of bending of waves dependent on the refractive index of the two media.

Refraction of Light, Kuar & Gurnani

First of all, refraction is a quantifiable and measurable physical phenomenon. That means it can be calculated and accounted for, not just baselessly used to explain away findings we don’t like. Crucially, so long as the light wave is not traveling between mediums, refraction should not even be a factor. But, just to humor the skeptics, let’s calculate it nonetheless.

 

— Source: OMNI Calculator.

 

Given the speed of light through the air and the refractive index of air, we would at most expect to see a divergence of .264 ft over a distance of 9.51 miles. In other words, refraction can not be used explain our findings away — which is, again, assuming it’s even impacting our beam.

But wait, it gets even worse for the globe theory. On the theoretical globe model, any distance past the horizon should be constantly falling away from us. So for this experiment (assuming the globe model is correct), the target’s hidden height is not quite the accurate metric we want to look for. In fact, due to the tangential angle of an observer on a sphere, we should expect to see the laser well overhead of our camera team at Point A (visualized below).

 

— The projected path of our laser on the globe (not to scale). Source: Earth Curve Calculator.

 

As you can plainly see, that is not what we found at all. Not only did we not observe any hidden height on the target, we did not observe any measurable curvature whatsoever.

 

— Nikon P900 footage of our laser test (February 4th, 2024).
— Cell phone footage of our laser test (February 4th, 2024).

 

 


“It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.”

— Proverbs 25:2 KJV


 

The face, or the Circle of the Earth, is consistently described not as a mere ball adrift in some ever-expanding void — it is a meticulously crafted plane; encompassed by the boundaries set forth through the hand of the Almighty. The profound implications of these observations simply defy the deceptive narratives of mainstream science. The laser tests my team conducted across Tampa Bay serve as a testament to the steadfastness of God’s Word, once again unequivocally demonstrating the inconsistencies and impossibilities inherent in the globe model.

In the face of the ever mounting evidence exposing the fallacies of the heliocentric model, and the deceptive constructs of modern cosmology, we Christians must stand firm in our faith and boldly proclaim the sovereignty of our Creator. Refraction, curvature, and the purported explanations of secular science crumble under the weight of empirical evidence, thereby leaving the intellectually honest with no recourse but to acknowledge the veracity of Biblical cosmology. The laser beam that pierced through the mythical horizon — defying the expectations of the skeptics and affirming the Biblical description of our cosmos — serves as a beacon of hope for all who dare to question the prevailing dogmas of our age.

In conclusion, the revelation of Holy Scripture stands as an unyielding and unwavering beacon of truth amidst the tumultuous waves of skepticism and deceit, ever seeking to engulf the minds of men in their grasp. The epistles of Paul, the wisdom of the prophets, and the teachings of Christ: all converge to illuminate the divine design of our cosmos, revealing the intricacies of creation that declare the handiwork of God.

Thusly, we all have been confronted with a choice. A choice between embracing the immutable truths revealed through the Word of God, or clinging onto a phantasmal delusion of cosmic proportions and infernal origins. His Creation, and His unbreakable Word, has left you without excuse.

I fervently pray that my brothers and sisters in Christ would once again boldly declare, with unwavering faith and unyielding resolve, that the Earth is not a sphere suspended in the vast expanse of an ever-expanding nothingness.

It is a flat, immovable plane lovingly crafted by the hand of our Creator.

 


“Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.”

— Apocalipsis 4:11 KJV


Further Research

 

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57 Comments
AKJOHN
AKJOHN
February 6, 2024 7:57 pm

In regards to his quote.

As Paul reiterates in so many of his epistles, it is through Jesus Christ that all of creation was formed:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

When Paul says Jesus Christ he is referring to not the man Jesus. But, Jesus as the holy spirit. The holy spirit is the word. The holy spirit/word is the essence of God. Everything else is the essence of the Holy Spirit, including the physical body and Soul.
Observe nature: God made it so we may learn by observation. The physical world is circular in all ways. The cycle of life, the seasons, etc… We all have our delusions. That’s why many of us found are way to TBP. Grunge has more than most.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  AKJOHN
February 6, 2024 8:16 pm

Even Christians murder and subjugate each other – in the name of the prince of peace, of course – over interpretation of doctrine. TBP poster “flash” praises Torquemada for having done “nothing wrong”. Jesus would undoubted have torture-murdered us into belief in his offer of salvation (/sarc). It is good to see the observant refute this, AK John.

Anonymark
Anonymark
  Anonymous
February 7, 2024 8:16 am

That is why the history books are do full with Christian corpses.

Anonymark
Anonymark
  Anonymous
February 7, 2024 8:28 am

The bible tells you right inside it, not to trust it.

Voltara
Voltara
  AKJOHN
February 8, 2024 8:11 pm

None of the nonsense above has anything to do with Jesus’ teaching. And as for the claims made by Paul, believe them if you like but they also had nothing much to do with anything Jesus said.

Anonymous
Anonymous
February 6, 2024 8:05 pm

The flat Earth delusion is merely more proof of man’s limitless capacity for infantile escape into fantasy for illusory protection. How amusing and sad from one self-titled, “Eruditis”.

Like its belief in government.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  GrungeVet aka ScipioEruditus
February 6, 2024 9:15 pm

The vids cite the works of a logician who uses math to refute your assertions.

Your turn, typical cargo-culter.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  GrungeVet aka ScipioEruditus
February 6, 2024 9:34 pm

The sources I replied with are valid.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Anonymous
February 7, 2024 12:11 pm

You ass, MTF!

Anonymark
Anonymark
  GrungeVet aka ScipioEruditus
February 7, 2024 8:24 am

Take your curvature test and see how they don’t match at other locations of earth.

Pro tip: The earth isn’t round

Something about spinning inertia and equatorial bulges has notbeen considered in your attempt to prove flat earth.

One measurement at one location 9 miles apart near the flattest region of earth [closer to equatorial region than sub-arctic regions] does not a proof make.

Nope.
For proof you will need to repeat this exact experiment at locations all over the world and hand in the exact same results.

Which you know, because the curvature is not exactly round, will never, ever happen.

Blessings Scripio!

I Want Your DOR
I Want Your DOR
February 6, 2024 8:16 pm

Not on board with this…why are we talking about 2, 9, or 16 mile tests? Now, if you ask me if we landed on the moon over 50 years ago, that is a different story, and I am going to jump right aboard and write home later on the NO train. Flat Earth, meh…

Anonymous
Anonymous
  GrungeVet aka ScipioEruditus
February 6, 2024 9:22 pm

You wonder about nothing. You presume to know without question, while pretending to question, with no intention of observing objective truth that refutes your desired delusion. You insist that the Potemkin facade is a three-dimensional edifice, while denying your sensory input. See Yuri Bezmenov.

Who said that? A seeker of truth!
Who said that? A seeker of truth!
  I Want Your DOR
February 7, 2024 12:19 pm

Você já ouviu falar em perspectiva? Talvez a sua universidade DEI não lhe ensine esse cálculo!

Anonymous
Anonymous
February 6, 2024 8:21 pm
hardscrabble farmer
hardscrabble farmer
  Anonymous
February 6, 2024 9:03 pm

Here’s the problem, everything we use to determine the shape and movement of the Earth rely 100% on human senses. Can we see it curve? Can we feel it move?

In each case we are told that we cannot trust our own senses because they are not up to the task.

Therein lies the rub.

Every proof of the globe Earth believers relies on an explanation rooted in senses we have just been told we cannot trust.

If you won’t trust my senses, how could I possibly trust yours?

Some things are simply beyond the scope of human understanding.

Vanity of vanities, saith the Preacher, vanity of vanities; all is vanity.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  hardscrabble farmer
February 6, 2024 9:18 pm

Sophistry.

Circular, self-referential “reasoning”.

hardscrabble farmer
hardscrabble farmer
  Anonymous
February 6, 2024 10:52 pm

Logical fallacy.

See Red Herring.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  hardscrabble farmer
February 6, 2024 9:49 pm

Now do chemtrails…

mark
mark
  Anonymous
February 6, 2024 10:25 pm

Why…just look up…

GNL
GNL
February 6, 2024 8:56 pm

1. the curvature of the earth is not the same all the way around. It is uneven.
2. over many miles, even if you calibrate the laser to “shoot” a straight line, is it not possible that even just a .000001 of a micrometer could extend the reach of the laser?

Just asking. No, I’m not a scientist or genius.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  GrungeVet aka ScipioEruditus
February 7, 2024 5:18 pm

“one medium (the air)”
what do you think all that stuff your laser is lighting up consists of?

Tr4head
Tr4head
February 6, 2024 10:14 pm

And then we must believe that the Sun and associated planets are nothing but varying size paper plates floating around? And how thick would a flat Earth be? Maybe we actually can drill down to China. But wait, where IS China on a flat earth? Hmm. I am Christian and I don’t see the first hypothetical, ie, that the Bible said Earth is flat at all. This was a 19th century argument to discredit Christianity and was never biblical. Besides, the Bible is not a Science project.

https://answersingenesis.org/astronomy/earth/does-bible-teach-earth-flat/

hardscrabble farmer
hardscrabble farmer
  Tr4head
February 6, 2024 10:56 pm

You mustn’t believe anything that you find unbelievable, that’s the point.

The Earth neither feels like it is moving, nor does it appear to be round.

Since no human has within their capabilities the means of proving this, or disproving it, save to trust any one of his senses, the answer remains a mystery.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  hardscrabble farmer
February 7, 2024 2:25 am

“The Earth neither feels like it is moving, nor does it appear to be round.”

Yes it does.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Anonymous
February 7, 2024 5:39 am

Where did you witness this from please

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Anonymous
February 7, 2024 11:05 am

Pretty much everywhere. Not in most buildings though, it cuts you off. If you can’t feel it, spend more time in Nature.

Perfect Stranger
Perfect Stranger
  hardscrabble farmer
February 7, 2024 7:32 am

When you are at a constant speed in a vehicle, unless you make a sudden directional change you cannot feel that you are moving. You can feel acceleration and de-acceleration.

scott henson
scott henson
  Perfect Stranger
February 7, 2024 7:37 am

You could if you were in a convertible. Think!

Perfect Stranger
Perfect Stranger
  scott henson
February 7, 2024 7:55 am

If the air was static. Your convertible isn’t the proper analogy however, because the earth and the atmosphere is postulated to be a closed system, so the entire contents would be rotating.

Your convertible scenario would be the equivalent of the earth land rotating and the air not moving with it.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Perfect Stranger
February 7, 2024 1:29 pm

You can’t argue with these flat earth people, they will always win. Don’t waste your time.

scott henson
scott henson
  Tr4head
February 7, 2024 7:43 am

It’s exactly the opposite. The ball was created to discredit Christianity!

mark
mark
February 6, 2024 10:28 pm

A scriptural review of Cosmology and Deception unlike anything you’ve ever read. Do you struggle with the complexity of a Most-High Creator, Angels, Demons, Earth and Space? This book will be an eye-opener by enhancing your worldview regarding our true Cosmology and the things that are intentionally hidden from us today. We will rebuild the Cosmos as described from all Biblical references describing the Creation of the Universe, and reveal a new understanding of how it all comes to an end. A great book for the curious and anyone interested in learning the misunderstood aspects of the Bible and other ancient texts!

scott henson
scott henson
  mark
February 7, 2024 7:38 am

Great book!

mark
mark
February 6, 2024 10:31 pm

Haven’t read this yet, but will…has anyone?

With Biblical cosmology being one of the most censored topics on the internet, it’s time to see what they’re hiding and why they have worked so hard to hide it without all of the disinformation popping up. Unlike the internet, this book will overload you with the proofs, observations, and experiments that destroy the big bang narrative and bring esteem back to the Father where it belongs. On this journey to the truth, you’ll also find answers to the 2 toughest questions of “why they lie,” and “who they are?”

Like everyone else, the authors of this book were once firm believers that they lived on a pressurized ball in a vacuum that was spiraling around the sun at 66,600 mph. However, like millions of others, they abandoned this belief when discovering what you’re going to see as you turn the pages. By the last page you will see why the wisdom of this world is foolish to the Most High and what it really means in 1 Corinthians 3:18 when it instructs us to become fools so that we may be wise.

Truth About Cosmology puts several different facets of science to the test.

Is what we have been taught growing up real factual science or pseudoscience?

Have we been duped about our place in the cosmos?

Is the creation model found in Scripture able to co-exist with scientific findings?

Was Isaac Newton right about gravity?

What really is out there in space?

Is it possible to colonize mars and other planets?

Is the heliocentric globe model a true description of our place in the universe?

These and many other questions will be answered in Truth About Cosmology.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  mark
February 7, 2024 2:27 am

It’s so censored the Rand Corporation had a spinoff division that promoted it /s

but yeah, the big bang is jewish

Anonymark
Anonymark
February 7, 2024 8:00 am

Did you do the laser test at high tide or low tide?
The curvature changes with the tides
Even my dog knows that.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Anonymark
February 7, 2024 12:21 pm

Stop eating your dog’s food and “maybe” you’ll see!

Anonymark
Anonymark
February 7, 2024 8:03 am

The earth is not a round ball shape.
The curvature varies depending upon the latitude and exact location of any given measurement.
Jes sain.

I gaurantee your experiment will have different results if ever attampted at other locations.

Prove me wrong.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Anonymark
February 7, 2024 12:23 pm

George Lemaitre, the creator of the Big Bang theory, was a Jesuit and Jesuits don’t tell the truth, they just indoctrinate.

VOWG
VOWG
February 7, 2024 8:05 am

Way too many stupid people out there.

Anonyface
Anonyface
February 7, 2024 8:15 am

The Earth is described in Holy Scripture some 49 different times as having a “face”. 

Nice how you parsed your search “thy face”
Because if you search face, it applies to actual faces the most. [The bible isn’t claiming all humans are flat is it?”

See all the other uses if face at the link provided by article author:

https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=Face&t=KJV#s=s_primary_0_1

Svarga Loka
Svarga Loka
February 7, 2024 8:28 am

I went through a phase a number of years ago, around 2011 or so, starting with Sandy Hook, to obsessively research a whole lot of things that didn’t make sense ad just did not appear logical. After I found enough evidence to convince myself that it was a lie, I then moved on to the next thing, because it is a logical consequence to ask “heck, if they lied about that one, what else did they lie about?”

It is nice to see this topic revisited, although you don’t need additional evidence after you made up your mind once and for all.

I have been struggling because it is so frustrating that others around me won’t even LOOK, seemingly lacking any kind of curiosity.

Recently, I have come to realize that they are all on their own journey. I would not have believed the shape issue if I had not first spent years on Sandy Hook and the Zapruder film etc. I don’t think that there are shortcuts. You have to go through the motions yourself, one by one, in order. Most people will spend their entire lives without taking even a first step, and I have to realize that that does not necessarily mean that it was not a life well lived.

I am reminded of all that as I see my son struggle with a new piano piece that he is not ready for, filling his eyes with tears. I need to step back and find something more manageable for him first.

I have started to resort to just praying. Praying for my loved ones eyes to be opened. Or not. God knows best. The former really has a selfish motive, because life is more lonely when you are the only one, but it might not be what the other person needs or is ready for at this time.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Svarga Loka
February 7, 2024 11:26 am

I’m curious what seemed to you illogical about the earth shape that got you interested.

Svarga Loka
Svarga Loka
  Anonymous
February 7, 2024 1:09 pm

I was just spending weeks and months reading and watching about proofs or disproofs on curvature. I don’t particularly enjoy math or physics, so I will admit that the details of trigonometry elude me, but it seemed to make sense that the buildings on the other side of the Great Lakes should not the visible but rather be 100s of feet below the horizon, using a Nikon P100 camera on youtube videos. How do you explain that? The mirage explanation seems far fetched, too. Clearly, the curvature over large bodies of water doesn’t compute. On every flight I took, I watched the straight horizon and wondered, but I just don’t know. Could it be flat in some areas and curved in others? Could it have a shape that humans don’t know or understand? Could it be a sphere, but much larger than we are being told, with a less pronounced curvature? Is it moving? Well, it doesn’t appear to be, but I don’t know.

I just don’t know for sure, either way. And I never will, because I can’t prove it for myself and I don’t trust anybody who tries to prove it to me
There are too many inconsistencies that I have seen. It probably is unknowable in this life, but I don’t lose sleep over it.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Svarga Loka
February 7, 2024 5:10 pm

I meant what sparked your interest originally, or was it always there? Personally I never thought unconventionally about it except for when reading the Silmarillion and some Greek stuff.

“I was just spending weeks and months reading and watching about proofs or disproofs on curvature.”

That is just another form of indoctrination. If someone actually nailed a critical point, continuing is just sophistry.

I believed in the The Holocaust™. And one day a guy told me to get the numbers and just do the math on the crematoria. For once, instead of getting butthurt, I did the math. I did it a couple of different ways to be certain. No amount of arguing or proofs or videos could have done what that did.

When I heard Flat Earth, I dismissed it because whoever was talking about it just kept finding really stupid videos about it. Then a friend was doing the same. We were just arguing past each other. I have some training (like indoctrination, but more practical) and experience in this area, but was I really certain?. I had to do the math, and not just trust others on it. I came up with a few things that only logically make sense one way, I found numbers and double-checked them with older and different sources…

Do the math.

For me, the WHY of different theories, different histories, different beliefs is much more interesting.

Svarga Loka
Svarga Loka
  Anonymous
February 7, 2024 6:07 pm

In a nutshell:
1) I was always a very curious but also stubborn child. I won’t do anything just because someone tells me to. Blessed are my parents…
2) I originally started researching things like 9/11 to prove the nutjobs wrong. Turns out they were the ones that made more sense than the official story, which had more holes in it than Swiss cheese.
3) Then one thing led to another and I spent years going through the stages of grief as the world as I thought I knew it fell apart. Many sleepless nights without anybody to talk to about it.
4) Cue TBP, circa 2011 or 2012. It might have literally saved my life.

Flat earth is so much “out there”, so “crazy”, most will never be ready for it. It’s like the graduation capstone for your world-of-lies Bachelor’s degree. But even then you are just at the beginning of your journey.

To me, it’s actually liberating to know that almost everything thatvis outside of my little family or town/community sphere is a lie/fake.

It makes me appreciate the family even more. It’s a haven and refuge.

And surprisingly, I don’t need to be surrounded by people who see the world as I do.

I can stand on my own.

mark
mark
  Svarga Loka
February 7, 2024 10:21 pm

Svarga, No Name,

I avoided doing the deep dives needed for ‘Flat Earth’ for years…too many other mysteries and mounting suspicions to be solved.

First for me was the Gulf of Tolkien…once that personal FF was solved (didn’t take long) I went into all the related ones…years on Agent Orange and purging/detoxing from it so I could finish raising my daughter was top on my list…an obsession to purge the poison. (Another reason I fight/detox Chemtrails poisons…been there done that).

We are all Sprayed and Betrayed now…just LOOK UP.

Along that path came WAR IS A RACKET, then the FED Banksters (with occasional side trips into JFK). By the late 90’s and with the internet I was hip deep in what was called all the right wingnut full blown tin foil hat research then and now…by the same Mocking Birds…some who post here.

After 911…the Pentagon missile strike was what did it for me. Come on.

From 2000 to when I retired mid 2015 I was a Business Fraud Investigator, most of that time with my own one man consulting company…Have Investigation – Will Travel…so deep dive researching and investigating was what I did for a living…it was a good living.

But Prophecy became my research driving force…

Finally…I focused on the Moon landing con…666 NASA maff be hard. I could not avoid Flat Earth any longer…and I went after the truth.

There was a lot of ‘Confusion in the Cosmos’.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Svarga Loka
February 8, 2024 11:49 pm

I was the same as a kid.

I never lost sleep over any of it later except where it impinged on my worldview. After a dramatic shift occured maybe a decade ago, the easier it is to accept changes in my understanding of the details. Like puzzle pieces, things fit together so much better now, rather than making things more complicated.

What would you think or feel differently if you had come to the conclusion the conventional model of the physical world was correct?

Unlike Grunge and some others, I have no religious attachment either way, so I don’t really understand the effect of this one.

Anonymous
Anonymous
February 7, 2024 1:20 pm

Lol, that vid is on par with the old memes of allahu ackbar! getting dubbed over simple science experiments

bonus points for “Bahai Beach”, “we measured with GPS”, and “Both the laser and the Nikon P900 we used to capture this footage were leveled”

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
February 7, 2024 1:44 pm

Another fine article but Paul didn’t write the book of Hebrews. Note…

Hebrews 2:3 KJB… “How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;”

From the authors point of view, “we” includes author… “how shall we”, “if we”. Also does the word “us” include our author, whosoever that might be (I don’t know). Now examine the salvation which shouldn’t be neglected; from where and from whom did our author(s) learn it? It was first spoken by the Lord (that would be Jesus during His earthly ministry) and confirmed to author by “them that heard Him” (Jesus); that would be (at least) the twelve, of which Paul is not a part (see Acts 1:21-26). So our Hebrews author learned about the Lord from those that were with Him while He walked the flat earth!

What does Paul say about his knowledge of Christ? From where did it come?

Galatians 1:11-12 KJB… “But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.”

Paul writes specifically that he did NOT receive his knowledge by way of man as our Hebrews author did, Paul received his knowledge by direct revelation from Jesus Christ Himself… thus, Paul cannot be our Hebrews author. I’ve yet to figure out who that author might be, aside from God of course! And no, I don’t trust the publishers who print Paul’s name at the top of the Hebrews page, I trust scripture itself.

Vigilant
Vigilant
  grace country pastor
February 9, 2024 11:05 pm

I believe that it was Barnabus. He was a Levite. Hebrews describes the transition from the Levitical priesthood to the priesthood that is after the order of Melchizedek. Having a Levite explain the transition lends credibility.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Vigilant
February 10, 2024 2:25 pm

A compelling thought! Thank you for that!