THIS BUST SHOULD BE A DOOZY

110 comments

Posted on 24th June 2012 by Administrator in Economy

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Automatic Earth with another reality check on the shale gas BOOM!!!

Let’s see – tremendous levels of debt, hype times infinity, Wall Street shysters, douchebags like Aubrey McClendon, delusional drillers, record low prices, high drilling costs, and low EROEI. Sounds like a perfect combination.  

Shale Gas Reality Begins to Dawn

SUNDAY, JUNE 24, 2012  2:30 PM

It has long been our position at The Automatic Earth that North America is collectively dreaming with regard to unconventional natural gas. While gas is undeniably there, the Energy Returned On Energy Invested (EROEI) is dramatically lower than for conventional supplies. The critical nature of EROEI has been widely ignored, but will ultimately determine what is and is not an energy source, and shale gas is going to fail the test.

As we pointed out in Get Ready for the North American Gas Shock in July 2011, the natural gas situation is not what it seems at all:

The shale gas bubble is a perfect example of the irrationality of markets, the power of perverse short-term incentives, the driving force of momentum-chasing, the dominance of perception over reality in determining prices, and the determination for a herd to stampede over a cliff all at once.

The perception of a gas glut has driven prices so low that none of the participants are making money (at least not by producing gas) or creating value. We see a familiar story of excessive debt, and the hollowing out of productive companies dead set on pursuing a mirage.

Many industry insiders know perfectly well that the prospects for recovering substantial amounts of gas are poor, and that the industry is structured as a ponzi scheme. Still, there has been money to be made in the short term by flipping land leases and building infrastructure to handle gas.

The hype is so extreme that those who fall for it contemplate, in all seriousness, North America becoming a natural gas exporting powerhouse, and a threat to Australian LNG producers, or to Russia’s Gazprom.

This concept, constructed from a mixture of greed and desperation (at the lack of conventional gas prospects), is entirely divorced from reality. (See here for Dimitri Orlovs excellent piece on why Gazprom has nothing to worry about.)

Nevertheless, euphoric hype is extremely catching. Given that prices are driven by perception, not by reality, hype has the power to change the dynamics of an industry, exaggerating boom and bust cycles in practice. The hype has resulted in the perception of glut – that North America is drowning in natural gas. The inconvenient fact that this peception is completely wrong does not alter its power in relation to prices.

Natural gas companies gambling on shale gas have been facing prices so low – far below the cost of production – that all of them have been producing gas unprofitably. The financial risk has been increasing dramatically as the companies have been drowning in debt trying to ride out the rock bottom prices that have been the result of people believing the fantasy. Finally, casualties of the financial shenanigans involved are emerging. It is very likely that there will be many more, as companies that have tried to ride out the low prices go under.

Wolf Richter:

Natural Gas: Where Endless Money Went To Die

Alas, thanks to the Feds zero-interest-rate policy and the trillions it has handed over to its cronies since late 2008, the sweeps of creative destruction have broken down. Instead, boundless sums of money have been searching for a place to go, and they’re chasing yield when there is none, and so theyre taking risks, any kind of risks, in their vain battle to come out ahead.

The result is a stunning misallocation of capital to the tune of tens of billions of dollars to an economic activity drilling for dry natural gas that has been highly unprofitable for years. It’s where money has gone to die. What’s left is debt, and wells that will never produce enough to make their investors whole.

But the money has dried up. And drilling for natural gas is collapsing. Last week, there were only 562 rigs drilling for dry natural gas, the lowest number since September 1999…

 

…At $2.53 per million Btu at the Henry Hub, the price of natural gas is up 33% from the April low of $1.90 per million Btu, a number not seen in a decade.

.But even if it doubled, it would still be below the cost of production. And if it tripled, it might still be below the cost of production for most producers. That’s how mispriced the commodity has become.

More from Wolf Richter:

Dirt Cheap Natural Gas Is Tearing Up The Very Industry That’s Producing It

The economics of fracking are horrid. All wells have decline rates where production drops over time. But instead of decades for traditional wells, decline rates in horizontal fracking are measured in weeks and months: production falls off a cliff from day one and continues for a year or so until it levels out at about 10% of initial production. To be in the black over its life under these circumstances, a well in the Barnett Shale would have to sell its production for about $8 per million Btu, pricing models have shown.

…Drilling is destroying capital at an astonishing rate, and drillers are left with a mountain of debt just when decline rates are starting to wreak their havoc. To keep the decline rates from mucking up income statements, companies had to drill more and more, with new wells making up for the declining production of old wells. Alas, the scheme hit a wall, namely reality…

…The natural gas business is brutal. The peak in drilling occurred in September 2008 with 1,606 rigs. Then the financial crisis threw it into a vertigo-inducing plunge. After last years mini-peak, the plunge continued…

Production lags behind rig count, and while rig count for gas wells has been setting new decade lows, production has been rising month after month to new record highs. But lagging doesn’t mean decoupled. And someday…. Oops, it already happened. It has started. Production has turned the corner, and not just in one field, but across the US.

 

Its still just a little notch in the curve. But its a sign that the collapse in rig count is translating into lower production numbers. And when the steep decline rates are beginning to overlap the drop in rig count, production will head south in a dizzying trajectory.

Money has been thrown at the industry, but the notion is dawning that the game is up and that returns will never materialize. The ponzi scheme has reached its natural limit, and investors are waking up to the realization that they have been chasing a fantasy.

Ironically, just as the washout begins, natural gas prices may have bottomed. Conventional natural gas in North America peaked in 2001. Coal bed methane and now shale gas have been revealed to be massively overblown as an energy source. Producers are reaping the consequences of malinvestment and will be going out of business. Demand has been building with the transition from coal to natural gas for power generation. This is an ideal set up for a supply collapse and subsequent price spike.

North America is poised for a huge natural gas shock. Far from being an exporter, North America is going to experience a natural gas supply crunch. Prices will be rising at the same time as peoples purchasing power falls precipitously, thanks to deflation. The structural dependency on natural gas that has been cemented in recent years is going to guarantee maximum pain as prices reconnect with reality.

110 Comments
  1. Muck About says:

    I’ve got short and intermediate term buys on UNG this week. Maybe Nat. Gas has bottomed but I’ll wait and watch a bit longer before committing funds.. Right now it only good for trading.

    MA

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 12:36 pm

  2. SSS says:

    This article falls squarely in the “So What” column. The money involved is PRIVATE VENTURE CAPITAL. If the whole venture collapses like a house of cards, as the article predicts it will over and over again ad naseum, it won’t cost YOU a fucking penny, meaning no government tax dollars thown at yet another failed “Government Picks the Winners” program, a la Solyndra.

    I’m changing my mind. It’s not a “So What” article. It’s a piece of anti-capitalist bullshit.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8 Thumb down 6

    24th June 2012 at 1:04 pm

  3. Administrator says:

    SSS actually believes the shale gas boom has no government involvement. How naive for a secret agent.

    PA alone has thrown billions of taxpayer dollars at the gas industry with tax incentives, breaks, and credits. The promise of endless jobs has led our fine public servants to allow these corporate scumbags to drill with little to no safety regulations. When this boom goes bust, there will be putrid pools of toxic slime left, thousands of jobs lost, and the taxpayer left on the hook. Fucked again by the corporate fascist state.

    Time to get your magnifying glass out and get a clue SSS.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 7 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 1:32 pm

  4. SSS says:

    Before I lay into Admin with a two-by-four, I googled “steaming pile of shit” to go with my comments directed at Admin. I stumbled on this photo.

    ShitTattoo.jpg

    This tattoo on a girl’s back comes with this story. Seems she was the girlfriend of a tattoo artist and was cheating on him with his best friend. He found out about it, but played it cool and got her to agree to a tattoo on her back from the movie Narnia. He then plied her with shots of tequila and wine and proceeded to put this tattoo on her back. Too funny. She’s suing him.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 2:31 pm

  5. Colma Rising says:

    What’s better….

    That or tire tracks?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 2:49 pm

  6. SSS says:

    Admin

    You ignorant slut. You said, “PA alone has thrown billions of taxpayer dollars at the gas industry with tax incentives, breaks, and credits.” Bullshit. Show me one penny, just one penny, that has come out of the PA treasury and sent to the natural gas industry. EVERYONE who drills for gas and oil get the tax breaks you describe, at both the federal AND state levels. Why do governments do that? Because the revenue they expect to GAIN exceeds the tax breaks they are granting, such as gains on wages/salaries of the new jobs, gains on sales taxes, taxes on royalties paid, etc. If the whole venture collapses, then the state will STILL get some revenue because of the economic activity created before the collapse.

    Your penchant for false hyperbole is breathtaking, such as “the promise of endless jobs.” Show me one instance, just one, where the gas drillers promised endless jobs. You can’t, because it never happened. No one in his right mind would ever make a promise of endless jobs, except maybe you.

    You also said, “When this boom goes bust, there will be putrid pools of toxic slime left, thousands of jobs lost, and the taxpayer left on the hook. Fucked again by the corporate fascist state.” More bullshit, more blathering hyperbole. Every oil and gas well plays out sooner or later. 100%. No exceptions. And everyone knows that, except maybe you. When the well goes dry, jobs will be lost. Period. Happens all the fucking time.

    As for your bullshit “putrid pools of toxic slime left” and “the taxpayer left on the hook” statements, prove it. Show the readers here where the drilling contracts read, “any pools of toxic slime left will be cleaned up on the Pennsylvania taxpayer’s dime.” Can you do that, please, Mr. Charter Member of The Wilderness Society and Super Secret Admirer of The Sierra Club? Thank you.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 12 Thumb down 10

    24th June 2012 at 3:02 pm

  7. SSS says:

    Colma

    I think the flies going around the pile of shit add a nice touch to the tattoo.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 3:04 pm

  8. SSS says:

    Admin

    Heads up. I just got a call from a famous Hollywood producer, who asked to remain anonymous. He wants to make a movie entitled “Epic Beatdown, The Sequel.”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 3:20 pm

  9. Kill Bill says:

    I wonder what he tattooed on his best friends back.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 3:23 pm

  10. SSS says:

    Actual photo of a copper mine in Admin’s backyard. No wonder he’s pissed.

    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS3WOT9xmW_gbttD3AUiRQY3tTQSxbHnOTIMa1DMPhd4uOdSp6ywA

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 3:25 pm

  11. Administrator says:

    Clueless SSS

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 3:29 pm

  12. Colma Rising says:

    I was wondering when the opening salvos would escalate.

    After pausing from some fine literature, Administrator flanks with the groundwater question.

    Undoubtedly, SSS will impeach the accusers…

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 3:35 pm

  13. Colma Rising says:

    After nap-time, of course….

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 3:42 pm

  14. Administrator says:

    SSS about to flail about in flashlike frenzy of CIA level accusations and denials in an effort to distract from the ass kicking he is receiving from Admin. SSS should stick to golf and Latin America coups.

    Fracking fluid spilled into creek at gas well incident near LeRoy

    ERIC HRIN

    A incident involving a gas well spewing fluids occurred late Tuesday night in LeRoy Township, Bradford County Commissioner Mark Smith said today.

    Gary Wilcox, the county’s director of public safety, said there was no fire or explosion at the Chesapeake well site. He said, “They lost control of the well, there was a malfunction in something. They did lose pressure in the well, which caused material to come back up. They were fracing, so whatever material they were using when they were fracing is what came back up.” He didn’t know what type of materials they were.

    The material went into the containment area, and into a field and into a tributary of Towanda Creek and into Towanda Creek, he said. “I’m not sure of the amount of gallons that went into the creek,” he said.

    He said there is no adverse effects to the streams or waterways, however, and DEP is monitoring and taking samples. NO one from DEP was immediately available to confirm Wilcox’s comment about the effect on the waterways.

    Brian Grove, director of corporate development, for Chesapeake, said early this afternoon the incident occurred because of an equipment failure. He issued the following statement:

    “At approximately 11:45 p.m. on April 19, an equipment failure occurred during well-completion activities, allowing the release of completion fluids from a well at a location in Leroy Township, Bradford County, Pa. He called it a blowback.

    Crews are on location working to control the leak and contain the fluid flow. All relevant emergency agencies have been notified and are either on location or en route. Well-control specialists Boots and Coots have been mobilized and are prepared to respond if necessary. All non-essential vehicles have been removed from the location. An undetermined amount of water has flowed off the location. Crews are working to minimize any impacts to the nearby Towanda Creek.

    As a precautionary measure, seven families who live near the location have been temporarily relocated until all agencies involved are confident the situation has been contained. There have been no injuries or natural gas emissions to the atmosphere.”

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 3:44 pm

  15. Kill Bill says:

    marriage-two-men-fighting.jpg?w=610
    Someone bring the beer and hot wings this is going to be interesting!

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 3:48 pm

  16. Administrator says:

    If SSS can take a few minutes away from his Lawrence Welk reruns, he can click this link and learn something about the toxic pools of fracking fluid. No reason to worry. These corporations don’t really care more about short-term profits than the lives of people.

    http://www.marcellus-shale.us/impoundments.htm

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 3:56 pm

  17. Colma Rising says:

    waltermirisch.jpg

    Fluid?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 4:05 pm

  18. Administrator says:

    KB

    More like this.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 4:05 pm

  19. Administrator says:

    SSS on the golf course distracted by the epic beatdown applied to his specious ass by Admin.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 4:07 pm

  20. SSS says:

    Admin spews hysterical, flash-length articles to logjam the thread and changes the subject to water. Four homes with contaminated water ………. not 4 million or 4 thousand or 4 hundred or even 40, just 4 …….. and the fucking EPA steps in and Admin goes into orbit.

    You know what that article tells me, Admin. That you are the classic worshipper of a fart in a hurricane. Otherwise, that article doesn’t mean jackshit. Same goes for the next article about some chemical which may have gotten into a creek. Another fart in a hurricane. Oh, the goddamn horror. Did the EPA call for an emergency evacuation of Pittsburgh, Admin? Well, did it?

    Now, then, I await your brutal refutation of my initial remarks above about your misleading statements on PA “throwing billions of taxpayer dollars” at the natural gas industry, which you claim will leave pools of taxic waste behind after the wells play out. Try and focus this time.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 11 Thumb down 7

    24th June 2012 at 4:19 pm

  21. A Real American says:

    353b9e.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 4:23 pm

  22. A Real American says:

    This guy drank some fraking water. Dangerous stuff

    fart.jpg

    Can we all play along?

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 4:25 pm

  23. Administrator says:

    SSS

    I can find 50 articles about “small” meaningless farts in a hurricane within 30 minutes. Are you such a dullard that you actually expect these companies to commit one grand fuckup? No. They will commit thousands of fuckups due to short cutting safety procedures in order to make their profit goal set by suits at headquarters. Good to see you’ve retained that government drone mentality during your taxpayer financed retirement. Thanks for confirming my beliefs about government drones.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 4:25 pm

  24. Administrator says:

    Think of all the benefits to the people living near these fracking operations. They don’t have to boil their water for a cup of tea.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 4:32 pm

  25. Colma Rising says:

    32921_384x288_generated__8FHzSi8wCE2v77IsxLQ19w.jpg

    flamingmoe1.gif

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 4:35 pm

  26. ThePessimisticChemist says:

    The jobs promises have been mostly through the MSM, not official statements by the industry itself.

    At least, thats my take on it.

    As for the danger of fracking fluids, its true that the amount of damage we are aware of isn’t exactly massive, however I KNOW what those chemicals are, and I KNOW the precautions we have to take when handling them in the research lab.

    Its a laundry list of things that can kill you slow, fast or horribly. Not only that, but a large number of them are very stable and can reside in the fat of an animal or the soil/water of an area for a long damned time.

    They use those chemicals because they are cheaper than the alternatives, and they usually do so while following relatively stringent guidelines laid down by the EPA. The research we have shows that this is “good enough” however it is fairly unsustainable as there are better uses for those chemicals than fracking with them. With the world’s oil supplies drying up its the responsibility of the world’s chemists to find cheap, green alternatives to current crude oil fractioned chemicals, but since those new chemicals haven’t been discovered/created yet we need to pull our heads out of our asses and stop wasting stuff.

    @SSS –

    My understanding of the tax breaks thing is as you described, however I see the Admin’s point as they are breaking their promise to the state/country to not only produce energy, but also tax revenue. As it is right now they get tax breaks to lose money. Leave the taxes as-is, and it will drive out the noncompetitors which would hopefully start letting prices rise.

    Every time the government steps in to “fix” markets they mess everything up. I expect them to provide regulations and guidelines for everyone to play together, but when they start dictating who wins and who loses the whole thing goes to hell in a handbasket.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 4:37 pm

  27. Administrator says:

    Silly Wabbit

    Aubrey McClendon, brilliant CEO of Chesapeake Energy, says fracking fluid is safe enough to drink. Have a big glass SSS.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 4:37 pm

  28. Anonymous says:

    You going to let these curs play the violin for some isolated instances, SSS?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 4:44 pm

  29. Colma Rising says:

    ^^^^^^^

    Colma @ 4:44

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 4:46 pm

  30. DaveL says:

    Admin: “Cordially Admin sitting on the deck drinking a spiked Arnold Palmer and reading Starship Troopers.”

    Is that the story about bug planets?

    This thread is giving me gas.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 4:49 pm

  31. SSS says:

    Admin

    Pot calls kettle black. If there’s a government drone mentality in this discussion, it belongs to you, not me. You’re the one posting articles relying on government agencies such as the EPA to bolster your argument, not me.

    And as for that link you posted relating to the Marcellus Shale activity, you know what I saw, instead of your Chicken Little pictures of pools of toxic waste? I saw private sector economic activity. Lots of it. People sitting on heavy earth moving equipment and building impoundment ponds and drawing a solid paycheck for their labor and paying taxes THAT WEREN’T THERE BEFORE THE DISCOVERY OF NATURAL GAS DEPOSITS IN THE AREA. And I saw farms around those impoundment ponds that are paying fat taxes on their royalty checks THAT WEREN’T THERE BEFORE THE DISCOVERY OF NATURAL GAS DEPOSITS ON THEIR FARMS. That’s what I saw.

    So you go right ahead with your specious, hollow, misleading arguments. All mining activity carries a degree of risk to the miners (and investors) and some damage to the environment. Everyone knows that. You seem to be negatively smitten with this particular activity which will greatly benefit one of the poorest areas of PA. Strange.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 9 Thumb down 5

    24th June 2012 at 4:49 pm

  32. Colma Rising says:

    Seeming to be surrounded, relentless artillery punding away, SSS shows up behind the lines with a shell of his own…

    Thinking that perhaps DaveL would assist his fellow Tweener, we are instead privy to a comment on leisurely reading material…

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 4:57 pm

  33. ThePessimisticChemist says:

    @SSS –

    I fear that the short term monetary gains the populace reaps from said drilling will in no way offset the longterm damage done to the environment.

    My former boss and mentor worked in a contract lab in Colorado where he provided third party analysis for impoundment ponds as well as other sources. I’m getting my information from him, as well as from my own personal research and experience.

    The dangers are real, the benefits aren’t worth it. If people were free thinking and capable of looking at the long term they would laugh in the face of these “quick bucks”. The companies are just playing off of the FSA mindset that our corporations and country have tried so hard to instill in all of us.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 5:02 pm

  34. Colma Rising says:

    It must be naptime again.

    For Admin AND SSS.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 5:29 pm

  35. SSS says:

    18_tn.jpg

    Strip mine (coal) in West Virginia. Worth it or not, TPC? Yes or no. It’s already displaced some people who lived nearby, will produce 5-8 BILLION gallons of toxic coal sludge, sits on top of some abandoned coal shafts and upstream from the town of Whitesville, where many of the miners undoubtedly live. I ask you again. Worth it? Yes or no.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 6

    24th June 2012 at 5:46 pm

  36. SSS says:

    Colma

    After the thrashing I gave him, Admin drank himself into a stupor and passed out. Now, if you’ll excuse, I’m about to put a severe whoopin’ on that impertinent interluder, The Pessimistic Chemist.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 5:49 pm

  37. ThePessimisticChemist says:

    My current opinion: probably not. That being said MY post was referring to natural gas production and fracking in particular, NOT coal.

    I see your attempt to change the topic to coal and counter with “Boomers did it.”

    Advance warning: My next move is to claim Zionist Conspiracy!

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 6:01 pm

  38. Administrator says:

    SSS with the bullshit excuse that all mining activity carries “SOME DEGREE” of risk and “SOME” damage to the environment. What a load of shit. Mines are located in the middle of nowhere far away from people’s homes. This fracking is occuring in the fucking backyards of people while they still live there. Only a complete ignoramus would make the ridiculous argument that you are putting forth. If these companies want to frack and cause “SOME DEGREE” of environmental damage (ie flaming tap water, toxic spills into rivers, toxic ponds of chemicals, earthquakes, contaminated drinking water) then they should BUY the land and allow the residents to leave. That sounds like a capitalistic solution. Doesn’t it big guy? But that would dramatically cut into profits. We can’t let that happen. They’ve perfomed a cost benefit analysis and a certain level of cancer deaths among the poor schlubs is worth it.

    Your complete trust in these scumbag corporations is touching. Sorry big guy, you sliced this one into the woods.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 6:05 pm

  39. SSS says:

    “I fear that the short term monetary gains the populace reaps from said drilling will in no way offset the longterm damage done to the environment.”
    —-The Pessimistic Chemist

    What a crock of shit. Let’s turn to another valuable product from the Earth: timber. Did the companies which clear-cut old growth forests to build everything from houses to ships do any damage to the environment? You bet they did. They didn’t replant trees, and some pretty severe soil erosion set in which rendered the area rather useless for decades. Was it done for short term (whatever that means) monetary gain? Fucking A Tweety it was.

    Now we know better and do things smarter to the point that there is more forested area in the U.S. today than there was 200 years ago. Maybe the fracking process could be done more safely. I don’t know. But I do know that our increasing demand for natural gas, particularly in the exploding number of natural gas power plants being built, needs to be met. What better way to do it than right here in this country, where the jobs created stay right here. And it’s being done by the private sector, not some phony government bureaucracy in Harrisburg or DC.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 5

    24th June 2012 at 6:11 pm

  40. Colma Rising says:

    Very well. I shall take a nap of my own in hopes that I can move at work tomorrow…

    A summertime bug hit me like a Brinks truck Friday night….

    Perhaps the fever will produce dreams of a government of realistic and a Scientific Theory of Morals, franchise to any and all who dare put themselves in harms way first, where business and life are left alone so much as it does not interfere with society’s survival, and criminals like sandusky, corrupt officials and unruly miscreants are given proper corporal punishment…. All following the collapse of a well-meaning but foolhardy freebee society demolished by war with the Chinese Hegemony.

    Or it’s just bug planets.

    I expect to return to a classic TBP brawl wherein TPC survives a tangle with a Big Dog, his senses honed and his argument sharpened.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 6:13 pm

  41. AWD says:

    Colmes:

    I’ll send you some medicine through the server. Don’t cost much.

    Watching this argument is like watching two 85 y.o. men trying to piss through prostates the size of a grapefruit. Takes forever, and not much comes out. Entertaining all the same.

    Needs more insults

    3095419c-4b9b-4a30-a5c9-2332c38a7ac3.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 6:23 pm

  42. Administrator says:

    SSS waiting for the next assault by Admin.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 6:29 pm

  43. ThePessimisticChemist says:

    What a crock of shit. Let’s turn to another valuable product from the Earth: timber. Did the companies which clear-cut old growth forests to build everything from houses to ships do any damage to the environment? You bet they did. They didn’t replant trees, and some pretty severe soil erosion set in which rendered the area rather useless for decades. Was it done for short term (whatever that means) monetary gain? Fucking A Tweety it was.
    ===================================

    Timber grows back. Soil piles up in other areas. Coal dumps lots of toxic compounds into the ecosystem that were previously sequestered in borderline harmless black rocks under ground.

    Different levels of harm to the environment. The fact that you lump things together like this means we can’t really discuss one at length. I discuss gas, you bring up coal. I (briefly) address coal, and you switch to timber. You don’t seem to have a lot of confidence in your position.

    Each industry is very, very different. I’m sorry you can’t distinguish between them all. Here, I’ll help:

    Here is a piece of coal!
    220px-Coal_anthracite.jpg

    Here is a tree!

    Bright_green_tree_-_Waikato.jpg

    And, some natural gas!
    flaming-fart.jpg?w=300

    Colma – I expect to return to a classic TBP brawl wherein TPC survives a tangle with a Big Dog, his senses honed and his argument sharpened.

    A big dog? His bark is loud, but his bite is missing teeth.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 6:33 pm

  44. Administrator says:

    SSS actually believes the fracking industry is just public companies doing their part in capitalism. No government involvement in this boom. How touching to see the brilliance of an SSS analysis in all its glory:

    Fracking: Corruption a Part of Pennsylvania’s Heritage

    A study by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), published in 2004 concluded that fracking was of little or no risk to human health. However, Wes Wilson, a 30-year EPA environmental engineer, in a letter to members of Congress and the EPA inspector general, called that study “scientifically unsound,” and questioned the bias of the panel, noting that five of the seven members had significant ties to the industry. “EPA’s failure to regulate [fracking] appears to be improper under the Safe Water Drinking Act and may result in danger to public health and safety.”

    The following year, the Energy Policy Act of 2005—on a 249–183 vote in the House and an 85–12 vote in the Senate—exempted the oil and natural gas industry from the Safe Water Drinking Act. That exemption applied to the “construction of new well pads and the accompanying new roads and pipelines.” The National Defense Resource Council noted that the EPA interpreted the exemption “as allowing unlimited discharges of sediment into the nation’s streams, even where those discharges contribute to a violation of state water quality standards.” The exemption became known derisively as the Halliburton Loophole, named for one of the nation’s major energy companies, of which Cheney, whose promotion of Big Business and opposition to environmental policies is well-documented, had once been the CEO.

    Bills introduced in the U.S. House (H.R. 2766) and U.S. Senate (S. 1215) in June 2009 to give federal regulatory oversight under the Safe Water Drinking Act to hydraulic fracturing languished. New bills (H.R. 1084 and S. 587), introduced in March 2011 in the 112th Congress, are also expected to die without a vote.

    The natural gas industry has a long history of effective lobbying at the state and national level. America’s Natural Gas Alliance has four former Congressmen as lobbyists, according to research by the Center for Responsive Politics (CRP). Through various political action committees (PACs), the industry has contributedabout $238.7 million in campaign contributions, about three-fourths of it to Republican candidates, since 1990, according to the CRP. For the 2008 election, the gas and oil industry contributed $27.4 million, including contributions from individuals, PACs, and soft money, according to CRP data. Total contributions for the current election cycle, as of mid-March, are $20.6 million, with almost 90 percent of it going to Republicans.

    At the federal level, the top recipients of oil and gas contributions during the current election cycle, according to the CRP, are former presidential hopeful Gov. Rick Perry of Texas ($833,674), Lt. Gov. David Dewhurst of Texas ($650,850), presidential hopeful Mitt Romney ($597,950), Senate Majority LeaderMitch McConnell ($264,700), and Sen. John Barasso of Wyoming ($225,400), a member of the Energy and Natural Resources Committee. Every one of the top 20 recipients is a Republican.

    Mixed into Pennsylvania’s energy production is not only a symbiotic relationship of business and government, but a history of corruption and influence-peddling. Between 1859, when an economical method to drill for oil was developed near Titusville, Pa., and 1933, the beginning of Franklin D. Roosevelt’s “New Deal,” Pennsylvania, under almost continual Republican administration, was among the nation’s most corrupt states. The robber barons of the timber, oil, coal, steel, and transportation industries essentially bought their right to be unregulated. In addition to widespread bribery, the energy industries, especially coal, assured the election of preferred candidates by giving pre-marked ballots to workers, many of whom didn’t read English.

    In a letter to the editor of The New York Times in March 2011, John Wilmer, a former attorney for the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection (DEP), explained that “Pennsylvania’s shameful legacy of corruption and mismanagement caused 2,500 miles of streams to be totally dead from acid mine drainage; left many miles of scarred landscape; enriched the coal barons; and impoverished the local citizens.” His words serve as a warning about what is happening in the natural gas fields.

    Pennsylvania’s new law that regulates and gives favorable treatment to the natural gas industry was initiated and passed by the Republican-controlled General Assembly and signed by Republican Gov. Tom Corbett. The House voted 101–90 for passage; the Senate voted, 31–19. Both votes were mostly along party lines.

    In addition to forbidding physicians and health care professionals from disclosing what the industry believes are “trade secrets” in what it uses in fracking that may cause air and water pollution, there are other industry-favorable provisions. The new law guts local governments’ rights of zoning and long-term planning, doesn’t allow for local health and environmental regulation, forbids municipalities to appeal state decisions about well permits, and provides subsidies to the natural gas industry and payments for out-of-state workers to get housing but provides for no incentives or tax credits to companies to hire Pennsylvania workers. It also requires companies to provide fresh water, which can be bottled water, to areas in which they contaminate the water supply, but doesn’t require the companies to clean up the pollution or even to track transportation and deposit of contaminated wastewater. The law allows companies to place wells 300 feet from houses, streams and wetlands. The law also allows compressor stations to be placed 750 feet from houses, and gives natural gas companies authority to operate these stations continuously at up to 60 decibels, the equivalent of continuous conversation in restaurants. The noise level and constant artificial lighting has adverse effects upon wildlife. As a result of all the concessions, the natural gas industry is given special considerations not given any other business or industry in Pennsylvania.

    Each well is expected to generate about $16 million during its lifetime, which can be as few as ten years, according to the Pennsylvania Budget and Policy Center (PBPC). The effective tax and impact fee is about 2 percent. Corbett had originally wanted no tax or impact fees placed upon natural gas drilling; as public discontent increased, he suggested a 1 percent tax, which was in the original House bill. In contrast, other states that allow natural gas fracking have tax rates as high as 7.5 percent of market value (Texas) and 25–50 percent of net income (Alaska). The Pennsylvania rate can vary, based upon the price of natural gas and inflation, but will still be among the five lowest of the 32 states that allow natural gas drilling. Over the lifetime of a well, Pennsylvania will collect about $190,000–$350,000, while West Virginia will collect about $993,700, Texas will collect about $878,500, and Arkansas will collect about $555,700, according to PBPC data and analyses.

    State Sen. Daylin Leach, a Democrat from suburban Philadelphia, says he opposed the bill because, “At a time when we are closing our schools and eliminating vital human services, to leave billions on the table as a gift to industry that is already going to be making billions is obscene.” State Rep. Mark Cohen, a Democrat from Philadelphia, like most of the Democrats in the General Assembly, agrees. The legislation, he says, “produces far too little revenue for local communities, gives the local communities local taxing power which most of them do not want, because it pits one community against the other, and gives no revenue at all to other areas of the state.”
    The new law is generally believed to be “payback” by Corbett and the Republican legislators for campaign contributions. The industry contributed about $7.2 million to Pennsylvania candidates and their PACs between 2000 and the end of 2010, including $860,825 to the Republican party and $129,100 to the Democratic party, according to data compiled by Common Cause. In addition, the natural gas industry contributed about $1.6 million to Corbett’s political campaigns during the past 10 years, about $1.1 million of that for his campaign for governor, according to Common Cause. Rep. Brian L. Ellis (R-Butler County), sponsor of the House bill, received $23,300. Sen. Joseph B. Scarnati (R- Warren, Pa.), the senate president pro-tempore who sponsored the companion Senate bill (SB 1100), received $293,334. Of the 20 Pennsylvania legislators who received the most money from the industry since 2001, 16 are Republicans, according to Common Cause.

    Rep. H. William DeWeese (D-Waynesburg, Pa.), received $58,750, the most of the four Democrats. DeWeese, first elected in 1976, had been Speaker of the House and Democratic leader.

    It’s possible that the significant campaign contributions didn’t influence Pennsylvania’s politicians to rush to embrace the natural gas industry and its controversial use of hydraulic fracking. It’s possible that these politicians had always believed in fracking, and the natural gas industry was merely contributing to the campaigns of those who believed as they do. However, with the heavy amount of money spent by the natural gas lobby and, apparently, willingly accepted by certain politicians, there is no way to know how they might have voted had no money or lobbying occurred.

    Tom Corbett’s first major political appointment after his election in November 2010 was to name C. Alan Walker, an energy company executive, to head the Department of Community and Economic Development. ThePennsylvania Progressive identified Walker as “an ardent anti-environmentalist and someone who hates regulation of his industry.” A ProPublica investigationrevealed that Walker had given $184,000 to Corbett’s political campaign.

    Shortly after taking office, Corbett repealed environmental assessments of gas wells in state parks. The result could be as many as 2,200 well pads on almost 90 percent of all public lands, according to Nature Conservancy of Pennsylvania.

    Corbett’s public announcements in March 2011, two months after his inauguration, established the direction for gas drilling in Pennsylvania.

    In his first budget address, Corbett boldly declared he wanted to “make Penn­syl­va­nia the hub of this [drilling] boom. Just as the oil com­pa­nies decided to head­quar­ter in one of a dozen states with oil, let’s make Penn­syl­va­nia the Texas of the nat­ural gas boom. I’m deter­mined that Penn­syl­va­nia not lose this moment.” Lt. Gov. Jim Cawley would later boast, “The Marcellus [Shale] is revitalizing our main streets in downtowns.”

    Within the budget bill, Corbett authorized Walker to “expedite any permit or action pending in any agency where the creation of jobs may be impacted.” This unprecedented reach apparently applied to all energy industries. That same month, Corbett created an Advisory Commission, loaded with persons from business and industry. Not one member was from the health professions; of the seven state agencies represented, not one member was from the Department of Health.

    Between 2007 and the end of 2010, the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection (DEP) issued 1,435 violations to natural gas companies; 952 of those violations related to potential harm to the environment. In March,Michael Krancer, the new DEP secretary, also a political appointee, took personal control over his department’s issuance of any violations. By Krancer’s decree, every inspector could no longer cite any well owner in the Marcellus Shale development without first getting the approval of Krancer and his executive deputy secretary.

    “It’s an extraordinary directive [that] represents a break from how business has been done” and politicizes the process, John Hanger told ProPublica. Hanger, DEP secretary under the Ed Rendell administration, said the new rules “will cause the public to lose confidence entirely in the inspection process.” He told theScranton Times-Tribune the new policy was the equivalent of every trooper having to get permission from the state police commissioner before issuing a traffic citation. Because the new policy is so unusual and broad “it’s impossible for something like this to be issued without the direction and knowledge of the governor’s office,” said Hanger. Corbett denied he was responsible for the decision. Five weeks after the Krancer decision was leaked to the media, and following a strong negative response from the public, environmental groups, and the state’s media, the DEP rescinded the policy—which Krancer claimed was only a three-month “pilot program.”

    “When state agencies say they will ‘regulate’ or ‘monitor’ hydraulic fracturing to reduce known threats, we should not accept this as a guarantee of any kind,” says Eileen Fay, an animal rights/environmental writer. Fay argues that because of legislative corruption, it is a responsibility of citizens to protect their own health and environment by “putting pressure on our legislators.”

    In February 2012, Corbett proudly signed Act 13, a merger of the House and Senate bills.

    HB 1950 had initially included a provision to provide up to $2 million a year in funding to the Department of Health for “collecting and disseminatinginformation, preparing and conducting health care provider outreach and education and investigating health related complaints and other uses associated with unconventional natural gas production activity.” That provision, strongly supported by numerous public health and environmental groups, was deleted in the final bill.

    The Pennsylvania Constitution (Article I, section 27) declares: “The people have a right to clean air, pure water, and to the preservation of the natural, scenic, historic and esthetic values of the environment. Pennsylvania’s public natural resources are the common property of all the people, including generations yet to come. As trustee of these resources, the Commonwealth shall conserve and maintain them for the benefit of all the people.”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 6:40 pm

  45. Administrator says:

    TPC

    Watchout for the TBP big dogs. They are really dangerous. They might gum you to death.

    Gus_ugliest_dog_1111576c.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 6:45 pm

  46. Anonymous says:

    Unfortunately I cant stay to play, real life calls.

    Have fun all!

    -TPC

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 6:50 pm

  47. SSS says:

    “Mines are located in the middle of nowhere far away from people’s homes.”
    —-Admin

    Just when I thought Admin couldn’t say anything more stupid, he proves me wrong. For over a century, when a valuable deposit of a mineral is found, regardless of where it is, people MOVE to where that mineral is and build a town. Ever heard of Bisbee, Arizona, Admin? San Manuel? Ajo? Just three of many towns that sit right next to a copper mine (open pit, by the way) in this state. How about Wallace, Idaho or Leadville, Colorado. Right next to silver, lead, and molybdenum mines. None of these towns were there BEFORE those minerals were found.

    As to your comment about the mining companies buying the land, why should they? Much cheaper to buy the mineral rights from the landowner and pay a royalty, isn’t it? You do know something about keeping costs down, don’t you, Mr. Ikea?

    Just to infuriate you even more about costs, read the federal government’s Mining Act of 1872, which is still in force. It gives mining companies the right to extract minerals from “The People’s” property, ie. federally owned lands. Nowadays, mining companies have to jump through a myriad of hoops created by the EPA, but once they get the green light, those minerals belong to the evil mining companies. Billions and billions have gone into private, evil coffers that way. I bet you are just tickled pink, aren’t you?

    This is not going well for you, Admin. In one sense, it’s downright sad. Yet in another, I’m flush with the feeling of overwhelming victory.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 6:56 pm

  48. Llpoh says:

    Damn – the Admin has morphed into Flash. A cut-and-paste addiction is a terrible thing to watch develop. Admin, we will arrange an intervention. I only hope it isn’t too late.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 6:57 pm

  49. Administrator says:

    Senile old CIA agent still babbling on about copper mines when we are talking about fracking. Focus old man. Are you having flashbacks to the good old days when you were winning the War of Drugs? Bwaaaahhhhaaaa!!!!

    You respond to my comment about fracking occurring in the back yards of people with idiocy about towns near copper mines. What a pitiful display of debating skills. Are you sure you weren’t a KGB agent? You certainly aren’t reflecting proudly on the CIA with this display of dimwittedness.

    Let me focus your mind. We are discussing fracking, not mining. It’s good to see you are so cost conscious. I presume you thought Ford’s cost benefit analysis on Pinto deaths was brilliant corporate management. Great cost containment.

    Jessuz – this is like kicking a retarded shit eating monkey.

    It’s so sad to see someone’s mind deteriorate before my very eyes.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 5

    24th June 2012 at 7:07 pm

  50. SSS says:

    TPC posts a picture the size of a highway billboard and then exits stage left. Good riddance.

    Admin posts an article the length of which would give flash an orgasm. Sheesh. No wonder you try to stick to what someone else has written. Everything that reflects your personal knowledge and opinions on the subject of mining comes across as silly, just plain silly. But I’ll read the fucking “War and Peace” treatise anyway.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 7:09 pm

  51. Administrator says:

    SSS

    Based on your comprehension skills, you should have a 3rd grader read the article to you and explain it with crayons.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 7 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 7:11 pm

  52. Administrator says:

    SSS & LLPOH – Big Dogs of TBP

    dog_barking.gif

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 7:13 pm

  53. llpoh says:

    Admin – don’t make me get involved. You wouldn’t like it. It is already an uneven fight what with SSS spanking you like a poor step-child. And here I was voicing concern about your recently acquired cut-and-past addiction, and you gotta start posting cartoons. I may have to revise my diagnosis from cut-and-paste addiction to early onset dementia.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 7:24 pm

  54. dilligaf says:

    no, this bust should be a doozy…

    5665858.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 7:31 pm

  55. sensetti says:

    TPC
    It’s my understanding the fracking fluids are proprietary information. What chemicals do they use in this process
    Fracking Fluid – A mixture of water, sand and proprietary chemicals are injected into the ground during oil and gas drilling operations. The exact ingredients that are employed by companies involved have not been officially disclosed and due to exemptions enjoyed by drilling companies (e.g. the “Halliburton Loophole”), the ingredients remain proprietary and are not subject to regulation by agencies such as the EPA. Independent testing has been done on fracking fluids, however. The Endocrine Disruption Exchange, a non-profit organization headed by Dr. Theo Colborne, has identified 649 chemicals recovered from drilling operations, including Volatile Organic Compounds (VOCs), Neurotoxicants, and other dangerous chemicals which are heavily regulated when used in most other capacities.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 7:47 pm

  56. Administrator says:

    Admin quivering with fear with the possibility of llpoh entering the fray.

    SSS after giving the Admin a spanking.

    Next TBP big dog.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 7:51 pm

  57. llpoh says:

    Admin considering his options:

    fear.gif

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 7:56 pm

  58. Admin says:

    Oh no -SSS AND LLPOH!

    i_wet_myself_tshirt-p235465685039413074b7jvr_400.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 7:59 pm

  59. Administrator says:

    Actual picture of LLPOH’s hand. Now you know why he is so sensitive about thumb rings.

    thumb-ring-03.BMP

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 8:04 pm

  60. SSS says:

    BTW, Admin, I am giving you a thumbs up on some of your insults, based on degree of creativity. For example, “Based on your comprehension skills, you should have a 3rd grader read the article to you and explain it with crayons.”

    Back to our regularly scheduled firefight. That long article you posted was a waste of time. It cites one, just one, EPA environmental engineer (what the fuck is an environmental engineer, anyway) who dissented on a 2004 EPA scientific study that found fracking of little to no risk to human health. Needless to say, I’m not impressed with this tidal wave of dissent.

    Here’s another gem from the article. “Over the lifetime of a well, Pennsylvania will collect about $190,000–$350,000, while West Virginia will collect about $993,700, Texas will collect about $878,500, and Arkansas will collect about $555,700.” This quote is not taken out of context and meant to imply that Pennsylvania should impose higher taxes per well just because other states have higher tax rates.

    Well, damn, Sam. Aren’t Pennsylvanians just about the dumbest collection of Neanderthals you’ve ever seen? Lower taxes per well in Pennsylvania means gas companies will just STAMPEDE TO WEST VIRGINIA where they will pay up 5 TIMES THE TAXES PER WELL. Isn’t that how capitalism is supposed to work, Admin? Companies looking for the most expensive place to do business? Why dig a gas well in Pennsylvania when I can dig one in West Virginia and pay another $800,000 in taxes to do so. Is that what Wharton teaches its students? I’m sure it does.

    I need to go get a shower. I’ve worked up quite a sweat pummeling Admin into a fine talcum powder. Add a little scent, and you could dust a baby’s butt with him.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 8:07 pm

  61. Administrator says:

    The last time llpoh dared to confront Admin. It wasn’t pretty.

    20120305-Punch-in-the-Face1.jpg

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 7 Thumb down 6

    24th June 2012 at 8:08 pm

  62. llpoh says:

    Admin now able to cure diaper rash and prevent jock itch:

    henry-bum.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 8:09 pm

  63. llpoh says:

    Admin after our last encounter:

    ?type=display

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 8:11 pm

  64. Administrator says:

    SSS really losing it now. He previously scorned the EPA as a worthless organization and now denigrates the article because the EPA did not concur.

    Do you even know what you believe?

    The article is a balanced assessment of the situation in Washington DC and PA. Money talks big guy. Corporations buy off politicians and get what they want. In this case, they get sweet tax deals and loose or no safety requirements.

    It’s good to know who the supporters of corporate fascism are on this site. I guess I should have known. You can take the drone out of the government but you can’t take the government mindset out of the drone.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 8:15 pm

  65. llpoh says:

    Admin preparing for his next fight:

    b1c68574245d26cc678f8ef643ebc6ad.jpg

    LLPOH preparing:

    body-builder.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 8:15 pm

  66. Administrator says:

    llpoh

    Come up with something original. I already thrashed you and SSS with face battered pictures.

    Yawn

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 7 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 8:17 pm

  67. Administrator says:

    llpoh looking in the mirror

    5875214_f260.jpg

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 10 Thumb down 7

    24th June 2012 at 8:20 pm

  68. llpoh says:

    Hey – the scared turtle and the wet-your-pants stuff were good. And of course, this is your reaction upon my arrival:

    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ7DLKI-CBED_j9khz78EkfwsLsDYLZh4StK5zHVeaV2f8Bg4Wo4SNvi35Q

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 8:21 pm

  69. Administrator says:

    The delusion of pussies.

    30788_404056756921_691641921_4962833_3200489_n.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 8:22 pm

  70. Administrator says:

    llpoh

    I notice you have tattooes and an earing. Which ear makes you gay?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 8:24 pm

  71. llpoh says:

    What are you thaying, Admin? You got thomething againth gayth?

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 8:31 pm

  72. AWD says:

    This thread is like a hot chick farting in the pool

    fart1.jpg

    Alluring but disgusting

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 9:15 pm

  73. Colma Rising says:

    Classic.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 9:21 pm

  74. SSS says:

    Admin decends to a blizzard of funny pictures. Pathetic. Never once has he addressed the specifics of any of my cogent, thoughful, fact-filled remarks. Not once.

    The latest Admin detour. “Corporations buy off politicians and get what they want. In this case, they get sweet tax deals and loose or no safety requirements.” Define the term buy off. Do you mean bribery? If so, cite any proof that that is the case in this instance. If you mean corporations contribute to elected officials who support their best interests, well, name a time and place when any corporation has NOT done exactly that. Just one example. We’re waiting for your wisdom.

    From a proud supporter of corporate fascism to a proud supporter of environmental extremism,
    SSS

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 9:25 pm

  75. Zarathustra says:

    AWD, an obvious photoshop. Hot chicks don’t fart.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 9:28 pm

  76. AWD says:

    We all love a good big dog fight,

    afgan-dog-fights5-1297764594.png

    Too bad we can’t place any bets

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 9:31 pm

  77. Administrator says:

    SSS

    I’m not used to debating dullards. It’s good to see you are in complete agreement with Mitt Romney – “Corporations are people”.

    Are you really so naive that you believe the hundreds of thousands in political contributions to key politicians by corporations and their PACs and lobbyists do not have an impact on legislation? Really? Are you just acting dumb? Or are you really that dumb?

    There happen to be hundreds of thousands of corporations in this country. Most of them are small businesses and have never and are incapable of influencing politicians with contributions. Only mega-corporations can do so. Sounds like a great capitalist fair level playing field. Right old man?

    You want an example of a corporation who has not made contribution to an elected official to influence them?

    You might know him as LLPOH.

    BOOOOYAAAA

    SSS flubs another 3 foot putt and breaks his putter over his knee.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 9:46 pm

  78. Administrator says:

    AWD

    If this was a horse race, they would have already put SSS out of his misery with a bullet to the head as he has three broken legs.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 3

    24th June 2012 at 9:48 pm

  79. Colma Rising says:

    SSS said:

    Dr.Evil_.jpg

    “From a proud supporter of corporate fascism to a proud supporter of environmental extremism…”

    Aye yie yie….

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 10:04 pm

  80. Colma Rising says:

    I guess that’s enough shit-stirring for a night?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 10:22 pm

  81. Novista says:

    Enough?

    despair-consultant.png

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 12:05 am

  82. Ron says:

    So the problem is the frickin fluid,so change it.Im really not counting on anything.Were sliding down a big hill.Pickup trucks running in NG sounds good.Some fake jobs for awhile.
    I saw Pickens on tv pushing NG,at least someone is trying to push some kind of job creation.
    Yes,oil and coal and NG.Bring it on baby!
    Im glad me n the wife dont argue like you old married couples.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 12:30 am

  83. Maddie's Mom says:

    Fun times!!!

    See??? Who needs teevee?

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 10:33 am

  84. SSS says:

    Maddie’s Mom

    You have been privy to the second time this year when I’ve mopped the floor with Admin’s hairy hide.

    The first occurred in the Edward Bernays-Guatemala Coup discussion, which reflected Admin’s inability to put a historical event in proper context. Admin is one of those people who think James Buchanan was largely to blame for the Civil War, when it fact the seeds for that conflict were planted before the ink was even dry on the Constitution.

    The second is this thread. The poor guy gets wrapped around the environmental axle about fracking for natural gas and has nightmares about fracking fluid getting into his drinking water, even though he lives 300 miles to the east of where most of the wells are being drilled. Next we’ll hear his version of how fracking in the Bakken shale oil deposits in North Dakota are threatening wildlife in Yellowstone National Park, some 500 miles to the west. Never mind that North Dakota’s state treasury turned a $1 billion dollar profit last year and unemployment in the state is less than 3%.

    I love the smell of singed eyebrows in the morning.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 11:01 am

  85. SSS says:

    Maddie’s Mom

    And Admin’s taste in music sucks.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 4

    24th June 2012 at 11:04 am

  86. Administrator says:

    Billy Joe’s pants fell down after witnessing the devastating beatdown Admin applied to the doddering old man of TBP.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 11:45 am

  87. AWD says:

    Reminds me of the classic SouthWest airline thread. That was some fun.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 12:10 pm

  88. Maddie's Mom says:

    New day, new focus.

    I don’t know what to believe. Data is manipulated and lying is what everyone does now.

    My hubby and daughter both work in the industry. I have concern for DD’s job and have had long before I read this piece. She works with a group directly involved in the North Dakota “boom”.

    As for DH, I shared a few snippets with him and he argued with them. All he knows is that his customers are going all out for the nat gas.

    Further discussion is pointless, so I have bookmarked this article and we’ll see how things go.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 1:23 pm

  89. llpoh says:

    SSS – you beat the Admin down with words. I humiliated him with a series of well-selected pics. If we do not see him for weeks I will not be surprised.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 6:56 pm

  90. Administrator says:

    LLPOH & SSS high fiving their victory

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 7:04 pm

  91. llpoh says:

    Admin – pan back up through the posts. Notice how the fans have voted – my pics have administered an epic beat-down of your lowly selections. SSS has delivered ANOTHER record-breaking ass-kicking – especially since you had to resort to cut-and-paste, which we all know is the last salvo of the vanquished.

    Admit it, you are a:

    loser.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    24th June 2012 at 7:13 pm

  92. KaD says:

    Considering 28% of Americans have no savings at all; up from 24% last year..http://www.upi.com/Business_News/2012/06/25/Poll-28-percent-have-no-savings-at-all/UPI-63961340643474/.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 9:08 pm

  93. Muck About says:

    MA does not waste time on such drivel as this thread has devolved into..Zzzzzzzzzzz.

    MA

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 9:17 pm

  94. llpoh says:

    Muck fell asleep in the middle of a post. Again.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 9:24 pm

  95. ThePessimisticChemist says:

    “TPC posts a picture the size of a highway billboard and then exits stage left. Good riddance.” – SSS

    Translation: This kid is kicking my ass, thank god he’s gone. Better make a quick insult now!

    ===========

    Dear sweet, gentle triple S. The picture was an acknowledgement to your advanced age. I’m sorry the others were probably too small for your aged eyes to perceive, but I didn’t think that TBP was worth me manually blowing up images for the forum’s more geriatric members.

    I see the argument made great headway while I was gone.

    “SSS has delivered ANOTHER record-breaking ass-kicking” – llpoh

    I’m confused, at what point did this transpire? All he did was prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he had no idea what he was talking about when it comes to gas production.

    Then (not to be outdid) he went on to prove his ignorance in other areas as well.

    Usually I enjoy SSS’s posts, and 9 times out of 10 I agree with him, but this thread has just been a giant clusterfuck on his part. Here’s hoping he rebounds safely.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 11:28 pm

  96. SSS says:

    Murky said, “MA does not waste time on such drivel as this thread has devolved into..Zzzzzzzzzzz.”

    How do you know it devolved into drivel unless you wasted time reading it, dumbass?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 11:38 pm

  97. SSS says:

    TPC

    Just exactly how did this thread turn out to be a giant clusterfuck on my part? Despite the interludes of insults and funny picture avalanches, a TBP specialty, take a look at my replies to Admin’s comments. I repeatedly and directly addressed points that he posted, whether they were his personal comments (rare and stupid) or someone else’s. Repeatedly.

    Did he respond in kind, save for calling me a demented old man (let me be clear here, Admin and I are good friends on this site and occasionally descend into vitriolic name calling)? You appear to have picked up well on his attacks on me by using such terms as ……. advanced age …… aged eyes ……. geriatric members (of TBP). Be forwarned, my friend, Admin will turn on you just as quickly as I will.

    You seem to be miffed that I didn’t stick precisely to the script of fracking for natural gas. That was quite intentional. Mining in general in this country is under severe, and I mean severe, attack by government bureaucrats and environmental extremists. And they’re winning. So if I ventured off into general discussions about mining, past and present. I think my points are relevant and important AND CORRECT.

    Now, if you want me to get back on script about fracking, I will be more than happy to do so. Lay it on me. This old dog CAN learn new tricks. Your move.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 12:26 am

  98. Zarathustra says:

    I enjoy the flamewars around here, for the most part but sometimes there’s a bit too much testosterone on this thread. My personal rule: When simply tossing shit for tossing shit’s sake, make it clear that’s what I’m doing. Otherwise I make my case as clearly as I can, refute the opposition as simply as I can, then walk away without giving a shit whether anyone agrees with me or not. Having said that, carry on.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 12:52 am

  99. Zarathustra says:

    PS, I wish there were an edit function on this blog.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 12:53 am

  100. crazyivan says:

    ” I presume you thought Ford’s cost benefit analysis on Pinto deaths was brilliant corporate management.” -Admin

    You sir are a fool. More babies were concieved in the back of hatchback Pintos than were people consumed in fireballs of exploding Pintos.

    Your data is flawed.

    And you are a BIG FUCKING PUSSY!

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 12:58 am

  101. Zarathustra says:

    crazyivan, I call bullshit. More kids were conceived in the back seat of a ’38 buick than in all the pintos of the world, except for midgets and asians.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 1:11 am

  102. crazyivan says:

    Zara

    Point taken.

    But like the rest here, you change the subject.

    The fact here is that normal sized teenagers can comfortably fuck in the back of a Pinto.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 1:23 am

  103. Colma Rising says:

    Alas! YOU are the fool, Crazy Ivan….

    Everyone knows that the Pinto hatchback produced a fraction of those consumed in fireballs…

    It was the station wagon that provided soaring fertility rates.

    You confuse orange Pintos with Green.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 1:51 am

  104. Zarathustra says:

    Funny thing about the Pinto (which was a piece of shit). The famous Mustang had exactly the same design. The frame of the Mustang ended at the rear suspension. Aft of that, everything was just sheet metal. Having said that, I loved my 64.5 mustang, which at least looked good and handled good, if you learned how to treat it. The Pinto was just a piece of shit.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 2:13 am

  105. Zarathustra says:

    PS, Did I say that the Pinto was a piece of shit? I think it was competing for that honor with the Chevy Vega and lost.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 2:17 am

  106. Llpoh says:

    What about the AMC Gremlin. Now THERE was a piece of shit.

    Z

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 2:25 am

  107. Zarathustra says:

    Llpoh, The main issue with the Gremlin is that it was fucking ugly. AMC had a special talent for producing ugly cars. I don’t think they inherited that from absorbing Studebaker or Nash. I blame Mitt Romney’s dad.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 2:42 am

  108. Zarathustra says:

    Regarding the Ford Pinto (lol) and the Chevy Vega (moar lolz), and without even mentioning the crap AMC vehicles from that era, I would just like to point out that teh boomers had nothing to do with any of them. Fuck you in advance.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 6:29 am

  109. Zarathustra says:

    PS, we drove volkswagens

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1

    24th June 2012 at 6:56 am

  110. SSS says:

    Normal TBP comment thread. Fracking for natural gas turns into the merits and demerits of fucking in the back seat of a 1938 Buick. It’s a wonder we’re not all be locked up as a “grave and present danger” to national security.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    24th June 2012 at 8:06 pm

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