Here is what I don’t get Admin. Star keeps going on about 3 billion dollars in this quarter like it is supposed to mean something. I am first to admit to not being a money guy and bean counter. Not sure if I am able to parse the charts, graphs and spreadsheet that all the pundits are mucking about with. Still I do know this from balancing a budget every month. It doesn’t matter how much a household takes in. It matters moar how much goes out. Maybe though I am old school when it comes money.Maybe I should just embrace the voodoo economics and sky high valuations being pimped by Elon…
[img[/img]
I can’t see how this company can continue as a going concern when they are burning thru over a billion every quarter. I have a question. Maybe star can answer this seeing as he is so quick to dismiss me by offering a calculator.
How much profit is there in making a Model 3..
Just wondering.
Seeing as you are much better than I maybe you can help a fella out..
Star – this is all speculative. Tesla is bleeding money. Last quarter they lost $4.20 a share. Sales increases do not mean profitability. If they keep bleeding money, they are doomed. And so far, they seem to keep bleeding money. Analysts expected $3 billion in sales and a loss of only $2 a share. Oops on that part.
This is a risk game – there is so much money floating around folks are making bets on the future, rather than on fundamentals. I would not touch Tesla with a barge pole.
The entry of the big boys is imminent. They have the ability to undercut Tesla, they have the overall volume, the supply chains, the economy of scale, the dealer networks, and they actually know how to build cars. Electric cars are orders of magnitude easier to build than combustion engine ones, save maybe for battery tech.
Tesla is screwed. Sales mean little. Gotta turn a profit, and Tesla is far from doing that.
That’s not quite accurate. Tesla has almost 1.2 billion more cash in the bank at the end of this quarter than it did last quarter. The big boys aren’t as formidable as you seem to think they are, in this case. Where they going to get the batteries? Musk was smart. He built the world’s largest battery factory in partnership with Panasonic. That’s where everybody’s going to have to buy their batteries. The big boys have been at this game for a while and have been striking out. BMW has had two electrics out for years, the I4, and the i8. They both suck, and they both don’t sell in the states. Neither one is a pure electric, either. Tesla is doing a number on BMW anyway, the Model S outsells BMW’s big cars, and the model 3 is already putting a hurting on BMW’s bread and butter, the 3 Series. See the chart above. Porsche looked like it had a contender in the Mission E. https://youtu.be/euB34FJ15f8. The concept was beautiful. The production car, now called the Taycan, is bland at best.
They just threw in the towel and bought 10% of Mate Rimac’s company, hoping to harvest some of his technology.
Rimac produced a car a few years ago called the Concept one. They made 7 of them. That’s how desperate Porsche is to figure this out. And in general, their engineers are second to none. I’ve had 3 Porsches. They’re probably the most bulletproof car on the road. Those guys have their act together. Their stated goal is to produce only 20,000 electric cars a year by 2022. That’s not going to touch Tesla. Tesla will make more electric cars then Porsche will make cars in 2019. Tesla will probably never have a losing quarter again. Watch this play out. It cost them less than 30 grand to manufacture a model 3. I think the breakdown is in one of the links I have above. They’re miles ahead of the competition in battery technology. Light years ahead of the competition in software technology. And they have 10,000 charging stations around the United States already built. I don’t think anybody else has any. Musk has build a monster. There’s a Tesla place around the corner from me, I see them unloading trucks full of cars every day. All those cars are already sold. Doesn’t matter how many hundreds of thousands of orders they have. No other company has any orders. There’s a lot of bad information going around.
They build their fucking cars in a tent. The QC issues with those cars will be epic. I think he should come out with a new model – Tesla Flamethrower. Oh yeah, their standard car is a flame thrower.
Jim, join me in praying for the souls of those short sellers. They had families who once loved them. And now their wives are going to leave them, and shack up with black guys. And their kids are going to drop out of school with their pants hanging off their ass. All because they made one mistake. It weighs heavily on me. I could have saved them.
Why do you feel the need to outright lie and make up your numbers when defending this piece of shit. Your declaration they have $1.2 billion more cash than last quarter is entirely FALSE? Here is their cash balance for the last 4 quarters:
I think it was one of the articles you posted said they ended the first quarter with 1 billion in the bank. Don’t lose sight of what’s really important here. The children.
Gotta say much respect for you. Luv ya Man! In the face of everything you have decided to die on this hill. To be honest I kinda want Musk to be on right track. And by extension you.
I can’t read financial reports in same way as lloph and Admin. So I tend to defer to them. But still I am rooting for ya bud. Not many will stand up to their continued barrage and then come back for moar. But I can’t drink the Kool-aid. Sorry…
This amateur see many parallels in this thread to BlackBerry some years back. They spent years trying to recover from the debacle of underestimating Steve Jobs and his cult. Were eventually forced to hire a cult figure of their own in John Chen to turn the company around. Quarter after quarter it was promised the light would shine just around the bend.
It never did.
Eventually they had to throw in the towel and sell off the phone that made them what they were. They are now a shadow whence they turned that corner.
I am not great a predictions. Still from where I sit what I see happening is Tesla floundering much as BBM did. They will be dragged kicking and screaming to downsize. Forced to cling and hold onto their core asset, their QNX, the battery technology. Ten years gone they will be a supplier to the big boys who are now getting serious and coming on the scene. It all got baked into car when they started building cars in tents. Sooner or later that will impact quality and reliability. Something that is gonna bite them in the ass down the road.
Which gets me to my next point. They just don’t have the infrastructure in place to service these cars when they break down. And they are gonna break down. The biggest test in selling a car isn’t getting it off the lot. Then the salesman is selling the dream. It is some years when it turns into a nightmare. Look to future, five years later, when a Mom is broke down on the road going to soccer practice. In the car, an ungrateful Preen and a three year old who just shit in his pants. That is when the real bottom line will be found. Forget the spreadsheets.
Look at Fiat. That company wanted into the North American Market yet saw the weakness in their Product, the 500. It wasn’t in the design. Car is a solid piece of engineering. Rather it was in the lack of the Dealer Network. They went out and bought, they would say entered into a partnership, a car company just so that they could provide the support to selling their cars.
Yeah some will say the traditional business model is antiquated and outdated. With the age of Amazon and Kindle is ripe to be replaced. Maybe it has stopped making sense. It is the reason Tesla has so far worked. A cult of personality back stopped only with Elon..
He is after all the epitome of the American Dream.
A Robber Baron like times of old. He does seem to have one hand in the pocket of the Government. In a non-homo, lets just be friends, kinda way. 🙂
Sorry man I just had to throw that one in…
The latest whore on Wall Street
The latest wearing the same dress.
The latest one writing the rules
The latest Oligarch in their bed
Blackberry is not a good analogy, Rob. I understand Tesla in a different way than those guys do, no need for me to defer to them. The fat guy who wrote the other article yesterday, come on, he’s no baller. He ordered a model 3. If he had game, he would have bought a Model S – for his wife. I don’t expect people on that economic level to understand an Elon Musk. Musk made it out the other side. He’s in sheltered water now. That’s why Wall Street reacted so favorably. Tesla is a monster. The hard part’s over. All the little chickenshit complaints raining down on Musk mean nothing. Keep this in mind. As I write this, Tesla is the most valuable car company in North America by stock market valuation. So I’m not alone on some island.
Boat Guy
August 1, 2018 4:45 pm
Tesla : section 8 for millionaires and billionaires cool cars with limited practical use at a huge loss for Mr. & Mrs. Middle class taxpaying Americans with a noose around their neck thanks to their elected representitives and Team Circle Jerk Of Wall Street to K-Street to Capitol Street prepare to kick out the last leg of the stool balancing them from certain death !
Well Done America we are on the eve of destruction . Don’t worry America the Kardashian Armenian Mud Sharks will be fine but the rest of us are screwed
Anonymous
August 1, 2018 5:47 pm
Nose cone is off his little rocket thruster, if I had to guess.
Don’t really care if he’s a helmet or a tent head.
Let it go, yo. Damn.
Jack Lovett
August 1, 2018 6:01 pm
If all that $ wasted by the gov parasite musky would have been used to develope a hydrogen powered engine? Wow! But we would have a very pissed off rottinfeller. Re; VWs hi mileage engine. And rottinfeller put the big hurt on VW for that.
dawg,
i know very little about alternative energy but i’ve always heard that the problem w/hydrogen is it’s explosiveness but that it is plentiful–
by the tone of your question i take it that that is not the case,correct?
The problem is in its explosiveness. In the presence of oxygen, one spark and BAM! You remember the Hindenburg… All the gas burnt away in a wink of an eye…..To create the hydrogen one needs input energy. That fact alone makes it useful only for energy storage not as a source…
This was all tried by Ballard about 20 years ago.. it failed spectacularly… just like Tesla is gonna. It was a promise sandwich without any meat…
Tampa,
Hydrogen is abundant…sort of. It doesn’t really exist as a gas naturally here on Erf; it’s all bound up with other stuff, like hydrocarbons. And water.
So you can split water molecules to get hydrogen using heat or electricity. You can also get it by various methods from methane and coal, for example.
The problem I was alluding to is that all of the methods take energy, and lots of it. Where does that energy come from? Burning fossil fuels accounts for about 63% in the U.S.
So as of yet, the hydrogen miracle just isn’t.
Gasoline is also highly explosive, a gallon of it having the explosive potential of a case of ditching dynamite.
Hydrogen is a common industrial gas, you can buy it by the cylinder or in bulk at most welding gas supply houses.
FWIW, the best use of hydrogen is not as a combustion fuel in engines but as the fuel source for fuel cells that would drive electric vehicles instead of those silly batteries that everyone gets all giggly over for some reason.
Tesla is not a fraud but a great blues/rock band who took their name from the great inventor/man of vision!Been around now about 30 years and still rocking out crowds where ever they play,Tesla rules!
Oh,you mean the awful car that is named affter the great man that unlike the man or band will disappear in the ash heap of history.
Sigh,hard to type one handed while soaking ones eye,James is the Tesla fan!
Administrator
Author
August 1, 2018 8:43 pm
Things are looking up. No wonder the stock is soaring after hours.
[img?itok=zcu0bun7[/img]
Administrator
Author
August 1, 2018 8:45 pm
He better collect more deposits, with this free cash flow. Gotta keep the ponzi scheme going.
[img?itok=MuhQNecQ[/img]
Scott halloween
August 1, 2018 10:30 pm
Admin. I’m glad you liked the idea, but I wanted “Lefty” bingo. 😉
bigfootmm
August 1, 2018 10:50 pm
It’s all been pretty wonderful for Tesla buyers who have been getting a $7500 tax deduction. But that deduction is going down or away with increased sales, so Congress to the rescue! Next will be a $7500 tax credit to keep things going Musk’s way! The musk-making skunks spray to win.
I think I will hold onto my put though, just in case Tesla’s margins don’t ever even come up to GM’s, which are actually low enough to predict bankruptcy once again.
Tesla has only lost $1.53 billion in the first six months. Outstanding Elon!!!!
He promises profitability any day now, and the dumbass investors believe this nutjob blowhard.
Here is what I don’t get Admin. Star keeps going on about 3 billion dollars in this quarter like it is supposed to mean something. I am first to admit to not being a money guy and bean counter. Not sure if I am able to parse the charts, graphs and spreadsheet that all the pundits are mucking about with. Still I do know this from balancing a budget every month. It doesn’t matter how much a household takes in. It matters moar how much goes out. Maybe though I am old school when it comes money.Maybe I should just embrace the voodoo economics and sky high valuations being pimped by Elon…
[img
[/img]
I can’t see how this company can continue as a going concern when they are burning thru over a billion every quarter. I have a question. Maybe star can answer this seeing as he is so quick to dismiss me by offering a calculator.
How much profit is there in making a Model 3..
Just wondering.
Seeing as you are much better than I maybe you can help a fella out..
Cheers
rt
I can answer that Rob. Look at this in the meantime and I will get you the answer. https://mobile.twitter.com/Tesla/status/1024791046100738048?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet Here you go, buddy. add this to the graph above, along with the fact that I underestimated their gross income by a billion dollars for the quarter, and it will give you a pretty clear picture of why the stock is up almost 10% after hours. You know what they say, stormy weather in Shortville. https://business.financialpost.com/transportation/autos/tesla-model-3s-most-outspoken-critic-changes-his-mind-sees-potential-for-30-profit-margin . Remember, you can trust anything about a car (or business) to the man who wears the star. ? Here is some more. https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-08-01/tesla-soars-despite-record-quarterly-loss-8-million-daily-cash-burn
Star – this is all speculative. Tesla is bleeding money. Last quarter they lost $4.20 a share. Sales increases do not mean profitability. If they keep bleeding money, they are doomed. And so far, they seem to keep bleeding money. Analysts expected $3 billion in sales and a loss of only $2 a share. Oops on that part.
This is a risk game – there is so much money floating around folks are making bets on the future, rather than on fundamentals. I would not touch Tesla with a barge pole.
The entry of the big boys is imminent. They have the ability to undercut Tesla, they have the overall volume, the supply chains, the economy of scale, the dealer networks, and they actually know how to build cars. Electric cars are orders of magnitude easier to build than combustion engine ones, save maybe for battery tech.
Tesla is screwed. Sales mean little. Gotta turn a profit, and Tesla is far from doing that.
But what do I know.
That’s not quite accurate. Tesla has almost 1.2 billion more cash in the bank at the end of this quarter than it did last quarter. The big boys aren’t as formidable as you seem to think they are, in this case. Where they going to get the batteries? Musk was smart. He built the world’s largest battery factory in partnership with Panasonic. That’s where everybody’s going to have to buy their batteries. The big boys have been at this game for a while and have been striking out. BMW has had two electrics out for years, the I4, and the i8. They both suck, and they both don’t sell in the states. Neither one is a pure electric, either. Tesla is doing a number on BMW anyway, the Model S outsells BMW’s big cars, and the model 3 is already putting a hurting on BMW’s bread and butter, the 3 Series. See the chart above. Porsche looked like it had a contender in the Mission E. https://youtu.be/euB34FJ15f8. The concept was beautiful. The production car, now called the Taycan, is bland at best.
They just threw in the towel and bought 10% of Mate Rimac’s company, hoping to harvest some of his technology.
Rimac produced a car a few years ago called the Concept one. They made 7 of them. That’s how desperate Porsche is to figure this out. And in general, their engineers are second to none. I’ve had 3 Porsches. They’re probably the most bulletproof car on the road. Those guys have their act together. Their stated goal is to produce only 20,000 electric cars a year by 2022. That’s not going to touch Tesla. Tesla will make more electric cars then Porsche will make cars in 2019. Tesla will probably never have a losing quarter again. Watch this play out. It cost them less than 30 grand to manufacture a model 3. I think the breakdown is in one of the links I have above. They’re miles ahead of the competition in battery technology. Light years ahead of the competition in software technology. And they have 10,000 charging stations around the United States already built. I don’t think anybody else has any. Musk has build a monster. There’s a Tesla place around the corner from me, I see them unloading trucks full of cars every day. All those cars are already sold. Doesn’t matter how many hundreds of thousands of orders they have. No other company has any orders. There’s a lot of bad information going around.
They build their fucking cars in a tent. The QC issues with those cars will be epic. I think he should come out with a new model – Tesla Flamethrower. Oh yeah, their standard car is a flame thrower.
Jim, join me in praying for the souls of those short sellers. They had families who once loved them. And now their wives are going to leave them, and shack up with black guys. And their kids are going to drop out of school with their pants hanging off their ass. All because they made one mistake. It weighs heavily on me. I could have saved them.
Why do you feel the need to outright lie and make up your numbers when defending this piece of shit. Your declaration they have $1.2 billion more cash than last quarter is entirely FALSE? Here is their cash balance for the last 4 quarters:
Q3-2017 – $3.67B
Q4-2017 – $3.52B
Q1-2018 – $2.79B
Q2-2018 – $2.20B
You’re a liar. Anyone sense a trend in Tesla cash. Their quarterly free cash flow is negative $700M. Tick tock.
I think it was one of the articles you posted said they ended the first quarter with 1 billion in the bank. Don’t lose sight of what’s really important here. The children.
Star
Gotta say much respect for you. Luv ya Man! In the face of everything you have decided to die on this hill. To be honest I kinda want Musk to be on right track. And by extension you.
I can’t read financial reports in same way as lloph and Admin. So I tend to defer to them. But still I am rooting for ya bud. Not many will stand up to their continued barrage and then come back for moar. But I can’t drink the Kool-aid. Sorry…
This amateur see many parallels in this thread to BlackBerry some years back. They spent years trying to recover from the debacle of underestimating Steve Jobs and his cult. Were eventually forced to hire a cult figure of their own in John Chen to turn the company around. Quarter after quarter it was promised the light would shine just around the bend.
It never did.
Eventually they had to throw in the towel and sell off the phone that made them what they were. They are now a shadow whence they turned that corner.
I am not great a predictions. Still from where I sit what I see happening is Tesla floundering much as BBM did. They will be dragged kicking and screaming to downsize. Forced to cling and hold onto their core asset, their QNX, the battery technology. Ten years gone they will be a supplier to the big boys who are now getting serious and coming on the scene. It all got baked into car when they started building cars in tents. Sooner or later that will impact quality and reliability. Something that is gonna bite them in the ass down the road.
Which gets me to my next point. They just don’t have the infrastructure in place to service these cars when they break down. And they are gonna break down. The biggest test in selling a car isn’t getting it off the lot. Then the salesman is selling the dream. It is some years when it turns into a nightmare. Look to future, five years later, when a Mom is broke down on the road going to soccer practice. In the car, an ungrateful Preen and a three year old who just shit in his pants. That is when the real bottom line will be found. Forget the spreadsheets.
Look at Fiat. That company wanted into the North American Market yet saw the weakness in their Product, the 500. It wasn’t in the design. Car is a solid piece of engineering. Rather it was in the lack of the Dealer Network. They went out and bought, they would say entered into a partnership, a car company just so that they could provide the support to selling their cars.
Yeah some will say the traditional business model is antiquated and outdated. With the age of Amazon and Kindle is ripe to be replaced. Maybe it has stopped making sense. It is the reason Tesla has so far worked. A cult of personality back stopped only with Elon..
He is after all the epitome of the American Dream.
A Robber Baron like times of old. He does seem to have one hand in the pocket of the Government. In a non-homo, lets just be friends, kinda way. 🙂
Sorry man I just had to throw that one in…
The latest whore on Wall Street
The latest wearing the same dress.
The latest one writing the rules
The latest Oligarch in their bed
same as it ever was…
Blackberry is not a good analogy, Rob. I understand Tesla in a different way than those guys do, no need for me to defer to them. The fat guy who wrote the other article yesterday, come on, he’s no baller. He ordered a model 3. If he had game, he would have bought a Model S – for his wife. I don’t expect people on that economic level to understand an Elon Musk. Musk made it out the other side. He’s in sheltered water now. That’s why Wall Street reacted so favorably. Tesla is a monster. The hard part’s over. All the little chickenshit complaints raining down on Musk mean nothing. Keep this in mind. As I write this, Tesla is the most valuable car company in North America by stock market valuation. So I’m not alone on some island.
Tesla : section 8 for millionaires and billionaires cool cars with limited practical use at a huge loss for Mr. & Mrs. Middle class taxpaying Americans with a noose around their neck thanks to their elected representitives and Team Circle Jerk Of Wall Street to K-Street to Capitol Street prepare to kick out the last leg of the stool balancing them from certain death !
Well Done America we are on the eve of destruction . Don’t worry America the Kardashian Armenian Mud Sharks will be fine but the rest of us are screwed
Nose cone is off his little rocket thruster, if I had to guess.
Don’t really care if he’s a helmet or a tent head.
Let it go, yo. Damn.
If all that $ wasted by the gov parasite musky would have been used to develope a hydrogen powered engine? Wow! But we would have a very pissed off rottinfeller. Re; VWs hi mileage engine. And rottinfeller put the big hurt on VW for that.
Where does all the hydrogen to fuel these awesome engines come from, spanky?
dawg,
i know very little about alternative energy but i’ve always heard that the problem w/hydrogen is it’s explosiveness but that it is plentiful–
by the tone of your question i take it that that is not the case,correct?
Red
The problem is in its explosiveness. In the presence of oxygen, one spark and BAM! You remember the Hindenburg… All the gas burnt away in a wink of an eye…..To create the hydrogen one needs input energy. That fact alone makes it useful only for energy storage not as a source…
This was all tried by Ballard about 20 years ago.. it failed spectacularly… just like Tesla is gonna. It was a promise sandwich without any meat…
thanks (in a non homo friendly kind of way)
you’re welcome Red 🙂
Hey back the fuck off RiNS. You’re not qualified to answer Tampa’s question.
I am a licensed Professional Engineer with a Bachelor’s in Mechanical Engineering (channeling some Chip for ya tonight).
lol
Couldn’t resist. Some moments are so easy to explain that even a dumbfuck like me can feel safe as a fool rushing in…
🙂
Tampa,
Hydrogen is abundant…sort of. It doesn’t really exist as a gas naturally here on Erf; it’s all bound up with other stuff, like hydrocarbons. And water.
So you can split water molecules to get hydrogen using heat or electricity. You can also get it by various methods from methane and coal, for example.
The problem I was alluding to is that all of the methods take energy, and lots of it. Where does that energy come from? Burning fossil fuels accounts for about 63% in the U.S.
So as of yet, the hydrogen miracle just isn’t.
Gasoline is also highly explosive, a gallon of it having the explosive potential of a case of ditching dynamite.
Hydrogen is a common industrial gas, you can buy it by the cylinder or in bulk at most welding gas supply houses.
FWIW, the best use of hydrogen is not as a combustion fuel in engines but as the fuel source for fuel cells that would drive electric vehicles instead of those silly batteries that everyone gets all giggly over for some reason.
rdawg- I have posted this car many times, the Quant e-Limo 920hp nanoFlocell that runs on salt water. Hydro cars are the future dawg.
Dawg- Some of these cars are available now:
Tesla is not a fraud but a great blues/rock band who took their name from the great inventor/man of vision!Been around now about 30 years and still rocking out crowds where ever they play,Tesla rules!
Oh,you mean the awful car that is named affter the great man that unlike the man or band will disappear in the ash heap of history.
Sigh,hard to type one handed while soaking ones eye,James is the Tesla fan!
Things are looking up. No wonder the stock is soaring after hours.
[img
?itok=zcu0bun7[/img]
He better collect more deposits, with this free cash flow. Gotta keep the ponzi scheme going.
[img
?itok=MuhQNecQ[/img]
Admin. I’m glad you liked the idea, but I wanted “Lefty” bingo. 😉
It’s all been pretty wonderful for Tesla buyers who have been getting a $7500 tax deduction. But that deduction is going down or away with increased sales, so Congress to the rescue! Next will be a $7500 tax credit to keep things going Musk’s way! The musk-making skunks spray to win.
I think I will hold onto my put though, just in case Tesla’s margins don’t ever even come up to GM’s, which are actually low enough to predict bankruptcy once again.
I hear Musk is accepting Litecoin for deposits.
Being fair, the Model 3 might turn out to be a fine automobile.
If anyone can just figure out how to make them.