CLIMATE CHANGE

Guest Post by Hardscrabble Farmer

On Saturday morning after chores we set up on the dock of the sugar house and prepared to slaughter turkeys. We started out with 20 poults this year. In April we slipped them into their pen under the deck of the milk house and watered and fed them twice a day until they were old enough and fast enough to let loose in the orchard. We lost one about three days in when it managed to get itself stuck between the heat lamp and the brooder wall, another one a couple of days later when it jumped up onto the rim of the water bucket and then fell in and drowned. The last one disappeared from the count around the middle of June and we wound up with a final count fully grown birds ready for Thanksgiving, 7 hens and 10 toms between 12 and 35 pounds.

Doing the turkeys is one of my least favorite annual rites; the birds are heavy, the feathers difficult to pull even when they’ve been scalded and it’s a cold time of year to be working all day with water. This year I had plenty of people ask if they could help, but none of their schedules lined up the right way so I found myself having to do the work by myself. The air was crisp, the sky so blue that it was hard on the eyes, but you could see the first of the distant contrail lines being etched across its surface, and invisible jet cursor like the one on an etch-a-sketch, leaving a scar on the face of the day.

If you work out of doors you get to be very familiar with the weather, especially in a climate where the seasons dictate the cycles of life. Certain kinds of clouds precede specific types of weather, the way the wind comes in ahead of a front carries smells with it that tell you what kind of rain it will be, or how heavy the snow will fall. If you pay close attention to the variety of clouds, their density and the speed with which they cross the sky you can almost set your watch by the arrival of a cold front, or a break in the patterns. On some days, not all mind you, the jets that leave the trails will cross the sky repeatedly, zig-zagging back and forth across the sky, usually they begin in the south, from east to west and slowly as the day progresses they will rise up across the horizon from somewhere in Massachusetts until they are directly above us.

These delicate scrimshaw drawings on the horizon will bleed into bands, whitish at first but then oily looking, like gasoline on a puddle, leaving sun dogs and attenuated curtains of wispy fog across what was only moments before crystal clear. I have watched them often enough now to know the difference between normal air traffic and these deliberate actions. Though they are more often seen in the daylight, there are times when they come out after dark. From the front of the house you can see, on a clear night, 75 miles or more.

You get to recognize the normal air traffic far to the south, the back and forth at certain elevations and the direction where they originate and where they vanish. Normally you might see three in an hour, maybe four, never more, day or night. On the days when they fill the sky with their scrim of clouds from dissipated trails there are usually three or four aircraft working together, one behind the other at slightly different altitudes, back and forth, rising higher by the hour back and forth until the sky is completely obscured. One afternoon we watched as one jet made repeated loops at thirty thousand feet, leaving circular trails above us that linked into a chain before it finally headed off to the seacoast, the blurry ovals melting into each other until every last trace of clear sky was utterly gone.

Lately whenever you hear some authority figure mention the term climate change they have begun to amend their lecture long enough to repeat the refrain that it is “settled science”. Sometimes they will give the percentage of scientists who say that this is so and the number is always north of 97%. Their voices will lower, deliberately, I suspect, and they will often repeat that phrase for emphasis. “Settled science” in the way that a parent will tell a demanding child that the matter is no longer up for discussion- “it’s settled.” they will say with the same gravity, as if the pronouncement itself has decided the matter rather than the merits of the argument. I find that kind of rhetorical posturing to be a kind of signal, not that the argument is definitive, but rather that the door of inquiry is no longer open.

Our betters have decided, for better or worse, that the bothersome population needs to move on to other topics still open to free discussion, like favorite TV shows or which platform is superior, Samsung or I-Phone. Politically it is settled, of course, a tax is coming and we are going to pay for it through increased costs for the most fundamental services to the most obscure behaviors. There is no democracy when it comes to revenue, only compliance and anyone who points out that it looks more like a money grab than a solution had better keep their head down. You don’t need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows. The United Nations, one of the leading proponents of the political solution to climate change is located in on an 18 acre complex that sits on the East River of Manhattan Island.

Unknown to most of the members is that several blocks west of their headquarters there sits a massive stretch of exposed bedrock known as the Roches Moutonees, where ten thousand years earlier massive glaciers once scraped their surfaces under the pressure of a half mile thick body of ice. Were it not for global warming the rooftop where the elites land their luxury helicopters prior to attending their climate summit would, at just over 500 feet, still be some 1500 feet beneath the top of the glacier that once buried the entire northeastern seaboard. On that particular point, the science is settled.

Preparing a turkey for Thanksgiving is a task that most people will never undertake in a lifetime. Everyone eats turkey, but getting one from the field to the table is a process better left to others. My son, bless his heart, gave up his day to give me a hand with the birds and we set up a system to behead the turkeys, bleed them out and scald them before beginning on the plucking. A 35 pound tom turkey will not lay his head on the chopping block as dutifully as a Carmelite nun and the sounds that accompany this task create a cacophony that sets the rest of the flock into responses and calls of their own. Turkeys signal each other through a complex system of vocalizations, a chirping from the hens that always sets off in unison at the smallest sounds around them and a gobble from the toms in concert to establish their presence and availability.

Once the slaughter begins the sounds change and the toms lead and the hens stay silent. Towards the end the flock grows quieter until there are no sounds whatsoever, a deafening silence. We talk while we work, stopping to warm our hands in a bucket of hot water, changing latex gloves as they tear or fill up with a pink mix of blood and water. The process takes all day, about forty minutes per bird no matter how fast you are. My wife had told me about her last trip to the grocery store and stopping to check on the prices of turkey there, “Fifty-nine cents a pound”, she told me.

I tried to figure it out in my head, how you could even feed a turkey for 59 cents a pound, never mind the associated costs of labor getting it to harvest weight, the slaughter, the transportation, refrigeration, the stocking and the markups at every step along the way before it made it to the conveyor belt at the checkout. It simply isn’t possible, under any circumstances to provide that price for that commodity and not lose money. Unless there is some massive subsidy somewhere along the way where money is pumped into the system in order to suppress the price, it simply cannot be done.

That of course is coming from someone who has done this often enough to have a fairly good idea of what is involved. Since turkeys are not widgets, it’s inconceivable that any kinds of shortcuts can be taken to trim the price down to that degree. To get a thirty pound tom turkey you need 100 pounds of feed. At the rock bottom prices the cost of feed exceeds the cost of the turkey by 41 cents a pound without factoring in any other cost or process. Like all things in America these days, there is a disconnect between reality and perception. The mechanisms behind this are open to debate, but the reality is what it is.

I have noticed that while the official organs of the State and its apparatchiks are unanimous when it comes to climate change, they are equally on board with debunking the aircraft I see routinely blotting out the blue sky with their vapor trails. I see what I see and I’m not the kind of person who can deny reality no matter how many scientists agree on a particular topic. If climate change is a concern I would suggest they start with the most obvious source available and that’s whatever those planes are painting the heavens with every month, every year. I understand greenhouses and how that effect has supposedly determined the temperature of other planets, notably Venus, so pretending that a cloud covered sky isn’t a contributing factor is a kind of denial you wouldn’t expect from this crowd, but deny they do.

I don’t speculate on what it is that comes out of the back of these aircraft, that is for other people to determine, what I do know is that they alter the weather when they operate, if clouds are part of weather, that is. Maybe they too have been redefined and clouds no longer count in the world of meteorology, but whatever the purpose or intent, the outcome is undeniable. Man made aircraft can change the weather from a cloudless sunny day to an overcast one filled with horizon to horizon cover that blocks the sunlight and does whatever else it may.

When you’re all done with turkeys the last thing you want to do is eat one, that feeling goes away in a day or two when your hands no longer smell like feathers and feet and that’s when you start to think about how those birds were able to convert grass seeds and crickets, apples and pumpkins, corn meal and earthworms into a meat so juicy and flavorful, so packed with L-tryptophan, a precursor to seratonin, that literally tens of millions of Americans drift off to sleep before kick-off on the last Thursday of November. We like to part our bird into breast and leg quarters and brine them for a couple of days. We slow roast them at 200 degrees for about twelve hours until tender and then coat them with sea salt and fresh ground pepper and set the roasting pans under high heat until the skin blisters and browns.

The finish is beautiful, each section cooked to perfection and the quality of that bird unlike anything I have ever eaten in my life, even at 59 cents a pound. My son and I finished working in the dark and above us the coverage of the sky was complete. Not a star was visible in the sky, only a blanket of hazy, milky whiteness and a rising half moon surrounded by a ring, like Saturn. When I was younger my Grandfather used to tell me that this was a sure sign of snow, but that was before the planes with aerosol dispersal systems criss-crossing the sky whenever the mood strikes.

I’m not a scientist and I don’t claim to be one, but I know that CO2 isn’t a pollutant as the Settled Science Climate Change Affirmers, it’s a bi-product of living breathing creatures and I do know that whatever is coming out of the back of the airborne dispersal systems of if it is for our benefit or detriment, but I do know that it is definitely unnatural and controllable if someone is looking for a place to start that isn’t in my wallet. I don’t usually include links to other websites on the Internet because I can only vouch for my own words and don’t want to discredit or endorse someone without their tacit approval, but hey, it’s almost Thanksgiving and I’m grateful for their work in supporting what I see.

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142 Comments
Maggie
Maggie
November 23, 2015 8:22 am

I am not saying this was a foreshadowing, but it is interesting that it was made in just before the television era.

Maggie
Maggie
November 23, 2015 8:25 am

Maybe is so, maybe is not, but at least there is ample serious research about it to support the chemtrail theory.

Maggie
Maggie
November 23, 2015 8:27 am

Rev 11:18 “And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.”

BEA LEVER
BEA LEVER
November 23, 2015 8:49 am

Maggie- They are so consumed with depopulation they can’t see that they are destroying the Earth. Even children can can tell a contrail from a chemtrail, why is it most of TBP is having trouble with this subject?

Phaedrus
Phaedrus
November 23, 2015 9:12 am

“By way of response.”

Well and compellingly said, Hardscrabble, all of it.

Stucky
Stucky
November 23, 2015 9:20 am

“Stucky, you know that it has been done, you know that the data is available with the click of a mouse …..” ——– HF

Actually, no, I don’t know any of that.

I reject the premise that humans can make weather on a large scale. Why can’t they make it rain in drought stricken CA??

I still don’t know what the hell turkeys have to do with this, and I read your article twice.

Phaedrus
Phaedrus
November 23, 2015 9:36 am

Small farm life as it’s actually lived adds charm, soul and local color, and it takes us back to our roots closer to the land. Hardscrabble is an accomplished and very talented guy, writing with the human touch but knowledgeably, a winning combo. He asks us for nothing. He promotes no cause. But maybe most of all, he educates us with his eloquence and wisdom, the latter of which is in extreme short supply in this much degraded culture. Rap is Crap, y’all.

I say keep the turkeys in the narrative.

Rise Up
Rise Up
November 23, 2015 9:56 am

“My wife had told me about her last trip to the grocery store and stopping to check on the prices of turkey there, “Fifty-nine cents a pound”, she told me.”
—————————-
I got our turkey at Whole Foods here in Northern VA.

$1.69/lb for frozen
$2.69/lb for free-range, fresh
$3.69/lb for free-range, fresh, non-GMO

I got the $2.69 one–an 11-pounder.

As to chemtrails, Tony’s links are good.

Increased intensity of western forest fires is due to chemtrails–the aluminum acts as an accelerant.

As usual, SSS is totally clueless and prefers propaganda to facts. Typical CIA brainwashing. He just can’t help himself, I guess.

mike in ga
mike in ga
November 23, 2015 10:09 am

Maggie, can I talk turkey with you for just a sec? I, too, am cooking a wild turkey for the first time AND we picked up a ham yesterday ‘just in case’. My friend who shot the turkey for us recommends brining to keep the meat moist. Are you brining? Making your own or buying premade? I would like to make it from scratch but might go with the tried and proven. Good luck with your efforts and I’d like to compare notes with you afterwards.

This is written while sitting in front of a window on a cloudless day with an absolutely beautiful blue sky stretching as far as I can see in every direction. No chemtrails observed nor harmed in the making of this turkey missive.

Maggie
Maggie
November 23, 2015 10:24 am

Okay, am not sure this link will work as a share, so I will put it here both ways. We had a turkey earlier this year and it was, as you say, dry and tough. So, I realized something was wrong with my approach.

I looked up several cooking tips and settled on this one because I didn’t want to use brine. I also don’t have fatback, but have some very fat bacon, unsliced, that I bought really cheap at the local butcher shop, thinking it will provide the fat needed for the lean wild turkey.

See, already I am substituting.

sharer/sharer.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.seriouseats.com%2Frecipes%2F2013%2F11%2Fthanksgiving-wild-turkey-from-the-wild-chef.html

http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2013/11/thanksgiving-wild-turkey-from-the-wild-chef.html

Rise Up
Rise Up
November 23, 2015 10:35 am

Some “scientists” support aerosol spraying dubbed Solar Radiation Management. Anyone who denies this is real and ongoing needs to pull his/her head out of their ass. Some claim that it is only a concept that has not been put into practice. For others like HSF who can actually see what goes on above their heads, it’s beyond obvious…

Furthermore, those of us who understand this problem CAN distinguish between a contrail and a chemtrail. I have seen both in the sky simultaneously.

For those of you who understand pictures better than words, this illustration should help you, along with the caption of the drawing immediately below:

[imgcomment image[/img]

“Overview of the principal SRM geoengineering techniques that attempt to increase the reflection back to space of the incoming solar radiation. These techniques are often referred as acting by a “parasol or umbrella effect”.”

Maggie
Maggie
November 23, 2015 10:41 am

@Rise up… very good link. Thanks.

DRUD
DRUD
November 23, 2015 10:42 am

HSF Says: “Because it’s worth noting that your government has been engaged in weather modification for at least half a century and is willing to put such programs down in writing. Stupidity or hubris, your call.”

Ah…but there is plenty of both in evidence and combined with some good solid misplaced patriotic zeal. This is why they are so fucking dangerous.

As for chemtrails, along with so many other things, lies and truth, facts and speculation have become so intertwined they can never now be untangled. A Gordian Knot of bullshit, if you will. The only answer, as ever, is live your life as best you can today. Repeat when tomorrow comes. Kudos, again, for doing just that and for writing it down for us all to read.

B
B
November 23, 2015 10:46 am

Following the comments to my post, it is quite obvious that there is nothing that one could say that would change the minds of those who do not believe in anthropomorphic climate change. It is tantamount to arguing about religion. I suggest Admin not to waste reader’s time by posting anymore articles concerning climate change

Rise Up
Rise Up
November 23, 2015 10:55 am

Stucky says: “Here’s a million dollar idea; rent a fucking airplane and go collect the contrails and analyze them! So simple a caveman could do it.”
————————————–
Stuck, your juvenile mind is a stunning thing to behold…of course there has been analysis of chemtrail residue with soil testing.

http://holmestead.ca/chemtrails/soiltest.html

From a telephone conversation with one of the agronomists at the laboratory (A & L Canada Laboratories East, Inc.) I learned that soil testing that included aluminum testing was a relatively new addition to the standard agricultural tests – just over the last few years. He also maintained that the level of aluminum found in this particular series of tests was “not unusual”.

This same agronomist seemed unable to give a simple, direct answer to my question of what is considered to be the traditional historical background level of naturally occurring aluminum in agricultural soils although one page on the web site of his laboratory had the following statement along with an illustration with specific figures: “Aluminum greater than 400 ppm is a problem for most growing plants. The primary target for aluminum is the root cap. Therefore, it has a major impact on root growth and efficiency.”

[imgcomment image[/img]

The aluminum reading that had been reported in our ten local soil tests ranged from a high of 1692 ppm (parts per million) to a low of 712 ppm – and that lowest one happened to be the Holmestead field. The average of all ten fields was 1247 ppm which is in the “Very High” range of the above published Aluminum Rating.

Our interest in the level of aluminum is related to the fact that there have been numerous reports of various aluminum compounds being found in the “chemtrails” that are being constantly sprayed. Just search Google for chemtrails + aluminum or aluminium: Google search – the list of results is extensive!

Holmestead.ca has touched upon this subject before – almost two years ago, where we presented the results from Edmonton where laboratory tests (Lab Tests) showed levels of aluminum and barium as much as twenty times the normal background levels in rain and snow precipitation and were such that soil conductivity was greatly elevated.

Rise Up
Rise Up
November 23, 2015 11:05 am

Maggie says: @Rise up… very good link. Thanks.
———————————————-
Maggie, I meant to include the link where the illustration came from. Here it is:

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1364032113008460

I neither endorse or reject the contents of the link, but felt the illustration was useful to the conversation. It clearly displays stratospheric aeorsol spraying by aircraft as one of the options to counter what they perceive as global warming.

Rise Up
Rise Up
November 23, 2015 11:14 am

Stucky says: I reject the premise that humans can make weather on a large scale. Why can’t they make it rain in drought stricken CA??
————————————–
Stucky, has it ever occurred to you that there may be those who DON’T WANT rain in CA?

Think.

As to the ability of humans to “make weather”…who said this?

“Others are engaging even in an eco-type of terrorism whereby they can alter the climate, set off earthquakes, volcanoes remotely through the use of electromagnetic waves.”

It was Secretary of Defense William Cohen.

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/02/weather-wars.html

“The American Institute of Physics (the organization mentioned above in the Boston Globe article) provides an interesting overview of the history of weather modification:

From 1945 into the 1970s, much effort went into studies of weather modification. American entrepreneurs tried cloud-seeding to enhance local rainfall, Russian scientists offered fabulous schemes of planetary engineering, and military agencies secretly explored “climatological warfare.”

***

At the close of the Second World War, a few American scientists brought up a troublesome idea. If it were true, as some claimed, that humans were inadvertently changing their local weather by cutting down forests and emitting pollution, why not try to modify the weather on purpose? For generations there had been proposals for rainmaking, based on folklore like the story that cannonades from big battles brought rain.

Now top experts began to take the question seriously…. At the end of 1945 a brilliant mathematician, John von Neumann, called other leading scientists to a meeting in Princeton, where they agreed that modifying weather deliberately might be possible. They expected that could make a great difference in the next war. Soviet harvests, for example, might be ruined by creating a drought. Some scientists suspected that alongside the race with the Soviet Union for ever more terrible nuclear weapons, they were entering an equally fateful race to control the weather. As the Cold War got underway, U.S. military agencies devoted significant funds to research on what came to be called “climatological warfare.”

Gryffyn
Gryffyn
November 23, 2015 12:58 pm

We are having a beautiful blue sky day here in my part of the Southern Appalachians. Not a single cloud, contrail or chemtrail, just some light haze on the horizon. It is just like 9/12/01. There is an East-West and a North-South air corridor that pass nearby but not overhead and I am not even seeing the short little high altitude contrails that normally dissipate in a few seconds. Some days there will be big fat trails that stretch from horizon to horizon and slowly spread out and merge into a light gray cloud cover. ‘Tis a mystery.

Stucky
Stucky
November 23, 2015 1:31 pm

“Stuck, your juvenile mind is a stunning thing to behold …” ——- Rise Up

Juvenile mind, eh?

And all this time I thought you were a friend.

Well, how ’bout you Blow Me, friend?

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 23, 2015 1:50 pm

Maggie says: Now, the puffy things stay almost all day sometimes. It is different, for sure.

Good point, Mags. I recall they did dissipate rapidly before, unless it was sky writing.

Stuck, the turkeys are there to question price manipulation by unknown entities, weather – same question.
Now I have a new job connecting the dots in HSF’s stories.

hardscrabble farmer
hardscrabble farmer
November 23, 2015 1:54 pm

Hey Stucky, from a former Garden Stater to a current one I give you my solemn oath that I will never waste yours or anyone else’s time posting anything that I haven’t either experienced first hand or researched in depth. I’m just not into bullshitting people. If it interests you, look into it, if it doesn’t don’t get wound up over it. And the turkey part is a metaphor. Although the turkeys are real.

What is observable is undeniable. That is the basis of all scientific discovery. You will never, not once hear some politician or talking head refer to anything else in the entire known universe of human experience as “settled science”.

Don’t you find that curious?

Just so you know, the Emperor’s New Clothes isn’t really about fashion.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 23, 2015 2:11 pm

Metaphor, that’s the word I was looking for. It’s been so long since HS. Back then, we learned that authors have a purpose or message in their works. In college we learned that sometimes the author has a message he was not entirely aware of. You have to suss this out by examining themes, analogies and metaphors. I am still trying to understand the horse fucking article. What was the author trying to say?, I wonder.

Stucky
Stucky
November 23, 2015 2:20 pm

“Stuck, the turkeys are there to question price manipulation by unknown entities, weather – same question.” ——— EC

Oh … I see …. so what HF is saying is that turkeys are manipulating the weather?

Rise Up
Rise Up
November 23, 2015 2:30 pm

Stucky says:

“Stuck, your juvenile mind is a stunning thing to behold …” ——- Rise Up

Juvenile mind, eh?

And all this time I thought you were a friend.
———————————-
Friend today, foe tomorrow…who cares? This is TBP, where we all have thick skins.

You’re OK in my book, Stucky, but sometimes kids say the darndest things.

Bea Lever
Bea Lever
November 23, 2015 2:42 pm

Rise- Do you understand how ANYONE can deny Chemtrails……all they have to do is fukkin look up. I hate to see people’s feewings hurt but Jeebus H. Krist people, this is like a HUGE wart on somebody’s nose……….how ca you miss it????

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 23, 2015 3:55 pm

Yes, Stuck, they are existential turkeys questioning the price they bring per pound at the market and chemtrails.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 23, 2015 3:57 pm

Stuck, a word to the wise, the troll patrol is watching. There’s a campaign afloat to ban trolls and other geeks. I categorically deny any involvement.

cz
cz
November 23, 2015 4:41 pm

HSF,
I have foundthat the peeps that question the reality of spraying are invariably arrogant and condescending. Just an observation from my actual life. I’ll usually just bring up the topic when outside with friends or strangers. I just point out the stripes in the sky then gauge reaction.
Also, obumma implied settled science in regard to a round earth. Makes me wonder. Question everything.

Llpoh
Llpoh
November 23, 2015 4:49 pm

If you want the best tasting turkey EVER slow cook it in a kamado cooker with your choice of wood smoke – apple, hickory, etc.

Man oh man, moist delicious turkey is the result.

Gator
Gator
November 23, 2015 5:12 pm

The climate change thing is easy to figure out. Just look at what they want to do to combat it. Taxes on carbon emissions. What emits carbon? Pretty much all economic activity. So, in essence, what they are pushing is a global tax on EVERYTHING. Global warming is just the vehicle they are using to com people into supporting something that will make their standard of living worse by every objective measure. Just another scheme to get moar control over everyone and steal more of their money. And a carbon credit exchange run by, surprise, surprise – Goldman sacs. Whev we can’t even get an accurate forecast of of it’s going to rain next week or not, I’m not getting rid of my tahoe because someone says the temp may rise 50 years from now.

As to the whole chemtrails thing, it is alarming. Aluminum isn’t supposed to be breathed in or eaten. I’ve even heard that high levels of aluminum in the brain are found in many people who suffer from alshymers(spelling?). So, they may well be poisoning the entire planet to fight a nonexistent problem, if all the chemtrails talk is accurate.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 23, 2015 5:20 pm

LLPOH, I haven’t had baked turkey in years. The Salvys boil it in a dutch oven. Then they serve it in these barbaric french rolls and call it panes con pavo. Can’t wait.

starfcker
starfcker
November 23, 2015 5:50 pm

The cloud seeding thing was a joint project of the navy and the research flight facility (RFF) which later became NOAA. Project stormfury. it was run by a guy named bob simpson, and the guys who physically outfitted the planes for this venture were brad patton, and my dad. They had DC-6’s, and later orion p-3’s

starfcker
starfcker
November 23, 2015 6:03 pm

I spent many summer days as a little kid crawling around those P-3s with a walkie talkie, bored to death, waiting to relay to dad whether something clicked or not. Stormfury was a failure. They gave it up after 15 years. Rise up, barium and aluminum are common ingredients in agricultural fungicides. Any lab rat ought to know that

gm
gm
November 23, 2015 6:43 pm

Just a weird thought , flame me if you wish , but what if the danger from fukashima radiation is so extreme that TPTB are causing a drought on the west coast so that rain ,laden with high dose radiation is stopped from polluting the ground, crops , etc?

I do not believe that TPTB have any altruistic thoughts about the sheeple , but protecting their resource rich land might be a consideration to them .

Sea life appears to have been decimated way beyond 1 in 10 dead.

If you look up U.N. resolutions , I believe they made it a warcrime to use any technology to modify the weather . This was 1971? resolution? My dates prolly wrong , but it was a concern back then .

Just my meandering thoughts lol

cz
cz
November 23, 2015 7:09 pm

gm
From what I’ve read, I’m afraid you are probably correct about the sea life.
As to your theory, it’s an interesting thought, but the jet streams and such don’t stop at the west coast of the us. All of the northern hemisphere will be/are contaminated.

mike in ga
mike in ga
November 23, 2015 7:27 pm

Thanks for the link, Maggie. It looks interesting and flavorful. I’m curious as to why you do not want to brine your turkey. I understand there are various schools of thought on this and I’m agnostic on them all as I’ve only roasted, never brined. Just curious if there’s a reason or bad experience, etc that influences your decision.

Maggie
Maggie
November 23, 2015 8:03 pm

@Mike… I assumed, perhaps wrongly, that brine meant MSG. Since you asked, I did a bit of research and while it CAN produce MSG, there are ways to limit that byproduct, so I just may give Brining a try, but not this Thanksgiving.

I picked up another rabbit doe and had to rescue Injun Joe from my cousin’s house because he bit the little toddler named Huckleberry when Huck reached into his and Tom Sawyer’s cage this morning. I-Jay probably thought the little finger was a tasty morsel, but Huck’s father wanted to squash I-Jay and so, I went to pick him up on my way to get my new bunny hutches and new doe.

Unfortunately, I-Jay appears to have matured a bit and was overly interested in the doe in the communal cage in the back seat, so since I have my breeding buck, am thinking I-Jay may be my first brining experiment.

Keith Elder
Keith Elder
November 23, 2015 8:44 pm

I believe that industrial civilization is destabilizing the climate. I don’t know what mix of CO2, pollution, and ozone are causing it. I believe that arctic ice is shrinking every year, and when it melts completely in a few years that the albedo effect will cause methane hydrates to be released, further exacerbating the problem. I believe that the average temperature went up by 1 degree C during the week after 9/11 that planes weren’t flying.

I didn’t collect the data, so I can’t be certain of any of this. But I do know that the climate is destabilizing, based on the weather extremes of the last few years.

What do anthropogenic climate change deniers think is causing this?

gm
gm
November 23, 2015 9:12 pm

@ keith um let me think , if im not mistaken the goddamn sun is a factor ?.

Seeing as how the entire realm of planets are heating up ?
If im not mistaken ,humans , so called anthropogenic , are only on this earth ?

Omg didn’t climate change scientisits say we were in a global COOLING pattern just 20 years ago ?

What if OMG humans are not really involved in this equation ? Whay if it is just a TAX plan from the U.N? At least that is how they describe it actually .

I am a denier sir , since none of the “settled science ” considers the sun ? as a factor.
Muander minimum ? or maximam are thoughts to consider .
Tough crowd here , you better peel that onion way back and get to the core sir , co2 is what trees and plants EAT . And kick off a little oxygen as a byproduct. Whatever

jamesthewanderer
jamesthewanderer
November 23, 2015 10:45 pm

‘I believe that industrial civilization is destabilizing the climate.”

IMMEDIATE FAIL. Science is for facts, without “adjustment” or “correction” to fit a theory. Belief belongs in churches; if you cannot follow / verify the argument, the reasonable thing to say is “I don’t know enough about it to have an opinion”.

” I don’t know what mix of CO2, pollution, and ozone are causing it.”

Why are you limiting the causative factors to these three? IS IT POSSIBLE that something else (say, sunlight variations over time / albedo variance / vocanism / orbital wobble / all the above plus a few thousand more) is causing this? How can you tell it’s only these three, or any other given three?

” I believe that arctic ice is shrinking every year, and when it melts completely in a few years that the albedo effect will cause methane hydrates to be released, further exacerbating the problem.”

There you go, believing again. Paid your tithes to the Church of Gaia yet? Sent in your check to Saint Al for your sins of carbon footprinting? Just wait, your invoice for carbon taxes will arrive if the UN has its way…

” I believe that the average temperature went up by 1 degree C during the week after 9/11 that planes weren’t flying.”

WHY? Who said that, and why, based on what data? Who provided that data, from what original sources? And was it “adjusted” to fit a theory rather than examined to see if it fit?

“I didn’t collect the data, so I can’t be certain of any of this. But I do know that the climate is destabilizing, based on the weather extremes of the last few years.”

Human lifetimes are too short to judge climate activity. My ancestors lived through the last Maunder Minimum, when the Thames froze over and various other areas were inhospitable. They also lived through the Medieval warming period, when grapes were grown in Greenland. Various ones of them left records to show these events, that YOU have never seen in your lifetime. But you KNOW that the weather is “destabilizing”? If it is, could it be from something besides AGW (you know, like Mt. St. Helens and the other eruptions of the last decade)?

“What do anthropogenic climate change deniers think is causing this?”

Any of a number of factors you have failed to consider or ruled out because of your religion. Some are listed above, more are available from queries online. Also, consider that

the East Anglia emails,
various other inconvenient truths like IPCC corruption,
database concealment and “adjustment” for theory fit and
proven frauds like Michael Mann’s “hockeystick”,
the wholesale corruption of climate journals by activists and
research money flowing to fund the fraud

have lost the confidence of anyone who actually understands science and how it is supposed to work. I think AGW is a proven fraud that degrades the reputation of anyone who defends it based on corrupted data, unjustifiable “adjustments” and selective cherry-picking of information to support it. Go find someone stupid if you want worship, you’re unlikely to find it here.

Maggie
Maggie
November 23, 2015 11:01 pm

I just watched the Terminator: Genesys film and am not sure what I just watched. I think there were contrails in there somewhere.

(JOKING, but EGAD, what was that movie? Did Arnold write that one for Arnold?)

SSS
SSS
November 23, 2015 11:45 pm

“Because it’s worth noting that your government has been engaged in weather modification for at least half a century and is willing to put such programs down in writing. Stupidity or hubris, your call”
—-someone above, maybe HSF, heh

I’ll vote that I’m stupid, Farmer. Dumber than a fence post. You brought this chemtrails bullshit up. So why don’t you and I go head-to-head, and you can bring in the rest of the clueless idiots in this thread on your side as your allies. I can handle 15-1 odds. On a good day, 20-1.

I’ll give you the opening kickoff. Ready, set, kick.

Tucci78
Tucci78
November 24, 2015 5:48 am

Regarding the 1959 Disney “the World of Tomorrow” short feature allegedly about “chemtrails,” are you bozos claiming that “chemtrails” are cloud seeding?

Nothing more than that?

Tucci78
Tucci78
November 24, 2015 6:04 am

Kieth Elder writes: I believe that industrial civilization is destabilizing the climate. I don’t know what mix of CO2, pollution, and ozone are causing it. I believe that arctic ice is shrinking every year, and when it melts completely in a few years that the albedo effect will cause methane hydrates to be released, further exacerbating the problem. I believe that the average temperature went up by 1 degree C during the week after 9/11 that planes weren’t flying.

I didn’t collect the data, so I can’t be certain of any of this. But I do know that the climate is destabilizing, based on the weather extremes of the last few years.

What do anthropogenic climate change deniers think is causing this?

Well, it’s what you “believe.” You haven’t any certainty as to “the data” (by which might be meant the reliability of the observations upon which your beliefs are based), but you claim to “…know that the climate is destabilizing….”

Obviously, it’s a matter of faith for you, whether it takes on the coloration of religious dogma or not.

So what’s to be said? The phenomenal universe as manifest in the global climate is at odds with what you “believe” (why do scientifically illiterate panickers always pants themselves with that word?), but you’re clearly uninterested in – perhaps incapable of – embracing factual reality, so what remedy can I apply to abate your hysteria?

———————————-
“One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It s simply too painful to acknowledge — even to ourselves — that we’ve been so credulous. (So the old bamboozles tend to persist as the new bamboozles rise.)”

— Carl Sagan, “The Fine Art of Baloney Detection,” Parade, 1 February 1987

Tucci78
Tucci78
November 24, 2015 6:53 am

Blithers B: …it is quite obvious that there is nothing that one could say that would change the minds of those who do not believe in anthropomorphic climate change. It is tantamount to arguing about religion. I suggest Admin not to waste reader’s time by posting anymore articles concerning climate change

That last translates as “the contention regarding man-made climate change as principally the result of atmospheric carbon dioxide released in the course of petrochemicals fuel combustion is utterly indefensible on the face of all evidence available, and it distresses me [“B”] to have it discussed anywhere I might find it, so please stop talking about it!”

A little more wordy than B might use in expressing himself, but remember that this is a friggin’ idiot who uses “anthopomorphic” (“man-shaped”) when the term is anthropogenic (“man-caused).

Precision as well as common fucking sense is beyond this hapless klutz.

Alexander Ac
Alexander Ac
November 24, 2015 10:52 am

“I’m not a scientist and I don’t claim to be one…” – that was clear from the beginning.

— Alex

Maggie
Maggie
November 24, 2015 1:13 pm

As I’ve been looking further into this topic, I’ve discovered there is really no need to worry. The safety and welfare of humanity is safeguarded by the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) , which is a specialized agency of the United Nations. It is the UN system’s authoritative voice on the state and behaviour of the Earth’s atmosphere.

“Since its establishment, WMO has played a unique and powerful role in contributing to the safety and welfare of humanity. Under WMO leadership and within the framework of WMO programmes, National Meteorological and Hydrological Services contribute substantially to the protection of life and property against natural disasters, to safeguarding the environment and to enhancing the economic and social well-being of all sectors of society in areas such as food security, water resources and transport.”

I am so relieved.

http://www.wmo.int/pages/index_en.html

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 24, 2015 1:29 pm

Folks here in the AV are taking this event seriously. I was at the mall waiting for the church lady. I’ll wait for you in women’s shoes, I said. I got drowsy. Slipped off into little-bb land. The saleslady roused me with her loud blather bout how women’s boots are a must-have for the upcoming El Niño.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 24, 2015 1:30 pm

I got 100 again. Wow!