Light in the Philosophy of Zarathustra

And they will make a new world, freed from old age and death, from decomposition and corruption, eternally living, eternally growing, possessing power at will, when the dead will rise again, when immortality will come to the living, and when the world will renew itself as desired. Yt19.11 [1]

This passage, one of the most beautiful to be found in the younger Avesta, proclaims at once with missionary zeal the goal towards which all Zarathushtrian efforts were directed: nothing less than the total transformation and perfection of existence (Frashkart).

Zarathushtra s vision of the supreme deity, Ahura Mazda, was that of a good God: wholly benevolent, totally loving, the author of all quality, beauty, and of everything life-enhancing and positive. But precisely because he was entirely good, he was not all-powerful. He possessed a vulnerability that was an attribute of his goodness, a vulnerability present in all those who are sensitive and benevolent. Ahura Mazda desired Man to participate with him in bringing the creation to perfection. (Y31.21). Man was free to accept the call or to refuse it. The invitation was given freely, without any threats of punishment or promises of reward: the end result would be reward enough. The process towards its completion: a journey of creative self-discovery in which the individual would both finds and fulfills his intrinsic humanity.

Answering this divine call, the followers of Zarathushtra saw themselves as a loose brotherhood of individuals working (each on his own initiative) in a common cause alongside their God to transform the world — their thoughts, words and actions reflecting the longings of their prophet:
May we be among those who bring about the transfiguration of the earth. Y30.9

The means by which this desired end was to be accomplished was by an ever-greater growth and evolution of the light of glory (xvarnah). This primordial light, uncreated because it was a natural property of the deity (Ys 12.1, 31.7, 35.10), was the energy out of which Ahura Mazda had created everything in existence including the divine beings of the pleroma. It was a light that filled the heavens, the abode of light (Y31.20) but was undeveloped and latent in matter. The basic duality in the philosophy of Zarathushtra was not that of light against darkness, but of manifestation and latency of the light (the menok and getig states of existence). In addition, the word xvarnah carried with it the implication of destiny, suggesting a positive bias in the universe towards the emergence and evolution of the light – a kind of anticipation of the Frashkart at the heart of creation: an assurance, similar to that of Julian of Norwich that, all shall be well….. and all manner of things shall be well.

But this was not the purely abstract light of the Gnostics and Manicheans. It was not an alien presence imprisoned in the grossness of matter, calling out to the individual to free him out of the stinking body out of this desolate place. [2]

The light did not require the individual to reject matter or retreat into the rarefied world of the intellect. This radiance was an intrinsic property of matter. Man belonged to the earth and the earth belonged to Man. He would never be able to feel himself at home anywhere else but in the material world. The Zarathushtrian conception of this interrelationship of man with nature was very strong. Man was not placed into the universe like an object among other objects in the way that the God of the Old Testament placed Adam into an already-completed garden. Rather he was born out of his environment like an apple from a tree, or ripples from a pond.

Hence arose the Zarathushtrian respect for all life and nature, a reverence which the prophet himself voiced in his songs:
The radiance of the sun and the shimmering of the dawn at the break of day are reflections of your glory Y50.10 and which his followers echoed:
We revere all the holy creatures that Mazda has created, which were established holy in their nature and we revere all the springs of water and the growing plants and the entire earth and heavens even towards the lights without number. Y71.6

When he looked about him at the physical world, the Zarathushtrian was confronted by the goodness of Ahura Mazda reflected, in some form or another, in every object and being which he saw; and (in the later literature) each element of the physical world was imagined as under the protection of one or other of the Amesha Spentas (Holy Immortals), the hypostases of Ahura Mazda.

The final transfiguration of the world, its final ideal state (Frashkart), is an image of the universe ablaze with the auroral light of the xvarnah, a light illuminating all things animate and inanimate, bestowing meaning and value upon them, and opening up their dimension of transcendence.

Seeing Persons, Lighting Haloes
It is all too easy to imagine the xvarnah, so seemingly abstract and distant from everyday life, as merely some fanciful metaphor with relevance only for poets and philosophers. But this light of glory, about which so many books have been written, is exactly what makes each of us uniquely human. Its influence can be discerned in all the minutiae of human life. In order to gain a real feel for the benefits of the light, it is necessary only to consider the concept of the person.

Most of us are able to experience a human being in one of two ways: as an object (a collection of tissues, chemical processes and electrical impulses) or as a person (an indivisible whole with a face and a name). Once an object is perceived as a person, a mysterious new dimension opens up: we recognize something that exists on a higher level than mere sensory perception. We respond to the infinite within the finite. To recognize a person when all we have before us is a mass of physical characteristics – hair, teeth, tissues – is to perceive that object qualitatively, i.e., to see it in a new light: in the light of the xvarnah.

We take for granted our remarkable ability to perceive persons: we hardly give it a second thought. Its sheer wonder becomes clear only once we experience someone who possesses no such intuition: the classic autistic person. Broadly speaking, the severely autistic individual can be described as being trapped in a world of physical matter and strict reasoning. He finds it difficult to communicate, to imagine or to deal with other people socially. Although good at learning complex rules, he is nevertheless incapable of reacting sympathetically to others because he can never imagine what anyone else is thinking: he has no concept of mind. The whole interior (infinite) world of the person as person is unknown to him. His relationships are directed chiefly towards objects: which is how he perceives other people — as objects.

Science knows nothing of the person. The person (the uniqueness of the person) cannot be expressed in concepts at all. It evades all rational definitions because all the properties by which it could be characterized can be met with in other individuals. Personality can be grasped only by direct intuition. Similarly, a face – the symbol of the person – differs from all other faces in very minute details, barely describable in words. Yet to other human beings, the recognition of these features as a unique person goes far beyond what science can explain.

Once the internal world of another individual is revealed, by virtue of our recognition of him as a person (an object open to infinity), the whole world of human relations suddenly becomes possible: co-operation, intimacy, compassion, understanding, love….. civilization.

When we fall in love with another human being, we are seeing that individual as more than just a person. For a time, the image we have of him or her is complete (because illuminated strongly by the light), whole, and hence (whole-ly) holy. That atmosphere of wonder and colour that suddenly surrounds the object of our attentions (when coincidences abound, when the world suddenly becomes saturated with meaning and everything in creation revolves around this single human being), is a quality of the xvarnah. We are loving someone who does not (yet) exist. We are seeing them as they will appear (one day) in the full light of the Frashkart.

The halo (the aureole, the nimbus) is one of the great abiding icons of Zarathushtrianism. This is the light which in Zarathushtrian as well as in Christian and Buddhist iconography, is to be found glowing about the heads of great kings, priests or holy men. Each of us has set at least one halo ablaze in the course of our lives. When we fall in love, it is as if we have lit up the beloved s halo. Perceiving their dimension of transcendence, we recognize the divine in them. For what is a halo but a human being lit up with the light of great love, value, or destiny? A lover does not love the physical body of his beloved at all, but the ideal image of her, the angel to whom she corresponds. Of course he does love her body also, but for the sake of her person: because it belongs to her and manifests her reality. That physical body can be old as a grandmother, sick, diseased, (barely recognizable as a human being), punctured by tubes and plugged into monitors, but still loved and adored for the person within it.

Divine Fire
The divine light, the sacred fire, the so-called fire-temples, the aureoles, the Mountain of the Dawns, the Peak of Judgment, the Auroral fires, the Chinvat Bridge – the symbolism can easily become heady, the imagery intoxicating. Reason begins to lose its foothold here. But to remove such poetic elements at the heart of any philosophy or religion is to rip out its heart and corrupt its truth. For religions, as well as philosophies, live and breathe by the quality of their poetry: by their ability to set hearts alight and not just heads. Sometimes it can be more instructive to follow the images of thought to where they lead us, rather than rush immediately to dissect with the intellect. (We are reminded that Zarathushtra was first and foremost a poet, and proud of it). One of the utterances of the Delphic Oracle was that only poetry could be accepted as truth in every age.

So many traditions bear witness to the experience of the uncreated light that it is impossible to indicate even a tiny representative sample here. It is the fire of the Burning Bush seen by Moses; the pillar of fire before the Israelites in the desert. It is the Kibriya. It is the tongues of fire revealed to the apostles of Christ at Pentecost; and the light of the Transfiguration glimpsed by them on Mount Tabor (Lord, Lord, this is a good place to be). The Manichaeans, blinded by its beauty, looked in disgust at the material world that had become dark and dead for them in contrast. Rumi wrote eloquently in praise of it, but at first he was terrified of its illumination:

I lost my world, my fame, my mind
The sun appeared and all the shadows ran
I ran after them but vanished as I ran
Light ran after me and hunted me down [3]

The Islamic philosopher who borrowed more elements from Zarathushtrianism than any other was probably Suhrawardi. For him the universe was an infinite sea of lights: nothing existed that was not light. It is interesting to note that Suhrawardi reserved a special place for Vohuman in his Philosophy of Lights. Whereas he equated the other Amesha Spentas roughly with Plato s Archetypes (his latitudinal order of lights), Vohuman (Bahman) he considered the primary archangel of the longitudinal order: the first light emanating from the Godhead, the nearest to the supreme Godhead himself (Hormuzd).

All truly great symbols overflow the boundaries of meaning and invade the world of the senses. Light (perhaps the greatest symbol of them all) is no exception. Many of the early Christian saints such as Gregory Nazianzen, Cyril of Alexandria, Maximus, Macarius of Egypt, Andrew of Crete, John Damascene, Symeon the New Theologian, Euthymius Zigabenus, etc., all spoke of the Divine Light as if they had seen it with their bodily eyes. For if the intensity of the light is in some way a measure of wholeness, some argued, then surely it should be experienced by the whole man and be perceptible to the physical senses as well as to the intelligence. I had often [bodily] seen the light [4], wrote Symeon the New Theologian in the eleventh century in defence of this position – and we have to believe him. But the dispute as to whether the light could in fact be seen with the bodily eyes split the Christian Orthodox Church. Gregory Palamas (the Byzantine apostle of light) healed the rift in the fourteenth century with a series of compromises, but he still remained tantalizingly ambiguous on the subject:
The light has sometimes also been seen by the eyes of the body, but not with their created and sensory power; for they see it after having been transformed by the spirit. [5]

Yet the basic intuition of a synchronism between the spiritual and the sensual continued to be felt and expressed. Writers like Rumi and Ibn Arabi conceived of the spiritual and the sensual as conspiring together in some mysterious and irrational fashion. And Suhrawardi, when defining his fifteen varieties of spiritual light, seemed often to be describing what are known today as photisms: intense flashes before the eyes sometimes experienced by people who practice meditation. Varying in intensity from pinpoints to large areas of bright and coloured lights, these photisms have been experienced by far too many people for them to be easily dismissed. Individuals as varied as Ibn al-Arabi and Emanuel Swedenborg have investigated them, (the latter thinker believing them to be internal signs of approval).

Is the divine light then purely intellectual; is it spiritual, physical; or perhaps all three? Is it a property of the very nature of God, or merely his energy? In the end, the real nature of this light defies all attempts to grasp its full significance, because you cannot demonstrate that which is itself the cause of all demonstration.

Notes

  1. Yt19.11 in Corbin, H. Spiritual Body and Celestial Earth. Taurus 1976 (1990) pp. 13-14
  2. Mandaean text in Jonas, Hans. The Gnostic Religion. Beacon Press p.88
  3. Rumi in Harvey, Andrew. The Way of Passion. A Celebration of Rumi. Souvenir Press 1994 p. 59
  4. Lossky, Vladimir. The Vision of God. (Trans. Ashleigh Moorhouse) The Faith Press. American Orthodox Book Service 1963 p.118.
  5. Palamas, in Mantzaridis, Georgos. The Deification of Man. St. Vladimir s Seminary Press (New York) 1984 p.100

Ys = Yasna
Yt = Yasht

http://www.iranchamber.com/religions/articles/light_philosophy_zoroaster.php

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Stucky
Stucky
November 29, 2017 7:05 am

I’m first to post!!!

Leaving for the DMV in a few minutes …. Ms Freud’s driver license renewal … will read article while waiting in line ..

Edit: Here we are at the DMV … 2o minutes BEFORE the doors open…. and there are 34 people ahead of us!!! Fucken overcrowded POS little state. Way more than half are kneegrows or Mexicans, really. If we just deported them all, we’d be 8th in line. Fuckers …

kokoda - AZEK (Deck Boards) doesn't stand behind its product
kokoda - AZEK (Deck Boards) doesn't stand behind its product
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 8:13 am

Pox on you from Maggie

Maggie
Maggie

Thank you. I was slow to the laptop. Watching George Burns and Gracie.

AWB
AWB
  Maggie
November 30, 2017 4:52 am

I refuse to waste my time even trying to understand this. I see no one else did, either.

Besides, isn’t zarathustra dead? Buddha, Confucius, Mohammed, they’re all dead. Jesus Christ is the only man whom God Almighty, maker of heaven and earth and all that is in them, raised from the dead and set at his right hand.

That’s not so hard to understand, and in one sentence. Zara is a white boy from the suburbs of Dallas who adopted the Z religion. Nice to see his drug therapy is coming along.

Oh, and fuck you Maggie and Stufuk, and the echo chamber that represents your mindless followers. At least this article represents a differing point of view, as opposed to the self affirming bull crap that’s normally posted here, and you don’t even bother to comment on the substance of the article. Shame on you.

KeyserSusie
KeyserSusie
  AWB
November 30, 2017 1:37 pm

Hi A&WrootBeer. I think you are trying to hit the nail on the head here.

i forget
i forget
  Zarathustra
November 30, 2017 2:40 pm

I got faith. George Michael. Good album.

KeyserSusie
KeyserSusie
November 29, 2017 7:21 am

Circles and Lights

I have shared this meditation video before and repeat it here as i can think of no other response except gratitude and a quote from The Screwtape Letters “that inarticulate sense for actuality which is our ultimate safeguard against the aberrations of mere logic.” Zara, masterful. Thank you.

Not Sure
Not Sure
November 29, 2017 7:34 am

Second! ( I think)

Any way, beautifully written piece, thanks for your effort!

I would just like to understand the concept of evil or darkness, as it would help me understand your concept of the light; does darkness exist in the absence of light? Does the belief system focus on the light as the thing to grasp and evil overcome by only seeking the light?

As a Christian, I understand there is an evil that will be vanquished in the end; is there a definition of evil in the body of your teachings, or is it not mentioned as light has already defeated it?

Not trying to argue, honest question!

Stucky
Stucky
November 29, 2017 7:57 am

Ahura Mazda … such an unfortunate name.

I can only picture a kneegrow Star Trek communications officer driving a Jap car. We’ve achieved assimilation.

Maggie
Maggie
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 8:38 am

I had a Mazda once… we ran that four cylinder sucker up to 248,000 miles, then sold it for “parts” to a fat Mexican named Fred who answered our newspaper ad and showed up with $400 cash for the “car that runs.” He said he was parting it out to Mexico.

We got a ticket in the mail when “someone” blew through the Pike Pass on the Way to New Mexico (we got a picture of our little Mazda’s license tag, still registered to me in the mail blazing through the gate at 80 mph.) We learned a lesson about taking the license plates off our car.

Now, about the light. My cousin, at age 70, moved to India to become enlightened. She’s full of this shit now.

AWB
AWB
  Maggie
November 30, 2017 4:54 am

Are you sucking stukfuk’s dick now? I would have thought better of you, apparently I was wrong.

Stucky
Stucky
  AWB
November 30, 2017 8:00 am

So, now Asshole Without Brains (AWB), a slimy creature who claims to follow Christ, writes that Maggie sucks my dick. An amazing display of following the Prince Of Peace, is it not?

A few days ago, I gave indisputable examples that Asshole Without Brains is a bad man. I encouraged you to vote him down at every opportunity. Now would be a good time to do so … on ALL his posts. It only takes a second to do so.

AWB
AWB
  Stucky
December 1, 2017 6:24 am

No less than what you’ve written, yet you take exception when someone else does it.

I’ll stick by what I said, it’s a echo chamber in here, and the only sound is Maggie sucking your diseased donkey dick. I won’t ask how it tastes.

You’re a disgusting piece of shit, and it’s about time someone called you on it. I’m only calling it the way it is, and I won’t invoke the name of Jesus Christ to do it.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  AWB
November 30, 2017 9:38 am

AWB, I objected to strangers getting too familiar and calling Maggie, Mags. I objected when Rdawg called her elderly.

It is very evident that you have no self respect to disrespect a woman such as Maggie, a Red Rope, a high school Valedictorian, a union rep, a Tea Party leader, a deer hunter, a dog lover, a survivalist and a patriot. She is a wife and mother worthy of emulation.

You are scum. You are filthy scum. You are not worthy of spit. You are beneath Matt Lauer and all the other gropers, which is pretty low.
EC

AWB
AWB
  Anonymous
December 1, 2017 6:25 am

Like anybody gives a shit what Stukfuk’s minion think. What’s the matter, Maggie not sharing?

IndenturedServant
IndenturedServant
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 4:41 pm

Stucky, I always wonder if Joe Isuzu was his right hand man?

AWB
AWB
  IndenturedServant
November 30, 2017 4:55 am

Slow news day at the retirement home? Oops sorry, that’s MA.

Working from home again? Yeah, right! HAHA

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, I still got it. Contrary to news reports of my untimely demise, and Stukfuk’s fondest wet dreams.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Lucia W.
Lucia W.
November 29, 2017 8:11 am

That was beautiful, Zara. Thank you.

Diogenes
Diogenes
November 29, 2017 8:36 am

Very nicely done! The light you speak of was called the organic light by the Gnostics.What about Angra Mainyu(Ahriman)?

Maggie
Maggie
November 29, 2017 8:39 am

Zara… I will read this later after I actually wake. I have a feeling it is better than the George and Gracie filter in place.

Stucky
Stucky
November 29, 2017 8:58 am

” …. without any threats of punishment or promises of reward …”

Aaaaand that’s why the religion never became very popular.

Without everlasting riches, or the threat of eternal suffering, it’s hard to motivate the masses to enlist.

jimmieoakland
jimmieoakland
November 29, 2017 9:41 am

As Wordsworth pointed out, we all have seen the light–as children:
“The earth, and every common sight, To me did seem Apparelled in celestial light, The glory and the freshness of a dream. It is not now as it hath been of yore;– Turn wheresoe’er I I may, By night or day, The things which I have seen I now can see no more.”

Everyone who watches young children at play intuits that they are seeing a world that is lost to adult eyes. And why? Because , “Shades of the prison-house begin to close Upon the growing Boy,” and we lose the ability see the world as it truly is. It is the work of a lifetime to regain that vision, and unfortunately few really do.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  jimmieoakland
November 29, 2017 9:50 am

Right on!

Grog
Grog
  Zarathustra
November 29, 2017 9:57 am

back in the 1980s, GMC and Toyota were working on a joint project.
the idea was to produce a car that would suit the driving tastes of both countries.
they combined the GM Chevette and the Toyota.
It was called the Toylette

Stucky
Stucky
  Grog
November 29, 2017 10:58 am

Volkswagen wanted to combine the best features of their VW CLI (actual car) with the Ford Taurus and named the new vehicle …. Clitoris.

It stunk. But, men couldn’t wait to get in one.

james the deplorable wanderer
james the deplorable wanderer
  Stucky
November 30, 2017 9:12 pm

1970s joke:
The Japanese took 50,000 aluminum cans and beat them into a sort-of shape, put a lawn mower engine in it and rubber baby-buggy wheels on it and called it a car. Then the marketing department hit a snag: what to name it?
They knew their German friends had a way with names. So they put in a call to Munich:
“Ja, Volkswagen here. Was das ist?”
The Japanese explained what they had done, ending up with the need for a name.
“Ja, das gut. When is a new name needed?”
The Japanese were a little behind schedule, it takes time to beat out 50,000 aluminum cans. They needed a new name tomorrow to make the launch date.
“Ach, du lieber! DAT SOON?”

i forget
i forget
  Zarathustra
November 29, 2017 11:05 am

Met a guy who thought it was worthwhile to read the writing on one’s own walls. Had to agree.

Who scribbled all this graffiti on my walls?!!!

First it was significant others…later I internalized all that grafitas as my own, added some bits of embroidery…later still I pulled out stitches & dang if under all that robery wasn’t a penguin! Penguins are funny, much laughter ensued…but if it’s a class action suit, it’s a very small one.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  i forget
November 29, 2017 2:29 pm

All the enlightened ones love to laugh, sitting on a curb and watching penguins of their own.

Grog
Grog
November 29, 2017 9:46 am

I lost interest after there was no “enlightenment” of the
the aureole, or the nimbus.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 9:49 am

Wallace Stevens: ““Death is the mother of beauty. Only the perishable can be beautiful, which is why we are unmoved by artificial flowers.”

Krishnamurti: “Truth is a pathless land.”

Krishnamurti: “Be a light unto yourself.”

Dylan Thomas:
“And honoured among foxes and pheasants by the gay house
Under the new made clouds and happy as the heart was long,
In the sun born over and over,
I ran my heedless ways,
My wishes raced through the house high hay
And nothing I cared, at my sky blue trades, that time allows
In all his tuneful turning so few and such morning songs
Before the children green and golden
Follow him out of grace.

“Nothing I cared, in the lamb white days, that time would
take me
Up to the swallow thronged loft by the shadow of my hand,
In the moon that is always rising,
Nor that riding to sleep
I should hear him fly with the high fields
And wake to the farm forever fled from the childless land.
Oh as I was young and easy in the mercy of his means,
Time held me green and dying
Though I sang in my chains like the sea. ”

All the great philosophers have said one thing in common: “Know thyself.”

All the glorification of the self and its potential achievements are antithetical to what we might think of as “spiritual.” Instead, it is endings that matter. The end of the self, which really is a result of hormones and outside influences. We humans are ambitious for anything and everything and get led off into a wonderland of possibilities by religious leaders of every stripe. Oh, the glory of the light!

Bull. We are here to struggle and to discover what we are. When we see what is, what is changes. Our world is chaos and it is we who create this world with our desires taking all the energy needed to observe what we are. Chase light all you want to, but that is revealing in itself. The self is a construct and is capable of every kind of mischief. Glorify it with religious striving? Folly. And destructive.

Lao Tzu
47
There is no need to run outside
For better seeing,
Nor to peer from a window. Rather abide
At the center of your being;
For the more you leave it, the less you learn.
Search your heart and see
If he is wise who takes each turn:
The way to do is to be.

Diogenes
Diogenes
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 10:40 am

Krishnamurti: “Why does the mind think about sex at all? Why? Why has it become a central issue in your life? When there are so many things calling, demanding your attention, you give complete attention to the thought of sex.. What happens, why are your minds so occupied with it? Because that is the way of ultimate escape, is it not? It is a way of complete self-forgetfulness. For the time being, at least for the moment, you can forget yourself and there is no other way of forgetting yourself. Everything else you do in life gives emphasis to the “me”, to the self. Your business, your religion, your gods, your leaders, your political and economic actions, your escapes, your social activities, your joining one party and rejecting another all that is emphasizing and giving strength to the “me”. That is, there is only this one act in which there is no emphasis on the “me”, so it becomes a problem, does it not?
The First and Last Freedom, pp 228-229

*** WHICH WAS WHY KRISHNAMURTI WAS SECRETLY BANGING HIS FRIENDS WIFE FOR YEARS ***

Stucky
Stucky
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 11:04 am

‘Krishnamurti: “Why does the mind think about sex at all? Why?”

You see, the mere fact that he asks such a question, is why his religion is of no interest to me.

Over a billion fucken people in India …. what he should have said was, “Will you people please stop fucking, fer Krishna’s sake!!”

Diogenes
Diogenes
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 11:21 am

Krishnamurti was a total charlatan. Stucky, didn’t you see my note that he was fucking his friends wife for years.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 12:44 pm

Lies

“Keep moving Dan.
Don’t you listen to him Dan.
He’s the devil not a man.
He spreads the burning sands
With Water.”

Stucky
Stucky
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 2:24 pm

“Here is my secret. I don’t mind what happens.”
—- Krishnamurti

Sounds like ol’ Krishna doesn’t give a fuck.

Hmmmm. Might have to do some further investigation into this dude.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 2:41 pm

“I see!”said the blind man to his deaf brother who was listening to the radio. Nothing more beautiful than an open mind.

Diogenes
Diogenes
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 3:28 pm
EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 10:54 pm

I think she shaves the hoohah. Whoo wee.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 12:48 pm

Krishnamurti spoke against religion in all its forms. He asked questions that one might bring into your mind and answer for yourself in your effort to understand yourself. What you are saying is just gibberish with an effort toward looking real smart and with it. Do you really believe you are not obvious? Do you know the meaning of “fatuous?”

Diogenes
Diogenes
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 1:05 pm

You’re a fucking fool. “Lives in the Shadow With J. Krishnamurti” – Radha Rajagopal Sloss. Read it and weep. Yeah I was suckered by Krishnamurti’s mindfuck when I was about 40 years younger.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 2:01 pm

I’ve read it. Bohm and you believe it. Good for you. But of course having been suckered once you didn’t learn much, did you? Have you considered you might have been suckered by that corrupt little fucker, Rajagopal, who all his life wanted to be the One and couldn’t stand that he was not and Krishnamurti was. But having studied Krishnamurti, you might be expected to have learned something about yourself. But what you learned, evidently, was that you are a sucker and ran with it. Nice job.

Diogenes
Diogenes
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 2:59 pm

Rajagopal didn’t write it, His daughter did, and she has letters from her mother to prove it. Yeah, I learned that Krishnamurti was a spoiled pussy who spouted mindfuck nonsense, but it was entertaining when I was in my early twenties. If my memory serves me, K said that you should never get your ego invested in the guru.

Stucky
Stucky
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 1:46 pm

There roams here a dick named Bigfoot,
Said he, ‘knowest thou that ye art fatuous’?
Said I, ‘sucketh thou my hairy balls’, toots.
SILLY fucker, he whose brain is so gelatinous!

I hope I answered your question.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  Stucky
November 29, 2017 2:19 pm

There once was an angry fella named Stucky.
One day his ass caught on fire from all the heat.
He yelped for help and ran as if at a track meet.
Everyone saw and thought, “what a pussy.”

Anonymous
Anonymous
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 5:19 pm

Bigfoot (21 IQ) proves color is destiny, he obviously has a lower IQ than a Yeti (40 IQ).
The whites win again, dammit!
EC

Maggie
Maggie
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 5:44 pm

There was a big kraut name of Stuck
Who wanted none to give a fuck
when along came a YETI with a dick like spaghetti
who insisted Stuck’s luck truck and duck.

What does this mean? Dunno. Rhymes.

Rdawg
Rdawg
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 8:38 pm

There once was a poster named Maggie,
Whose elderly tits were now saggy,
We’re reminded each day,
In every way,
That her husband, Big Nick, is not faggy.

Maggie
Maggie
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 9:43 pm

Haha… is what I get for limerick slinging without a license.

Rdawg
Rdawg
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 9:53 pm

Whew. I thought you might be pissed. Wimmens is hard to read sometimes.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 10:14 pm

It’s sad to hear you think Maggie is elderly. Me and Stuck are at least a nickle older than her. I guess we’re decrepit.

Rdawg
Rdawg
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 10:25 pm

Chill. It’s just a limerick, and the word choice worked syllabically.

My 11 year old son thinks I am positively ancient at 48.

i forget
i forget
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 11:23 am

I’ll never forget the effects of testosterone replacement therapy.

And thinking has nothing to do with it – even tho rationalizing is the easiest route to narration of the ensued root looking to plant itself, more or less constantly.

Hormones are just like drugs. They are not intellectual. At least not honestly so. Which is wordplay. Rationalizing the root does not call into question the root’s “honesty.” I guess that’s what Thoreau meant. Lol…

Grog
Grog
  i forget
November 29, 2017 1:24 pm

Context is a bitch
n’est pas?

A man missed a Bible question because
he did not know what Deuteronomy was.

Oh, yeah, I’ll help you.

I want you to get Gonzales
and show up Hughes and Costanzo.

They don’t pay me no more,
and I’m mad.

Oh, no!
You dummy.
The answer is lpswich clams.

i forget
i forget
  Grog
November 29, 2017 3:15 pm

If you’re feeling froggy, jump. But if you’re groggy, jump up & down, or just lie down. The whirld’ll still be here, either way, but crumbled cookie fortunes will be deciphered, one way or, possibly, the other.

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 12:40 pm

You know so little, but believe what you are told or read. Why not discover for yourself what is real? Ah, but that is hard. So much easier to spread lies about something you cannot possibly know anything about except second hand. Whereas, the teachings are right there for you to discover whether they are true.

i forget
i forget
  bigfoot was here
November 29, 2017 11:14 am

You gots big feet. Smaller ones’ll have difficulty walking at all, let alone a mile, in your shoes.

Grog
Grog
November 29, 2017 9:50 am

Brighter and Whiter
Loving that idea.
None of the “we was Kangs” shit.

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i forget
i forget
November 29, 2017 10:49 am

“…the symbolism can easily become heady, the imagery intoxicating. Reason begins to lose its foothold here. But to remove such poetic elements at the heart of any philosophy or religion is to rip out its heart and corrupt its truth.”

Just so. And if the desire or goal or compulsion is intoxication, fine. Even continuous intoxication – fine. But heady intoxication alone does not, cannot, traverse all the bases, get you home, or asymptotically thereabouts. All arguments from oracular authority aside.

The only sour note in this series. Character arced from “pessimist”\realist to optimist…aka a trope. The need – compulsion – to speak a narrative explanation, poetically or intellectually, is the usual “happy ending” suspect. Words, soaked in emotion, or soaked in intellect, & resonantly pushing speakers\listeners emotions\intellects buttons, are all too often nets cast over the netsmith himself…then projected, cuz, socialanimalight reflexesparks thru nervous systems, uncritically usually – if it feels good, including good cogitation vibrations, do it – toward the more the merrier, & the “safer.” Tropes that grope pleasantly get picked up, like viruses, in a hand-to-hand combat that is rarely recognized as such. And the 1st rule (after smashing one’s own face) of fight club is….

Nair takes the hair off, narrative glues it back on. I see zz(z) top dudes, dudettes, everywhere.

KeyserSusie
KeyserSusie
  i forget
November 29, 2017 1:16 pm

Coherence speaks with your wise words.

I offer a poem.

Disambiguation

Seek the disambiguation of a waning cause
Is there ever any reason to Love’s pause
Cleave the fatuous plane asunder
Leave answers to those who wonder
Break the jaw of the other kingdom of death
The cat’s paw clutches all, all that is left

bigfoot was here
bigfoot was here
  KeyserSusie
November 29, 2017 2:36 pm

Is this about annihilation of the self?

Diogenes
Diogenes
  KeyserSusie
November 29, 2017 3:01 pm

Should I puke now or later?

KeyserSusie
KeyserSusie
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 5:58 pm

A hollow man has nothing to puke.

diogenes
diogenes
  KeyserSusie
November 29, 2017 7:12 pm

A man full of hot air has nothing to puke.

i forget
i forget
  KeyserSusie
November 29, 2017 3:12 pm

Ah, but disambiguation is the cause 7 du jours a week, isn’t it?

And soup-slurping jurors, scared to quaking of the nazi’s disapproval –no soup for you!– have been made increasingly susceptible to voir dire straights, it seems. Or maybe not. Maybe they’ve always been just as susceptible.

I shave the coherence of co♦hair♠ance – the beard & thee, the king & I – & trip the light fantastic. (For the fun of it. Fun is wise & vice versa.) Seasonally adjusted, of course, just like love’s seasons adjust.

Land that plane before cleaving it – or be sure, hands on, your chutes are packed perfectly enough to break the “free”-fall. (TANSTAAFL…no matter what the merry banksters “packin’ yer chute” would prefer you believe.)
Wonder→answer→wonder→answer→wonder→∞∞

Give the jawing of obsequious obsequies to dead kings – long live ‘em – & king’s filled cemeteries a break. Or a brake.

Cat’s curious paw’s a rabbits foot, until the cusp of 9-10, and maybe it still is, even then.

Play trial & error. (If your kaleidoscope landed on such a wiring configuration, what else are you gonna’ do?)

Play those that would play you voir dire straights of Messina. Even, or esp, if your momma don’t dance & your daddy don’t r&r.

Screw all judges’ instructions…covertly, if possible. (Martyrdom’s masochism in noble robes. Corners are a different story. That’s jaw-breakin’ time.)

Play the cards *and* these cardsharps pretending eyes in the sky. Those are definitely trying to offend thee.

Pluck up the true grit. Like Rooster: in the land of cross-eyed criminals, the one-eyed man with teeth enough to grip the reins can unseat those that would reign on his personal property parade.

Paul
Paul
November 29, 2017 11:48 am

Galatians 1:8:

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse!

Diogenes
Diogenes
  Paul
November 29, 2017 12:37 pm

DICK!

Anonymous
Anonymous
November 29, 2017 2:01 pm

Stuck mentions a bunch of Mexicans; Mags, Fred the Mexican and Grog, Gonzales. This place has been invaded.
EC

Maggie
Maggie
  Anonymous
November 29, 2017 5:47 pm

But not a sign of Alejandro, the Cuban?

BL
BL
  Maggie
November 29, 2017 10:27 pm

Maggie- I found your Alejandro in Tiajuana working a gig at the grocery store. EC and I have determined that he is gay.

I even posted a video of the poor unfortunate, ask EC.

Diogenes
Diogenes
  Zarathustra
November 29, 2017 4:55 pm

Truth! Hey Zara it was a great article even though the comments kinda ran off the rails.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Diogenes
November 29, 2017 6:21 pm

You know why? Stuck summed it up, the gospel of Mazda is meaningless; be good, or don’t.
There is no meaning there, no point at all.
EC

BL
BL
  Zarathustra
November 29, 2017 10:35 pm

Z- You bought a ticket to the world, if you like Mazda that is fine as long as you follow the basic rules. How many times throughout history has there been the story of the deity born on December 25th, died and was reborn three days later. Many times Z so carry on.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
November 29, 2017 11:05 pm
Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
November 30, 2017 2:26 am

Zara, I thought this was quite interesting.
It’s been a long time since I’ve studied the various religions. Is the one in which the priests had to carry a bowl and spoon and beg for food because they couldn’t hurt any plant or animal and, therefore, couldn’t feed themselves? As I said, it’s been a long time, so I could be wrong.

Diogenes
Diogenes
  Vixen Vic
November 30, 2017 8:13 am

I think you are thinking of the Jain religion not Zorostorian.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
  Diogenes
November 30, 2017 9:47 am

I think your right, it’s the Jains. I always wondered how they could walk around without fear of squashing an ant or rolly-polly or lady bug.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
  Zarathustra
November 30, 2017 9:51 am

That’s really quite interesting. I looked it up on the Internet just to get a fast idea about it and plan to read more as soon as I get a chance. I think it’s always good to study different religions, but when your time is limited, it’s hard to follow through unless something like this article brings it back to your attention.

Diogenes
Diogenes
  Zarathustra
November 30, 2017 10:09 am

Wow! I love the tradition of the flame eternally lit.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
November 30, 2017 9:52 am

By the way, there are still Zoroastrians in Iran, aren’t there? This is a very old religion.