@speed

The spent fuel Nuke problem is one I hadn’t ever thought of before Fuk-U-shima.

What I imagine will be done is before the grid goes down completely hopefully all the fuel will be taken to a very dry desert location and left to melt down. This way it should be a long time before the stuff makes it into the water cycle. Of course, any gaseous radionucleides would still percolate out into the atmosphere but hopefully that is not so much as to overly irradiate the food supply.

Another option would be to take the fuel by container ship over the Marianas Trench and drop it. The fuel would be cooled by the ocean, and would of course create a dead zone in its location, but not much really lives down that deep anyhow due to lack of light and lack of oxygen. There are som weird forms of life that live near deep volcanoes though.

Problem with this one is the fuel will gradually dissolve and be dispersed through the ocean, but again hopefully once dispersed this way the additional radiation in the environment doesn’t mess up the food chain too badly.

Only other option would be as long as we have enough energy resource to build real big Booster Rockets, we start firing the stuff off into space on a collision course with the Sun, which is where all the radioactive materials can find a happy home with others of their kind. However, I don’t know how many tons of the stuff we have in spent pools worldwide, and how many rocket boosters it would take to push all the stuff out of Earth Orbit. Then the other problem of a rocket malfunction at some point.

Anyhow, the best option to me seems to be the desert. Saudi Arabia after the last of the Oil has been sucked dry seems like a good location.

RE

One more point I would like to make on the length issue of my posts.

I know most of you went to college, although it seems like the preponderance of people here got their degrees in IT, Engineering, Accounting and Medicine, so perhaps you never had to write a college paper.

Typically you have to write a 10 page paper a week in Contemporary Civilizations, and another one for Humanitie, at least that was what I had to do. So that is 20 pages every week.

Not in words, but how long in pages do my posts run? 4-5 pages usually. My daily rants come out roughly every other day for about 3 per week. So I am writing about 15 pages a week, up it to 25 with the responses I make inside the comments. I’m not writing much more than I did in College.

The length issue of my posting is a total Strawman argument. The style aspect has more validity, since this isn’t generally the style you use for a college paper, but I feel it cconveys my message best so that is how I write it.

RE

@Speed

Indeed, if the economic crash comes rapidly here and we don’t get the Nuke Plants decommissioned before it happens, then we most certainly have many more Fuk-U-shimas possible, and that is a major worry now. Also as you indicate, many toxic waste dumps that are contained by levees which will give way over time, spewing the poisons out all over the place.

Nature will eventually clean up the mess, though the longer half-life radionuceides will persist for quite some time. People probably will get more cancers and die much younger, with large Death Zones surrounding the old Nuke Plants. It would be a wise idea to move as far away from them as you can, and Upstream of them as well.

Based on what happened at Fuk-U-shima and knowing that as soon as the grid goes down these plants are toast, we really should be decommissioning all Nuclear Reactors right NOW and putting all the spent fuel and contaminated piping etc in one pace as far from where anybodyy lives as possible. Antarctica is another good spot to dump it, perhaps it will stay cold enough not to melt through its containers.

Unfortunately, Pro-Nukers aren’t going to allow the necessary immediate decommissioning of ALL Nuke Plants, so down the line here a piece we are going to be in a world of shit, no doubt.

RE

First, thanks to Admin for pushing this FFDR back up on the queue of Recent Posts so we can keep the debate going. There has already been a lot of first class contribution to the thread, so rather than start a new FFDR to cover the Bobby Kennedy Assassination and the 60’s Social Upheaval right now, I felt it would be better to keep the discussion going in this thread for a while longer. Not to say I won’t write another FFDR in the future to cover this period in further detail, I almost certainly will. Lots of great Multimedia to incorporate which I can’t do inside the comments, at least not the Vids.

Also, WARNING here now that I have finished this installment. RFK was the Jumping off point here for this rant, but there isn’t all that much about RFK himself in here, and nothing about the Conspiracy Theories surrounding his assassination for people looking for that stuff. The post turned out to be more about the repercussions of the Assassinations through the society in their aftermath. So now, for those of you still up for another 2400 words, here it comes.

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Howie made the case in his post that essentially the Boomers as a group weren’t tough enough in their attempt at rebellion in the 60s. They “Sold Out” too quickly and easily. He makes the analogy to what is currently going on in Syria and Bahrain, where the Revolutionaries are dying in the Streets by the Truckload at the moment. By contrast, their 60’s counterparts here in the FSofA only had 4 Dead in Ohio along with a few assorted Lynchings of Black folks and some of their White sympathizers down in Old Dixie. So were the FSofA Boomers of the period just not as TOUGH as the current crop of Towel Heads revolting in the M.E.? They Sold Out so quickly and easily! PUSSIES!

My response to that is that the Towel Heads are no tougher, and they will Sell Out just as easily, and even Cheaper than the Boomers Sold Out here if the MONEY is coughed up. The evidence of that is in Saudi Arabia, where the House of Saud has kept their population from going BERSERK by forking over MONEY to the Hoi Polloi, some $30B to keep their bellies full here out of their Oil Wealth. If the Syrians had the Money the Saudis do, they could buy off their population also, just they do not have the MONEY to do that.

Back in the 60s, our Ruling Oligarchy was even RICHER relatively speaking than the House of Saud, and they probably still are. To buy off the Boomers they forked over a HUGE amount of Cash to the impoverished here, in the form of the Great Society Programs. Of course they did not fork over their OWN money, but rather the Tax money of the Middle Class for the most part, but they still did fork over a shitload of money to the folks who ALWAYS are at the forefront of the class warfare Battle Lines, the really Poor folks. Middle Class folks don’t for the most part go out into the Streets and RIOT. Only folks with NOTHING LEFT TO LOSE go out to Riot and get their heads busted and eyes and lungs filled with Tear Gas. The White Kids who went out on the College Campuses weren’t the TRULY POOR for the most part, but they did sympathize with the truly poor and they were not convinced that they were going to do much better than that at the time. Once they WERE convinced of that, this bunch Folded pretty quick and Hippies turned into Yuppies. They Sold Out, clearly. They also will now PAY for Selling Out, dearly. What goes around, comes around, and Eternal Justice cannot be denied.
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Mainly at that time, most of the REALLY poor folks were Black, but there were also lots of young White folks who were pretty poor also without a lot of Opportunity. Those were the folks hitching their way to the Haight in the Summer of Love in 1969. To buy them off, access to a College Education was expanded through Goobermint backed Student Loans, women were convinced through the Women’s Liberation movement to go to Work, and a series of Financial Bubbles were created to provide work opportunities for all these folks. In fact though, real Wealth was not created, we were still LOSING money because to maintain all of this we had become a net a Oil Importer. Gold reserves were draining out as a result, so we soon were forced to go off the Gold Standard under the Rule of the Republican POTUS Tricky Dicky Nixon to continue the Illusion of Wealth creation through ever expanding Debt. This covers the period from 1970 to today.
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Anyhow, it wasn’t all that hard to Buy Off the Young Boomers of the era , but its not really that hard to buy off ANYBODY, if you have the MONEY to do it with. The Saudis do have the money, at least for right now they do long as they still have Oil to export and somebody to buy it with money that works to buy anything.

Now, when I said in my previous post that the Boomers were CRUSHED by the Assassination of Bobby Kennedy, it’s certainly not the same type of CRUSHING going on right now inside Syria. There wasn’t Blood in the Streets EVERYWHERE, just in a few Select Locations. One of those Locations was Vietnam, where in fact poor Boomers were dying by the Truckload at the time. What all the rest of the Younger Boomers not quite old enough to be Cannon Fodder got to SEE on the Nightly Newz were all the Riots in Watts and Chicago and all the mayhem going on in Vietnam. Many of said Child Boomers, even Black 11 YO boys in CA and White 11 YO Boys in NYC (I realized when you put the date of June 5th up that I also was 11 at the time, not 12. We are EXACTLY the same Age Howie! I am August baby, what about you?) pinned their HOPES on Bobby Kennedy. He represented something to us, he was a SYMBOL of a change we were hoping for. Of course, all the Kennedy boys had their Flaws, as did MLK, but to 11 YO boys those flaws weren’t known or apparent at the time. When these two symbols got gunned down in 1968, something just as important as life itself got crushed. HOPE got crushed.
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In the ensuing period, with the Great Society programs taking effect, the Black folks in the inner cities quieted down and stopped rioting. Young white folks took out the new Guaranteed Student Loans to go to College, Black kids with lower grades and SAT scores got into good Universities and Law and Med Skules ahead of more qualified White kids through Affirmative Action. I KNOW this was true, I LIVED through that time, and I had a few White friends a little closer to the center of the SAT Bell Curve who did not make the cut because they were competing with lower qualified Black kids who jumped the line through Affirmative Action.

Anyhow, all of them, the Affirmative Action beneficiaries, the Blacks and Hispanics and Native Americans and Women, they all went out to Work in the new Jobs being created by the Financial Bubbles. Just to keep the same standard of living the Silents enjoyed, it now took both parents to accomplish, but at least there was Opportunity out there and the Media pushed the consumer culture and glorified the Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous. The MYTH that everyone could and would become RICH participating in this culture was sold to them every night, and everyone wanted a piece of that pie. A few people did get it, as a few always do when there is a large pool of money circulating and some of them figure out ways to get a lot of it moving in their direction. But of course, every Dollar that centralizes into the hands of one Rich person has to come at the expense of a Dollar that came out of the pocket of a Poor person who did not figure out how to get the money moving his way. So most people in even a Fixed Pool of Wealth start getting poorer, while a few people start getting Richer. Thing is here, this wasn’t a Fixed Pool of REAL Wealth, the real wealth of Available Energy was actually shrinking while the Pool of Dollars was growing due to Debt, with 2 results. Result 1, persistent Inflation through the time period devaluing the Dollars. Result 2, debt burden taking what wealth there was and sieving it toward those who issued the debt. The more debt money you could issue and get some Sucker to take on, the more you could attach via interest on the money you issue. So of course at the very top end of the Ponzi, the Rich got ever Richer through the time period, while the poor got ever poorer. All done on the backs of GUESS WHO? Yes, you guessed it, the Boomers.

For the last 40 years, the vast majority of Boomers who were Middle Class and not Rich have been REPEATEDLY RAPED, with both parents working just to trying to tread water in the shrinking pie of real wealth. The consequences to the families were increasing Divorce rates and Latchkey kids, with the State expanding the Warehousing of children in Schools into increasing Day Care at the youngest ages, and longer time in Community Colleges at the far end, while everyone is STILL being Sold on the idea we can all be RICH. Of course, for everyone to BE Rich, TONS of new Debt money had to be issued, and SOMEBODY had to be the SUCKER to take on that debt. The SUCKER was CLUELESS J6P, who took on the Debt in two ways, in Consumer level Credit of CCs and HELOCs, and in Goobermint Debt he would have to pay through Taxation. No Coinkidink here that as we moved into the 90s we got the Ad Campaign, “For everything you WANT but CANNOT afford, there is VISA!” The Sheeple HAD to be pushed into taking on more Debt, and since MOST people are IDIOTS, this was just not that hard to do. Yes, MOST Boomers are incredibly stupid people, but that is just because most PEOPLE are stupid people, of ANY generation. GenXers are no smarter than Boomers, WTF do you think have been signing most of the LIAR Mortgages since 2000? Not Boomers, they took out their mortgages back in the 80s and 90s. WTF do you think ran up their CCs to buy the Beemers and the Plasma TVs? GenXers. Millenials are so fucking Smart they turned themselves into Human Pincushions and spent their whole childhood playing Nintendo. Real Bright Bulbs there.
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Anyhow, this Bizness of trying to Pin the Blame on a particular Generation of Idiots is itself Idiotic. I don’t REALLY think Silents are to Blame, I just wrote that post that way to make a point. If you want to Place Blame correctly, you have to look at Cui Bono. Who BENEFITTED most from all this, and who had sufficient control to keep the wealth moving in their direction even as the absolute wealth of the society kept decreasing? You guessed this one ALSO, the Illuminati. As long as this huge pool of energy wealth was available to push around, virtually ANYTHING was possible, Bubbles of Financial Wealth could be blown anywhere. People with big enough piles of money can move whole markets in whatsoever direction they like, this is how it went in the 1920s, I put up a vid of that in a recent FFDR, if any of you watched it. However, when the malinvestment finally does crap out, SOMEODY gets left holding the Bag, and generally speaking to date its NOT the Illuminati, its J6P and his Goobermint that Socializes the Loss, while the Pigmen keep their Profits. Sadly though for the Illuminati, the Pool of REAL wealth has now SHRUNK to the point that they have to start Cannibalizing each OTHER to stay at the top of the Ponzi. Because for the most part, J6P has nothing left of value to TAX anymore, and the Property he “owns” has gone worthless. Nay, it is a LIABILITY to own Property now for J6P, it just burdens you with more Taxation and you have to buy energy to feed that McMansion and keep all its systems maintained and running.

So J6P here is going BROKE first, but in reality the whole fucking PLANET is going Broke, or in reality is ALREADY Broke. That INCLUDES the Illuminati, who now only maintain the ILLUSION of their wealth through accounting tricks of Mark to Make Believe. This mirage will evaporate here in due time, and when it does everything we have ever known to be true will Come to Glory. Truly I believe that the Book of Revelation understates the case of what will be coming down the pipe here when this Civilization Collapses. In Biblical times, only 25% of the population went to Glory in a Civilization Collapse. Right now, nothing short of 90% reduction looks likely to work, and 99.9% isn’t outta da question here either. We will have to do a rewrite of the Book of Revelation.
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RE

“I seriously hope ‘they’ have a plan but it is looking more and more like a clusterfuck from where I sit.”-SZ

I’ll go with the Clusterfuck Hypothesis. I think they had a Plan for the upside which worked very well, but other than some well stocked Bunkers for the downside I do not think there is any plan at all. At least not a Plan that will work

That Apocalypse Artwork of Washington seems about guaranteed now. Too many fragile systems in place all dependent on cheap portable energy to function. They may take a decade or even two to crash commpletely, but crash they will. Unless we very quickly get the political will to start decommissioning the Nukes and putting all that POISON somewhere it will do the least damage when the grid goes down, we are going to have Fuk-U-Shimas everywhere. If Dry Cask Storage in Yuucca Mountain is the best we can do, we have to do it NOW. Shut down the Nukes, take a year to cool the last of the spent fuel enough too put it in casks and BURY it far far away. If we don”t, every spot within 50 miles of a current Nuke is most certainly going to be a Death Zone.

Oppenheimer was VERY VERY RIGHT. “I am Become DEATH, the Destroyer of Worlds.”

RE