The Energy Of Religion

Guest Post by The Zman

The other day, I caught a little of Jim Goad on Luke Ford’s podcast. I did not stick around long, as Goad went into a childish rant about religion. It was a bit embarrassing to see a middle-aged man carry on like a toddler demanding his binky. Then again, the sum total of atheism is a childish rant, demanding someone else explain the mysteries of religion to the satisfaction of an atheist. “Tell me how a loving God would let bad things happen to good people” is the typical rant. It is a question that can never be answered to their satisfaction.

Atheism is a good example of a negative identity. If Christianity did not exists. atheists would have to invent it so they could rail against it. You’ll never hear an atheists talk about the majesty or beauty of atheism. In fact, they never talk about it at all. Instead, it is endless complaining about religion, especially Christianity. The atheist defines himself entirely by his opposition to religion. It’s why they almost always inform you they are an atheist within five minutes of meeting them. They are like vegans in that way.

Atheism is nutty on two fronts. One is the core irrationality of it. The existence of God, gods or some supernatural force that animates the universe is unknowable. The big religions get that, which is why it is at the core of those faiths. For that matter, what we understand to be the universe could just be a kid’s science experiment in another dimension. Our world exists in a terrarium on the desk of some kid in the lizard people dimension. These are things we cannot know. That is the nature of faith.

This is where a “bible believing Christian” tells me I’m wrong. They know God exists because of something they read somewhere in their bible. Well, you don’t know that and saying you do puts you outside Christianity. The Catholic Church had a word for people who went around saying they knew things about God. They called them heretics and burned them at the stake. You can believe in God, you can believe he plays a hand in man’s affairs. You can believe anything, but you can only know what is knowable.

Belief is one of modern man’s oldest traits. It is assumed it co-evolved with language, for the simple reason both involve abstract thinking. The future condition tense, for example is about something that might happen in the future. This is not something that is real, that you see and touch. it is something you imagine. To express that, to even think it, you need language that can contain the idea. That is what language is, after all. It is a container to hold ideas and concepts that you can transmit to other humans, across time and place.

Belief works the same way, even simple beliefs that existed with primitive early man. To imagine a spirit force that animates the wind or the tides requires the ability to imagine that which cannot be seen or touched. Conjuring a spirit force as the explanation for the tides requires the ability to infer things from observation. This belief becomes a container to hold this idea. The stories that came to surround the existence of the spirit force are also containers, to make it easy to transmit this abstract idea to others over time and place.

As humans settled, their observations about nature mixed with their own ability to alter nature. The first breeding of dogs, for example, surely changed how people thought of animals and their fundamental nature. Throw in the complexity of human relations that arises from settled life and it is no surprise that belief became more complex. Those containers had to hold more complex abstract ideas, so simple beliefs based in nature were replaced with complex religious systems that could encompass complex ideas.

Put another way, just as our complex communications systems are part of what defines us as modern humans, our complex belief structures define us as modern humans. Belief, especially in the form of mature religious systems like Catholicism and its offshoots, is an incredibly efficient way of preserving and transmitting human experience and inferred knowledge. The Christian Bible contains vast stores of knowledge about human relations, just about everything one would ever need to know about human society.

A good way to think of this is to consider the gas tank in your car. It is for holding gasoline, which is the most amazing energy containing system we possess. Vast amounts of energy are contained in small quantities. That energy is so easily released, it requires only a small spark, yet it is so stable and safe, we lug vast amounts of it around at high speed on our highways. To top it off, it is relatively cheap. A thousand generations of human technological advance resides in that gas tank, powering your car down the road.

That’s why it has proven impossible to replace. By now, the West has probably invested close to a trillion dollars trying to come up with a replacement for gasoline and the equally amazing internal combustion engine. International huckster Elon Musk has driven himself to madness trying to build electric cars. Yet, we are no more closer to replacing the internal combustion engine than fifty years ago. Like solar power and renewable energy, the world of the electric cars remains an avatar that is always over the next hill.

Religion, and for the West that means some iteration of Christianity, is the gasoline and internal combustion engine of our culture. The long war on religion is not much different than the war on oil. The one difference is that unlike with cars, we did not wait for a replacement before junking the old technology. Instead, the West abandoned what worked for the fantasy of something better. We keep trying to make civic religion the replacement, but like Elon Musk, we are being driven mad trying to make it work.

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22winmag - when you ask certain persons which floor they'd like, and they respond with "ladies lingerie"- they're referencing the AEROSMITH SONG!!!
22winmag - when you ask certain persons which floor they'd like, and they respond with "ladies lingerie"- they're referencing the AEROSMITH SONG!!!
July 23, 2018 8:54 am

Funny how the “energy of religion” always seems get expended on the battlefield.

Call me both a God fearing Athiest and staunch anti-Humanist.

I have about much use for religion as I do for humanism… none.

Ham Roid
Ham Roid
July 23, 2018 9:04 am

Funny how when a society truly follows biblical principals they appear to prosper. And when they don’t they ultimately end up in the crapper.

Yeah. There’s obviously nothing to this Christianity malarkey.

Anonymous
Anonymous
July 23, 2018 9:19 am

“Tell me how a loving God would let bad things happen to good people”

Most of those using that argument consider themselves “good people”.

As did those preparing to stone the woman to death for adultery before Jesus pointed out otherwise.

FWIW, the only religion the atheists seem to have any problem with is Christianity, everything else (especially Islam) seems to get a pass.

jimmieoakland
jimmieoakland
  Anonymous
July 23, 2018 10:31 am

Yes, “good people” who are blind to the implications of their argument. People know that this is a world of suffering and grief, and inevitable death, and yet choose to bring children into it. How can any person claim to be a “loving” parent? They’ve created life knowing it will suffer.

Iska Waran
Iska Waran
July 23, 2018 9:26 am

While I was reading this, the page had to be reloaded three times. Demons.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Iska Waran
July 23, 2018 11:12 am

Me too, on the laptop at home.
“Aw, snap!” keeps popping up.
Gremlins? Or something to do with Settings, or browsers like DDG and Start page, which claim privacy, but have ties to Gargle? Hmmmm….

Jack Lovett
Jack Lovett
July 23, 2018 9:31 am

I have long wondered who wrote the bible. It is my belife that a loving GOD would never make a comment that he has a “chosen” people and that it would be that warmonger country of Israel led by Satanyahoo. No, I cannot buy that. A parent with several children would never say, Oh jonny, he is our favorite. The other children would be devastated. Begs the question, who wrote the bible?

Wip
Wip
  Jack Lovett
July 23, 2018 9:59 am

The Jews wrote the bible.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Wip
July 23, 2018 1:31 pm

The Jews are the tribe of Judah, there were twelve tribes of Israelite’s. Moses and Abraham both preceded them and were not even actual Israelite’s who were the descendants of Jacob who was one of Abraham’s sons.

Much of the Bible was written by non Jewish people.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Wip
July 24, 2018 10:52 am

2 Peter 1:21… “For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.”

God wrote the Bible. He moved the mouths and pens of men to record the words He wanted recorded. To believe anything else is to diminish Him that cannot be diminished. Imagine an all powerful God not being able to write a book that His creatures might know His thoughts. The concept would be laughable if it were not so serious an issue of unbelief amongst Christians, and I use that term very loosely. To believe the Bible is a collection of the thoughts of men is to render it meaningless. If God is not the Author, throw it away.

Jackson
Jackson
  grace country pastor
July 24, 2018 12:54 pm

But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
1 Corinthians 2:14

And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
John 20: 28-29

Thank God for the Bible.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Jackson
July 24, 2018 1:34 pm

Amen Jackson… Now I understand it, I’d be totally lost without it.

diogenes
diogenes
  grace country pastor
July 24, 2018 1:49 pm

IF “God” wrote the bible, it means he created many men who were a hell of a lot better writers than him/her/it. Haruki Murakami and Tolkien just to name two.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
  grace country pastor
July 25, 2018 1:02 am

It’s nice to see a pastor on this site for these religious-themed articles.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
  Wip
July 25, 2018 12:54 am

Hebrews wrote the Bible.

Edit: Hebrews moved by God.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Jack Lovett
July 24, 2018 11:08 am

“It is my belife that a loving GOD would never make a comment that he has a “chosen” people and that it would be that warmonger country of Israel led by Satanyahoo.”

What does your belief have to do with reality as it is Jack? If I believed that the sky was green would that make it so?

Do you have any idea WHY God called out the nation Israel? For what purpose did God form the nation in the first place?

(Those occupying the land that is called Israel today are not the Israel of God. I agree that they are the nation of satan, the god of this world.)

RiNS
RiNS
July 23, 2018 9:58 am

This scrit is hilarious..

The atheist defines himself entirely by his opposition to religion. It’s why they almost always inform you they are an atheist within five minutes of meeting them. They are like vegans in that way.

And that is different from the Thumpers extolling their Lawd and Saverer how…

Hypocrité muchly Zed-man..

You piss and moan about Goad going into a childish rant about religion then do exactly the same fucken thing when taking aboot the Atheists. After viewing both you have to wonder who are the poor lost souls.

But Come On Man!

All that can be said is Wow. Gotta say that it takes big nuts for you to climb on top of that manure pile and commence to throwing moar turds…

Anyways all that said and it still deserves an E for effort!

I will save you a seat and a beer or two in Valhalla. It is the least I can do for a friend…

skål from a fellow believer,

with blessed grace of Odin,

RiNS

[imgcomment image[/img]

Hollywood Rob
Hollywood Rob
  RiNS
July 23, 2018 11:13 am

Yeah, you tell him Odin son. His paltry little religion wasn’t even threatened. Z, you know I have appreciated your writing many times in the past. Unfortunately you have stepped off into the deep end of the drooler pool with this one. I am not saying you should stop writing, just don’t write when you are drunk. (That’s a joke son.) We all write when we are drunk.

Mary Christine
Mary Christine
  Hollywood Rob
July 23, 2018 1:51 pm

Nearly everything I have done while drunk has gotten me into a heap o trouble.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
  Mary Christine
July 24, 2018 12:24 am

LOL. Me, too.

Mary Christine
Mary Christine
  RiNS
July 23, 2018 1:53 pm

Nice looking god ya got there, RiNS. I don’t know what mine looks like.

Hollywood Rob
Hollywood Rob
  Mary Christine
July 23, 2018 2:23 pm

Oh yes you do.

Dutchman
Dutchman
July 23, 2018 10:03 am

@ Jack: I have long wondered who wrote the bible.

I can tell you – people from 2,000 years ago. Obviously, they had no idea about science, medicine, mathematics. They had no idea why things happened – thus ‘God’ must be the reason. It’s a book written by uneducated, superstitious people. Now the Pope (HPIC – Head Pedopile In Charge) will tell you that it was divinely inspired, and God told the people what to write – in a dream. Good luck believing that one.

However, just because you’re an atheist, doesn’t mean you’re an asshole, who protests religion. For me it’s live, and let live. I don’t even want the debate with the ‘believers’.

There is an asshole atheist group in Wisconsin: FFR – the Freedom From Religion organization. They give atheists a bad name.

Ham Roid
Ham Roid
  Dutchman
July 23, 2018 12:44 pm

You claim that because they couldn’t shoot a rocket into space that they were ignorant compared to you.

I can assure you that as swordsmiths of the past were far more skilled than those of the present, so were purveyors of common sense.

Personally, I read the Bible myself because I wanted to have an intelligent argument against what I saw as religious blowhards. Today, after continued study of the Book, I find myself arguing against the likes of you.

Read it. Then tell me how dumb it is. Until then, I might as well discuss gender identity with a Democrat.

Dutchman
Dutchman
  Ham Roid
July 23, 2018 2:21 pm

I’m not arguing. I was just giving an opinion.

Isn’t it odd that all these religious books / teachings are 1000’s of years old? People writing the ‘voice of god’, being visited by angles, virgin births, people being resurrected from the dead – it all happened a long time ago – but it doesn’t happen today – it all happened in the past.

However today, I’ve been told it’s possible to have a virgin birth. 🙂

Today, if you claim to hear the voice of god – you’re diagnosed as schizophrenic.

Ham Roid
Ham Roid
  Dutchman
July 23, 2018 5:25 pm

Miracles happen every day. They don’t all end up in the New York Times.

Rdawg
Rdawg
  Ham Roid
July 24, 2018 12:33 am

“Miracles happen every day.”

No, they don’t. Shit happens every day. Some of it “bad”, some of it “good”, some of it neutral.

Ham Roid
Ham Roid
  Rdawg
July 24, 2018 12:30 pm

Can I offer you a tissue?

Rdawg
Rdawg
  Ham Roid
July 25, 2018 1:03 am

No thanks.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Dutchman
July 24, 2018 11:00 am

“Isn’t it odd that all these religious books / teachings are 1000’s of years old? People writing the ‘voice of god’, being visited by angles, virgin births, people being resurrected from the dead – it all happened a long time ago – but it doesn’t happen today – it all happened in the past. ”

There is an extremely good and perfectly logical reason why these things happened in the past and why you do not see them happening today. If I thought you were even remotely interested I’d gladly explain it to you. Here’s a hint…

Bible Chart

Stucky
Stucky
  grace country pastor
July 24, 2018 11:30 am

From the “here’s a hint” link above.

Yup. Makes perfect sense to me!

[imgcomment image?w=676&h=478[/img]

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Stucky
July 24, 2018 12:09 pm

If you examine it thoughtfully, it might.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Dutchman
July 23, 2018 1:40 pm

The Bible is much older than just 2,000 years. In fact, most all of it was written prior to that with 39 of its books written 400 or more years prior to that (the common Protestant Bible which is the only one most people think of as the Bible).

jhpace1
jhpace1
July 23, 2018 10:11 am

This article is unbelievably ignorant. As if each person on the planet has the right to demand of God “Prove yourself to me.” Read the book of Job! The Judeo-Christian Bible is from the Judean Torah and the prophets of God, a chosen people, yes, there are even allegories made by God about choosing Israel and the disappointment that resulted!

But it’s not about just the Jews. It’s about correcting the sin of Adam and Eve in the beginning throughout history to the birth and sacrifice of Jesus Christ two thousand years ago. If you don’t believe the Holy Bible, even after reading it from cover to cover, then that is on you, not God. (Romans chapter 1) Salvation is a free gift, but even God has said there will be people who will never believe, even if someone was raised from the dead to talk to them about God. Every other “religion” on Earth requires salvation by works, but Christianity has salvation free for those who repent of their sins.

As for the common cry of “A loving God wouldn’t allow _____ to happen.”, when something evil happens it is not God but man doing it. A person murders another and you’re going to blame God? Blame the murderer!

Judaism become corrupted by the priests, by the tearing away of 10 tribes from Israel to make their own Israel (because of taxes at the time), and the Babylonian Exile created the Talmud, which is not the Torah and the words of the prophets of God. (For those who don’t believe a book can be handed down generation after generation and use the “phone game” to show it, let me ask them: what if someone told each person in the chain up to a certain point the same phrase? Then there would be no discrepancy. Until God stopped talking to each person in the chain. And there were enough copies to correct each other – distributed ledger!)

But Jesus came to fulfill the Law and present a new Covenant/Testament, grace instead of Law, and heartfelt change instead of what had degenerated into ritual. Naturally, we have degeneration again today, with organized Christianity degrading into mere ritual, as with the Catholic Church.

As for gasoline, the author clearly has not followed the writings of Nikola Tesla (1856–1943), free energy, technology that was halted, suppressed, naysayed at every turn, every day, locking us in a “no free lunch” box that is a lie and a trap. The same with many disruptive inventions that would change the status quo.

But as Jesus Christ is one day coming back, so will all these suppressed technologies be revealed one day, and those in power will be shown as the evil that they are.

Dutchman
Dutchman
  jhpace1
July 23, 2018 10:28 am

Jesus is commin! Look busy!

jhpace1 is a prime example of fervent religious belief: A circular thought where you read the Bible, and it supports you in believing it. In science it’s called a ‘self defining term’.
And with your belief you impose others ‘read the bible’. This is a common argument with some religious people – How do you know what is in the Bible if you haven’t read it? That’s like a queer saying: How do you know you wouldn’t like it – no thanks I’m not going to try it.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Dutchman
July 24, 2018 11:24 am

Dutchman… this is just staggering. Circular thought/logic? Did you actually just say and mean… “How do you know what is in the Bible if you haven’t read it?”

Let me ask, how do you know the sky is blue? Did you just “look at it” or did someone tell you it was blue and you believed them?

Do you think the Bible is “stupid” because other people tell you it is?

No way to go through life man… but hey, you do your thing and I’ll do mine.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
  jhpace1
July 24, 2018 12:36 am

jhpace1, which I could give you more than 1 thumbs up.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  jhpace1
July 24, 2018 11:26 am

@ jhpace1

Excellent brother.

Take it a step deeper…

Are Believers Today New Testament Christians?

grace and peace…

TampaRed
TampaRed
July 23, 2018 10:46 am

off topic but since he mentioned elon musk & tesla i’ll put it here–
tesla is so desperate for cash that they are asking suppliers who have already been paid,some as far back as 2016,to rebate part of their invoices back to tesla–very short article–

http://www.investmentwatchblog.com/desperate-tesla-asks-suppliers-for-cash-back-retroactively-to-2016/

Dutchman
Dutchman
  TampaRed
July 23, 2018 10:51 am

I believe these Tesla cars may be the new Delorean. If his car making operation goes under – people will be stuck with $100,000 white elephants, with no support.

Vixen Vic
Vixen Vic
  Dutchman
July 24, 2018 12:39 am

Do you mean the Edsel?

Dutchman
Dutchman
  Vixen Vic
July 24, 2018 9:38 am

Well at least the Edsel owners had Ford behind them. The Tesla owners are S.O.L.

Stucky
Stucky
  TampaRed
July 23, 2018 1:27 pm

Elon Musk offered some kind of submarine gizmo of his to help rescue those kids on Thailand.

It was pretty obviously a publicity stunt to get his name out there … and someone from the rescue team said so.

Then Elon called that person a “pedo”. Really. He called some rescue dude a pedo because of the submarine.

This was written up in the Sunday NY Post. The article just absolutely nailed Elon. How this latest incident — in a long line if bizzarro world incidents — just proves what an incoherent evil swindling loser this guy Musk is.

I think starfcker should sell his Tesla stock, pronto.

John 3:8
John 3:8
July 23, 2018 11:29 am

The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear the sound of it, but cannot tell where it comes from and where it goes. So is everyone who is born of the Spirit.

Robert H Siddell Jr
Robert H Siddell Jr
July 23, 2018 11:49 am

Z machine-guns enough unsubstantiated and false statements to make a thinking person’s head spin. The Trinity is real not because the New Testament says so but because it is so. It is as real as the nose on your face. I was an scientific agnostic sinner (and part Jew) but several Supernatural Events and a trip to the bottom of my barrel after being divorced woke me up. Now I am convinced and no amount of doubters can dissuade me. Yes, Jewish Mythmaticians wrote the Old Testament Tanakh but some verses are by the inspiration of God (Is 53, Zech13:6). Man has created many Philosophies (some by the inspiration of the Devil like Islam); but there is only one Religion created by the inspiration of God, Christianity, even though almost every Denomination has become a Christian Cult (Catholic, Mormon, Jehovah’s Witnesses, etc). Draw close to God, and He will draw close to you (James 4:8). Behold, I stand at the door and knock.. (Rev 3:20). I am with you always (Matt 28:20).

Dutchman
Dutchman
  Robert H Siddell Jr
July 23, 2018 12:06 pm

Well here it is, I was waiting for this doozy: there is only one Religion created by the inspiration of God, Christianity

All those other folks are wrong – because the bible says so.

Rdawg
Rdawg
  Robert H Siddell Jr
July 24, 2018 12:35 am

So…you’re not part Jew anymore?

Did the invisible oil wash all the Jew off you?

Robert H Siddell Jr
Robert H Siddell Jr
  Rdawg
July 24, 2018 12:58 am

I have no other info about the “oil”, but my Jewish “part” won’t change any more than an other person’s genetics change short of mutations etc. Let me repeat myself, there are good and bad Jews just like every race. Have a blessed day.

grace country pastor
grace country pastor
  Robert H Siddell Jr
July 24, 2018 11:45 am

@ Robert…

“Yes, Jewish Mythmaticians wrote the Old Testament Tanakh but some verses are by the inspiration of God (Is 53, Zech13:6).”

Careful. Who gets to pick and choose which verses are of God and which are not?

“…but there is only one Religion created by the inspiration of God, Christianity…”

Not true. The only religion God ever imposed upon man was Judaism (the law) and that because of transgressions and unbelief in a far more simple message. Israel existed for centuries before the law was given.

Gal 3:19… “Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.”

Bible Christianity is the 100% pure absence of religion.

Eph 2:8-9… “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”

“…even though almost every Denomination has become a Christian Cult…”

Agreed. Which one is not a cult and why? The three verses you chose to include (James, Rev. and Mat.) are all written by God directly to the nation Israel for a specific purpose. Understanding why this is answers the cult question.

subwo
subwo
July 23, 2018 12:02 pm

I just watched Max Igan’s Piecing together the past at his thecrowhouse youtube site. It was just published on the 20th and gives and interesting take on what Islam and Christianity are what once shared prior to what they are day. The languages of the new world peoples all share the root Hungarian tongue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJGJzl_-B8c&t=556s

Fleabaggs
Fleabaggs
July 23, 2018 12:10 pm

God does not need my permission to be or do whatever he wants.
My own Atheism was born of resentment and conceit.
I don’t demand that anyone should believe in Christ but I’m also not in charge thank God.

JR Wirth
JR Wirth
  Fleabaggs
July 23, 2018 1:48 pm

If you think you’re in the driver seat you will always hate God. Once you accept that he’s sovereign and does what he wants, you’re ahead of 90% of the population.

Mary Christine
Mary Christine
  Fleabaggs
July 23, 2018 1:58 pm

God doesn’t demand we believe, therefore, we should not demand of others.

I always hated it when people preached to me when I was an unbeliever and I refuse to preach to others. If someone really wants to know more, I will offer to help them.

None Ya Biz
None Ya Biz
  Mary Christine
July 24, 2018 11:13 am

My two cents. There is a creator. Science can state the universe began with a big bang and I will reply, “What/who caused it?”. For every instance, I do that.

However, is the creator a micro manager? Seems to me, with a universe as vast as it is, he would have more to do than hang around earth to watch what humans do here.

Now I do believe that the creator is an experimenter. He is a creator after all. He would just be busy somewhere else creating life to see how the experiment turned out.

I have read that time for the creator is so vast that the entirety of the human existence is merely a blink of the eye in time. Maybe he will return and see what the human race did or didn’t do. I don’t know. I think he might be glad the human race didn’t destroy itself. If the human race did, then I think he might be sad it did but would go about his/its business.

Until someone can tell me how all existence came into being, I will put my trust and belief in a creator of all things.

Saint RiNS the Benevolent, Son of Odin
Saint RiNS the Benevolent, Son of Odin
  None Ya Biz
July 24, 2018 2:52 pm

Ok Nunya Biz I’ll play.

Prove there was a beginning..

Soup
Soup
  Fleabaggs
July 25, 2018 5:16 pm

Fleabaggs

Why are you thanking God when you don’t believe in Him?

DRUD
DRUD
July 23, 2018 2:43 pm

It’s a good piece, Zman, and as such widely misunderstood and misinterpreted.

Every time I have heard people “debate” topics like these, they fuck it up from jump.

I have said time and again, how “God” and “Religion” and “Faith” are RADICALLY different concepts that get conflated willy-nilly and render debate useless. If there is God, a Creator, a Grand Designer of Everything That Is, His existence is not eliminated by our lack of belief and if there is not such, His is not brought into being by our belief, no matter how fervent.

Religion, all religion, is very clearly man-made, it did not exist before mankind and cannot exist without mankind. This does not make all of them false, necessarily, and renders none of them valueless, but it is a vital logical distinction. Conflating the concept of God with that of Religion is present in EVERY SINGLE argument I hear from both fucking sides!
Faith is a individual choice–a continuous choosing, based on nothing and everything–to say that Yes, there is purpose to this Life (Wallace’s water we are all continuously immersed in, but scarecely even aware of) something that renders it full of meaning. What power, majesty and beauty is available to we sentient meat-sacks, and yet we stumble around like kids in the schoolyard screaming “My God can beat up your God!” or even sillier “There is no God…you’re stupid!”

We don’t know, we can’t know, but we can contemplate, we can wonder, we can stare in awe at this silly little, unimaginable immense, deeply textured thing called Life.

Dutchman
Dutchman
  DRUD
July 23, 2018 3:00 pm

Good analysis.

Montefrío
Montefrío
July 23, 2018 2:48 pm

I’m an agnostic for the simple reason I’m not omniscient, but to the best of my knowledge, neither is anyone else. I’m disinclined to believe there is a “Supreme Being” with an individuated identity and will, but that’s no guarantee there’s not. My own belief in what transcends the material is most closely approximated by Zen, a way of living linked to a not-highly-articulated philosophy that largely coincides with Taoism. That notwithstanding, I favor Christianity as a public religion that binds Europeans together and has an ethical, moral and general societal code I believe to be the best yet developed; I’m with Mr. Z on that one. If materialist atheism or “civic religion” displaces the Western Christian tradition, as the secular materialists work tirelessly to do, I fear greatly for my grandchildren and descendants I’ll never know. If one’s deepest belief system is that we are all merely flesh lumps responding to pleasure/pain stimuli, that belief will almost certainly guarantee that it comes true, but more the latter stimulus than the former.

Peaknic
Peaknic
July 23, 2018 5:58 pm

Sorry, but while there is a group of people who are both atheists and liberal extremists who want to outlaw anything that offends them (e.g., guns, drugs, motorized vehicles, etc), they are not the same.

Atheists are rationalists. We want some empirical data to support a theory, or else we can’t buy into it.

As one, I could give a crap how others (family members included) want to spend their time. I choose to get stuff done or actually have a day of REST rather than waste half my weekend talking and singing to someone who is likely not listening, if he exists at all.

I can’t act like circular logic is valid, but if delusional people want to believe in fairy tales, I’m not going to rub it in their face. It makes life harder for ME. Like Ron White said, “You can’t fix stupid”.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  Peaknic
July 23, 2018 6:01 pm

Oh, and Agnostics are just Atheists who are trying to play nice with religious fanatics. I used to play that game, too. Stop hedging.

KeyserSusie
KeyserSusie
July 23, 2018 6:33 pm

Religion: a decipherable cause describing an indecipherable cause embedded in the world, physical and mental.

MarshRabbit
MarshRabbit
July 23, 2018 8:37 pm

“God said, Let there be light: and there was a big bang”
Genesis 1:3

MarshRabbit
MarshRabbit
July 23, 2018 8:42 pm

so what does an atheist say when someone sneezes?

Rdawg
Rdawg
  MarshRabbit
July 24, 2018 12:37 am

Some things are culturally ingrained.

Stucky
Stucky
  MarshRabbit
July 24, 2018 11:30 am

“You’re soooo good looking.”

(Seinfeld episode)

MarshRabbit
MarshRabbit
July 23, 2018 8:46 pm

Question: “Why doesn’t God do something about poverty/injustice/etc?”
Answer: “he did; he sent you!”

Darrell Dullnig
Darrell Dullnig
July 23, 2018 8:52 pm

Note to Admin: please consider not ever running articles dealing even remotely with theological issues. I have read two offerings in as many days, and the commentary, not to mention the articles themselves reflect poorly on the site. It would be laughable if it was not so pitifully painful to read grade school level analysis of a subject that defies any coherent concept of the subject among Homo sapiens, let alone any real understanding of its implications. It would be okay to dabble in it for fun, but western civilization is falling apart right now, and we would all be better off trying to decide whether or not GGG is playing a tactical game of chess, and which side of the board he is on rather than diving into a very deep philosophical pool in which these players make the blind men trying to describe an elephant look like geniuses.

Rdawg
Rdawg
  Darrell Dullnig
July 24, 2018 12:39 am

Darrell Dullard: fuck you. You want to push your own content, get your own site. You don’t want to read about theological issues, skip to the next topic.

Darrell Dullnig
Darrell Dullnig
  Rdawg
July 24, 2018 8:27 am

Don’t be so prickly, dawg. There are always exceptions to every rule, and you can fancy yourself one of them.

Probably good advice though. I might take it.

Rdawg
Rdawg
  Darrell Dullnig
July 25, 2018 1:05 am

I wouldn’t be Rdawg if I weren’t prickly; emphasis on the prick.

Soup
Soup
July 24, 2018 11:11 am

Religion and faith are often considered the same thing by people who don’t understand words. Religion’s root mean to be “re-bound”, or “re-tied to”. The King James bible exquisitely defines faith in Hebrews 11:1: “Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen”. Things that are different can’t be the same. Faith is the opposite of religion.

Religion is trusting in your works, that you are a “good person”. Five times the bible tells is “there is none that doeth good”. I’m saved, and I can’t do good. It was true 2500 years ago, and it’s true today.

I trust the KJV Bible, in that over 300 prophecies came true with the death, burial and resurrection of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and that at least 517 people saw the risen Jesus Christ (1 Cor. 15:5-8). Those prophecies were inspired by God and written by men over a 1500 year period.

You can believe a book and the things in it. It is possible.

Bobbivilla
Bobbivilla
July 24, 2018 9:44 pm

Here is the kicker for me… The Bible…(God’s Book?) says…
ALL MEN HAVE BEEN SHOWN that He is real!
Romans. 1:
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

God is awesome! His book is lovely, and jam packed with knowledge that is truth!

That is AWESOME, in these evil days!

Blessing to all believers!!