SMOKEY’S COUNTDOWN TO IMMINENT ARMAGEDDON

122 comments

Posted on 28th September 2011 by Administrator in Economy |Politics |Social Issues

,

As everyone knows, the date is September 28, 2011. Sometime in the next three days the Muslim terrorists roaming our lands will unleash a massive attack on the U.S. Picture mushroom clouds and death and destruction on an epic scale. It is a stone cold lock to happen. It is imminent. Has Smokey ever been wrong before? Below is a countdown clock. I suggest you check this post frequently over the next few days to watch the countdown to imminent Armageddon.

122 Comments
  1. Axel says:

    I’ll bring the popcorn.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 9:45 am

  2. Administrator says:

    We must stay vigilant

    633777258143702090-terrorists.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:48 am

  3. Stan says:

    What about the terrorists who work for CNBC? Or the ones who carry badges?

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 9:50 am

  4. Muck About says:

    Just because the Jewish New Year starts as sunset tonight, why Armageddon this year? They celebrate it every year…

    Just don’t ask me to eat the traditional food..

    MA

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 9:54 am

  5. Dave Doe says:

    Is there anyplace we can bet against Smokey on this. I usually don’t gamble but this and the college football picks seem like a sure bet.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 10:35 am

  6. AKAnon says:

    DD-The correct phrase you refer to is “a mortal lock”. You’re welcome.

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    28th September 2011 at 10:42 am

  7. Dave Doe says:

    What’s the difference between a mortal lock and a lock. If you win you win. Of course, Smokey has promised many locks that ended up being schlocks.

    Don’t thank me yet.

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    28th September 2011 at 10:43 am

  8. Tim says:

    Of course, on the other hand, if Smokey’s correct, and a huge event DOES take place between now and Friday, you’ll never hear the end of it.

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    28th September 2011 at 11:05 am

  9. Colma Rising says:

    Alright, you cackling hyenas and scurrying jackals, I sense that you’ve had your little ding dongs kicked into your throats so much this week by Smokey, his having little assistance from the Ancient Warrior SSS, that you have decided to circle back in on the carcass… with llpoh busy whetting his mackeral on a tuna boat, I’ve a little news for you:

    Your ability to laugh and discuss terrorism as a distant memory is the product of the sweat and blood of Intelligence and Military personnel working around the clock to assure that in this nasty world of today, you can all sip lattes and utter “false flag” from your round bellies a’ jiggling with uneasy laughter…

    I don’t know if you have noticed, but relations with those dirty turncoats in Pakistan, a nuke-wielding Haji-hotbed, has been crumbling. The borders are wide open like a hooker’s snatch at 5 am on a Sunday morning. It seems everyone is going about their lives talking sports and philosophy.

    I for one am not falling into that rut. I smell something in the air that I don’t like and I’m not talking about the sugarloaf I just laid after my morning coffee. Laugh now and ridicule genuine eforts to protect us all in a mean world now, because you won’t be if one of these skinnies breaks the perimiter with their sinister plans to disrupt our way of life.

    Fucking curs is right.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 8 Thumb down 8

    28th September 2011 at 11:10 am

  10. Smokey says:

    Colma,

    It’s about fucking time you quit lurking and stepped up. I knew you were lurking, otherwise I would not have received any thumbs up in my recent battles.

    You are right. Pakistan could blow any day now. They are openly aiding in the killing of American soldiers in Afghanistan. I never trusted the cocksuckers anyway. Bin Laden living downtown next to their military base and they had no idea? Give me a break.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 11:22 am

  11. Stucky says:

    Colma

    You braindead cur!

    They have ALREADY disrupted our way of life. Have you been asleep for the past decade?

    Colma living his fanatsy life
    funny-pictures-no-regrets.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 11:26 am

  12. Smokey says:

    Oh. I forgot. We should preemptively nuke Pakistan NOW.
    obama_bill_ayers_bomb_pakistan_284515.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 11:29 am

  13. Administrator says:

    Smokey

    You know how to not have Pakistanis killing US soldiers in Afghanistan?

    Listen closely. Put your thinking cap on. Come a little closer.

    DON’T HAVE ANY FUCKING US SOLDIERS IN AFGHANISTAN!!!!!!

    Lesson over.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 27 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 11:30 am

  14. Stucky says:

    Smokey wants to bomb the shit out of everybody.

    Lesson over.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 11:31 am

  15. Smokey says:

    Colma,

    Be wary of Stuck. He will soon reach his lean fighting machine weight.

    LOL—-Stuck couldn’t beat his meat if he caught it off guard.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 5

    28th September 2011 at 11:33 am

  16. Smokey says:

    National anthem of the Administrator and his band of Ron Paul curs:

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 11:42 am

  17. Stucky says:

    Stop fantasizing about my meat, Smokey. You’re creeping me out.

    BTW, I’ve been flogging the dummy since I was 13. I have it down to a science.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 11:50 am

  18. Dave Doe says:

    If something happens between now and the announced date – it means Smokey is a terrorist.

    I’m still trying to find a “Short Smokey” ETF. No dice.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 11:57 am

  19. Persnickety says:

    Smokey and the people he wants to bomb bomb bomb:

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 12:10 pm

  20. flash says:

    sure, new threat arises….naturally….gotta’ kill those wily Pakistanis now,else the mooslims will come to rape your goats and play futbal with your daughters.
    The fight against the current threat must go on, black flag or else …into perpetuity or at least while the dollar still exists as a global reserve currency.

    PCR nails it ,again…..gotta’ a 12 incher, dontcha’ know?

    The Latest Orchestrated Threat

    by Paul Craig Roberts

    Recently by Paul Craig Roberts: Stuck Pigs (and Presstitutes) Squeal

    Have you ever before heard of the Haqqanis? I didn’t think so. Like Al Qaeda, about which no one had ever heard prior to 9/11, the “Haqqani Network” has popped up in time of need to justify America’s next war – Pakistan.

    President Obama’s claim that he had Al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden exterminated deflated the threat from that long-serving bogyman. A terror organization that left its leader, unarmed and undefended, a sitting duck for assassination no longer seemed formidable. Time for a new, more threatening, bogyman, the pursuit of which will keep the “war on terror” going.

    Now America’s “worst enemy” is the Haqqanis. Moreover, unlike Al Qaeda, which was never tied to a country, the Haqqani Network, according to Admiral Mike Mullen, chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, is a “veritable arm” of the Pakistani government’s intelligence service, ISI. Washington claims that the ISI ordered its Haggani Network to attack the US Embassy in Kabul, Afghanistan, on September 13 along with the US military base in Wadak province.

    Senator Lindsey Graham, a member of the Armed Services committee and one of the main Republican warmongers, declared that “all options are on the table” and gave the Pentagon his assurance that in Congress there was broad bipartisan support for a US military attack on Pakistan.

    As Washington has been killing large numbers of Pakistani civilians with drones and has forced the Pakistani army to hunt for Al Qaeda throughout most of Pakistan, producing tens of thousands or more of dislocated Pakistanis in the process, Sen. Graham must have something larger in mind.

    The Pakistani government thinks so, too. The Pakistani prime minister,Yousuf Raza Gilani, called his foreign minister home from talks in Washington and ordered an emergency meeting of the government to assess the prospect of an American invasion.

    Meanwhile, Washington is rounding up additional reasons to add to the new threat from the Haqqanis to justify making war on Pakistan: Pakistan has nuclear weapons and is unstable and the nukes could fall into the wrong hands; the US can’t win in Afghanistan until it has eliminated sanctuaries in Pakistan; blah-blah.

    Washington has been trying to bully Pakistan into launching a military operation against its own people in North Waziristan. Pakistan has good reasons for resisting this demand. Washington’s use of the new “Haqqani threat” as an invasion excuse could be Washington’s way of overcoming Pakistan’s resistance to attacking its North Waziristan provence, or it could be, as some Pakistani political leaders say, and the Pakistani government fears, a “drama” created by Washington to justify a military assault on yet another Muslim country.

    Over the years of its servitude as an American puppet, the Pakistan government has brought this on itself. Pakistanis let the US purchase the Pakistan government, train and equip its military, and establish CIA interface with Pakistani intelligence. A government so dependent on Washington could say little when Washington began violating its sovereignty, sending in drones and special forces teams to kill alleged Al Qaeda, but usually women, children, and farmers. Unable to subdue after a decade a small number of Taliban fighters in Afghanistan, Washington has placed the blame for its military failure on Pakistan, just as Washington blamed the long drawn-out war on the Iraqi people on Iran’s alleged support for the Iraqi resistance to American occupation.

    Some knowledgeable analysts’ about whom you will never hear in the “mainstream media,” say that the US military/security complex and their neoconservative whores are orchestrating World War III before Russia and China can get prepared. As a result of the communist oppression, a signifiant percentage of the Russian population is in the American orbit. These Russians trust Washington more than they trust Putin. The Chinese are too occupied dealing with the perils of rapid economic growth to prepare for war and are far behind the threat.

    War, however, is the lifeblood of the profits of the military/security complex, and war is the chosen method of the neoconservatives for achieving their goal of American hegemony.

    Pakistan borders China and former constituent parts of the Soviet Union in which the US now has military bases on Russia’s borders. US war upon and occupation of Pakistan is likely to awaken the somnolent Russians and Chinese. As both possess nuclear ICBMs, the outcome of the military/security complex’s greed for profits and the neoconservatives’ greed for empire could be the extinction of life on earth.

    The patriots and super-patriots who fall in with the agendas of the military-security complex and the flag-waving neoconservatives are furthering the “end-times” outcome so fervently desired by the rapture evangelicals, who will waft up to heaven while the rest of us die on earth.

    This is not President Reagan’s hoped for outcome from ending the cold war.

    September 27, 2011

    Paul Craig Roberts [send him mail], a former Assistant Secretary of the US Treasury and former associate editor of the Wall Street Journal, has been reporting shocking cases of prosecutorial abuse for two decades. A new edition of his book, The Tyranny of Good Intentions, co-authored with Lawrence Stratton, a documented account of how Americans lost the protection of law, has been released by Random House.

    Copyright © 2011 Paul Craig Roberts

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    28th September 2011 at 12:31 pm

  21. flash says:

    BTW ,don’t fergit to say your pledge,before condemning more women and children to cowardly drone attacks.

    I pledge blind devotion to a flag representing a United State of Corporatism and to Fascism for which it stands, one Empire under tyranny, insufferable, without liberty or justice for any.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 12:33 pm

  22. flash says:

    BTW another good twofer.If not for Libertarians, their would be no counterbalance to the insane level of madness to which our brain dead electorate and their psychopathic handlers would stoop. No one is safe when the insane idol worshipers mix jingoism and religion.

    Libertarianism Is Cultish?
    Posted by Thomas Woods on September 27, 2011 09:55 AM

    Libertarianism is “cultish,” say the sophisticates. Of course, there’s nothing cultish at all about allegiance to the state, with its flags, its songs, its mass murders, its little children saluting and paying homage to pictures of their dear leaders on the wall, etc.
    Bookmark/Share | Suggest a Link

    re: Libertarianism is Cultish?
    Posted by Thomas DiLorenzo on September 27, 2011 12:46 PM

    Not to mention, Tom, the black-robed deities of the “supreme” court dressed in black capes, surrounded by a giant mural of Moses receiving the Ten Commandments; a national capital littered with statues of all the state’s former henchmen on horseback, its political bloviators in full bloviation; the Temple to Zeus (er, I mean, Lincoln), complete with fasces inscripted on the front; and of course the Roman-style “motorcades” for our emperors whenever they step out for an ice cream cone after dinner.
    Bookmark/Share | Suggest a Link

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    28th September 2011 at 12:38 pm

  23. flash says:

    one more bed wetters and then I’ve really got to get back to work. Christian my big hairy ass. Christians don’t turn rabid ,bloodthirsty dogs loose on innocent women and children.

    Are You an Imperial Christian?

    by Laurence M. Vance

    Recently by Laurence M. Vance: A Simple-Minded Warmonger

    The tenets of imperial Christianity include things like blind nationalism, belief in American exceptionalism, willful ignorance of U.S. foreign policy, childish devotion to the military, cheerleading for the Republican Party, acceptance of the U.S. empire, and support for a perpetual war on terror – all, of course, with a Christian twist for effect. In other words, the views of Mike Huckabee, Sarah Palin, Michele Bachmann or Rick Perry.

    I have some simple yet pointed questions for Christians who subscribe to, or can be characterized by, the above things:

    Is the president of the United States God?
    Is America the nation of Israel?
    Is the United States the client state of God?
    Is the U.S. military the Lord’s army?
    Does the United States enjoy a special relationship with God that other nations don’t have?
    Is the Christian’s sword anything but the word of God?
    Does the Bible command any Christian to kill any adherent of a false religion?
    Does the Bible command any Christian to go on a crusade against Muslims?
    Does “obeying the powers that be” mean that Christians should always do anything and everything the government says?
    Does the Bible say that anyone other than God should receive unconditional obedience?
    Is it okay for Christians to participate in U.S. government wars just because God commanded the Jews in the Old Testament to go to war?
    Does the Lord approve of everything the U.S. government does?
    Does the Lord approve of everything the government of Israel does?
    Is being patriotic more important than being biblical?
    Is the Republican Party the party of God?
    Is it more scriptural for a Christian to be in the military than in the ministry?
    Does God need America’s help to protect Israel?
    Does God need the U.S. military to maintain order throughout the world?
    Is the U.S. military a godly institution?
    Is the CIA a godly institution?
    Did God command the United States to build over 1,000 foreign military bases?
    Did God command the United States to station troops in over 150 countries?
    Does God always approve of U.S. foreign policy?
    Is it biblical that churches send more soldiers to the Middle East than missionaries?
    Did God appoint the United States to be the world’s policeman?
    Does the New Testament command churches to hold special military appreciation days?
    Does the New Testament command churches to glorify the military on the Sunday before national holidays?
    Have U.S. wars always been just, right, and good?
    Are all Muslims terrorists?
    Was every Iraqi and Afghan killed by the U.S. military a terrorist?
    Does the New Testament encourage Christians to wage war against anyone or anything but the world, the flesh, and the devil?

    If you are a Christian and answered in the affirmative to one or more of these questions, then I understand why you are an imperial Christian. Repent.

    But if you are a Christian and answered in the negative to all of these questions, then why are you an imperial Christian? Why do you make apologies for the state, its leaders, its military, its wars, its imperialism, and its interventionism? Why are you so devoted to the Republican Party? Why do you sing songs to the state in church on the Sunday before national holidays? Why do you encourage Christian young people to join the military? Why do you recite meaningless prayers for God to bless U.S. troops engaged in unjust wars?

    Think about these things. Pray about them. Meditate on them. Just don’t be an imperial Christian.

    September 28, 2011

    Laurence M. Vance [send him mail] writes from central Florida. He is the author of Christianity and War and Other Essays Against the Warfare State, The Revolution that Wasn’t, and Rethinking the Good War. His latest book is The Quatercentenary of the King James Bible. Visit his website.

    Copyright © 2011 by LewRockwell.com. Permission to reprint in whole or in part is gladly granted, provided full credit is given.

    The Best of Laurence M. Vance

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    28th September 2011 at 12:41 pm

  24. Colma Rising says:

    Stuch: I haven’t spent a second cowering.

    You people tend to forget that YOU bought the heaps of rubber dog shit from an emerging economy that needs some Texas Tea pumped through those shit holes. Its all fine and dandy when you get your plastic cups, 100 count 2 for 1 at some shell of a store for your swank beers from a lead-ridden tap… but when Haji gets all pissy you lift said cups to drink out of one corner of your pursed lips and motherfuck the other 1% who do your dirty work.

    What’s it going to be, gentlemen? No profits and unaffordable goods or sending the best in to snatch your raw goods from baathist dictators?

    If Ron Paul were to receive a fraction of a briefing that any prez did, he’d shit a defense bill quite similar. I’m voting for the man, but c’mon… do you really think otherwise?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 1:02 pm

  25. TeresaE says:

    Wow, the story continues.

    GREAT articles Flash, thank you.

    Colma, “you people”? Really? You are trying to win an argument by using a dismissive statement meant to corral people into a little group making it easier to dismiss our side of it? Really?

    I stand by my assertion, every right you have freely traded for security won’t amount to shit when you figure out we are not secure ANYWAY.

    Explain that.

    How can we have trashed the Constitution and still end up with an attack? The logic taxes my brain just like the vaccination logic.

    My unvaccinated child can infect your vaccinated one. How is that possible? If vaccines works, then YOUR KID WOULD BE SAFE no matter that mine has the shots or not.

    If trashing our rights worked, then we would already live in drug & terrorism free Utopia with NO NEED to further trash the rights remaining.

    Circular logic, love it.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 1:17 pm

  26. Smokey says:

    Colma,

    Good point.

    I believe Obama had every intention of yanking all the troops from the mid east as soon as he was given a chance. He’d voted against them his entire time as a Senator, and his campaign theme was to bring them home.

    But within his first couple of days in office, he was faced with the hard facts.

    In my opinion, Obama hasn’t performed that bad. I mean, I thought when he was inaugurated on that Tuesday at 11:30 am that his first act as President would be to order all white men to the cotton field by 5 am the next day. Since he didn’t do that, everything else is a plus.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 1:18 pm

  27. Smokey says:

    flash,

    Paul Craig Roberts may be the most outspoken 9/11 Truther in the country, short of DP.

    Are you sure you want to reference that totally discredited fool?

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 2 Thumb down 6

    28th September 2011 at 1:23 pm

  28. Administrator says:

    Smokey

    FXP up 7% today. Are you in?

    Bank of America has a huge presentation about the hard landing of China.

    Pucker up.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 1:50 pm

  29. Smokey says:

    Bank of America?

    I rest my case.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 1:57 pm

  30. Dave Doe says:

    Hugh Hendry is Killing It Shorting China This Year

    http://www.businessinsider.com/hugh-hendry-short-china-up-39-2011

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 2:35 pm

  31. Colma Rising says:

    TeresaE: I don’t have kids, thank God above, as I find their incessant noise, narcicism and stench to be all but intolerable…

    However, when my inner voice screaming that I must bless this world with my superior genetic code overcomes my logic, I would certainly vaccinate them. I assume you’ve not known anybody who survived polio.

    As for “You People”, I mean people who refuse to see their hand in the cause and effect which governs all. Maybe if we’d had a little foresight years ago, we’d have mended our clothes and washed out our beer cups. Alas we didn’t.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 2:40 pm

  32. flash says:

    Smokey says:

    flash,

    Paul Craig Roberts may be the most outspoken 9/11 Truther in the country, short of DP.

    Sure, and why not? I’ve yet to read an essayist yet whose opinion diodn’t have one or two gaping holes,no matter how educated.
    That said, PCR does raise some interesting questions that where never answered by the 9/11 Commission. I may be mistaken , but seems to me even some of the members of that appointed commission called some of the finding into question.
    I. for one have never delved into the subject at all. for me,there are to many other evils that the Federal government has committed to even contemplated one more.
    I think it safe to say that since the beginning of this so called Union the US government has killed enough innocent people in the name of “We the consented” to rival the governments of Hitler, Mao, and Stalin combined.
    Start adding up the southerners slaughtered, the tens of thousands of native Americans annihilated, the German,Japanese, Filipinos,Korean , Cambodian , Laos,Vietnamese, South American, Mexican, Iraqi, Iranians, Yemen-ese, Libyan and various other civilians killed by US military,or US military trained killers then we’ve killed and participated in killing more than enough.
    When will US sanctioned murder stop.
    The US is certainly not a nation of godly people to allow so much murder to be conducted in their name, which is why I believe that God has no mercy left for this country.
    I’m feel safe in saying that God has had enough.

    What to disagree with?He’s asking the right questions,not that anyone can ever expect to get a straight answer from a Godless pack of liars….never happened, never will.
    Oh, but sometimes they tell the truth, you say?
    How can you tell?

    The Critics of 9/11 Truth: Do They Have A Case?

    by Paul Craig Roberts

    Recently by Paul Craig Roberts: In America the Rule of Law Is Vacated

    The short answer to the question in the title is no.

    The 9/11 truth critics have nothing but ad hominem arguments.

    Let’s examine the case against the truthers presented by Ted Rall, Ann Barnhardt, and Alexander Cockburn.

    But first let’s define who the truthers are.

    The Internet has made it possible for anyone to have a web site and to rant and speculate to their heart’s content. There are a large number of 9/11 conspiracy theorists.

    Many on both sides of the issue are equally ignorant. Neither side has any shame about demonstrating ignorance.

    Both sides of the issue have conspiracy theories. 9/11 was a conspiracy whether a person believes that it was an inside job or that a handful of Arabs outwitted the entire intelligence apparatus of the Western world and the operational response of NORAD and the US Air Force.

    For one side to call the other conspiracy theorists is the pot calling the kettle black.

    The question turns not on name-calling but on evidence.

    The 9/11 Truth movement was not created by bloggers ranting on their web sites. It was created by professional architects and engineers some of whom are known for having designed steel high rise buildings. It was created by distinguished scientists, such as University of Copenhagen nano-Chemist Niels Harrit who has 60 scientific papers to his credit and physicist Steven Jones. It was created by US Air Force pilots and commercial airline pilots who are expert at flying airplanes. It was created by firefighters who were in the twin towers and who personally heard and experienced numerous explosions including explosions in the sub-basements. It was created by members of 9/11 families who desire to know how such an improbable event as 9/11 could possibly occur.

    The professionals and the scientists are speaking from the basis of years of experience and expert knowledge. Moreover, the scientists are speaking from the basis of careful research into the evidence that exists. When an international research team of scientists spends 18 months studying the components in the dust from the towers and the fused pieces of concrete and steel, they know what they are doing. When they announce that they have definite evidence of incendiaries and explosives, you can bet your life that that have the evidence.

    When a physicist proves that Building 7 (the stories not obscured by other buildings) fell at free fall speed and NIST has to acknowledge that he is correct, you can bet your life that the physicist is correct.

    When fire department captains and clean-up teams report molten steel – and their testimony is backed up with photographs – in the debris of the ruins weeks and months after the buildings’ destruction, you can bet your life the molten steel was there. When the same authorities report pumping fire suppressants and huge quantities of water with no effect on the molten steel, you can bet your life that the temperature long after the buildings’ destruction remained extremely high, far higher than any building fire can reach.

    When the architects, engineers, and scientists speak, they offer no theory of who is responsible for 9/11. They state that the known evidence supports neither the NIST reports nor the 9/11 Commission Report. They say that the explanation that the government has provided is demonstrably wrong and that an investigation is required if we are to discover the truth about the event.

    It is not a conspiracy theory to examine the evidence and to state that the evidence does not support the explanation that has been given.

    That is the position of the 9/11 Truth movement.

    What is the position of the movement’s critics? Ted Rall says: “Everything I’ve read and watched on Truther sites is easily dismissed by anyone with a basic knowledge of physics and architecture. (I spent three years in engineering school.)

    Wow! What powerful credentials. Has Rall ever designed a high rise steel building? Could Rall engage in a debate with a professor of nano-chemistry? Could he refute Newton’s laws in a debate with university physicists? Does Rall know anything about maneuvering airplanes? Does he have an explanation why 100 firefighters, janitors, and police report hearing and experiencing explosions that they did not hear or experience?

    Clearly, Ted Rall has no qualifications whatsoever to make any judgment about the judgments of experts whose knowledge exceeds his meager understanding by a large amount.

    Ann Barnhardt writes: “I gotta tell you, I’ve just about had it with these 9/11 truthers. If there is one phenomenon in our sick, sick culture that sums up how far gone and utterly damaged we are as a people, it is 9/11 trutherism. It pretty much covers everything: self-loathing, antisemitism, zero knowledge of rudimentary physics and a general inability to think logically.” She goes down hill from here.

    Amazing, isn’t she? Physics professors have “zero knowledge of rudimentary physics.”

    Internationally recognized logicians have “a general inability to think logically.” People trained in the scientific method who use it to seek truth are “self-loathing.” If you doubt the government’s account you are antisemitic. Barnhardt then provides her readers with a lesson in physics, structural architecture and engineering, and the behavior of steel under heat and stress that is the most absolute nonsense imaginable.

    Obviously, Barnhardt knows nothing whatsoever about what she is talking about, but overflowing with hubris she dismisses real scientists and professionals with ad hominem arguments. She adds to her luster with a video of herself tearing out pages of the Koran, which she has marked with slices of bacon, and burning the pages.

    Now we come to Alex Cockburn. He is certainly not stupid. I know him. He is pleasant company. He provides interesting intellectual conversation. I like him. Yet, he also arrogantly dismisses highly qualified experts who provide evidence contrary to the official government story of 9/11.

    Alex avoids evidence presented by credentialed experts and relies on parody. He writes that the conspiracists claim that the twin towers “pancaked because Dick Cheney’s agents – scores of them – methodically planted demolition charges.”

    Little doubt but there are bloggers somewhere in the vast Internet world who say this. But this is not what the professionals are saying who have provided evidence that the official account is not correct. The experts are simply saying that the evidence does not support the official explanation. More recently, an international team of scientists has reported finding unequivocal evidence of incendiaries and explosives. They have not said anything about who planted them. Indeed, they have said that other scientists should test their conclusions by repeating the research. After calling experts “conspiracy kooks,” Alex then damns them for not putting forward “a scenario of the alleged conspiracy.”

    Moreover, not a single one of the experts believes the towers “pancaked.” This was an early explanation that, I believe, was tentatively put forward by NIST, but it had to be abandoned because of the speed with which the buildings came down and due to other problems.

    Unlike Rall and Barnhardt, Alex does refer to evidence, but it is second or third-hand hearsay evidence that is nonsensical on its face. For example, Alex writes that Chuck Spinney “tells me that ‘there ARE pictures taken of the 757 plane hitting Pentagon – they were taken by the surveillance cameras at Pentagon’s heliport, which was right next to impact point. I have seen them both – stills and moving pictures. I just missed seeing it personally, but the driver of the van I just got out of in South Parking saw it so closely that he could see the terrified faces of passengers in windows.’”

    If there were pictures or videos of an airliner hitting the Pentagon, they would have been released years ago. They would have been supplied to the 9/11 Commission. Why would the government refuse for 10 years to release pictures that prove its case? The FBI confiscated all film from all surveillance cameras. No one has seen them, much less a Pentagon critic such as Spinney.

    I have to say that the van driver must have better eyes than an eagle if he could see expressions on passenger faces through those small airliner portholes in a plane traveling around 500 mph. Try it sometimes. Sit on your front steps and try to discern the expressions of automobile passengers through much larger and clearer windows traveling down your street in a vehicle moving 30 mph. Then kick the speed up 16.7 times to 500 mph and report if you see anything but a blur.

    Alex’s other evidence that 9/11 truthers are kooks is a letter that Herman Soifer, who claims to be a retired structural engineer, wrote to him summarizing “the collapse of Buildings 1 and 2 succinctly.” This is what Soifer, who “had followed the plans and engineering of the Towers during construction” wrote to Alex: “The towers were basically tubes, essentially hollow.” This canard was disposed of years ago. If Alex had merely googled the plans of the buildings, he would have discovered that there were no thin-walled hollow tubes, but a very large number of massively thick steel beams.

    Alex’s willingness to dismiss as kooks numerous acknowledged experts on the basis of a claim that a van driver saw terrified faces of passengers moving at 500 mph and a totally erroneous description in a letter from a person who knew nothing whatsoever about the structural integrity of the buildings means that he is a much braver person than I.

    Before I call architects kooks whose careers were spent building steel high rises, I would want to know a lot more about the subject than I do. Before I poke fun at nano-chemists and physicists, I would want to at least be able to read their papers and find the scientific flaws in their arguments.

    Yet, none of the people who ridicule 9/11 skeptics are capable of this. How, for example, can Rall, Barnhardt, or Cockburn pass judgment on a nano-chemist with 40 years of experience and 60 scientific publications to his credit?

    They cannot, but nevertheless do. They don’t hesitate to pass judgment on issues about which they have no knowledge or understanding. This is an interesting psychological phenomenon worthy of study and analysis.

    Another interesting phenomenon is the strong emotional reactions that many have to 9/11, an event about which they have little information. Even the lead members of the 9/11 Commission itself have said that information was withheld from them and the commission was set up to fail. People who rush to the defense of NIST do not even know what they are defending as NIST refuses to release the details of the simulation upon which NIST bases its conclusion.

    There is no 9/11 debate. On the one hand there are credentialed experts who demonstrate problems in the official account, and on the other hand there are non-experts who denounce the experts as conspiracy kooks. The experts are cautious and careful about what they say, and their detractors have thrown caution and care to the wind. That is the state of the debate.

    September 14, 2011

    Paul Craig Roberts [send him mail], a former Assistant Secretary of the US Treasury and former associate editor of the Wall Street Journal, has been reporting shocking cases of prosecutorial abuse for two decades. A new edition of his book, The Tyranny of Good Intentions, co-authored with Lawrence Stratton, a documented account of how Americans lost the protection of law, has been released by Random House.

    Copyright © 2011 Paul Craig Roberts

    The Best of Paul Craig Roberts

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 4:11 pm

  33. Administrator says:

    WE’VE BEEN SAVED AGAIN. JUST IN THE NICK OF TIME. ALL HAIL DHS.

    Man Arrested In Sting Operation For Intending To Blow Up Pentagon, Capitol

    Submitted by Tyler Durden on 09/28/2011 16:36 -0400

    Diversion time. According to The Hill, in an elaborate sting/entrapment operation, the FBI arrested Rezwan Ferdaus for plotting to use drone airplanes loaded with C4 explosives and fly them into the Pentagon and Capitol. Ferdaus was made to believe he was working with members of al Qaeda, who were
    actually undercover agents. From The Hill: “According to the DOJ, Ferdaus aimed to create a devastating psychological impact with the attacks, saying at one point, “I just can’t stop; there is no other choice for me.” “Although Ferdaus was presented with multiple opportunities to back out of his plan, including, being told that his attack would likely kill women and children, the affidavit alleges that Ferdaus never wavered in his desire to carry out the attacks,” reads a DOJ press release.” It is ironic how every time there is a major drop in the market or the president’s rating reaches new lows we are reminded just how profoundly everyone overestimates their security, and supposedly liberty, in this (once) greatest country on earth.

    More:

    Ferdaus allegedly gave the undercover FBI agents a detailed set of
    attack plans “with step-by-step instructions as to how he planned to
    attack the Pentagon and Capitol,” according to the Department of
    Justice.

    Ferdaus, a Northeastern University graduate with a degree in physics,
    allegedly visited Washington, D.C., in May, taking pictures of his
    intended targets and proposed launch-sites for the remote-controlled
    aircraft, according to the DOJ.

    Ferdaus’s plan allegedly evolved
    to include a “ground assault” as well, in which six people would
    coordinate an automatic weapons attack with the aerial assault and
    massacre whoever came into their path, according to the DOJ.

    For
    the past five months, Ferdaus has allegedly been stockpiling the
    equipment he needed for his proposed attack, including a remote
    controlled aircraft, 25 pounds of fake C-4 explosives, six automatic
    AK-47 assault rifles and three grenades, according to the DOJ. He
    allegedly kept all of it in a storage facility in Massachusetts, where
    he was arrested.

    Next steps: discover your inner patriotic E-Trade baby and buy, buy, buy stocks. That. And stay away from D.C.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 4:41 pm

  34. Administrator says:

    DOESN’T SOUND LIKE ENTRAPMENT AT ALL. HOW CONVENIENT TO MAKE THE ARREST WHEN OBAMA’S POLL NUMBERS ARE AT A NEW LOW

    Man arrested in ‘step-by-step’ plot to blow up Capitol, Pentagon

    by Jordy Yager – 09/28/11 03:45 PM ET

    The FBI arrested and charged a man Wednesday for allegedly plotting to blow up the Capitol and the Pentagon.

    The 26-year-old Massachusetts man, Rezwan Ferdaus, was arrested as part of an FBI sting operation in which he was made to believe he was working with members of al Qaeda, who were actually undercover agents.

    Ferdaus allegedly gave the undercover FBI agents a detailed set of attack plans “with step-by-step instructions as to how he planned to attack the Pentagon and Capitol,” according to the Department of Justice.

    The plans focused on the use of three small remote-controlled drone-like aircraft loaded with C-4 plastic explosives, which he planned to fly into the Capitol and the Pentagon using GPS equipment, according to the DOJ.

    The DOJ stressed that the public was never in danger from the explosive devices, which it said were controlled at all times by undercover FBI officials who closely monitored Ferdaus as he allegedly developed his plot.

    According to the DOJ, Ferdaus aimed to create a devastating psychological impact with the attacks, saying at one point, “I just can’t stop; there is no other choice for me.”

    “Although Ferdaus was presented with multiple opportunities to back out of his plan, including, being told that his attack would likely kill women and children, the affidavit alleges that Ferdaus never wavered in his desire to carry out the attacks,” the DOJ said in a news release.

    Ferdaus, a Northeastern University graduate with a degree in physics, allegedly visited Washington in May, taking pictures of his intended targets and proposed launch-sites for the remote-controlled aircraft, according to the DOJ.

    Ferdaus’s plan allegedly evolved to include a “ground assault” as well, in which six people would coordinate an automatic weapons attack with the aerial assault and massacre whomever came into their path, according to the DOJ.

    For the past five months, Ferdaus has allegedly been stockpiling the equipment he needed for his proposed attack, including a remote-controlled aircraft, 25 pounds of fake C-4 explosives, six automatic AK-47 assault rifles and three grenades, according to the DOJ. He allegedly kept all of it in a storage facility in Massachusetts, where he was arrested.

    Ferdaus was also charged with attempting to provide material support and resources to a foreign terrorist organization — al Qaeda — in order to carry out attacks on U.S. soldiers stationed overseas, federal authorities said.

    Ferdaus allegedly modified eight cellphones to act as detonation devices for improvised explosive devices, and gave them to the FBI agents to be used against American soldiers in Iraq.

    “During a June 2011 meeting, he appeared gratified when he was told that his first phone detonation device had killed three U.S. soldiers and injured four or five others in Iraq,” according to the DOJ. “Ferdaus responded, ‘That was exactly what I wanted.’”

    Last week, Ferdaus gave the FBI agents a training video he made demonstrating how to make cellphone detonators, authorities said.

    According to the DOJ, a focal point of Ferdaus’s plots revolved around “jihad” and his desire to carry out the will of Allah.

    The U.S. attorney for the District of Massachusetts, Carmen M. Ortiz, stressed that any underlying religious motives to Ferdaus’s actions should not reflect on the Muslim culture at-large.

    “I want the public to understand that Mr. Ferdaus’s conduct, as alleged in the complaint, is not reflective of a particular culture, community or religion,” Ortiz said.

    “In addition to protecting our citizens from the threats and violence alleged today, we also have an obligation to protect members of every community, race and religion against violence and other unlawful conduct,” he said.

    According to federal authorities, Ferdaus faces up to 15 years in prison on the material support and resources to a foreign terrorist organization charge; up to 20 years in prison on the charge of attempting to destroy national defense premises; and a five-year minimum mandatory sentence, and up to 20 years, on the charge of attempting to damage and destroy buildings that are owned by the United States by using an explosive.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 4:52 pm

  35. Stucky says:

    Ferdaus has allegedly been stockpiling the equipment he needed … including a remote controlled aircraft, 25 pounds of fake C-4 explosives, six automatic AK-47 assault rifles and three grenades ….”

    Did he get these at Walmart?

    Seriously, how in the fuck does one acquire such things?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 4:59 pm

  36. Administrator says:

    Stuck

    From the FBI. He got all of the stuff from the FBI.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 5:00 pm

  37. Persnickety says:

    That’s funny, all the weapons he supposedly had are illegal in Massachusetts. Whocouldanode!?!?!!?

    Imagine how few attempted terror attacks we would have if the FBI stopped bankrolling naive amateur terrorists. Why, it could even be zero!

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 5:04 pm

  38. Persnickety says:

    Jim – these AKs must have been leftovers from Project Gunwalker. Some two-bit Mexican narco thug is alive today because the feds didn’t have time to send those AKs down to Mexico like the other couple thousand they sent down there.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 5:05 pm

  39. Smokey says:

    flash,

    When you claim that this country has murdered as many as Hitler, Mao, and Stalin combined, you are running into some pretty big numbers.

    Most estimates put Mao at 50 million plus.

    Most estimates put Stalin at about 23 million.

    Most estimates put Hitler at about 12 million.

    flash—That totals 85 million murdered.

    See flash, that’s the thing about the Hate-America club, and you are a charter member. You can’t just say, “Well, America has committed some atrocities as have all countries.” and leave it there.

    That’s not enough for you or your club. You simply can’t resist the urge to LIE in your insatiable quest to motherfuck this country. America has caused nowhere NEAR the number of deaths as Hitler, Mao, and Stalin—and you know it and EVERYBODY else knows it. But that urge to shit on this country is all-consuming, so you simple make up the facts as you go.

    If you tried to make that ludicrous case to any legitimate group of historical scholars, you’d be hooted out of the auditorium.

    Why don’t you just move to North Korea or Syria and be done with it ?

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 5

    28th September 2011 at 5:18 pm

  40. Colma Rising says:

    Sergeant GreyBush is disguised as Captain Cuttenpaste again.

    -Booger Eater

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 5:34 pm

  41. Dave Doe says:

    OMFG, I actually agree with Smokey. Get him boy – sic, sic. Tear his nuts off. That a boy.

    Admin, can we get a rule change to require an executive summary for anything over 150 words.
    Christ, what ever happened to links. Christ, what ever happened to Christ.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 5:43 pm

  42. SSS says:

    Flash

    That over-the-top article you posted by Thomas DiLorenzo, particularly the part about the War Against the Plains Indians, is so unbalanced as to be laughable, eg. “This type of a war of extermination or genocide was repeated hundreds of times from 1865-1890, when Sherman’s “final solution” was finally realized.”

    First of all, the Sand Creek Massacre was a RENEGADE action by Col. John Chivington, and one of the officers under his command went so far as to refuse to obey Chivington’s orders to attack, and that officer and his men did not participate. No one authorized that attack because the Indians at Sand Creek had been resettled there and promised the protection of the USG. And along comes this fucker Chivington, who eventually was disgraced for the rest of his life. Many women and children were slaughtered at Sand Creek, granted, but it wasn’t because of any action sanctioned by the USG.

    Second, no mention is made in the article of President Grant’s Peace Policy, which was instituted in 1870 and blew up in 1876 after the Battle of Little Bighorn. Grant’s policy held in check the worst instincts of General Sherman, who did in fact despise Indians, and to a lesser degree General Phil Sheridan. During those years, it was USG policy to contact the various Plains Indian tribes and peacefully convince them to move onto reservations under the protection of the USG. It worked to a degree, but administered with a frightening amount of corruption. Many members of the Sioux and Northern Cheyenne tribes wanted nothing to do with that reservation shit. Two of those Indians will remain famous forever: Sitting Bull and Crazy Horse.

    Third, Dee Brown (author of the Wounded Knee book cited several times by DiLorenzo in the article) eats shit. She’s so fucking out there when she claims that “this type of war of extermination or genocide was repeated hundreds of times from 1865-1890.” Ok, bitch. Show me the list of hundreds of times. Total fucking garbage.

    Look, Flash. I know damn well that the USG fucked over the Indians really badly during the entire 19th Century. It’s well documented, and it’s an ice cold fact. I read about it all the time. I’m just finishing up a book entitled, “Chief Joseph & the Flight of the Nez Perce,” by Kent Nerburn. Another fuck job on the Indians by the USG. And yeah, Sherman shows up as a total asshole.

    But here’s what I don’t like. Taking another sad chapter in US history and putting it on totally unsubstantiated, inaccurate, and outlandish steroids. It was bad enough as it was without the bullshit embellishments.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 6:10 pm

  43. Dave says:

    Mushroom clouds, death and destruction on a massive scale and we’ll still be able to do this???

    “I suggest you check this post frequently over the next few days to watch the countdown to imminent Armageddon.”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 7:11 pm

  44. flash says:

    “See flash, that’s the thing about the Hate-America club, and you are a charter member. You can’t just say, “Well, America has committed some atrocities as have all countries.” and leave it there.”
    That’s not enough for you or your club. You simply can’t resist the urge to LIE in your insatiable quest to motherfuck this country.Why don’t you just move to North Korea or Syria and be done with it ?”

    You fucking moron, this country hasn’t a goddman thing to do with that fascist fucking government in DC.
    The majority of American could give a fuck less if the Federal government nuked any other country on the earth…just wouldn’t give a shit if they got their free shit on time.

    That said, fuck you and your fascsit banana Republic.I love my country , was born here and plan on dying here .Got it shit stain?
    If you want to persist in blind idol worship, be my guest,nut the fact are indisputable.

    Hundred of thousands killed in The war of
    Northern Aggression,hundreds of thousands of American Indians murdered, millions of “Huns” murdered during WWI and over a million more starved to death by blockade after WWI by Treaty of Versailles, millions more murdered by bombing campaigns in Japan, Germany , Italy, Vietnam,Lao, Cambodia,Iraq, Afghanistan.Then death by embargo of millions more in Iran, Iraq,ect.
    And don’t forget all the shitstom of death rained down in Nicaragua and neighboring countries by Reagan and predecessors.

    I don’t have time to do a chronological timeline documenting all the direct and indirect genocide caused by the Fascist fucks in DC due to bandwidth limits, but I’ll leave you with this.
    ESAD.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 7:48 pm

  45. flash says:

    @SSS,
    that exactly the point DiLorenzo makes , no one was ever punished…get it?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 7:50 pm

  46. flash says:

    Smokey,

    I’ve been thinking about all the harsh words Between us and I like to clarify one point in particular,
    You still eat shit….hope you don’t take it personal though.

    People like you give my country a bad fucking name.

    Love It or Leave It?

    by Michael S. Rozeff

    Recently by Michael S. Rozeff: ‘Central Banks’ Are Not Banks

    Libertarians who criticize the United States government are sometimes told “If you don’t like it here, leave.” Sir Walter Scott’s lines are a poetic reply:

    “Breathes there the man, with soul so dead,
    Who never to himself hath said,
    This is my own, my native land?
    Whose heart hath ne’er within him burn’d,
    As home his footsteps he hath turn’d,
    From wandering on a foreign strand?”

    Even the patriotic song “This Is My Country” at least begins well with

    “This is my country! Land of my birth!
    This is my country! Grandest on earth!”

    before it veers off into a pledge of allegiance, which is, however, to America, and not to the United States of America, which is America’s federal government.

    One’s native land and country are not the government. America is not the United States of America, which is a government. One’s land and country are not the Department of Education, the Internal Revenue Service, the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, and the Transportation Security Administration. Emotion felt toward one’s country is different than emotion felt toward the government of one’s country.

    Why connect one’s consent or non-consent to government (one’s loving it or not) to staying in the country or leaving it? Why connect consent to location? If one does not consent to a government, why is exit from the country thought to be a necessary implication? Why not simply end one’s relations with that government and remain in the country?

    The government won’t let you. That’s why.

    A little background first.

    Libertarians stand for freedom and against undesirable government coercion, which is coercion that is aggressive in nature and not defensive; or coercion that attacks freedom rather than protects it.

    Libertarians are not necessarily anarchists. Anarchists either prefer no government at all for themselves or else are comfortable with a voluntary form of self-government. Some libertarians are anarchists, while others desire various forms of government. Both libertarians and anarchists do not want others to impose their governments on them. Panarchists are persons who desire that all persons, right down to the individual, have the freedom to choose their own governments within one’s native land and country. This means that one country could contain many possible governments. As this freedom increases, it means that territoriality of government diminishes or even ceases.

    Libertarians, anarchists and panarchists, whatever may be these shades of difference, all would be happy if other people would leave them to their own devices and not coerce them via governments.

    Fred Reed recently expressed a degree of panarchist belief when he separated living in a country from consent to its government:

    “A fruitful field of disengagement might be called domestic expatriation – the recognition that living in a country makes you a resident, not a subscriber. It is one thing to be loyal to a government that is loyal to you, another thing entirely to continue that loyalty when the Brown Shirts march and the government rejects everything that you believe in. While the phrase has become unbearably pretentious, it is possible to regard oneself as a citizen of the world rather than of the Reich.”

    This passage refers to a given person residing in a country without consenting (subscribing) to a government. This statement is consistent with panarchism. It contrasts sharply with the exercise of the right of revolution of an entire people that Jefferson proposes in the Declaration of Independence:

    “That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government…”

    Jefferson reserved a right of revolution to an entire people. Panarchism does not preclude this possibility, but this is really not how revolutions proceed. Usually they are led by small groups that manage to install new and coercive governments. By contrast, panarchism is brought into being by any size group, from one person on up, that is able to release itself from coercive government restrictions to any degree.

    To panarchists, the right to alter government is not a right only of “the people” as a whole but of every single person. Freedom is at the level of each person. It is not necessarily an idea belonging to an aggregate called “the people”. However, whatever person or group or people can gain a freedom-expanding concession from government by removing some coercion, even if others do not, is altering its relation to government. A partial abolition of some facet of government occurs.

    For example, there are 564 Indian tribes (nations) in America that currently have their own relations, as peoples, with the U.S. government. This number is not fixed. The Amish do not have a separate nation within a nation but their church officials led a campaign that ended in 1965 with the Old Order Amish not having to pay social security taxes. On the other hand, the government (through the Food and Drug Administration) is enforcing restrictions on Amish sales of unpasteurized milk to willing customers.

    Lysander Spooner criticized the Constitution as not being a contract among known individuals who agreed to it and signed it. Spooner’s analysis of consent reaches the point where he writes

    “The question, then, returns, what is implied in a government’s resting on consent?

    “Manifestly this one thing (to say nothing of the others) is necessarily implied in the idea of a government’s resting on consent, viz: the separate, individual consent of every man who is required to contribute, either by taxation or personal service, to the support of the government.”

    “Separate, individual consent of every man” is the key conclusion of any logical analysis of consent such as Spooner’s. This is the panarchist view. Panarchists are aiming for each and every person to get out from under a government that is not of their choice. Jefferson wrote

    “That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.”

    Panarchists take this seriously. Consent of the governed does not mean consent of an arbitrary group that someone designates as “a people” or as “the people”. It means individual consent.

    It is the case that some persons wish to be coerced by a government in certain matters. They accept that government willingly and allow such coercion. In this choice there is no diminishment of their freedom. But when that government coerces other persons who do not accept that government’s rule, then those involuntarily-coerced persons suffer a loss of freedom.

    Those people who want their governments to coerce them in certain activities or want their goverments to have certain powers over them have a right to erect such governments; but they do not have a right to erect their coercive governments over other people who do not want them or choose them.

    One denies freedom to others when one denies them their right to consent to coercive governments for themselves. Libertarians and anarchists cannot make others free by abolishing their governments – not if those people want them. Efforts to persuade others of the virtues of life without government should not be misconstrued as attempts to infringe upon the right to choose one’s government – even a coercive government at that.

    Whoever supports the most extensive freedom of every person cannot favor governments that coerce people who do not wish to be coerced, but they can tolerate governments whose subjects consent to them, as long as they keep their coercion limited to those who consent.

    The loss of freedom today is very large because today’s governments exercise extensive powers upon non-consenting persons as a routine matter. Since these powers touch so very many aspects of people’s lives, freedom of the person is vastly diminished. This would not be the case if governments allowed exit or personal secession within the country; but, to the contrary, they nearly always exclude the freedom of each person to exit from a government’s rule while remaining in the country. Governments punish attempts to exit. Governments punish attempts to live under alternative rules and laws.

    The freedom to exit the oppressions of unwanted government is a long-sought centuries-old goal, often accomplished through migration or physical exit from a country. This goal is far from being a reality. Present-day governments with constitutions would have us believe that all of us are free because of various voting procedures or some semblance of rule of law, but of course all of us are not free. Most of us can find many denials of freedom in our lives.

    Libertarian calls for greater freedom and libertarian statements that many people in this and other “free” countries lack freedom often meet with denial, resentment and anger. Libertarians are sometimes told to pack up and leave if they don’t like it. This suggestion only proves that the freedom to exit is exactly that freedom which people do not currently possess, for freedom to exit from a government means freedom to choose one’s government where one lives.

    It is undeniably true that one may expatriate or emigrate as a means of seeking greater freedom, but why should a person have to move? Being forced to move in order to exit a government means that one is subject to a government’s coercion. Moving should be voluntary. One’s country and one’s land are not the same as the government that claims to rule that country and the persons living in that land. Leaving the country, leaving one’s land, and leaving one’s relations and relationships behind in order to exit a government is not a solution consistent with full freedom. That action is chosen by some only because the government coercively claims jurisdiction over territory and all persons within that territory. Those who leave their country are being involuntarily coerced into a second-best solution.

    Panarchists point out that territory is the heart of the matter. Territory is the device by means of which governments inflict uniformity of law when what is required for full freedom is non-uniformity of law within a given land. One person’s government may wish to forbid drugs for its subscribers, but another person’s government may not. One person’s government may wish to coerce everyone into a health insurance policy while another person’s may not. One person’s government may wish to tax its subjects, arm some of them and attack Libya while another person’s government may not. A high degree of freedom in a land or country cannot occur when government is government by territory and when that government possesses power over many facets of life and living.

    All of Spooner’s No Treason is worth reading carefully. Spooner wrote of the Civil War

    “The principle, on which the war was waged by the North, was simply this: That men may rightfully be compelled to submit to, and support, a government that they do not want; and that resistance, on their part, makes them traitors and criminals.

    “No principle, that is possible to be named, can be more self-evidently false than this; or more self-evidently fatal to all political freedom.”

    Majority rule doesn’t determine right. Freely-given consent is the support of a government of free persons:

    “Majorities and minorities cannot rightfully be taken at all into account in deciding questions of justice. And all talk about them, in matters of government, is mere absurdity. Men are dunces for uniting to sustain any government, or any laws, except those in which they are all agreed. And nothing but force and fraud compel men to sustain any other. To say that majorities, as such, have a right to rule minorities, is equivalent to saying that minorities have, and ought to have, no rights, except such as majorities please to allow them.”

    The only way that persons can all agree to a set of laws and a government within what we call a country like America is to abandon the idea that a government must be territorial. A government of free people is not marked by borders and territory imposed by government or arrived at by wile, treachery, seizure, and warfare, but by people who freely consent or subscribe to it. Instead of the territorial notion of government, or the notion that majority rules in a given territory, government is properly thought of as something to which a group of persons willingly subscribe, while leaving other groups to subscribe to their preferred governments or none at all.

    If some persons form a government, what right do they have to govern, make laws and tax everyone within a territory that their government claims, even those who do not consent? None. Governments routinely rule out secession by their claims to territory and their claims to rule over everyone within that territory. They back up these claims by force, not right.

    It is when governments peacefully allow exceptions to their coercive laws for some persons or groups, or recognize different laws for different groups within their borders, or allow some lands to escape their jurisdiction, or allow peoples to secede and form their own governments that we get movement in the direction of greater freedom.

    There are many separatist movements throughout the world. They struggle. This is because governments and majorities refuse freedom to minorities. It is quite often the case that groups seeking to end the domination of one government behave no differently from the government they seek to replace or secede from. They often believe in coercing those who may fall into its newly-won domain as defined by a new set of borders. Even secessionists fail to recognize that the principle of secession as a bulwark of freedom of the person can only be applied consistently right down to the personal level.

    The right or freedom personally and individually to choose one’s government goes largely unrecognized, unacknowledged and unsupported. It is not only not taken seriously in today’s world by almost everyone, it is a freedom that is denied by governments worldwide and denied with force of arms and bloodshed.

    Consent of the governed should be a matter of clear, open and free choice of each person. Consent of the governed cannot be inferred from a situation in which government has the guns and individual persons obey, or in which citizens must follow a set of highly complex voting procedures, determined by governments and parties, within and bounded by bordered territories in which governments reign without competition.

    The usual ways to alter this situation are unusual. They involve revolutions, rebellions, and bloody secessionist movements; and they often lead right back to governments that are territorial. The alternative is to recognize the right to choose one’s government and that government need not necessarily be territorial.

    Across the world, people are automatically placed beneath and under governments by virtue of where they happen to live. The spot of territory where one happens to be born or where one spends one’s life is the criterion that governments use in order to identify, tag, monitor and coerce people. The territorial principle that governments invoke is, with few exceptions, that all those people within its borders are its subjects or citizens, regardless of whether or not they willingly accept the coercions that such a government entails. Governments at all levels do not allow people under them to opt out. They do not allow secession down to the personal level, which is what freedom to choose one’s government actually means.

    Governments fight tooth and nail against secession. The very existence of these governments as territorially-coercive entities is why they fight secession, and this resistance to secession is clear proof that today’s governments are coercing people who do not want to be coerced.

    Government by territory and by coercion within territory cannot be reconciled with full freedom of the person and consent of the governed. At the extremes, it is one or the other. In between the extremes, which is life as we know it, there is a constant struggle that moves us toward greater coercion or toward fuller freedom of the person.

    Who has the gall to tell the Amish that if they do not like the government’s milk regulations that they can jolly well pack up and leave the country? The FDA does. The government does. This is the government’s policy and if you live in this country, you shall obey.

    Almost every American today is the Amish. Everyone must obey all sorts of objectionable uniform laws and regulations, without exception. Love it here or leave. The reason for this connection is force, not justice. This is coercive government by territory. It is not government by consent.

    September 27, 2011

    Michael S. Rozeff [send him mail] is a retired Professor of Finance living in East Amherst, New York. He is the author of the free e-book Essays on American Empire: Liberty vs. Domination and the free e-book The U.S. Constitution and Money: Corruption and Decline.

    Copyright © 2011 by LewRockwell.com. Permission to reprint in whole or in part is gladly granted, provided full credit is given.

    The Best of Michael S. Rozeff

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    28th September 2011 at 7:53 pm

  47. Smokey says:

    flash,

    Keep motherfucking the country and calling yourself a patriot.

    You LIED, as your club always does. You were exposed and now you are pissed off.

    Don’t get angry. You can’t help it.

    You and your Hate-America club members are hardwired to motherfuck this country. You have no choice, because it is genetically driven.

    The hate for this country is in your fucking DNA. Don’t get angry at me for exposing something that is so screamingly obvious. You have posted dozens of comments declaring to the world that America has a rich tradition of mass murdering innocent people.

    You are EXTREMELY conflicted.

    On the one hand, repeatedly motherfucking America and bragging about all of the (perceived) transgressions. On the other hand, claiming to be a true patriot. LOL

    Do you still stand by your earlier claim that America historically is no worse than Mao, Hitler, and Stalin? Or are you going to back off now that the remark has gotten some scrutiny on this thread?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 8:01 pm

  48. Smokey says:

    No, flash, I didn’t take it personal.

    Words on a blog.

    If you and I are to do battle, you may want to recruit some help. I have many fine enemies on this site who would be glad to team up with you.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 8:07 pm

  49. flash says:

    Smokey, if you can take time out of licking your own bung hole, take a gander at this.
    This data doesn’t even take into account the mass bombing campaigns carried out agaisnt civlians in WWII or the mass murder committed against Southerners, Indians,
    Cubans , Philippinos,ect.

    It don’t take no turd polishing ,ass jockey to figure that if all missing data were available, the death toll would likely range in the high millions.

    Suck on that bitch.

    http://nottheenemy.com/index_files/Death%20Counts/Death%20Counts.htm

    Data from William Blum book, “Rogue State” supplemented by casulty data from various sources
    Last Revised: 20-Jul-03 12:30

    Low High Reference
    1945-1951 China ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 126-7 reports US funded war against Mao Tse-tung’s Communists, even though Mao had been a US ally in the fight against the Japanese during WWII.

    1947 France ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 127 reports US agency hired “Corsican gangs” to terrorize and murder Communists who were running for election.

    1946-1958 Marshall Islands ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 127-8, author reports how the US nuked the Marshall Islands, contaminating the land and food eaten by the locals — who were evacuated.

    1947-1970s Italy ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 128 reports decades of CIA interference against alleged Communists and Socialists who were running for elected office.

    1947-1949 Greece ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 128 states US intervened in a Civil War, backing a fascist regime that was “highly brutal” for 15 years

    1945-1953 Philippines ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 128-9 notes that the US backed Phillipine military in fighting the “leftist Huks,” then interfered with elections and got famed torturer Ferdinand Marcos into office.

    1945-1953 Korea 3,000,000 4,500,000 Robin Miller, “Washington’s Own Love Affair with Terror,” ZNet magazine: http://www.zmag.org/millerterror.htm. He reports that “3,000,000 civilians” killed comes from: Jon Halliday and Bruce Cumings, Korea: The Unknown War, NY: Pantheon Books, 1988, p. 200 (two million North Korean civilian deaths and one million South Korean). See also http://www.gliah.uh.edu/historyonline/con_korea.cfm (2-3 million civilian deaths). Joel Andreas, “Addicted to War” p 13 cites “4,500,00 died.”

    1949-1953 Albania William Blum, “Rogue State” (2000), Common Courage Press, p. 129 “Hundreds of emigres lost their lives or were imprisoned”

    1948-1956 Eastern Europe 200 300 Ibid., p. 129 “…at least hundreds of deaths.” 200 – 300 inserted as a modest quantification of “hundreds.”

    1950s Germany ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 129, Blum notest that CIA conducted “wide ranging campaign of sabotage (and) terror” against the East Germans.

    1953 Iran 6,000 16,000 Reza Baraheni The Crowned Cannibals (1977): 6,000 killed , Rummel: 16,000 democides: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat6.htm#Chile

    1953-1990s Guatemala 100,000 200,000 Report from United Nations Truth Commission. Number includes more than 600 masacres. Heard on KPFA Nov 13, 2002. Also, Jennifer Harbury (1995). “Bridge of Courage,” Common Courage Press, p. 21, “…200,000 unarmed civilians…” Mark Zepezauer, (1994) “The CIA’s Greatest Hits,” Odonian Press, p. 13, “The CIA … inaugurated a series of bloodthirsty regimes that murdered more than 100,000 civilians over the next 40 years.”

    mid 1950s, 1970-1971 Costa Rica ? ? William Blum, Rogue State, p. 131 reports repeated attempts to oust and assassinate President Jose Figueres.

    1956-1958 Middle East ? ? William Blum, Rogue State, p. 132 reports attempts to overthrow Syrian government, to “overthrow or assassinate Nasser of Egypt” and sending 14,000 troops into Lebanon.

    1957-1986 Haiti 3,000 60,000 William Blum, Rogue State, p. 132. In 1959 “…US military…smash an attempt to overthrow Duvalier.” Between 1957 – 1986 “3,000 democides (Rummel), 60,000 k 9 Dec 1998 London Guardian, 60,000 16 July 1986 L.A. Times.” http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat5.htm#Haiti

    1950s-1960s Western Europe William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 132-3 reports that for 20 years the CIA ran massive anti-Communist anti-Socialist propaganda campaigns, funding “political parties, magazines, news agencies, and journalists…”

    1953-1964 British Guiana / Guya ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 133 reports US toppled multiple governments in this country.

    1958-1963 Iraq 3,400 3,700 William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 134 “…thousands of communists were killed.” Iraq (1959-66)
    Coups: Govt. vs. Shammar Tribe, et al., 1959: WHPSI: 2,300, Eckhardt: 1,000 civ. + 1,000 mil. = 2,000, Small & Singer: 2,000, 1963: 1,400 (WHPSI) found at http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat7.htm#Iraq

    1940s-1960s Soviet Union William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 134 notes that during this period the US sent “many hundreds” of sabateurs into the Soviet Union. Also, that during the period the CIA participated in an anti-Soviet book publishing effort that produced over 1,000 secretly sponsored books.

    1945-1973 Vietnam 3,800,000 3,800,000 Attorney General Robert MacNamara in May 1999 Commonwealth Club of SF speech + Govt of Vietnam. As this number is “official,” it is posted as the “low” and “high”

    1955-1973 Cambodia 500,000 1,000,000 Documentary, “The Trials of Henry Kissenger,” 2002, estimated Cambodian casualties @ 500,000. See 1962-1975 Laos. website: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat2.htm

    1957-1973 Laos 70,000 250,000 Mark Zepezauer, (1994) “The CIA’s Greatest Hits,” Odonian Press, p. 42, reports 2,000,000 tons of bombs dropped on Laos by U.S. in “secret” war. Wallechinsky, 1959-75: 250,000 deaths and Rummel, 1954-75: War Dead: 32,000, Democide: 38,000 for a TOTAL: 70,000 at http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat2.htm

    1965-1973 Thailand ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 136-7 reports that during this period the US used bases in Thailand to bomb Vietnam. At the same time, the US backed Thai police and the Thai dictator to put down resistance to the US presence.

    1960-1963 Ecuador ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 137 reports that US backed coup against President Jose Maria Velasco following his refusal to back US policy on Cuba.

    1960-1965, 1977-1978 The Congo / Zaire ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 137-8 reports CIA backed coup against duly elected President Lumumba, who was assassinated, leading to the rise of Mobuto, a dictator who terrorized his own people. In 1977-8, President Jimmy Carter sent troops in to what had become Zaire to help Mubutu put down a rebellion.

    1960s France / Algeria ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 138 “…evidence indicates, the CIA was involved in an aborted plot to assinate the French president.”

    1961-1964 Brazil ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 138-9. US backed military coup that removed democratically elected President Goulart and yielded 15 years of military dictatorship, including disappearances, death squads, and torture.

    1965 Peru ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 139 “…US military proceeded to wipe out several guerrilla groups…”

    1963-1965 Dominican Republic ? 3,000 William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 139-40 states that US sent 23,000 troops into Domican Republic in order to prevent the restoration of the democratically elected president. Joel Andreas, “Addicted to War” p. 33 reports that “3,000 people were gunned down…”

    1959-2003 Cuba 20,000 “Fidel: The Untold Story” by Estella Bravo. Source documentary on Cuba 2002

    1965 Indonesia 500,000 2,000,000 Robin Miller, “Washington’s Own Love Affair with Terror,” ZNet magazine: http://www.zmag.org/millerterror.htm. He reports that the Indonesian govt admits killing 500,000 people, but that the Australian Secret Service put the figure at 2,000,000. He writes: “Some general sources on the slaughter: http://www.twf.org/News/Y1999/0915-Indonesia.html. http://dannyreviews.com/h/The_Indonesian_Killings.html. http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,530478,00.html.

    1966 Ghana William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 141 “…A CIA-backed coup sent” Kwame Nkrumah into exile…

    1969-1972 Uruguay William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 142 US trained Uruguans in torture and to set up death squads to put down rebellion.

    1964-1973-1990 Chile 5,000 30,000 William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 142-3 notes years of CIA anti-Salvador Allende efforts that eventually included assassination, book burnings, torture, disappearances, and death squads. US Govt and Grenville est 5,000; Human Rights Groups, 30,000: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat6.htm#Chile

    1967-1974 Greece ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 143-4 notes a 1967 CIA backed coup yielded the Greeks, censorship, torture, and murder.

    1960s-1980s South Africa ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 144 notes the CIA weighed in on the side of racist South African govt against the black majority. Ploughshares 2000: 7,000 since 1990; Truth and Reconciliation Commission Political violence: >12,000 (7/90-12/93)

    1964-1975 Bolivia ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 144-5, notes CIA backed coup overthrew President Victor Paz…

    1972-1975 Australia ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 145, notes US & British pushed for dismissal of Prime Minister Edward Gough Whitlam.

    1972-1975 Iraq ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 145, notes US provided covert aid to Kurds, then cut them off and allowed hundreds to be executed.

    1974-1976 Portugal ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 146, US backed covert and overt aid to elected Portugese officials persisted until US backed candidates prevailed.

    1975-1999 East Timor 200,000 200,000 Matthew Jardine, “East Timor: Genocide in Paradise,” Common Courage Press, see: http://www.officeoftheamericas.org/books/genocide_in_paradise/genocide_contents.htm#Contents. William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 146-7 reports Amnesty International also reports 200,000 figure

    1975-1980s Angola 300,000 800,000 Mark Zepezauer, (1994) “The CIA’s Greatest Hits,” Odonian Press, pp. 54-55. William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 147 notes US, China & South Africa backed one faction while the other was backed by Cuba and the Soviet Union, prolonging a war that cost “perhaps half a million lives.” Washington Post 650,000 to 800,000: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat3.htm#Ang75

    1976 Jamaica ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp 147-8 notes inteference in Jamaican elections

    1980s Honduras ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p 148 notes US turned Honduras into a base from which other military operations could be launched, while simultaneously controlling Honduran politics.

    1978-1990 Nicaragua 30,000 50,000 William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 148-9 notes US used “Contra” as mercenaries to overthrow Sandanista government. 30,000 (Britannica), 50,000 (Chomsky) http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat4.htm#Nicaragua

    1970s-1990s Philippines 60,000 175,000 1. B&J: 60,000, Ploughshares 2000: Mindinao: 100,000-150,000 since 1971 + vs. NPA: 25,000 since 1969 for a TOTAL: 150,000 ± 25,000: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat4.htm#Philippines

    1979-1981 Seychelles ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 149-150 reports US was behind a failed invasion by mercenaries.

    1979-1984 South Yemen ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p.150 reports that US sent North Yemen weapons and paramility attack South Yemen.

    1980 South Korea 200 2,000 William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp 150-1, reports US military joined Korean military in crushing a student uprising that sought and end to phony elections and torture. He notes reports of from “several hundred” to 2,000 deaths resulted and refers to Covert Action Information Bulletin, Dec 1980 p.9-15.

    1981-1982 Chad 40,000 40,000 William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 151-2 writes that US & France built up an Army of supposed peacekeepers in Chad. Instead, its leader Hissen Habre overthrew the government of Chad, installed himself, and had his secret police murder “tens of thousands” – with US support. 21 May 1992 Toronto Star, AP: 40,000 died in detention or executed, according to a government commission. Samuel Decalo, Historical Dictionary of Chad (1997): 40,000, Dictionary of 20C World History: 40,000: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat5.htm#Chad2

    1979-1983 Grenada 68 250 William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 152 reports that following a disinformation campaign, that US invaded in October 1983 and overthrew government. TOTAL: 250 (B&J) or 102 (War Annual) or 89 (Marley) or 68 (Rogozinski) reported at http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat7.htm#Grenada. Joel Andreas, “Addicted to War” reports that 100 civilians were killed during the US invasion of Grenada.

    1982-1984 Suriname 0 0 William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 152 reports a planned US covert invasion was cancelled following its disclosure.

    1982-1983 Lebanon 241 241 Joel Andreas, “Addicted to War” p. 15 reports that 241 Marines were killed by a truck bomb following US invasion of Lebanon to back the Israeli invasion.

    1981-1989 Libya 100 100 William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 153, reports assassination attempts, sanctions, disinformation campaigns, aircraft shot down, and Qaddafi’s home bombed, “killing scores of people.”

    1984-1995 Turkey 30,000 50,000 PRESS RELEASE
    Armenian National Committee of Eastern Massachusetts, Chomsky Addresses Armenian Forum, Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002, http://www.hraic.org/chat/chomsky.html, Robert Fisk, “Turkey Targets Chomsky,” http://www.counterpunch.org/fiskchomsky.html. Fisks reports “tens of thousands” of Turkish Kurds killed and 2 to 3 million made refugees for 30,000.. Report, Dec 16, 1990, “Panama: “Operation Just Cause” – The Human Cost of the US Invasion, by Physicians for Human Rights. http://www.phrusa.org/research/health_effects/humojc.html gives 50,000.

    1987 Fiji ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p. 153-4 indicates that it appears that the US Govt provoked a coup in order to end Fiji’s anti-nuclear policy that prohibited “visits” by US ships.

    1989 Panama 200 3,000 Report, Dec 16, 1990, “Panama: “Operation Just Cause” – The Human Cost of the US Invasion, by Physicians for Human Rights reports 614. http://www.phrusa.org/research/health_effects/humojc.html. US Govt said to report 200, NY Times 4/1/1990 673 and Joint delegation of CODEHUCA + CONADEHUP 2,000 – 3,000 at http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat7.htm#Panama

    1979-1992 Afghanistan 875,000 1,500,000 at website: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat2.htm source USAID study at 875,000 and Britannica Annual (1994) at 1,500,000

    1980-1992 El Salvador 70,000 80,000 Britannica: 70,000, Dict.Wars: 80,000: http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat4.htm

    1987-1994 Haiti ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p 157-8, blum writes that U.S. interfered in Albania elections.

    1990-1991 Bulgaria ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” p 157 notes that US Government interfered with 1990 elections and after the Communist candidate won anyway, the US then pressured the Bulgarians until their govt collapsed.

    1991-1992 Albania William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp 157-8.

    1993 Somalia 500 1000 William Blum, “Rogue State,” p.158 “500 to 1,000″ Somalians killed” by the U.S. — in one battle + 18 Americans dead.

    1990-2002 Iraq 1,158,000 1,500,000 Thomas Ginsberg, The Philadelphia Inquirer, Jan 5, 2003. Reports that 158,000 “Iraqi men, women and children died during and shortly after the Persian Gulf war.” Joel Andreas, “Addicted to War” p. 25 echos that figure and adds that “over one million Iraqis” were killed by the devastation and sanctions. Attorney General Ramsey Clark in speech given in Washington D.C. demonstration, October 26, 2002, estimated deaths at 1,500,000.

    1991 Iraq 0 500,000 Robert Collier, “Iraq links cancers to uranium weapons…” San Francisco Chronicle, Jan 13, 2003, states that a 1991 Britain’s Atomic Energy Authority study concluded that the use of Depleted Uranium against Iraq by the U.S. and Britain “could eventually” kill an additional 500,000 people by causing cancer. A U.N. subcommittee designated DU as a “weapon of mass destruction.” http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2003/01/13/MN233872.DTL

    1990s-present Peru ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp 160-1, author notes that U.S. has been helping Peruvian government fight guerilla movement, while claiming to be there helping to fight the war on drugs.

    1990s-present Mexico ? ? William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 161-2 points out that U.S. has supplied weapons, training, and support to Mexican military that engages in torture and masacres of the Zapatistas.

    1990s-present Colombia 17,000 17,000 William Blum, “Rogue State,” pp. 161-4, reports U.S. supplying military aid to fight FARC, a political movement. He reports that a 1994 “Amnesty International report estimated that more than 20,000 Colombians had been killed between 1986-1994. Claimed that “Washington Post (15, Jan 1996) 17,000 deaths, 1990-94 at http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat4.htm#Col. Totals apparently run much higher when including the pre-U.S. ? years of the 1970s and 1980s.

    1995-1999 Yugoslavia 500 2,500 Michael Parenti (2000), “To Kill A Nation,” Verso, NY, pp. 122-123. 500 “low” is an estimate from Human Rights Watch. Belgrade is reported to have stated 500 military and 2,000 civilians were killed.

    2001-present Afghanistan 3,100 49,600 Research study published December 10 by Marc W. Herold, Professor of Economics, International Relations, and Women’s Studies at the University of New Hampshire. http://www.commondreams.org/news2001/1210-01.htm and http://pubpages.unh.edu/%7Emwherold/. Claimed that “Time” Oct 14, 2002 reports 5,000 Taliban and Al Qaeda killed. While (London) Guardian is claimed to have reported 49,600 “war-related avoidable deaths” cited at http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/wars21c.htm#USTerror.

    2003 Iraq 6071 7,780 Getting added up at http://www.IraqBodyCount.net as of 7/20/2003
    147 224 US casualties in Iraq 2003: see http://www.mediareform.net/news.php?id=673 reporting “Editor and Publisher” 17 July 2003.
    2003 ? Syria ? to be determined…
    2004 ? North Korea ? to be determined…
    2005 ? Iran ? to be determined…
    ========== ==========
    10,778,727 16,861,695 KILLED

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    28th September 2011 at 8:08 pm

  50. flash says:

    Smokey says: If you and I are to do battle, you may want to recruit some help. I have many fine enemies on this site who would be glad to team up with you.

    Need help? Just act retarded…works for RE.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 8:09 pm

  51. flash says:

    I’m out…wasted enough bandwidth on this subject….believe the lies.
    Ignorance is bliss.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 8:10 pm

  52. DavosSherman says:

    Flash, Smokey calls that fine list of indisputable facts – “embassies”.

    Here is a picture of a Smokey Embassy.

    WIC_tactical_aid_carpet_bombing.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 8:15 pm

  53. Dave Doe says:

    Oh, so that’s why they call him Smokey. Got it.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 8:19 pm

  54. Colma Rising says:

    Ahhh… like the good ol’ days.

    Flash: Don’t be a poon. You and Smokey might need to team up on a BBES thread, and certainly if a cum-guzzler shows up trolling… now that you’re back, I might have something ready for the weekend that’ll rile you up into old form.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 8:57 pm

  55. Smokey says:

    See flash, you take off and another charter member of your club shows up to back you.

    Shit, he could even have helped you “no wholes barred”.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:03 pm

  56. DavosSherman says:

    Dave, that is Smokey’s idea of a 2 trillion dollar “embassy” and those pilots, navigators and bombarders are “ambassadors” delivering “kind words” in 156 out of 198 countries.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:08 pm

  57. llpoh says:

    Smokey – sorry I am out of touch. Youu know better than 1) to fight with flash as all you get back is pages of the dictionary and 2) to attach specific dates to predictions. Remind Adminn how his prediction of a US led war in the middle east before the last congressional elections is working out for him. I am still waiting to see that one come to pass.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:08 pm

  58. Dave Doe says:

    Davos,

    LOL, I guess he could have gone for DaisyCutter for more flair but it all makes sense now.

    Spreading the gospel world wide. Gotta love it.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:13 pm

  59. llpoh says:

    Colma – ggod idea to stay on Smokey’s good side. But for fuck sake do not feed the flash – it only encourages him.

    I am only able to follow this thread in general terms. However, their certainly seems to be a lot of pussies hanging around. Grow some hair on your balls y’all.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:15 pm

  60. Buckhed says:

    Flash…I’ve said many times we should have a National Holiday for John Wilkes Boothe …..He gave Lincoln what he deserved…a bullet in the back of the head !

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 9:15 pm

  61. Colma Rising says:

    Davos dared not show up until it felt safe.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:19 pm

  62. Smokey says:

    llpoh,

    You missed a couple of thermonuclear threads while you were away.

    I had to fight solo, but I still routed the opposition with stunning ease despite going against about eight of them myself.

    If you had been here to help me, it would have been a laugher.

    Despite my overwhelming success solo, I look forward to your full time return.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 9:21 pm

  63. Administrator says:

    LLPOH

    Did you forget that we’re involved in 3 wars in the middle east? These things happen at your age? Don’t catch any crabs.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:23 pm

  64. Administrator says:

    llpoh shows up to caress Smokey’s balls and say go get em big guy.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:24 pm

  65. llpoh says:

    Back next week. Let them quake in fearful anticipation.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:25 pm

  66. Administrator says:

    Smokey and LLPOH longing for each other. Don’t ask, don’t tell.

    6a0105364a8fba970c014e885b3483970d-800wi

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    28th September 2011 at 9:27 pm

  67. Dave Doe says:

    LLPOH what does LLPOH stand for. Lots of Luck Phising for Halibut?

    Can you provide any football picks we can bet against. That would be the most helpful thing for Smokey right now.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:30 pm

  68. DavosSherman says:

    “Davos dared not show up until it felt safe.”

    Fuck that assinine sound.

    I did some work today after pinning Smokey’s chest down with my knees like some dickhead NYC Pig. Where the fuck were you yesterday when the Smokester was calling 3 wars and massive military occupation in 156 out of 198 countries “embassies”?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:32 pm

  69. Smokey says:

    I will say this in all honesty and sincerity.

    If I even knew where to find that kind of sick shit on the web, I would consider myself in deep need of psychiatric evaluation.

    You may as well post dog dicks here.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 4 Thumb down 5

    28th September 2011 at 9:32 pm

  70. llpoh says:

    Admin – envious aren’t you. How is that prediction going by the way. I haven’t forgot that one. I distinctly remember calling bs.

    Smokey doesn’t need help. He will get it anyway. Let the cowering commence.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 6

    28th September 2011 at 9:34 pm

  71. Administrator says:

    Smokey

    Tell the truth. It moved, didn’t it? You’re among friends. Tell the truth. We’ll support your man love for LLPOH.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 3 Thumb down 5

    28th September 2011 at 9:38 pm

  72. Smokey says:

    Life Liberty Pursuit of Happiness,

    I beat these curs beyond recognition yesterday and today. They were begging for mercy, but the beatdown was vicious and relentless. For a change, the Administrator was not getting the worst of it. He knew from past experience what would happen if he went all in, so he steered clear.

    I was constantly waiting for him to tell me, “Lay off, Smokey. It’s not worth it. You’re going to kill them all. Please Smokey, I’m begging you, there will be nothing left. Think of their families. “

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 9:39 pm

  73. Dave Doe says:

    To cancel out the shit above. That shit is bad karma – even for Smokey and LLPOH.

    0317_sex_tips_couple_making_out_sm.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:40 pm

  74. Administrator says:

    llpoh enters the arena buzzing like an annoying fly, swatted by the Administrator.

    Buzzzzz

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:41 pm

  75. llpoh says:

    Admin – you. Said the U0s would create the conflict. Bad call there.

    Smokey – admin has flash to back him up. Nice. Tells you all you need to know re who is winning.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 9:41 pm

  76. llpoh says:

    “The US”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 9:43 pm

  77. Colma Rising says:

    Just keeping the peace, llpoh…. let us know how the exploits on the high seas went later… and as I always say, don’t ask us to smell your finger.

    Admin: Isn’t it bed time? Not the image to retire to.

    Davos: I lurked yesterday and, as usual, watched as Smokey dispached a horde of hippy curs with ease.Good try, but heart and ferocity won the day.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:45 pm

  78. Administrator says:

    llpoh

    I hope you are at sea. It’s the only safe place on the planet. Smokey’s imminent terrorist attack is imminent. Suitcase nukes are planted all over the country and ready to be detonated imminently.

    Get back here soon so you and Smokey can passionately defeat the curs. Does your wife know about your man crush on Smokey?

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:46 pm

  79. DavosSherman says:

    “I beat these curs beyond recognition yesterday and today. They were begging for mercy, but the beatdown was vicious and relentless.”

    And carpet bombing 2 year olds is doing peace work from the embassy.

    Proof that there are 4 categories “people” fall into:

    1.) The Delusional
    2.) The Pessimist
    3.) The Realist
    4.) The Optimist

    And I can always spot the Delusinalist because they mistake the Realist for the Pessimist and try to turn them into an Optimist.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:47 pm

  80. AWD says:

    Which one of you is da bitch?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:48 pm

  81. Smokey says:

    LLPOH,

    The Administrator had MANY to hide behind while you were away.

    Platopubics, Davos, flash, TeresaE, Stuck and several more.

    Hey, they wanted some. They got some.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 9:48 pm

  82. Buddabull says:

    The fuse has been lit. They need every diversion that they could think of to keep the people from seeing what is really going on. South America is looking better everyday.

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 9:49 pm

  83. Dave Doe says:

    I still have a bad taste in my mouth. Let’s try this — grrrrhhrhhh. Yes, that’s better.
    5cc6b384d58c00f54fb10808e7c9a746.jpg

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:49 pm

  84. llpoh says:

    Man I cannot wait til I get my hands on a computer. Interesting Admin has ready access to. Those pics. Perhaps he subscribves to Twinkies R Us. Admin has decided that rather than face up to his bad calls himself he will mislead and post gay porn. Good. I know now that the gloves are off. No rules – my favorite. It will be ball kicking time soon enough. Better wear a cuup.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 9:51 pm

  85. AWD says:

    DD:

    Pictures of chicks don’t get rid of cock-breath.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:52 pm

  86. Smokey says:

    LLPOH,

    I’ve never had to straighten out Davos before.

    But, hey. He wanted to dance so we danced.

    He’ll be having nightmares and waking in cold sweats reliving the savage pummeling for months.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 9:53 pm

  87. Administrator says:

    llpoh

    Do you and Smokey take the gloves off? I’d highly recommend that you keep the gloves on. Longing for each other on the blog is really pathetic. Doesn’t wearing a cup interfere with your fun?

    I hope you get back to kick our asses before the terrorists reek havoc upon our land. Our way of life is imminently in danger.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 9:58 pm

  88. llpoh says:

    Does Mrs Admin know about your gay porn stash?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 9:58 pm

  89. Smokey says:

    LLPOH,

    Administrator talks about man-love.

    It was a disgrace that all these curs had their tongues out fighting over who had first dibs on ramming it up Ron Paul’s hershey highway.

    I mean, there were about eight or ten of them sucking Ron Paul’s shriveled pecker right here on this site. And the hell of it is, they ALL think Ron Paul can win.

    And I’d fuck with ‘em about how RP has no chance, and then they’d get delirious and rabid. It was a fucking scream. You missed some fun.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 10:00 pm

  90. Administrator says:

    llpoh

    All I did was google “llpoh and Smokey” and that picture came up. Yikes!!!!

    If I google “imminent terrorist attack” the same picture comes up. Yikes!!!!!

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 10:01 pm

  91. Administrator says:

    Do you and Smokey have dreams about a three way with Dick Cheney?

    Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 10:04 pm

  92. llpoh says:

    Mewthinks Admin is preoccupied with gay stuff. A bit closeted maybe?

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 5 Thumb down 5

    28th September 2011 at 10:08 pm

  93. Administrator says:

    Don’t worry llpoh. This is a libertarian site. Whatever you and Smokey do on your own time is your own business. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 10:11 pm

  94. llpoh says:

    When admin dreams of RP I wonder who is on top.

    It is pitiful he thinks RP can win. Even RP knows better. Talk about a man crush.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 3 Thumb down 5

    28th September 2011 at 10:13 pm

  95. Smokey says:

    llpoh,

    There does seem to be an obsession there.

    I’d bet he’d come out of the closet for Ron Paul.

    In a New York second.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 10:13 pm

  96. Smokey says:

    10:13 pm Both barrels.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 4 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 10:15 pm

  97. llpoh says:

    I forgot – go Eagles. Bwahahaha. Perhaps if they had paid Vick a few more million it would have made a difference. Always a good idea to give a ghetto rat lots of money. It really motivates them.

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 3 Thumb down 5

    28th September 2011 at 10:18 pm

  98. Administrator says:

    llpoh

    Mewthinks you’re poking your phone a little too angrily. Calm down. Take a deep breath and think of Smokey. Your two-man gang is unbeatable. We await your imminent return. Have you called in your stone cold lock football bets? Smokey assures us he can’t lose with this week’s picks.

    Have you caught anything besides crabs?

    Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 10:24 pm

  99. Administrator says:

    How’s your favorite player Tony Homo doing? I understand his picture is next to the word choke in the dictionary.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 10:26 pm

  100. llpoh says:

    Romo sucks but they are still 2 and 1.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4

    28th September 2011 at 10:32 pm

  101. Administrator says:

    I smell Super Bowl. Maybe that dickhead owner can spend another billion to get a quarterback that isn’t a pussy choke artist.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 10:36 pm

  102. llpoh says:

    Decision decisions – would I rather have a choke aerist or a whiny never won nothing felon with the morals of a guuer rat and an oversized contract guaranteed to result in demotivating him. Hmmm. I will take. Romo. But I would rather have Colt McCoy.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3

    28th September 2011 at 11:25 pm

  103. matt says:

    Admin is beating down smokester and llpoh with a flurry of lefts and rights. llpoh is furiously paddling back to shore to help ol’ man smoke locate his missing eyeball from the beating. what will happen next?

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 11:27 pm

  104. Colma Rising says:

    SSS:

    Be wary, Salma, and women in general are not easy to forget infidelity of any sort.

    Admin, llpoh:

    You’re smoking stanky digity-dank. You can take it to the bank:

    49ers +10 on the Eagles this weekend.

    Mortal Lock.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 1:21 am

  105. Colma Rising says:

    006BDS_Salma_Hayek_012.jpg

    “Giada? How could you, SSS, HOW COULD YOU?”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 1:37 am

  106. flash says:

    It does seem that the asshole that be are gearing We the US for a real hot war @ the tops of the world.
    For the simpletons that think the military has the nations best interest at heart, here how it workz.
    The military is controlled by politicians who are themselves controlled by corporations which profit off the war via weapons sales and resource access.
    Don’t take my word for it?How about the word of a Two-Time Congressional Medal of Honor Recipient ,Major General Smedley D. Butler”
    WAR IS A RACKET
    http://www.lexrex.com/enlightened/articles/warisaracket.htm
    Always has been.

    And we are just pawns in the game ….expendable if you will.
    As my drill Sergeant once said, it’s mind over matter, I don’t mind and you don’t matter.

    Check out Eric Margolis , on the next big ass smoker. …hand in glove with PCR’s gist, something is cookin’ and it don’t smell all that great.

    Forget Libya or Syria. Worry About Kashmir!

    by Eric Margolis

    Recently by Eric Margolis: Take Up the White Man’s Burden

    Does anyone remember Kashmir? Well, we certainly should. If nuclear war ever breaks out, the most likely place would be in Kashmir.

    The fabled state of Kashmir lies in majestic isolation amid the towering mountain ranges of the Himalayas and Karakoram that separate the torrid plains of north India from the steppes and deserts of Central Asia.

    Nineteenth Century geopoliticians called Kashmir one of the world’s primary strategic pivots. My book War at the Top of the World was written to help warn of the manifest dangers coming from this complex, little-known confrontation which is the world’s longest running border conflict.

    The state human rights commission of the Indian-ruled portion of divided Kashmir just reported its investigators had found 2,156 bodies buried in unmarked graves in 38 different locations. Most were young men. Many bore bullets wounds.

    Grisly and horrifying as this discovery was, there was hardly a peep from India’s allies, notably the United States and Britain, who have raised such a hue and cry over alleged civilian deaths in Libya, Iran and Syria. India shrugged off the report.

    There may be many more bodies to be found. Most, or all, were the product of the decades-old uprising by Kashmir’s Muslim majority against often brutal Indian rule that the outside world has largely ignored.

    Historic Kashmir, with its distinctive Indo-European and Tibetan-Mongol peoples, has ended up divided between three nations: India, Pakistan, and China.

    Some nine million Kashmiris live in the Indian-ruled two thirds of Kashmir; over three million in the Pakistani portion, known as “Azad Kashmir,” or in Pakistan proper, and small numbers in the frigid, 15,000-20,000 ft high Aksai Chin plateau which is controlled by China.

    Kashmir’s Tibetan-race people mostly live in Indian-controlled Ladakh, long called “Little Tibet.” There, Tibetan culture has fared far better under Indian rule than in Chinese-ruled Tibet.

    When Imperial Britain divided India in 1947, the Hindu maharaja of Kashmir opted to join the new Indian Union. But 77% of his people were Muslim (20% were Hindu, 3% Sikh and Buddhist). Muslim Kashmiris wanted to join newly-created Pakistan. Fighting erupted. India and Pakistan rushed in troops.

    The cease-fire line that ended the fighting has become the de facto border between the Indian and Pakistani ruled parts of Kashmir. India claims all of Kashmir, including Chinese-occupied Aksai Chin. Pakistan also claims all of Kashmir. In 1948, the United Nations called for a plebiscite in Kashmir to decide this issue. Pakistan accepted; India refused the UN resolution.

    India and Pakistan have fought three full-scale wars over Kashmir and innumerable border clashes, some of which I have witnessed. Last week, three Pakistani soldiers were killed on Kashmir’s de facto border (called the Line of Control) by Indian fire.

    Today, hundreds of thousands of Pakistani and Indian troops confront one another on Kashmir’s cease-fire line, and further south in the plains of Punjab. They are backed by growing numbers of tactical nuclear weapons that are on a three-minute hair-trigger alert, making Kashmir the world’s most dangerous border.

    Kashmiri Muslims have resisted Indian rule since 1947. In the early 1990’s, massive uprisings erupted against Indian rule, which was enforced by 500,000 troops and ill-disciplined paramilitary police. Pakistan’s intelligence service, ISI, began training Kashmir “mujahidin” and sending them across the border to reinforce the uprising. But Pakistan’s covert support waned after 9/11.

    Indian authorities blamed the uprising on “cross-border terrorism.” Indian security forces struck back with maximum brutality, leading India’s human rights groups to denounce the repression.

    Muslim villages were burned; suspects were tortured; Muslim women were gang-raped by Indian border police; large numbers of young Muslim men were taken from villages and simply disappeared.

    Now we know where they went – filling many of the unmarked graves discovered last month.

    An estimated 80,000 Kashmiris have so far died in the uprising, the majority Muslims. Muslims also committed bloody atrocities against Hindus and Sikhs. Now, Indian rights groups are demanding that India’s high courts investigate the crimes that have been committed in Kashmir, put an end to them, and punish the guilty parties.

    Continued selective moral outrage on our part is unacceptable. India’s allies must encourage Delhi to face this ugly issue and end this blight on India’s democracy and good name. The outside world has to tell Delhi that if it wants to be a respected world power and have a seat on the UN Security Council, it must end the killing and torture in Kashmir. Pakistan must be reminded to stop stirring the pot.

    Resolving the Kashmir dispute will eliminate the gravest danger faced by mankind: an India-Pakistan nuclear exchange that could kill an estimated 2 million initially, 100 million thereafter, and spread clouds of radioactive dust around the globe.

    Kashmir has poisoned relations between sister nations Pakistan and India who are hopelessly locked in this sterile conflict. Desperately poor India and Pakistan waste tens of billions on military spending because of Kashmir. Clever Indian diplomacy has long kept the Kashmir conflict in the shadows.

    Time now for the world to get involved. The solution: let all the borders fade away. Turn Kashmir into an autonomous, demilitarized free trade zone.

    September 7, 2011

    Eric Margolis [send him mail] is the author of War at the Top of the World and the new book, American Raj: Liberation or Domination?: Resolving the Conflict Between the West and the Muslim World. See his website.

    Copyright © 2011 Eric Margolis

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 6:23 am

  107. flash says:

    Them game is on.It’s the Collectivist’s Uncle Tom against the Fascist’s Uncle Tom.
    Dueling Uncle Tom’s
    .A win ,win situation for the corporatist.
    Smacks of Deliverance to me.

    2mpekub.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 6:39 am

  108. flash says:

    This is whats it’s all about.An, as the availability of oil becomes even more scarce, the fight will become desperate to the point of anyhting goes and beyond.

    published in 1928.The truth never goes out of style.
    http://yamaguchy.com/library/denny/denny_index.html

    We Fight For Oil.
    foroil.gif

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 7:10 am

  109. Novista says:

    Don’t Accuse Me of “Blaming America” When I Blame the Government
    By Robert Higgs

    http://www.campaignforliberty.com/article.php?view=1279

    [snip]
    People accused of blaming America are commonly called “America haters.”

    Although this riposte to criticism is the rhetorical tactic of first resort for the more simple-minded, flag-waving species of self-anointed patriots, it is by no means their exclusive property. Neocons writing in such elevated outlets as the New York Times and the Washington Post have not been bashful about smearing their critics as people who “blame America.

    As for me, a definition of terms would be useful … maybe America =
    geographical area?
    population of 310,000,000?
    a mythical country that was always good and pure like you were told in school?
    neocon paradise?

    or … a once and future republic …

    honest enough to admit its mistakes and with enough integrity to rise above them.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 7:38 am

  110. TeresaE says:

    SSS, I’ll second your Giada, hot and can cook.

    Hell, I’d do her and I don’t swing that way!

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 8:08 am

  111. Hope@ZeroKelvin says:

    My only problem with Gaida is that it is hard to trust a skinny cook. Her food is kind of la-de-dah.

    Now Paula Dean, ya buddy, that is a woman who can cook – and looks like she enjoys her own cooking. My coronary arteries start to spasm just reading her recipes!

    Ahem. Back to topic.

    Perhaps Smokey’s countdown clock has something to do with this:

    http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/09/hezballah_cells_active_worldwide_including_in_us.html

    “The radicals ruling Iran, ever since the Islamic Revolution, have invested heavily to expand their field of operations in Europe and America. I witnessed their activities when, as a member of the Revolutionary Guards, I was also a CIA spy. Every Iranian embassy, Islamic cultural centers, mosques, offices of Iran Air, Iranian shipping lines, Iranian banks, and many front companies dealing with Iran are being used by the Iranian Quds Forces and intelligence agency for recruitment, transfer of arms and cash, and terrorist activities.

    They have successfully placed many cells in Europe and, through ties with the Hugo Chávez government in Venezuela, have placed hundreds of Quds Force members along with Hezb’allah terrorists in front companies in Venezuela. Iran has set up an explosives lab in Venezuela for its cells with the knowledge of the Chávez government. In return, the Iranian regime has given hundreds of millions of dollars to Chávez.

    These cells, through collaboration with drug cartels, have infiltrated Latin America and have even set up shop in Mexico, from where, in a coordinated effort, they are infiltrating the United States.”

    Perhaps that is why Big Sis and the fed.gov are conducting these types of exercises:

    http://wtop.com/?nid=109&sid=2567658

    “The exercise was the not the first time D.C. has tested its emergency response. In May, the city ran a drill centered around a “man-made” catastrophe. West says the May exercise exposed the need to have a number of organizations outside the realm of public safety trained on how to react in the wake of a disaster. ”

    Just so you know.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 8:48 am

  112. Administrator says:

    Hope

    This dude who wrote the article is a nutjob fraud.

    “Reza Kahlili,” self-proclaimed ex-CIA spy, makes new Iran claims
    By Jeff Stein

    Reza Kahlili, a self-proclaimed former CIA “double agent” inside Iran’s Revolutionary Guards, appeared in disguise at a Washington think tank Friday claiming that Iran has developed weapons-grade uranium and missiles ready to carry nuclear warheads.

    The pseudonymous Kahlili, whose previous accounts have been greeted with widespread skepticism, also said Iran was planning nuclear suicide bombings with “a thousand suitcase bombs spread around Europe and the U.S.”

    “This is a messianic regime. There should be no doubt they’re going to commit the most horrendous suicide bombing in human history,” Kahlili said. “They will attack Israel, European capitals and the Persian Gulf region at the same time, then they will hide in a bunker [until a religious prophecy is fulfilled]… and kill the rest of the nonbelievers.”

    Kahlili was showcased Friday by the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, a Washington think tank founded by a former senior official of the American-Israel Public Affairs Committee.

    He appeared wearing dark glasses, a surgical mask and a San Francisco Giants baseball cap, and spoke through a voice altering apparatus. Bodyguards stood nearby.

    “Yes my appearance was as such for security purposes,” Kahlili told SpyTalk over the weekend, “to protect my family both here and back in Iran and more so to protect the one individual whom I recruited, who may be still working inside.”

    The Washington Institute posted an audio recording of his appearance.

    “From my sources,” Kahlili told his audience Friday, “I have heard Iran has successfully enriched uranium over the 90-percent threshold, and that was even before they announced the 20-percent experiment. And that they have missiles that they have not publicly shown, because that would verify their intention of carrying out [sic] nuclear warheads.”

    Kahlili said he passed along that and other information to the CIA, which he suggested was suppressing his report on uranium enrichment.

    “The last information I passed on from my sources within the Guards in Iran was several months ago about another possible nuclear site. I passed that information to the CIA for verification,” he said.

    But he also criticized the CIA for allegedly rejecting his proposal that it “should help Iranians free themselves of this evil regime.”

    “I wish my CIA handler were here today so I could ask him, ‘How is that working out for you?’” he said.

    Several current and former U.S. intelligence officials in the audience “rolled their eyes” at Kahlili’s claims, said one observer who was present.

    Some in attendance compared Kahlili with Ahmed Chalabi, the former Iraqi exile who helped convince the George W. Bush administration that Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. After the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq, the claims were proved false.

    CIA spokesman Paul Gimigliano, who was not present, challenged the some of Kahlili’s implications.

    “As our government as a whole has made clear, Iran’s nuclear program is a high-priority security issue. It would be wrong for anyone to suggest that the United States doesn’t recognize that.”

    A U.S. counter-proliferation official, who would discuss the highly sensitive issue only on condition of anonymity, dismissed Kahlili’s uranium claims.

    “We’ve had real successes in acquiring some of the Iranian government’s most tightly held secrets, including discovery of its concealed enrichment facility near Qom,” the official said. “But things like 90-percent enrichment just don’t tally out.”

    Kahlili was also questioned skeptically about his claim that he was welcomed into the Revolutionary Guards’ intelligence section despite his involvement in “the freedom movement.”

    Kahlili said that came later. He grew up in a prosperous Tehran family. In the early 1970s, his father sent him to the University of Southern California and bought him a red Ford Mustang.

    When he returned home after the overthrow of the shah in 1979, he was initially enthusiastic about the revolution, he said. But he soon became disenchanted. Instead of endangering his family by quitting, he reached out to the CIA and worked as a “double agent” inside the organization.

    “Three former CIA officers who ran Iranian operations in the ’80s and should have been knowledgeable said they had never heard of such a significant penetration of the Guard during this period,” The Washington Post’s veteran spy-watcher, David Ignatius, said in a review of Kahlili’s memoir, A TIME TO BETRAY: The Astonishing Double Life of a CIA Agent Inside the Revolutionary Guards of Iran.

    “A current U.S. government official, however, did vouch for Kahlili’s role as a spy,” Ignatius added.

    “I can’t confirm every jot and title in the book,” the official told Ignatius, “but he did have a relationship with U.S. intelligence.”

    “I can say without any doubt that Mr. Kahlili’s relationship to the U.S. intelligence community is legitimate,” his lawyer Mark Zaid said. “His book was cleared.”

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 8:58 am

  113. eugend66 says:

    cia_risk_management.jpg

    oprah_obama_hillary.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 9:36 am

  114. flash says:

    @ JQ,
    It’s like a global dating game wherein the USA get sto pick,from behind the curtain, the next new coterie with whom we must ally or else!
    Oh lookee, Pakistanis now want a piece of We the US! Those damn fools, don’t they know, the Empire always strikes first…..OK , but only after a false flag Op.

    @ Hope,
    Yet, where is the proof of Mr. Cloak and Dagger’s claims that Iran will eat our goats?
    Just because this clown has on a mask does not make him a super-hero.

    http://www.theburningplatform.com/?p=22195#comment-83275
    Are We At War With Pakistan?

    Seems like it…
    by Justin Raimondo, September 26, 2011
    | Print This | Share This | Antiwar Forum

    In the days before the Empire, generals – particularly Chairmen of the Joint Chiefs – kept their mouths shut. The Founders’ justified fears of military intrusion into the political realm were still present in the American consciousness, and the idea that an American general might try to influence policy directly, by making public statements on controversial political topics, was considered outside the norm. Today, however, no one is shocked by Admiral Mullen’s testimony before the Senate Armed Services Committee that we are, for all intents and purposes, already at war with Pakistan:

    “Extremist organizations serving as proxies of the government of Pakistan are attacking Afghan troops and civilians as well as U.S. soldiers. For example, we believe the Haqqani Network – which has long enjoyed the support and protection of the Pakistani government and is, in many ways, a strategic arm of Pakistan’s Inter-Services Intelligence Agency – is responsible for the September 13th attacks against the U.S. Embassy in Kabul.

    “There is ample evidence confirming that the Haqqanis were behind the June 28th attack against the Inter-Continental Hotel in Kabul and the September 10th truck bomb attack that killed five Afghans and injured another 96 individuals, 77 of whom were U.S. soldiers. History teaches us that it is difficult to defeat an insurgency when fighters enjoy a sanctuary outside national boundaries, and we are seeing this again today. The Quetta Shura and the Haqqani Network are hampering efforts to improve security in Afghanistan, spoiling possibilities for broader reconciliation, and frustrating U.S.-Pakistan relations. The actions by the Pakistani government to support them – actively and passively – represent a growing problem that is undermining U.S. interests and may violate international norms, potentially warranting sanction. In supporting these groups, the government of Pakistan, particularly the Pakistani Army, continues to jeopardize Pakistan’s opportunity to be a respected and prosperous nation with genuine regional and international influence.”

    If the evidence is so “ample,” why didn’t Mullen reveal any of it during the course of his testimony? It’s “classified,” which means we ordinary mortals aren’t entitled to see it: we just have to take their word for it. In this context, however, their word isn’t worth a hill of beans.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 9:41 am

  115. Smokey says:

    Hope,

    Terrific article.

    But unfortunately that does not support the agenda of the Hate-America crowd so it will be summarily dismissed as a fairy tale.

    Of course lies will be used to refute your article.

    There is a part of society, I call them the Hate-America members, who would much prefer to climb up a tree and tell a lie, than to stand on the ground and tell the truth.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 10:15 am

  116. Administrator says:

    Hope

    You should sell the Brooklyn Bridge to dimwits who believe any bullshit spun by any nutjob with an agenda. Some numbskulls will believe anything. Facts are of no interest to ideologues with an agenda to push. WMD are everywhere!!! ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 10:26 am

  117. Hope@ZeroKelvin says:

    OOOooo. I am being drawn into a proxy war between the neocon viewpoint of this R. Kahlili guy versus the liberal/antiwar views of Jeft Stein (who writes for the NYT, Wash Post, the Nation) versus the conservative-paleo-libertarian views of Justin Raimondo.

    Just like our country seems to be drawn into a new ME conflict these days.

    What’s a girl to believe?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Stein_(author)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Raimondo
    No wiki entry for Reza Kahlili,, strange.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 10:35 am

  118. Administrator says:

    Hope

    Here is a picture of Reza Kahlili at his news conference. Give me a fucking break!!!

    reza-kahlili.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 10:41 am

  119. Administrator says:

    Hope

    Smokey also believes in the tooth fairy.

    tooth-fairy-man.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1

    28th September 2011 at 10:44 am

  120. Smokey says:

    Hope,

    The integrity of your American Thinker post remains intact.

    Despite the pathetically feeble attempts of both curs, they refuted nothing in your article.

    BTW, that is a DAMN good article you linked to in American Thinker.

    Unfortunately, when you post on this forum anything that even HINTS at the terrorism motives of Iranian jihadists or other middle east savages, you are subjected to ridicule and treated as radioactive.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2

    28th September 2011 at 10:52 am

  121. Administrator says:

    Smokey also believes in cookie terrorists.

    cookie-monster.jpg

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 10:57 am

  122. Colma Rising says:

    When I’m sagging, I like to chow on pork chops and bob my head to EZ E.

    Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 0

    28th September 2011 at 11:12 am

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