Today, I believe, is the most pivotal time in all of America’s history.
So, here’s your question:
Before you answer, briefly consider these four things;
1)- ” … there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.” — Rom 13:1
2)- “In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last Trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.” ——- 1 Cor 15:52
3)- “For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the Trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first” ——- 1 Thess 4:16
4)- Some (many?) people believe we are living in the End Times. If so, the book of Revelation tell us that there will be worldwide death, destruction, and disasters as never before experienced by humanity. There are only three countries who can inflict such utter destruction; USA, Russia, and China (all mentioned in the Bible) ….. and a fourth country which can/will be the spark that lights the fuse (Israel).
=====
Here’s what I think is a reasonable proposition. Just like Obama was Satan’s Chosen One …. based on the above four items, it certainly seems reasonable to believe that Trump is God’s Chosen One.
Wow. God is back in town … makin’ America great again!
No – Trump is ‘my’ Chosen One, along with a rather large group of fellow citizens and even tens of millions of citizens of foreign countries.
We the people.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHDHd99wbP4
Yeah he be chosen alright – by the jesuit retards – hahaha
God had better be on Trump’s side because he is going to need all the help he can get. I’m not sure even God can get us out of the mess we’re in or if He wants to help us. We deserve what we get, we brought it on ourselves.
Revelation presents a rough trip. Until the end.
God has a will, a result to become manifest in the world of men.
His will is done, attempts to resist or prevent it are destined to fail.
Man decides how to carry it out, he can choose God’s way or he can choose his own way, the easy way or the hard way.
Men have a long history of choosing the hard way.
Today is day one of one hundred where we will find out if Trump is God’s chosen or a chump.
Rejoice………Oreo is O-ver aaaaaaaaaand OUT! HOORAH!
Wow Stucky – such a weighty question for so early in the morning! (It’s 5:30 a.m. in CA, second cup of coffee underway). You could sit down and write a book about this right now, as I’m sure others have already started.
The rise of Trump does have an otherworldly feel to it. God must have his way during 4th turnings as well as more complacent times. He also uses some depraved leaders for his own purposes. I am not suggesting DJT is depraved, but he doesn’t exactly give off the aura of sainthood. I think he was chosen to either be the lightening rod that attracts the final battle for tyranny (tyranny wins, bringing in global government and economic structure – the dreaded End Times) or a point of grace allowing this nation to repair its tattered institutions and possibly exert a more positive influence in the world. Only time will tell.
I’m with Kokoda on this one. No disrespect to the believers, but I honestly believe God had about as much to do with the results of the election as did Russian hackers, the FBI director or rayciss EBEs from Metaluna.
Same here – I have much respect for any believer as long as their religion doesn’t treat humans as trash.
In so much as every outcome is based on what has happened previously, sure God had a hand in this. There is a natural path for all things and no amount of disruption or diversion can alter that without consequence. That’s the beauty of God and Nature, they are immutable. Man is no different than a child building a stick dam across a brook. All his changes either conform to God’s laws or suffer the consequences of challenging them. Unintended consequences and all that.
For me, it is enough to see the looks of pained acquiescence on the faces of the defeated. It seems just.
Once again, I defer to the wisdom of the giants upon whose shoulders we all stand proud.
You had me at Pivotal.
My first reaction was to declare your description hyperbole. After all, haven’t there been some really decisive moments in our history? Shouldn’t Stucky have said “one of the most” of “in Modern Times?”
Then, I gave it some real thought, which is necessary with Stucky’s shit cause he don’t like to spoon feed. It really does seem that the analogy of the President steering the ship of the state is appropriate. With our country headed in the wrong direction since the Great Society was formed by LBJ with birth to burial guarantee of tax dollars for the free shit army. Now, with the entire FSA aligned to fight anyone who believes there are individual rights outside the collective rights of whatever group has been wronged in their minds, we have this Grey Champion about to take the helm.
Just because he is the Grey Champion and will direct the Turning doesn’t mean his steerage will be on target or successful.
But, I do think it will be a vast improvement over yesterday, when we were gifted with that lovely image of the Obamas on their “last day.”
Pivotal indeed.
Shouldn’t Stucky have said “one of the most” of “in Modern Times?”
—– Maggie the Wonderful
Wow.
This is crazy, Mags. I actually wrote “one of the most”!!! I swear. Then I looked it over, thought about it, and decided to remove it. So people can come up with their own conclusion. Which you did. Which makes you one the really Smarties here, for sure.
No need to kiss my ass. Aw shucks, I’m blushing.
You had me at the point just before you used the tired phrase; ‘you had me at…’.
“For me, it is enough to see the looks of pained acquiescence on the faces of the defeated. It seems just.” ——- hardscrabble farmer
+10000
No one has seen this video below. Yes, it’s be viewed 454,895 times …. but that’s ALL by me!! Oh, yes, when I am daily besieged by fucknut asshole libtards … then I daily watch this most beautiful political video of all time. (Only those of German descent can truly appreciate that glorious feeling of Schadenfreude!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeZ1vMc6CNQ
I still think Trump is a Transitional figure in this crisis. The facade hasn’t been torn off to show how bad things really are. I do worry that those opposed to Trump will do as all Socialists before.
Rather than conceding defeat, they will as Hitler did, hold out for Steiner, while watching the city burn to the ground.
Maybe then God will send someone to save us.
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By then though there will likely be not much left to save.
“If so…. there will be worldwide death, destruction, and disasters as never before experienced by humanity.”
Speaking of which, is it just me or did Indentured Servant just sort of vanish? Haven’t read a post from him a while.
He just made comments this morning in the FINALLY THE DAY HAS ARRIVED thread.
You should consider reading comments from the Dashboard section of TBP. That way you won’t miss any comments.
I do from time to time. So many posts here some days that the sidebar changes rapidly so I don’t look at it very often. I tend to go back to threads where I have posted which means I am not on the same threads as others. Even as a regular I think I miss a lot of what happens here. Too much ‘bullshitting’ and not enough time to keep up with it all I suppose. 🙂 I guess that means the site is growing which is a good thing…
FM, never complain about ‘bullshitting’ it only gives I-S an entry so he can bitch about the ‘assclowns’.
The reality is that you can’t follow all the threads, only a superhuman like Admin can do that.
Just pick a couple of articles and if you have questions, ask away, somebody will have seen a regular’s post. Or you can ask Admin directly.
I’m still here……..mostly in spirit though. My father was given 8-12 weeks to live on Christmas morning……..Merry Christmas! That isn’t even the tough part. My evil fucking witch of a mother has decided to make his final days as fucking miserable as possible in every way imaginable. It’s so bad that my brother actually moved my father out of his own home and into his to get him away from the abuse. Now the evil fucking witch is quite literally destroying the entire house (she’s paralyzed on her right side) by throwing shit and using her motorized wheelchair to smash everything.
If it were legal to kill people I would have already dispatched her. I’ve been dealing with doctors, mental health professionals (oxymoron?), lawyers, cops and several others trying to get her dumb ass sorted out. Looks like her next stop is going to be the state owned looney bin where she will spend the rest of her days tied up and sedated to the point of being compliant but fully aware of her misery and inability to do shit about it. Picture Murphy from One Flew Over The Cuckoos Nest.
Meanwhile, my father announced that his only regret in life is not killing more fish so we are planning to take him south to Lake Powell and Lead Mead and then travel north from S. Cal. to do some warm weather fishing. Our hope is to have him die with a fishing pole in his hand. If he’s up for it we might even fly down to the Sea of Cortez.
IS,
Sorry to hear about your family situation. I know your dad has been having a tough go of it for quite awhile. You’re a good son, though and I hope you guys get a few fun trips in while you can. Best to you and yours.
McMurphy. And he was no longer aware of anything, which is why Chief Broom suffocated him, he said Mac was already dead.
Can’t add much that FM hasn’t already said. But still I want to add my best wishes. Hope you can get to Sea of Cortez.
Adulterer, fornicator & thief – stitched up his creditors and lied. Backtracking flipflopping little cunt, breaking his pre-election promises and filling the swamp with Goldman Gators. I aint no Hitlery Cunton fan, but there are a boatload of deluded deceived rednecks here.
Cool!
If possible, could you please submit a youtube video of you and your tears and your achy-breaky heart? Please? (see video @ 9:40AM for inspirational ideas.)
Can’t you fucking read – I said I was no Hillary fan. I could give a friggin’ toss who gets in – and it does not make any difference anyway. Being stuck in the left-right paradigm just goes to show how mentally retarded you are. Deceived big time
What do you propose and how would that work out?
YOU called Trump a cunt. YOU called us rednecks. YOU accused Trump of breaking his pre-election promises ….. how is that even possible when he hasn’t yet been sworn in? It seems you are the one who is retarded.
Neither myself nor any other regular TBPer is in the least bit deceived by the left-right paradigm. You have no clue about us, this platform, or anything.
If anything, some — or, many — of us can be accused of False Hope. That’s right, in spite of all the fucken broken promises made by every POTUS in the last 30 years, and despite the power of those in The Swamp …… we’re just kind of hoping that Lord Trump will be the guy to drain The Swamp.
So, go ahead and mock those of us who aren’t so damned jaded that we can still hand on to a modicum of hope, however small.
You, on the other hand, who has no hope — why don’t you just kill yourself, then?
Stucky is still refusing to believe what Trump said about Clinton the day he was elected. Absolute denial. One day Trump calling the ho a criminal who ruined USA and the next praising the hag for her good work.
Now I know why he’s called Stucky – ‘cos he got his head STUCK so far up his gearbox. Maybe he is trying to kill himself by suffocating on his own shit – don’t need to do that- he got enough shite coming out of his cakehole.
rhetoric ain’t your strong suit catfish.
In your mad dash to insult you have shown that it is you that has head up ass! For fuck sakes you can’t even wait for Trump to screw up before throwing DJT under bus.
So who do think would be better.
Names please!
Haven’t you ever seen the Don kiss someone on the cheek as he sends them off to be killed?
“It’s nothing personal.”
Bye Bye Hillary,see you in the big house.
Everybody was waiting for Obama to pardon the Clintons. You can’t Blame Trump for being nice in aftermath of election. For fuck sakes the guy can’t catch a break with you catfish. On November 9th Obama was in charge not Trump. It was better then to lay low and follow Sun Tzu advice. Still wise.
“Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
― The Art of War-
By not pressing the point Obama couldn’t pardon Hillary because she wasn’t charged.
The cards are now dealt.
The hands will be played.
But what is important now is Trump has the Ace.
Conflating inaction until now with indifference by Trump then projecting that onto Stuckmeister doesn’t seem to make sense to me. The links are tenuous at best.
I am with TampaRed on this one.
The Donald is now the Don.
That kiss was nothing personal.
Stucky-You called me a hillbilly? I don’t live in the hills, don’t know any hillbillies. Stuck….people in Joo Jersey should not throw stones, and I mean that seriously.
catfish….who would you suggest to head the financial area? how about a Real Estate agent, or a Restaurant owner, or a Town Clerk, i.e., someone that doesn’t know finance at the highest level AND its interaction with DC/Fed. At least Munchkin (purposeful spelling) has been away from GS for 10 years. Yes, I do not like how his business foreclosed on homeowners.
Let’s see how this works out. Anything will be better than Obama – he rewarded the Banksters and screwed the poor and middle class.
kokoda
You all here know her as Ms. Freud. But, in real life my nickname for her is …. Munchkin. Really …. cuz she’s like 5’1″.
So, kindly fucken stop using that name when referring to Mnuchin. You are very very smart and I am certain you can come up with something quite clever.
Yours truly, and in the love of Christ.
Stucky
What about the rest of the sick neo-con bunch. Why didn’t he give Ron Paul a high-level job. Na, twat Trump is the New Puppet of New World Order. Twat Trump slagging off the whore Clinton and saying she is a criminal who destroyed USA. Less that hours after he was elected -the balding, orange-faced adulterer praises the old had for her good work. Well fuck you. If he’s your new Messiah then you are seriously more fucked than I thought you were.
KoKo- Please don’t gag me with pathetic apologist blather puke this early in the day. The concept that only bankster have the ability to run this country is ignorance at the highest level.
I’m going to enjoy my coffee now.
catfish
I ain’t no redneck. I got all my teeth. Seriously you are making too broad a stroke by painting everyone here a Trumpista. Most were pretty cool to idea of Trump Presidency a year ago. But seeing as the only alternative was the Clinton Global Initiative there wasn’t really any other choice but get on board the Trump Train.
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So much talk by her, Bill and Chelsea about the good deeds they were going to do. Save the fucking world. Yet they couldn’t even wait until the Inauguration to roll up their facade. All they did was line their pockets with graft while barely hiding their contempt for all us.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/2017/01/17/the_clinton_global_initiative039s_ignominious_end_400325.html
There is a serious lack of delusion here. Your ad hominem has no merit. Yeah Trump has hired a guy from Goldman Sachs. Maybe he doesn’t drain the swamp. But let’s try to at least wait 100 days before throwing him under the bus.
And you can slurp on a bucket of DDD’s.
Mudcat, AWD never got over the idea that Hispanics put Obama over the top. In this case, there is no denying that tards put Trump in the WH. Look at the election map, the flyover states went overwhelmingly for the narcissistic blowhard.
To ALL who believe in such things ….
….. please pray for El Coyote today. Seriously. Today will be a difficult day for him. Hopefully he won’t dispatch himself to the Great Beyond.
Hang in there El Coyote!!! Maybe Donald won’t build that wall after all.
Edited: I would also say pray for Bea Lever. However, he is wise and has decided to give Lord Trump at least 100 days …. bless his little hillbilly heart.
EC is praying for all of you.
He knows that things are fucked up and shit……….you have lost sight.
The great beyond being across the border in Nogales.
I thought the beautiful blonde would be out of her mind happy today.
Nope.
Only proves that an unhappy person will remain unhappy even after they get what they want.
It really makes no difference if your fucked up before the inaugo, you will still be a loser after.
As Dutchman said, a black president didn’t have much of an impact on the lives of blacks.
I hardly think it will make hillbillies better people, it just removes their excuse for drinking warm beer.
“2)- “In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last Trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.” ——- 1 Cor 15:52”
This sounds an awful lot like today’s “deplorables” and productive. We have been dead for about 8 years now, as Obamacare, liberalization and regulations have all but killed small business in this country, and thinking people have had to keep their heads low.
I am not sure about him being heaven sent, but at the very least, there is a new Sheriff in town, and things should get interesting. Waiting to see, and cautiously optimistic.
Slightly off topic, but relates to catfish:
There is this old black and white tv western series called Trackdown starring Robert Culp, and on the the episode I watched the other day:
A snake oil salesman in a covered wagon comes into town, to save the town, and his last name is – Trump, and he wants to build a wall around the city to save it from the destructions that is destine to happen at 12 midnight.
The reality is that there is a meteor shower and he plans on selling defensive shields to each family before the meteor shower, and they are just painted umbrellas with a metal washer.
So, I’m thinking trump watched this episode when he was a teenager, and it stuck with him his whole life.
It was like life imitating art, in a time machine.
For AA and catfish
hahaha glad to see thus social justice warriors cry – the deluded Trump supporters will have their time too when the realise they have been deceived. Trump started off well by praising Clinton for her great work – looks like the Adminisrator has selective memory or is retarded.
Trump was gracious in victory and following a long line of paying lip-service to someone who’s going off into the sunset. Let’s wait until the dust settles and we’ll see what’s in store. Tomorrow’s Trump cabinet may look quite different a year from now. Or perhaps you’re clairvoyant as well as omniscient? My guess is you’re an ignorant slob who doesn’t know his ass from his ass. Could be wrong of course, but not based on your comments here.
Deary me – what pathetic logic Admin has:- just because I’m not deceived by the twat Trump means that I am a pathetic, snowflake, retarded, liberal deceived by hag Clinton. That hormone-infested meat must be slowly attacking Admin’s grey matter.
Yeehaw, we got ourselves a live one here!
Goin’ after Admin straight away; no fucking around!
This oughta be good.
Hey Dog
need to smoke him out of cave. Then the big guy can breathe some fire upon him…
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AA, the illegal alien invasion we are suffering is real, dangerous, and destructive, not some harmless phenomenon that can be used to trick people because they don’t know about it.
I’d ask you if you have a better solution, but I’m thinking you’re in favor of it.
Is he God’s choice? I’m not sure yet, we’ll see. You will know a tree by its fruits. But what I DO know it that Hilary, like Obama, were minions of the Beast.
Trump has indeed been put into office by God. I make no pretense of knowing what He has planned. He may be saving us or He may be punishing us. We will see.
The thing I know is that God is in control.
God put a liar, thief and adulterer in office– hahaha – that put me in stitches. And he gonna stitch you’ll big time
Well, one thing’s for sure: He didn’t put you into office.
We (human beings) are cast onto the vast Sea of Existence, able to harness and manipulate the forces we discover according to our will, but unable to discern if there is a Will governing the Sea itself. I believe there is, but cannot begin to define it. In any case, the Donald captains a mighty ship and like all such men he is complicated.
Ultimately, however, I think events are in charge at this point in history…we enter a vast storm.
I think God does have a hand in it all for one simple reason: despite our idiocy, hubris and propensity for placing psychopaths in high places coupled with our having nuclear weapons for the last seven decades…we are still here.
I assume you’ve read and seen Solaris (the ’72 one, not the pathetic remake), but if by some chance not, do!
No, I’ve seen neither nor read the book, but its on the list now.
Thanks.
Stucky, I think you might be right.
So far, Trump has ascended to the presidency despite the spirited opposition of the Free Shit Army (a miracle in itself), the Republican Establishment, the Democratic Establishment, the Media, Hollywood, the educational system, the neocon/neoliberal deep state, and the snowflake army.
“They say that God is everywhere, but we most often think of Him as a recluse!” Back in town?
‘Bout time!
It may well be the most pivotal event, and God may have given us a gift.
People are waking up to the truth of who is calling the shots here in the
the USA, albeit slowly. Remember, we the people are steeped in propaganda
up to our eyeballs/almost drowning in it. Dragging our wet cold and exhausted
bodies over the rocks on to the beach we see the sun is shining.
Please check out an interview or 2/some of this guy’s interviews. He successfully
deconstructs the many terror events we have have told about. As for Trump?
We have no choice but to wait and see. Meanwhile, figure 90% of what we are
given by media is false, distraction, and scripted BS.
edit: Hey DRUD,…..same metaphor!
It is exactly 12:01 PM January 20th, 2017
Congratulations to you, PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP!!!!!!!
Do us proud!!
STUCKY, go easy man ! I’d sure hate to piss you off.
Too early of course to even wonder what TRUMP will do or accomplish.
I just finished listening to his speach. I have listened to every presidential inauguration speach since REAGAN ‘ first term. Most of the promises spoken during these events by most of the newly elected presidents were broken.
I haven’t voted since ROSS PETOT lost to BILLY ‘SKIN DOG’ CLINTON, as I just don’t believe these people. With any hope TRUMP will not dissapiont. Let us pray !
He has gotten the Clintons off screen at least until they trot Chelsea out.
Such Blasphemy so early in the morning…the dark powers truly are in control of the Scarlet Harlot here in the land of “liberty”….
Us Goyim are taught one way to look at things; for instance the Statue of Liberty! America and not the Goddess Columbia
If you believe this country has been run by God(Yawheh)-fearing men and women….men and women who have been corrupted by the power of the dark side; who have chosen to worship the fallen angel Lucifer and reject Yawheh’s commandments; who have been indoctrinated into the hidden “secrets” passed down for centuries through organizations like the Knights Templars, Freemasonry, Rosacrucians, New-Age philosophy and esoteric teachings from the Jewish Kaballah; which any critically thinking individual who is living with their heads not stuck in the sand should be able to see…..A SPIRITUAL BATTLE has been happening for centuries!! So many of us have been lost due to a lack of understanding and I fear many MANY more will be lost in these next fomented revolutions that are to occur to fulfill Yawheh’s prophecies that must come to pass! These secrets, hidden in plain sight like the adoption of the Great Seal of the United States and the placement of the Eye of Providence on the back of the $1 Federal Reserve Note in which “IN GOD WE TRUST” is written on the front and left for our own interpretations as to which God it is that we should trust…
Reminds me of a passage from the Good Book
1 Peter 5:8, NASB: “Be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary, the devil, prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.”
One of the cruelest tricks the “Great Deceiver” has ever done is to suggest that God is dead (Existentialism) or never existed in the first place!!
FREEDOM to do ANYTHING one desires is much more alluring than having to follow a bunch of rules like not coveting your neighbor’s wife or thievery or murder; GREAT POWER comes to those who reject Yawheh. When the “Rule of Law” is not followed by our leaders it only encourages the rest of us to follow suit! The rationalization might sound something like; well if they are cheating and making money and wealth then I’m gonna do it too in order to compete!! The trap has ensnared most of us at some point in time! We lose sight of why we are here!
Just look at George W’s first inaugural speech in 2001 (which I am sure he did not write):
“After the Declaration of Independence was signed, Virginia statesman John Page wrote to Thomas Jefferson, “We know the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong. Do you not think an angel rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm?”
…
We are not this story’s author, who fills time and eternity with his purpose. Yet, his purpose is achieved in our duty. And our duty is fulfilled in service to one another. Never tiring, never yielding, never finishing, we renew that purpose today, to make our country more just and generous, to affirm the dignity of our lives and every life. This work continues, the story goes on, and an angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.
God bless you all, and God bless America.”
http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=25853
When he says “God” he doesn’t mean Yawheh, but the true god of Masonry and the esoteric teachings of Alister Crowley and Albert Pike! Lucifer! As for John Page’s reference to an “angel” in the whirlwind; who do you think he is referencing?! And why is Bush even saying this in his first inauguration?! to brag to his brethren that the Novus Ordo Seclorum (Secular Order of the Ages) found on the back of the dollar bill and part of the Great Seal of the United States is nearing completion!
Who knows the Bible better than most…Besides, apparently, Stucky? That’s right, The Great Deceiver! This isn’t to be joked or mocked but to be considered; then understood….Christ followers continue to be deceived by the Scarlet Harlot and continue to promote the BEAST SYSTEM around the world! The level of brainwashing through the school system, modern Christian religions, Hollywood and psychiatry is truly an onslaught against Yawheh’s teachings and His creations!
And we wonder why Wicca and Satanism are some of the fastest growing religions in the world! It has been prophesized already! Alas, those who CAN hear WILL hear and those who cannot will surely perish!
Stand tall Brothers in Christ! Share your faith and do not be ashamed of it like popular culture and modern psychology would have you feel! A concerted effort has been waged for centuries on God’s creations…I fear this next generation will not even be allowed to have a choice! The final attempt by Lucifer to blaspheme the entity he rebelled against so long ago!
Geeze and here I thought catfish was a big downer with his full house.
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Fuck you got him beat with that Royal Flush…
an excellent youtuber named George Webb has a series on “Where is Eric Braverman” that I believe every American citizen needs to watch AT LEAST once! So much information…anyways… He mentions in his videos that Steven Feinberg, one of trump’s close economic advisors, who is CEO of Cerebrus Capital Management which has a subisidiary company Dyncorp ….the same Dyncorp who has contracts in Haiti and Syria and who the Honorable Representative Cynthia McKinney grilled Donald Rumsfeld about back in 2005 about Dyncorp getting federal contracts even after details emerged that they were involved in child sex trafficking and organ harvesting!
The whole charade that Trump is working against the CIA is laughable when considering many suggest Dyncorp is a front company for the CIA!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mr2oQExxGmU
Not to mention his pick for Tzar of Homeland Security General John Kelly worked for Dyncorp after leaving the military! First time a General has been placed overseeing a domestic civilian agency!?!
Nothing to see here though! Everything will be fine!
A thumb’s down with no comment eh? Sad! Plato’s analogy of the Cave comes to mind when discussing facts with the average brainwashed, dumbed-down American.
Thanks for that info platoplubius. There is plenty of reason to be suspicious of this man.
Blessings:-}
No worries! Truth is so much stranger than fiction! The cognitive dissonance we experience because of being kept in the dark for so long is truly mind boggling!
There is a qualifier for vs.1 and 2 of this passage. It is found in vs3 and following.
“For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:…..”
For a gov’t to be one that God establishes in this context it must be one that practices these principles.
They do not punish those who do what is right. And those who do evil should fear the gov’t established by God.
In this we see there have not been any gov’ts established by God in recent memory. I would like to believe this will change with Trump.
But, the problem makes itself clear in the fact that when God chooses kings for the good of the people He chooses men like David. A sheep herder.
When men choose kings they choose men like Saul. A man who God described would be like this;
“And he said, This will be the manner of the king that shall reign over you: He will take your sons, and appoint them for himself, for his chariots, and to be his horsemen; and some shall run before his chariots.
And he will appoint him captains over thousands, and captains over fifties; and will set them to ear his ground, and to reap his harvest, and to make his instruments of war, and instruments of his chariots.
(Huge spending on military)
And he will take your daughters to be confectionaries, and to be cooks, and to be bakers.
And he will take your fields, and your vineyards, and your oliveyards, even the best of them, and give them to his servants.
And he will take the tenth of your seed, and of your vineyards, and give to his officers, and to his servants.
And he will take your menservants, and your maidservants, and your goodliest young men, and your asses, and put them to his work.
He will take the tenth of your sheep: and ye shall be his servants.
And ye shall cry out in that day because of your king which ye shall have chosen you; and the Lord will not hear you in that day.
Nevertheless the people refused to obey the voice of Samuel; and they said, Nay; but we will have a king over us;…” 1Sam.8:11-19
Which model do you think Trump is representative of? I think we already know, and if we don’t it’s for sure we’re going to find out.
No king but King Jesus.
I am certainly in that group who believes we are in the final days before Christ comes. And this is why I believe that we will not have a ruler who is truly beneficent until Christ returns. In fact, it is most certain that they will be the kind of leaders that “sit at one table and tell lies”. Dan.11:27
Blessings:-}
“No king but King Jesus.”
NOT MY KING!!! NOT MY KING!!! NOT MY KING!!!
One way or the other the day is coming that you along with everyone else will bow to Jesus Christ as Lord. Rom.14:11 and Phil.2:10,11
Either voluntarily, or because of the realization that all other gods have been defeated. I hope and pray it is the former.
Blessings:-}
Ed, I am sure you’re a nice dude and everything, but I don’t believe in magic; never have.
“…you along with everyone else will bow to Jesus Christ as Lord.” What’s the deal with your God anyways? He’s the Supreme Creator, Alpha and Omega, Omnipotent, all that good stuff. And yet he requires complete submission and supplication from His very creation. I mean, do you make your kids spend one day a week praising you? Do you want them to bow to you?
It’s just sick, man.
Props on that one dawg!
You don’t understand, Rawdawg, you think with your mortal heart which is filled with lust. It cannot comprehend heaven. It defaults to the worldly rejection of heaven and all things that are good in favor of the self.
The self says, I would rather lead in hell than serve in heaven. That is the blindness referenced when you read, ..the blind leading the blind, they both fall into a hole. It is spiritual blindness. Keep smirking, poor fool.
Either your leading Rob or Rob is leading you, blind fuckers.
That’s a real nice copy and paste job from one of your apologetics books, EC.
Calling people fools and fuckers doesn’t make anything you say true, but it might make you feel good about yourself.
So go on with your bad self, vato.
Moran, I would rather fuck up a sentence than copy and paste from somewhere else. It is actually my idea.
A lot of the shit I write is at the moment without much reflection. If I could do better than that, I could write essays.
I read a few of the apologetic and homiletic articles but that was long ago. I prefer my own experience to somebody’s rationale.
As you can tell, I can’t expound on the bible like Edwitness or Plato. I get lost in their exposition. I prefer something simple enough so that my 85 IQ can understand.
Submitting to the God of the Bible is to trust Him. As a child should be able to trust his parents to care for him. And that trust helps the child understand that his parents tell him what to do because it is for his good. Even when he may not understand it at the moment.
God showed Israel that care even through the wilderness, a time of discipline. And so did Jesus in dying for us so we could live through faith in Him.
Who wouldn’t submit to a God like that? Especially when submission to Him means simply to love and trust Him. And in trusting Him you will know that when He says to do something it is always for your benefit.
It’s a win win situation.
Blessings:-}
PS I don’t believe in magic either.
Burning bush talking, dead for three days, etcetera sounds like magic to me.
Why would anyone in their right mind submit to a deity who can’t even be bothered to make an appearance once in awhile?
I mean, I had this lazy boss once but at least he showed up every day; even if he did sleep at his desk much of the time.
I have it on good authority that He is going to make an appearance soon. So I would suggest you get your house in order (trust Him as savior) just in case.
You won’t like the one you end up with if you don’t. Because you go with the god you serve.
Ed
If you don’t believe in God how can one serve them.
The rational man would believe in God. There is too much evidence not to. He still may not serve Him. But, he would believe in Him.
Blessings:-}
So your answer is that you are rational and I am not.
Got it!
Thanks you are swell!
Va te faire foutre.
No RiNS,
That’s your answer.
Blessings:-}
You are an idiot Ed.
Quote faith as facts.
Preach with hate from contempt.
Disguise that contempt with Blessings.
It is great for you that you have such a strong sense of belief. It must give you comfort. But you preach like a broken record. You are not open to debate.
When I saw this QOTD by Stucky it smelled of subversion. Even in my first post I played along. Knowing anyways that soon enough the Cavalry of Moral busy bodies would be trotting over the hill.
You have bought a book whole cloth that explains the great mysteries with faith in amazing words. I don’t begrudge you. The world is a scary place. But to dismiss folks who disagree is condescending and frankly not very Christian.
There are billions of people who don’t have the faith as you. For you to cast them all, as worshippers of evil wholesale is ridiculous, illogical and blessings aside abhorrent.
But have a Great Day anyways!
RiNS,
“But to dismiss folks who disagree is condescending and frankly not very Christian.”
It is my God, Jesus Christ, who as you put it, has dismissed folks who disagree. John14:6. For me to follow His example couldn’t be any more Christian. He allows all who would trust in Him and receive His gift of life eternal into His heaven. All others who choose someone else will go with that someone else.
It’s our choice. He doesn’t force us into submission. How is that condescending or dismissive? I define that as liberating. You and I are completely free to choose the eternity we want. It was Jesus that gave us that freedom. And it is Jesus that gives us the faith to choose to accept that freedom. There is one proviso. Humility before God.
And you are correct when you say my faith must be very comforting to me. Nothing could be more true.
Blessings:-}
Magic is very much real and alive! Our limited understanding of universal truths will always lead our mind to classify something we don’t fully understand as magic! Shoot! If I took a smart phone back to the first part of the 20th century I could suggest that it’s functionality is magical to the inhabitants of that time!
A great voice calling out in the wilderness who recently moved on to the other side in 2014 Dr. Stanley Monteith understood the spiritual battle that began in Lucifer’s rebellion in Heaven and continues here on Earth. As above so below!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UagqOHScNs
That’s true platoplubius,
Even maggot filled meat and disease caused by germs were magic to some not so many years ago.
Blessings:-}
So He said, “A man of noble birth went to a distant country to lay claim to his kingship and then return. 13Beforehand, he called ten of his servants and gave them ten minas. ‘Conduct business with this until I return,’ he said. 14But his subjects hated him and sent a delegation after him to say, ‘We do not want this man to rule over us.’…
Rawdawg, it turned out that the messiah was rejected by his own because they expected things he wasn’t going to deliver; riches, independence and influence. Just like you, they didn’t want to submit to any god and preferred to rule in hell first.
Yeah, that’s just like me alright. Did it ever occur to you that some folks reject the notion of a deity because it doesn’t make any logical sense to them, and the evidence presented is not convincing?
Many fascinating things about Christians. When confronted with non-believers, most of them I run across are very hostile. Most call names, just as you have done. Most are gleeful at the prospect of my suffering eternally in hell. Most of them believe that I reject their god because I wish “to do whatever I want, with no rules”.
But keep copying those verses, they’re real convincing. We both know you’re really just virtue signaling to your religious brethren here.
Uh, I have been mean to Plato and maybe I was a little icy with Edwitness, so this virtue signalling thing is a little off base.
As far as calling names, it’s more of a way to add color to the piece and not meant to offend you in any way, I mean, if I don’t say anything about your mom, you can assume we are cool.
I’d hate it if anybody thought I was selling virtue. (I’m not the sort of person anybody would look up to.) What I sell is ‘open your fucking eyes’.
If you knew, LLPOH sold me on integrity. I believed him and didn’t give him a load of shit about “I don’t believe in virtue”.
Just the other day, somebody mentioned John Lennon’s line – living is easy with eyes closed – there is no effort involved in that, all you need is doubt. Heh.
EC- LLPOH puts the “grit” in integrity. RATDAWG puts the “rat” in RATDAWG.
Bea,
That might have been somewhat clever if you didn’t need to add letters to the screen name. Your effort was, well, just sad and pitiful.
Participation trophy for trying though.
dawg
Don’t you have a sheep out back you need to go hump for a while?
Yeah Bea, another swing and a miss, I’m afraid. Hump a sheep? That’s all you got?
The battle of wits thing, well, you’re just not very good at it.
Lame conspiracies and I-told-you-so’s; now that’s your forte. Stick with that.
Good night, sweet prince. I’m out, and shan’t return. You get the last word, make it good.
Don’t worry dawg, your secret is safe with me…..just go easy on the livestock down there on the farm. Sorry to hear you shan’t return, RiNs will be lost without you.
Rat terrier
EC,
Yeah you did leave my momma out of it, so I’m glad we cool.
Here’s how simple it is. If you believe we got here by chance you must first reject the fact that the odds that the complexities of nature are too great for even the most ardent skeptic of the creation model to overcome.
With a number as small as 100, the chances of sequencing them so they fall into place when dropped from one to 100 the first time you try comes to one chance in 10 with 158 zeros behind it. But, the structure of DNA is multiples beyond that.
This leaves the rational thinker facing the fact that we must have come to this place by some intelligence putting us here. Even Richard Dawkins the most ardent defender of evolution admits this.
The God of the Bible left us a record of creation through His followers. He even gave specific promises called prophecy that prove who He is. If we can believe it we can have eternal life. If we don’t it’s because we won’t. Not because the evidence is not there.
There are imposters that most of mankind chooses to serve in spite of this fact.
As with them the choice is yours. And like I said, you go with the god you serve. The God of Christianity does not send anyone to hell. People actually choose it.
Blessings:-}
Is Trump a righteous man in the eyes of God? That is not for me to judge. Is Trump put into office to serve God’s purposes? Absolutely and there is nothing anyone in this thread can do about it.
With all the names attached to the purple avatar,couldn’t we just call “it”Sybil?
Stucky,I love you man but please stay away from me if it is lightning outside.
Trump’s a-comin’ and hell’s comin’ with him.
I do not think Trump is Jewish.
Ipso facto, not the chosen one.
Regarding the last trumpet.
From Revelation:
1: The crowd shouting, 2: One voice with a command, 3: Trumpets
Mirror image from the battle of Jericho in Joshua:
1: Trumpets, 2: One voice with a command, 3: Shouting from the people of Israel.
In one, the people of Israel entered the land of milk and honey. In the other, the land of milk and honey will be delivered to the people of Israel in the final battle.
Well let’s see what he actually DOES (rather than SAYS). I notice from the sidebar that U$ “Official” debt is now past the magical $20 T mark, so that’s an unpayable debt (no way that’ll ever be paid). Add on the future commitments and he’s voluntarily taken on “quite” the poisoned chalice. Let’s see how the rhetoric affects your creditors deciding on retaining or getting rid of US Paper – and if Trump decides on protectionism / tariffs – well others can play that game too.
A little less exceptionalism, a little more humility. Not too much to ask is it??
” …. USA, Russia, and China (all mentioned in the Bible) …” —— me, Stucky
Does anyone even READ my shit? I don’t think so. Because if you did, then someone, at least one person would have asked – “Where the fuck is USA, Russia, and China mentioned in the bible??”. Even Edwitness, the blessings dude, didn’t call out my bullshit. Whuts wrong wif y’all? Well, screw you then, I’m not tellin ya now no matter what.
I noticed it, but figured I would give you a pass since I think we are living in BABYLON. Of course, I thought Hillary was LITERALLY the whore and would mount a white horse to ride into the Inauguration.
Hee Hee… here’s an image for you. Nekkid, like Lady Godiva.
(eeeewwwweeee, I need to sterilize my imagination with peroxide now. that is an unforgivable image and I apologize.)
@ Maggie
Hilarious that you mention America is the Whore of Babylon and get thumbs up! And on another thread, the last time I checked, I had nearly 30 thumbs down for saying the same thing! HAHA!
America can not be the Babylon of Rev.17,18. That Babylon is a city. Rev.17:18
Blessings:-}
Of course the words “United States of America” or “Russia” are not mentioned in the Bible; however the kingdom’s discussed in end time prophecies can be understood through unraveling the meaning behind Daniel’s visions of the 4 beasts.
The sad thing about modern Christianity is that it will not suggest that America is the whore of Babylon (Scarlet Harlot) instead; most people believe the harlot to be the Vatican and Catholic Church.
Believe what you want. Don’t believe, that is still a belief! Again, those with ears that can hear will listen and those who cannot, won’t!
well, like Lady Godiva with short hair. EEEEEEWWWWWWEEEEEE!
I didn’t need to Stucky. I already know where they are found.
Ezekiel 38,39 US and Russia
Rev. 16:12 China
Blessings:-}
Wrong answer.
Correct answer: No where …… except in your fertile imagination, as noted above.
Then who are the young lions that come out of Tarshish? Ez.38:13
And the area that contains Meshech and Tobalsk? Ez.38:2,3
And the military that is 200,000,000 strong? Rev.9:16 and Rev.16:12
These are historically proven to be those you named. The US, Russia, and China among others.
Behold
Amazing words peddled as proof.
No, wrong thread. Haiku thread is MY post this morning. Go look at my comment to Undeliverable at 2:13 a.m. Haha… I was on a roll.
Come on RiNS,
Tarshish is historically an ancient name for Great Britain. Her young lions (a lion being the symbol for her) are those who came out of her. One of which would be the US.
Blessings:-}
Stucky says:
January 20, 2017 at 7:00 pm
” …. USA, Russia, and China (all mentioned in the Bible) …” —— me, Stucky
Does anyone even READ my shit? I don’t think so. Because if you did, then someone, at least one person would have asked – “Where the fuck is USA, Russia, and China mentioned in the bible??”. Even Edwitness, the blessings dude, didn’t call out my bullshit. Whuts wrong wif y’all? Well, screw you then, I’m not tellin ya now no matter what.
__________________________
Who the fuck cares? The Gathas are where it’s at!
“Did it ever occur to you that some folks reject the notion of a deity because it doesn’t make any logical sense to them, and the evidence presented is not convincing?” – Rawdawg
That is the atheist position. I have no answer to that. I would sooner try to convince my cat that I am the smarter creature.
I could write an apologetic essay until you were blue in the face. To no avail.
I don’t think folks try to convince you when you write stuff like the above, but you provoke them with your denial.
In the afterworld, if I see you there, I am either going to be very happy you made it or very unhappy that I didn’t.
I provoke them with my denial. That is an interesting sentence. I don’t believe in your god. So what? You believe in God; again, so what?
We’re both humans stuck on this rock until we’re dead. Some may think there’s more after the Final Act, but one thing’s for sure: as far as we can perceive it, once you’re gone that’s it for this particular brand of existence.
So I say live and let. Sure we tweak each other’s noses from time to time, but we can still get along, right?
Well, on second thought, unless you’re a Muslim. In that case fuck you, get off my property.
What if Trump really was chosen by God for this time? What if the cards are so stacked against him and, therefore, his “confidence” uniquely qualifies him for spectacular failure in the very near future?
What if this 4th Turning is not meant to have a happy ending?
What if, because of the technology (i.e. – surveillance, drones, advanced weaponry, etc), the world elite will finally be able to enslave humanity this time as they raise a new world system upon the inevitable collapse of this one?
What if the prophecies in the Book of Revelation were really meant for our time?
What if ten kings actually are about to enter from stage left in order to usher in their ever-elusive utopian dream of one-world under communism, as the curtain rises to reveal a Beast exiting the shadows with a 666 tattoo on his forehead and a credit-card reader in his back pocket?
What then? I’m not trying to be a smartass here. Because I do wonder sometimes in the middle of the night, while staring at the ceiling, or looking at the stars outside my bedroom window.
Unhyper,
We have a brave new world. What’s new? Everything that is, has been before and it will be again.
The prophesies apply in due time to all ages. Not all of them, we’re not talking Nostradamus here, but it is clear the world is headed towards a future destruction, the only hope offered is that some of us may make it. According to the lesson-book, most don’t make it. Too bad suckers!
https://youtu.be/6R3c1iemMQY
Trump is no more significant for having been plucked from a reality show. Nor is his achievement insignificant. In case you were comatose these last 6 months, he was selected by the proles. Stuck had conniptions when somebody suggested TPTB elected Trump.
Imagine if he heard somebody claim god did it? He’d get the 24 hour squirts. It were the tards that elected him. That doesn’t mean god had no interest in it. Have you ever read (Joseph) that god allows certain bad things for good?
This is man’s system and folks like Rawdawg deny god has any say in it. Whatever. Just living long enough, you can see that he has intervened in things big and small. No way we have made it this far without his handiwork.
But talking about god is anathema to heathens. As my buddy John so clearly put it using the TV cliche’ – ‘it makes me want to drive nails in my head.’
Ooh, this is getting good. I’m in yer head now.
Rawdawg, your a maroon. If you ever read One Flew over the Cuckoo, who hasn’t?, you would see that Kesey was describing America in the future. Here we have America controlled by a woman who tightens guys’ nuts good and tight. Her ample bosom is a chest full of money, since she is rich and represents the rich, which she always keeps hidden or at least disguised.
The people she has working for her, Negroes who hate white folk, a pliable doctor, a prudish nurse with the scar of Muzzie on her face, all follow her orders fearfully. Her assortment of nuts to tighten on a daily basis are compliant and those that are not, are fixed in other ways. She has a homosexual patient, a hen-pecked son, a man who was born dead, and she has an Indian chief’s son. The Indian represents forgotten Native Americans who are sheltered in reservations, treated as deaf and dumb, given menial tasks like they are children.
Then a champion appears, he wants to change things to make his stay more amenable to his likes. Nurse Big Boobs doesn’t like his plans. At one point, during a tussle, he exposes her foundation – her chest of cash. She has her revenge and the champion ends up a brain-dead automaton.
On the one hand, it sounds like a political story Maggie might tell. However, it also sounds to me like America, the champion in this case is the public rebelling against the establishment that has all the country under control, under sedation.
The Indian, seeing that in the the end, the champion is brain-dead, an empty shell of the former religious conqueror, finally decides to put an end to the champion and regain his freedom and his old country. The Indian is represents the true America, suppressed by an establishment that caters to queers, niggers, atheists and assorted neurotics.
Mac represents the ideals of individual freedom, independence, machismo and the pursuit of happiness. Once the establishment killed off that spirit, leaving nothing but an empty icon like a walking statue, the Indian representing the original America decides to kill off Mac since he is dead anyway. He then smashes the barred window which is the law and breaks free, he goes in search of his ancestral home; another America, as pure as nature, awaits.
You, Rawdawg, are that brain-dead shell, an atheist in opposition to the original faithful settlers. It is symptomatic of our times that your views are not cause for revulsion and loathing but are embraced by the general population of zombies carefully nurtured by the state.
And, to paraphrase the last line from the story: The Chief’s been away a long time.
Uncued, that would make an interesting essay. I believe you’ve got the idea.
I haven’t had a chance to read your FFF article but I liked the Indians dancing, one looked like Kokopelli. I wonder which is Coyote.
Yeah, I think Uncola may have actually referenced the genealogies from the Kesey prophecies there. Just as in a visionquest, pain is weakness leaving the body. Plus, in a free country, ending a sentence with a preposition is nothing to be afraid of.
Gee numb-nuts, I can’t thank you enough for telling me who I am.
After all, you know me so well from the few paragraphs I have written on this here blog; distilled my 47 years down to one sentence.
Now, fuck off.
Congresscritters, Parasites and Presidents
I watched the inaugural with mixed emotions, appreciating the zingers the truly brilliant speaker (how’s that folks? Wrote it himself, got to his points and did it with style) tossed at Congresscritters, Union Parasites, bureaucratic waste, and so on, and I particularly loved his tone and the no-holds-barred announcement that his administration was going to be different. Just the way he conducted his day demonstrated a change in atmosphere for conservatives desperate to see a brighter future for our children.
Of course, some of his rhetoric caused my perhaps-overly-political-science-educated mind* to flinch, knowing what Trump was doing was breaking the unspoken rules of the fakey-fake nicey-nice diplomatic world of Washington, D.C. Having worked there a time or two, I know everyone kisses everyone’s ass even if they loathe one another just in case the other someone slides to a position higher in power or gets hired by a lobbying firm that will pay some big dollars for a vote. Just remembering the kind of alliance shifting a change in military command or corporate policy could bring about in a government-associated organization made me think Trump’s stategy might work. Shake it up enough and sometimes the trash falls out like rats off that sinking ship.
Ending the double-faced actions of our Congresscritters should probably sit on the top ten to-do list for Trump. He should craft and send legislation for consideration to Congress discussing TERM LIMITS for themselves. He should remind the nation DAILY on Twitter or Instagram or TrumpTeeVee that Congress refuses to discuss TERM LIMITS. Why not grandfather it so we IMMEDIATELY get rid of the McCains, Pelosis, and Strom Thurmond, (I thought I saw him today dozing in the corner like he did for 30 some-odd years and he may have been there longer, but I only remember him looking like death for 30), and any other ROAD (retired on active duty) leeches hanging on. Really.
Remind the American People DAILY that Congress won’t discuss term limits.
Then, when Donald J. Trump discussed harnessing the reins of the U.S. economy to the engine of capitalism to pull America’s blood treasure from drug-infested ghettos and low paying menial jobs overburdened with college debt with zero skills from their worthless degree causing despair in their souls while C0ngresscritters are wining and dining and calling around for campaign donations because everyone knows you have to pass a bill to know what is in it, I grow enraged. If Trump’s administration can direct the intellectual treasure in our young people’s minds via career training and guidance programs to pour true meaning into the American Dream for them, Donald J. Trump has finally grasped the concept of an innovative motivator to end the waste of our blood treasure. Empowerment.
Every time a kid figures out how to do something, he or she prove themselves capable to THEMSELVES. Prove to them there is a better way than the life they’ve been confined to by welfare schemes designed to stable them. Give them opportunity to work for their ticket out of that mess and the majority will get on board and leave hopelessness behind. Trust me; I left a pretty dismal scene at the end of the Carter years with no jobs for anyone, stagflation, gas crises and oil gluts and I managed to work hard, joined the service and expanded my horizons. What a terrible thing to teach a kid: that they will always get something for nothing. Teaching a kid that doing nothing is valuable is evil. Of course, Congresscritters pretty much do nothing but call people and ask for money, so our kids can all go to Congress for TWO TERMS and do nothing of value there. Oh, yeah… Anthony Weiner already did that.
Seeing Trump’s obvious love for his family and their obvious adoration of him makes me hope to see the reputation of the family unit restored as the basic unit in the construction of our society. Every institution put together by government seems to make it harder for families to give their kids an opportunity for a better life. With the breakup of the family unit (and how ironic that a thrice-married president might restore the respect for a traditional family) after LBJ launched the Great Society which gave young women a monetary reason to become pregnant without a father-figure, upwards of half of children never know a father, so society grows weak. With increasing numbers of low-income women more than happy to join the free shit army and bleed government coffers dry, the country can’t survive. What is so hard to grasp about life being better for a child when there is a lifelong commitment to love and nurture them in place by two adult parents? (I will not even dispute the homosexual marriage issue: two parents would be better, period.)
We absolutely need to boycott the MSM. Trump should encourage boycotts of network and 24/7 news. And not the namby-pamby-don’t-buy-meat-on-Tuesdays sort of boycott trotted out due to rising beef prices in the 70s, but real meaningful refuse to watch or read anything but news and commentary provided by devoted truth-outers like Jim Quinn here at TBP or the Tylers at ZH or contributors to American Thinker or the hundreds or thousands of CITIZEN journalists who are TRULY trying to spread the word that a pack of liars got elected to the U.S. Congress decades ago and they refuse to acknowledge that they are never giving up their seat in the U.S. Congress and they plan to sit on the gravy train until they die. And, if they can spend some more of the hard-earned money of we who work hard against great odds to produce and build our lives in the REAL world, they will continue to send more minorities into ghettos with government handouts binding them further into a cycle of poverty the welfare and drug pandering parasites elected to Washington, D.C., never intend for them to escape. With at least half of Congress, if not more, willing to pour our tax monies into a running spigot to fund their reelection campaigns and to buy international favor for their pet Foundations to turn the American Economy into the giant Sugar Daddy of the world, the pompous and worthless media monsters are not something Mr. Trump can ignore long.
I meant to type a paragraph answering Unsung, but I suppose, once again, I digress.
Anyway, while you looked at the stars, I looked at a dozen two-week old bunnies, eyes just opened, hopping around their mother while I cleaned cages and refilled food bowls. I raked bunny poo and filled four feed bags with Chubby Bunny Farms Turf-Building Composted Pellets to take to my best friend’s grave to fertilize the tulip bulbs I plan to place in the form of a Valentine next week. I thought about how ObamaCare forced her off the healthcare plan she’d had for decades and caused her to try to cut corners in her care because the costs had increased so much she didn’t want to bankrupt her family. I thought about how Congresscritters have access to the best care money can buy at taxpayer expense and how they probably have access to medicines and treatments most of us could never hope to be treated with. I thought about how people stood in line for ten hours to pay respects to her closed coffin, where her husband and two beautiful daughters stood and accepted condolences from all the people who had loved her as a teacher, an elementary school principle, a small business owner and beloved friend to hundreds if not thousands of people. I truly believe there is a natural treatment for cancer and that if Congresscritters and agency heads in the revolving door theater of Washington, D.C., could get more money from THAT than they get from BIG PHARMA, then it would become available to the public.
It is always about the money, except when it is about God, who is Love, though Love is not God. It is the paradox that can only be resolved by Faith.
Now that we have a president who has so much money, he can’t be bought, could it possibly be about doing what is best for the country? Could it be?
Dear Lord, I hope so. Hope. A glimmer.
*I think I lacked only 3 hours in poli-sci for a double major at OU, but that doesn’t mean I learned anything worthwhile in any other than Cindy Simon Rosenthal’s classes. And I’m not sure she’d appreciate my mentioning her, since I’m obviously the type of person who comments on TBP, but I do respect her intellect and mentoring.
Terrific post, Mags.
[Unimportant Comment: Sometimes I get jealous of where you live … a pretty log cabin away from humanity. But, then I read that you’re shoveling rabbit shit in the morning … and suddenly I feel better about my own urban existence.]
Thanks, Stucky,
It doesn’t even bother me that you don’t realize the value Chubby Bunny Farms Turf-building Pellets offer the country at this moment. Our new country needs several dumptruck loads of decomposers to recycle the trash leeching all nutrients out of D.C. in order to turn the swamp into fertile soil allowing uncorrupted and uncontaminated ideas to grow and flourish.
My bunnies and I are hard at work producing as much wholesome clean compost as possible, just in case we are called upon to help the country.
A great post Maggie!
Can’t really add much else.
Stucky, I was trying to remember WHERE the hell I posted this comment. While writing it, I thought of a title for an article I’m going to try to write (you may have noticed I’ve been light on the keyboard lately or you may not give a shit, but I’m getting old. The doctor thinks I may have an ulcer and said I should not have more than two six ounce glasses of wine three nights a week. So I have to wait until after midnight so it is MORNING.
Anyway, no promises because The Burning Belly Trumps The Burning Platform.
Hey, Unrelated, how’s that for alliteration and amazing choice of action verb? Did you gimme a well-reasoned haiku line?
Is this Stucky’s attempt to get the first Shitfest of 2017 underway with new do-gooder-wanna-bes on the blog trying to save his soul? Stucky’s having some success, though not nearly the success a mention of the moon landing fraud can generate. C’mon. You can do better.
Then Eli said to her, “How long will you make yourself drunk? Put away your wine from you.”
You left us hanging? What’s the article about … and/or the title??
Sorry to hear about the medical issues. It sucks getting older. I know this from experience.
The haiku thingy? I just don’t get it. Me no likey it. Me give up.
Welllllll, to be honest, yeah …….. the first shit fest of 2017 kinda crossed my mind. Thanks for outing me.
Pretty perfect for a pew paper passer!
Overall your comment is accurate. Even excellent:-) Except for the premise. And that could make the body of your comment fall under it’s own weight.
The idea that term limits will fix the problem of lifer “Congresscritters” misses the real and underlying problem of an electorate that has been so dumbed down and brainwashed (especially the coasties) that they therefore are unable to make a different choice. They would not make the right choice if given the opportunity to. So when one scumbag is removed through term limits another will be right there to take his/her place. And they would be happy to have them.
Even term limits can not hide the fact that a people get the gov’t they deserve.
Blessings:-}
We better be careful, EC. All this theology might resurrect the ghosts of SMASH THE CONTROL MACHINE and REO Speedwagon.
Good morning, RiNS.
“When I saw this QOTD by Stucky it smelled of subversion.” —- RiNS
You dog! Blasphemer!!! Why you say this thing? Because I recently suggested that G-d is a chicken? How do you know he’s not? Because sometimes on very rare occasions I like to stir the shit? Oh, ye of little faith ….
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“There are billions of people who don’t have the faith as you. For you to cast them all, as worshippers of evil ….” —— RiNS
This is their modus operandi. Gayle probably believes the same as Edwitness for the most part …. but, she is NEVER in-your-face about it. There are very very few like her. The vast majority will condemn and dismiss. Why? I think they are just following the example of THEIR God. Even a cursory reading of the Bible will support this argument. Time after time after time God condemns even, and especially, his own Chosen People for their unbelief. And the condemnation is very often followed by action …. like striking them down with plagues and pestilences, or even killing them, sometimes bordering on genocide (see Note). So, why should we expect these Believers to act any differently?
Note: I’m working on a new article (really) — “How Mice Saved Ancient Israel From Total Extinction” — which will shed more light on this.
I grew up Baptist, where everybody is going to hell including those two girls giggling and passing notes in the back pew.
Nothing like having an Aunt and Mother turn around in sync and then rise and march to the back to haul you to the vestibule and beat you and cousin Paula’s asses.
Ah, Stucky, remember when adults were adults and kids were kids and the two rarely decided to act like the other? Remember when adults knew HOW to teach children a lesson?
I am also upset you didn’t mention how very devout I am. I had a conversation with the Lord last night in my dreams. I just don’t remember.
I couldn’t remember what I posted last night… hadda come read it and make sure it wasn’t obscene in the Holy Thread.
As usual Stucky, you miss the point. It’s called sowing and reaping. There are consequences for everything we do. Some are catastrophic. We know the ground rules going in. Then we complain that the consequence is too harsh when the ground is sown for generations (talk about longsuffering) for such a harvest. For reasons that obviously escape you, the leaven can not be allowed to leaven the whole lump.
Then finally, after generations of these unsuccessful attempts at keeping up their side of the agreement, this so-called “genocidal” God does the unthinkable. At least to those who see Him as you do. He brings out the “I will do it all, you just trust Me” clause He told Abraham about.
We see it in the movies and hear about events when someone dies so others might live. There is really no greater expression of love. Christians serve this kind of God. And even after that He is not done giving. Because when we trust Him as savior He gives us eternal life.
That sound like the definition of genocide to you?
Who have you or your god died for lately?
Blessings:-}
I was thinking the other day about the true value of roaches. Have you planned that one?
“As usual Stucky, you miss the point. ” ——— EdWitness
Then why bother responding to me? Because you think the BULLSHIT you spew — stuff I’ve heard literally thousands of times before — will set me straight? Seriously, at least I come up with new concepts. Absolutely nothing you say is new, original, or even thought provoking. You are nothing more than a Bible Parrot …. with a little bovine mixed in, as you regurgitate the same old tired cliches.
=======================
“Who have you or your god died for lately?” ——— EdWitness
WTF?? Since I’m actually typing and responding to your inane questions — I’m thinking that’s a good indication that I’m, ummm, alive. Could be wrong though. Have you died lately?
So, that leaves the death of God. OK. I had a chicken sandwich yesterday. Did you hear what I said? CHICKEN!!! That there means something.
“We see it in the movies and hear about events when someone dies so others might live. There is really no greater expression of love. ….. That sound like the definition of genocide to you?” ———- EdWitness
Well, not if you only pick passages which prove your point, and ignore mine.
Are you open for a genuine challenge, Mr. Bibleman?
—1) You submit a post with Bible verses which indicate God is good.
—2) I submit a post with Bible verses which indicate God is bad.
Simple Rules;
——1) ONLY the actual bible verses. NO commentary.
——2) We submit both posts on the same day. That way the people can decide who presents the better argument from sola scriptura
Seriously. Are you up to it? Well, are you punk?
You must have been reading something “into” what I wrote. The way you do the scriptures in the Bible. I did not “quote” a single Bible verse.
And any fool knows that cherry picking from any book or document allows a person to relate whatever bias the presenter wishes.
We Christians are given very specific instructions when interpreting the scriptures. Among which are to learn to rightly divide the word of truth. Which leads to the first rule for any student desiring to learn the meaning an author intends. Context, context, context. Otherwise known as hermeneutics. An impossibility when taking statements out of their original context.
I have spent decades practicing just that. From books as spiritually full and wisdom building as the Bible, to articles and comments I read at a site such as this. Only if I really was a “punk” would I accept such a challenge. Your challenge is therefore humbly declined.
Blessings:-}
@ Stucky
Probably one of the more ridiculous challenges you have come up with!
You think by cherry picking quotes out of the Bible like so many humans have done over thousands of years that you can paint God one way or another?
You cannot understand one, two, three, 10, random quotes out of the Bible without proper context (historical/temporal/spiritual relevance).
That’s like trying to explain the plot to a complete movie by cherry picking quotes from the beginning, middle or end of it…it would not help in understanding the motivations of any character who might go through a metamorphosis or change in the story. This is not to say that God’s will has changed like I am sure you will attempt to do. In addition, whether or not something is said for literal effect or metaphorical effect would need to be considered especially with the translation from Hebrew or Greek into modern languages.
However, one of the great things about being human is that many humans have come before us and spent countless years of their lives researching these things for us. But the fruit that has grown from the wayside of your sowing produces nothing of substance; only juvenile humor and disobedience. It’s ok if you don’t understand. At times, your stubbornness (like mine) has hardened your heart and we fail to act the way He would have liked us to act. The great thing about the story of Christ is the promise of redemption! If we truly are chronicling our motivations and choices on Earth and we are truly honest with ourselves about these motivations and choices we can wholeheartedly agree that we have not always made the correct choices nor, for the right reasons. Our stubbornness, egos and desires often blind us or prevent us from understanding at particular times in our lives. This is all, I think I am really trying to convey here. everything else is bullshit! and a refusal to accept the responsibility of free choice and the mercy associated through Calvary for each one of us!
I doubt he would submit to that.
He needs to be able
To pick the needle and
The skip in the record.
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“Your challenge is therefore humbly declined.” ——- Edwitness
Just as I suspected. Chicken shit coward.
Nevertheless, I will do it. Not today, not tomorrow, but sometime in the next few months. I am not kidding. A complete guide to your Evil God for future reference for all TPBers. Look for a title along the lines of “God is a prick”.
You’ll love it. I guarantee it.
Should be excellent. Can’t wait!
What I find most amusing with all this banter is Ed has taken on the role of Priest and scribe. He alone understands the good news. It is all clear and not open to interpretation. 2000 or so years ago Priests in a temple did much the same. Then along came a guy and threw a spanner into the works. They reacted in much the same way as Ed does now. Derision and contempt was grist for those Priests then is the jist of what I read by him now.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/12/18/did-historical-jesus-exist-the-traditional-evidence-doesnt-hold-up/?utm_term=.80ad7001c61a
It is great comfort I suppose to believe even when the evidence doesn’t add up.
Now I am being subversive.
🙂
Goal is 200.
Wow! The Washington Post nonetheless! An expose from mockingbird’s detailing the “fake news” of Jesus’ existence!
PRICELESS Rins!
Next thing you’re gonna link is an onion article saying the rapture already happened like some Holly Wood movie where people just vanish from Earth! HAHAHA~!
ZERO refutation of any of the contents of the article.
@ RiNS
Each of us is responsible for our own choices! I don’t believe Ed is suggesting that he is “sin free” or has done nothing wrong in his life! This is often a tactic deniers use to rationalize their own guilt and current understanding of morality and mortality! We all fall short of the glory of God,
Whoever is without sin cast the first stone! If we are honest with ourselves, we can accept our shortcomings and defer to God’s will/plan for the world and us!
This back and forth has been very rewarding and I appreciate your perspective! I have wrestled with many of the same arguments you have made at some point or another in my short existence here.
God Bless
@ Stucky!
Bring the blasphemy! At least you aren’t pretending to be someone you aren’t! That is commendable!
It sounds like a very unedifying read. I’m sure it will help all who read it in their pursuit of life and liberty and happiness. All your posts seem to have that vibe running through them.
Blessings:-}
One of the great things about God is that he lets us reject him if we want to. He gives each of us this terrible freedom. Apparently there is no interest in trying to fellowship with those who prefer to go their own way. Jesus wasn’t interested in coercion, either. Christians forget this when they try to convert through browbeating, which tends to repel more than attract.
The way I see it, the problem in the garden was pride (I want to be like God – the temptation presented to Eve). The only way to undo the resulting curse in our own lives is to become humble instead and admit we may possibly need some help on the journey. The ramifications of this decision are infinite in this life and the life after.
Stucky says:
January 21, 2017 at 11:18 am
“We see it in the movies and hear about events when someone dies so others might live. There is really no greater expression of love. ….. That sound like the definition of genocide to you?” ———- EdWitness
Well, not if you only pick passages which prove your point, and ignore mine.
Are you open for a genuine challenge, Mr. Bibleman?
—1) You submit a post with Bible verses which indicate God is good.
—2) I submit a post with Bible verses which indicate God is bad.
Simple Rules;
——1) ONLY the actual bible verses. NO commentary.
——2) We submit both posts on the same day. That way the people can decide who presents the better argument from sola scriptura
Seriously. Are you up to it? Well, are you punk?
________________________
Cool game. I’m up for it. My bible, not yours; the Avesta/Gathas.
I know absolutely ZERO about the Avesta/Gathas. So, how could I play?
You’ll just have to play with yourself.
All ya gots to do is axe!
http://www.zarathushtra.com/z/gatha/The%20Gathas%20-%20AAJ.pdf
http://www.avesta.org/
“You cannot understand one, two, three, 10, random quotes out of the Bible without proper context (historical/temporal/spiritual relevance).” —- Plato
I LOVE context. In every original article I’ve written here — Babel, David and Goliath, what Jesus really meant when he said ‘Give to Caesar ..”, and many others — I always provide a significant amount of context. So, please don’t lecture me on context.
Who know who is great at quoting out of context? Christians!! Constantly. That’s right. You see it with people like Edwitness who constantly throws out a single verse, or two max, to prove whatever point they are trying to make. The context of which is never ever supplied. I don’t see you crying about that.
@ Stucky
I’m not the one who suggested the ridiculous “game” of cherry picking Bible verses to make your point! I think that was YOU! What a foolish task! And yes, many Christians do do this, just as many non-believers do to validate their arguments! After all we are all Human and all fall short! None of us are perfect! I think often, times we attack each other because our “defensive shields are up!” and our egos blind us and prevent us from acknowledging our faulty or misguided logic. Wisdom can be gleaned from the countless stories from the Bible regardless of whether you believe in the existence of Yawheh or not!? So when I or others quote aspects of this wisdom the non-believers (usually non-believers because terrible things have happened to them in life and they blame God because if GOd was good why would he let bad things happen to good people…yada yada yada)…We have ALL HEARD IT BEFORE! God didn’t force us to take the fruit from the tree of knowledge, we did that on our own! albeit with a little help from the serpent!
Once again, you accuse me of cherry picking. Once again, there is a failure on your part to understand.
I can’t believe I’m going to try to explain it to you. Your mind is already made up that I’m a cherry picker. Nevertheless …
One of the categories will be “God as a Mafia Hit Man”. These verses will be those where God himself specifically kills people. Yes, Virginia, there are many verses which specifically say “and God killed him”. You would say you need to show the entire chapter!” Haha. As if “and God killed him” isn’t clear enough. But, why stop at the chapter? Why not include the whole book? Why stop there? Let’s include the entire OT!! Now that is full context. It’s also stupid and unnecessary.
So, you can continue to whine and complain about cherry picking. Even though it is not … and everyone will see that it’s not.
Once again, your motivation is to keep people from seeing the “difficult” verses about an angry, petulant, petty, and often evil minded god. Because “context” would prove that God is none of those things, supposedly. But, instead of YOU deciding for people what God is or is not, how about you let them decide for themselves based on sola scriptura?
Terrifying, isn’t it? But, don’t worry. Some, perhaps most, people will STILL believe “God is love” no matter how many scriptures one supplies showing otherwise. You have blind faith on your side. I have logic. Logic almost always loses in this scenario. So, really, don’t you worry your precious head over my cherry picking.
Ahh..you are referencing the belief being spewed in churches all across America that God loves you even though you are sinning. It is much more complicated than that! God loves us just like a father loves their child! I’m not sure you have children Stuck so it might be more difficult for you to comprehend and REALLY understand how difficult trying to be a good parent can be. He wants us to make the RIGHT choices; but at the same time, doesn’t want to infringe on the gift of “freewill.” I have found this to be true with my own desires with my young son! It is clear throughout the old testament and new, God detests the ACTS that go against His commandments just as I might detest my son’s resistance to respecting and adhering to my rules. Many of the rules I have given him rules not to be a dictator and him a puppet; rather, my experiences have suggested that these are the best ways to live and be productive in life; this is not to say that I don’t fail to follow my own rules at times; after all I am imperfect. The Jews consistently failed to follow the Law that was passed down to them from Him and out of mercy and grace He sent a redeemer. Someone that we could SEE and attempt to emulate! Jesus’ ministry was one of AGAPE love; but even He used the rod to level the heretical teachings and money changers in the temple just as I must do at times with my son; otherwise he may “spoil” and produce rotten fruit!
I would love to hear your personal experiences as to why you HATE GOD so much. I hated Him too for many years of my life! I blamed countless things that happened in the world on there not being a God or not the GOd I think He should be; because of my incomplete understanding of our human nature.
“You think by cherry picking quotes out of the Bible …” ——plato
Cherry picking; “selectively choose (the most beneficial items) from what is available”
And that’s exactly what I won’t be doing. I made it pretty clear that my list will be “comprehensive”. Nothing will be hidden. Meaning, the verses will be supplied. People can look them up if they are interested in context … even though it is not often needed. For example;
“Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves.” —- Lev 25:44 (Pretty clear, with or without context, that God is OK with making slaves of Gentiles.)
===================================
“Probably one of the more ridiculous challenges you have come up with!”
So say you. You remind me of the English speaking Catholic Church which for the longest time was aghast at holding Mass in English. “What? How can we let the plebes know what we’re talking about!!”. And more than a few church leaders didn’t want the Bible translated to English at all.
Since when is quoting Scripture a ridiculous challenge? What are you afraid of? The truth? That people just might see that the God you worship is a borderline psychopath?
Thanks for your condemnation of the project. I am now more motivated than ever to produce the work. Afterwards, we’ll let the people decide if it is ridiculous.
Stucky, it doesn’t matter your purpose. As long as you get something printed, there are so many out there who could use a verse or two.
Certainly, Rawdawg cries out like a baby for a spoonful of god’s word.
“What, then, is the issue? Only that in every way, whether by false motives or true, Christ is preached. And in this I rejoice.”
Excellent!! El Coyote.
Write a novel Stucky:-)
Blessings:-}
EC,
The second or third time you felt it necessary to mention me in this thread; I am touched.
This is fucking excellent!
I think it would be much more challenging, for you at least, to show WHY in God’s view these deaths, or slavery were necessary or condoned. Instead of just the fact that they were killed or enslaved. Because motive, what’s really in a person’s heart, has much more to say about who a person is than the act that comes from it.
You might even find out some things about yourself from your own motivations Stucky. Like say, those that would move you to write something like this.
I will even give you a hint for one of these; Leaven.
Blessings:-}
Well folks it appears I was wrong
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He has returned.
Get affairs in order.
The rapture is near.
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Who’d a thunk it.
A beach bum.
Would surf in to save us.
This guy is an imposter. You can tell by his blue eyes:-D
Blessings:-}
@ Ed
Blue eyes? Please explain what you mean?
Platoplubius,
Since Jesus was an Israelite, which makes Him a Middle Easterner, it is doubtful that He would have had blue eyes. I suppose it’s not impossible. But, it is very doubtful.
They tend to have darker skin than most Caucasians and generally have brown eyes.
Blessings:-}
“God is a borderline psychopath.”
More like a wild entity that will never fit into our tidy boxes. We would all like a God who is just like us, who sees things in the same limited fashion that we do. He would be so much more manageable then.
I think in your study of the God-as-psychopath verses, you will find that he smacks down the rebellious now and again, both Jew and Gentile. Humble people do not seem to draw his ire for some reason. The rest of us just cope with reaping what we sow, usually painful enough.
Very nicely put Gayle. I could not agree with you more. Or should I say I believe you have stated the Biblical position very well.
Blessings:-}
Ed
You and Gail should get a room.
With my sister?! Ha ha
Really! You think that is a Gotcha!
It is laughable and pitiful at the same time to hear somebody say, I can’t logically believe in [a] god.
To rely on one’s own reasoning here is to attempt to pull oneself up by one’s bootstraps. And no, Rawdawg, I didn’t borrow that from anybody.
8″For My thoughts are not your thoughts, Nor are your ways My ways,” declares the LORD. 9″For as the heavens are higher than the earth, So are My ways higher than your ways And My thoughts than your thoughts.…
18Let no one deceive himself. If any of you thinks he is wise in this age, he should become a fool, so that he may become wise. 19For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God’s sight. As it is written: “He catches the wise in their craftiness.” 20And again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile.”…
And yet time and again, it’s Christians who try desperately to use logic to prove the existence of a creator. Edwitness himself did so on this very thread.
So it’s okay for Christians to use logic to make the case for their deity, but “laughable and pitiful” for non-believers to reject the existence of God using the same method.
Got it.
Excuse me if I used base logic to convince you of anything. I find it tiresome myself. All I can offer is my experience, such as it is.
I used to talk more of spirits than logic. Then I realized I was preaching spirits.
I also learned an important lesson in talking to some drunks, the verse about casting pearls before swine applied.
As Gayle mentioned, and I implied earlier, you can’t hope to sow and reap at the same time. It works out that some sow and some reap. I tell you the truth; someday, somebody will see you arrive at the truth.
If you insist, as Edwitness and Plato have here, you run the risk of offending folks. You can’t make converts to Republicanism by beating folks over the head either, you teach them.
Funny thing about the truth, though. I do believe that there has to be an absolute truth; but I don’t think that human beings are adequately equipped to perceive it.
Ask two people to give you the truth about Obama’s presidency. One will tell you he single-handedly destroyed America, the other will tell you he’s the greatest leader we ever had. Who’s right? Each side will fight to the death to defend their position. Logical argument will never prevail; on this we can surely agree. Everyone has to find their own way.
So you, Ed, Plato, Stucky, RinS and others can tell *your* truth, but is it *the* truth? Well, no doubt everyone will think so as viewed through their respective worldview lenses.
I respect that folks believe in God, despite the fact that I poke fun from time to time. However, my many interactions with Christians on the interwebz suggest that they do not respect my dis-belief. You would not believe the vile things that have been said to me because I dare proclaim myself to be an atheist.
Not me, Raw. We have a great guy here goes by the moniker, Muckabout. You can’t but respect him for his experiences and life. I would be honored to meet him or SSS in person, I hold both in high esteem.
If I were to think myself better for my virtue as you call it, that would be dumb. As one person here reminded me, I can’t drive a tractor and build a house from scratch. That is admirable too.
I am short in stature and achievements, I am the least of you fuckers here. I would not call you names except, as I said, in the spirit of camaraderie.
Well said,
You are right Rdawg. And what you said here reinforces the fact that we are autonomous beings with free will. And those free will choices are what bring us to our conclusions about truth.
Blessings:-}
You are mistaken El Coyote,
I am not trying to convert anyone. I have no power to do that. It is only the word of God that is powerful enough to do that. When it is sent out by those who are His servants it never returns to Him void. It accomplishes exactly what he sent it to do.
It’s a sword remember? It divides those who choose lies from those who choose the truth. And as Gayle said before, it’s this terrible gift of choice that God wanted us to have so we could be truly free to reject or accept His gift of life.
Only God can save us. We are just messengers carrying His message to all people through time until time is no more. And He loves us so much he gave us all free will to decide. Instead of forcing Himself upon us.
You and I can not make anyone accept or reject Jesus. We are all completely responsible for our own choices.
And the gospel is an offense to those who are perishing. Don’t blame yourself or other Christians for someone’s rejection of the Gospel. If it’s message causes offense it’s because they have chosen to perish.
Blessings:-}