Many liberal concepts begin as well meaning “good intentions”. I believe a large portion of those peoples who consider themselves liberals do not realize that they are being led or herded in a direction where the true agenda is much more sinister than the “rallying cry” they have chosen to “follow” (i.e. gun control). I sincerely believe the people who are REALLY seek to disarm Americans (or any country for that matter) are people who have a vested interest in controlling and imposing their will upon those who are armed.
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People tend to be harder to load onto cattle cars or line up beside a ditch for that little brown spot in the back of the head when they have the means to kill their oppressors. Who is not for lower homicide and suicide rates? If one listens to the “MINISTRY OF PROPAGANDA” (aka MSM) long enough, one might be convinced that gun owning conservatives are not and are only blood thirsty-racist-deplorables. Commie-liberals are masters of the lie. They tell similar lies in regard to pollution and “clean drinking water”.
Who in the hell is not for clean drinking water? According to liberals and the MSM, it is the evil capitalist business owner, whose only concern is profit, The image Commie-liberals want to project is that business owners will stop at nothing even if it means throwing strychnine and baby kittens into nearby streams to make a dollar. Wasn’t it Goebbels who said “repeat a lie enough and it becomes the truth” (or something to that effect)? Using environmental laws and gun control are two tenants of Communism. These two issues are used to manipulate and to control people. Of course there are others, but since we are discussing gun control, I will not go there today.
Australians along with the inhabitants of many countries and cities have been lulled into believing that by surrendering or greatly curtailing the right for an individual to keep and bear arms murders, suicides and violent crimes can nearly be wiped out forever. This is not true in any society. As much as liberals and Communist want people to believe it, it doesn’t make it so. Never surrender any firearms. Citizens without arms are subjects.
The above video details the seven people slaughtered in Australia yesterday because the criminal who shot them did not obey the laws. It is the same in gun-free Chicago. Criminals (there is a reason that name has been bestowed upon the lawless) do not obey laws. “No Guns Allowed” signage doesn’t stop gun violence.
This is what is being promoted here, not that anyone is paying any attention to it.
http://www.guns.com/2018/05/03/congressman-ban-assault-weapons-go-after-those-who-dont-turn-them-in/
headline really has nothing to do with story in West Australia…
mmm where the 4 children ( who were autistic ) meant to grab their ar-15’s when they found out the grandfather was doing a murder suicicde?
of course not
Yah, it’s not like the other adults he murdered couldn’t have used a gun to defend themselves and the 4 children. If you’re going to troll, at least use your fucking head.
What gave you the impression that the firearms involved were not legally owned?
1) the guns were legally owned
2) the kids were in bed
3) the other 2 victims were the shooter’s wife and daughter
Under almost no circumstances could any of those people have defended themselves from a family member, who would have planned this in detail.
Any attempted comparison of gun crime in Australia, which is notably considered safe, to the US is absurd. Gun violence in Australia is quite low, with the two most likely causes of murder in Australia being knives and by being beaten. The US murder rate is largely related to gun deaths.
I am pro the right to keep arms. But make no mistake, when guns are readily available in countries with significant demographic and social issues and lack of a common culture, there will be significant gun crime. The US is the poster child for that truth.
The Chinese had an extremely common culture. Didn’t stop Mao from disarming (and killing) millions of them.
The Cambodians had an extremely common culture too. Didn’t slow Pol Pot down any either.
The Russians, as an ethnic group amongst other groups, …..
Your argument is full of holes. So were the victims, who were unarmed.
Some high percentage of US gun homicides take place in only a small percentage of the counties (big cities). And if banning guns did anything worthwhile, why are Londoners dying in knife attacks?
Guns are tools, like axes and chainsaws (shades of Quake!). Any tool can be misused, and humans do. So is the real issue banning humans? Or just banning the humans WHOSE VIEWS YOU DON’T LIKE OR AGREE WITH?
Choose carefully, and choose only for yourself. The rest of us have to live in reality.
James – I was making no fucking argument against guns. Read for comprehension. However, if you think gun crime is not a serious issue in the US, you are out of your fucking mind. 30,000 people a year die by gun in the US. That is a serious issue.
I am simply pointing out a fact: if a country’s citizens have ready access to guns, and the country has social issues, and demographic issues, and lacks a common culture, you will see a lot of gun violence. In the US, that is the case. Any pockets of the US without the above characteristics tend to be far safer. But overall, the US is not a safe place. It is an entire country, believe it or not, and US citizens are being killed in their tens of thousands by guns. And the issue needs to be addressed. It is a social, demographic, cultural issue.
Re London, what a load of horseshit. What are you, an imbecile? The London murder rate is lower than the NYC murder rate, and NYC is one of the safest large US cities. Londoners have a high murder rate by knife, but the overall London murder rate is 1/3 the rate of New York City. 1/3!! And the London murder rate is a small fraction of that of many other US major cities. It is far, far more difficult to kill someone with a knife than with a gun. That is a simple fucking fact. Also, your points re China under Mao, etc., are idiotic when the conversation is about murder.
I am pro gun rights for some of the reasons you mention above – to prevent despots, self defense, etc. . But if you are going to have a nation with huge social issues, which the US has, and if you are going to have a nation with enormous demographic issues, which the US has, and if there is not a common culture, as is the case in the US, and if guns are readily available, you will have a shitload of gun deaths. And that is the US situation.
I am not advocating gun control. I am saying fix the fucking other issues.
So what to do? Well, you can change the culture, the demographics, and the social situation. Start by getting rid of welfare, and stop coddling those that will not adapt to a common culture.
Read for comprehension?
“However, if you think gun crime is not a serious issue in the US, you are out of your fucking mind. 30,000 people a year die by gun in the US. That is a serious issue.”
Never said that. Never even implied it – but if it makes you feel good, fine. But then – how many die from car crashes? Defective / poisonous medicines / practices?
“But make no mistake, when guns are readily available in countries with significant demographic and social issues and lack of a common culture, there will be significant gun crime.”
SO, if guns are not readily available, there will be no gun crime? Is that so, Captain Obvious?
Or did you mean, if there is a common culture it will overcome such things as significant demographic and social issues even if guns are readily available?
OK, it was too convoluted to parse. Never mind.
“Also, your points re China under Mao, etc., are idiotic when the conversation is about murder.” The state cannot murder? LaVoy Finicum might argue that with you – if the state hadn’t killed him.
“I am not advocating gun control. I am saying fix the fucking other issues.” I might agree with you on that one – but doing so would require an Enlightenment superior to any in history. Good luck.
If guns are not readily available, gun crime will be reduced. That is indeed obvious. Hence why knife crime is more common than gun crime in Oz and London. But that bird has flown in the US given the hundreds of millions of guns in circulation, and there is no putting that genie back in the bottle. Banning or restricting guns when there are few guns in circulation will likely reduce gun deaths – ie Oz. But Oz had a low gun crime and gun ownership rate to begin with. It is a common misconception that guns are banned in Oz. Not so. Everyone I know have many, by the way.
And if you think that having a well armed citizenry would prevent millions of deaths in the face of a government with ill intent, you are mistaken. The military is far too well equipped. But at least the citizens would possibly win in the end. But at massive loss of life. But that glimmer of hope is one reason I do support gun rights.
Nice strawman trying to bring in car accidents and medicinal deaths, by the way, which have zero to do with this.
Re common culture, check out crime among the Swiss. Guns everywhere. Almost no gun crime. The Swiss common culture with relatively few social and demographic issues. Imagine that. Combine social, demographic, and cultural issues with a lot of guns and you get lots of gun crime.
Re the “if you think” comment, I did not say you thought it. That is what the “if” means.
Re fixing the issues, it does not require enlightment. It requires a joint will of the people. Unfortunately, the people are so fragmented that it is nearly impossible that the issues will be fixed.
And hence why I regularly say that the US is screwed. It is aging. Demographics are aginst it. It is riddled with debt and parasites. There is no common culture. The family structure is severely eroded. Education is in the toilet, and work ethic is largely gone. Government is corrupt. Etc etc etc. It is going to end very poorly. The question is when, and of great concern is what the remnants of the US will look like.
James – it has been fun. Thanks for playing!
Agreed – we were not too far apart to begin with.
“And if you think that having a well armed citizenry would prevent millions of deaths in the face of a government with ill intent, you are mistaken. The military is far too well equipped. ” Their families are not, so they are subject to pressure from loved ones in the line of fire. But yes, that is a last resort if the Feds decide they are invulnerable. I suspect whole units would rebel if ordered to shoot families.
“Nice strawman trying to bring in car accidents and medicinal deaths, by the way, which have zero to do with this.” Your thought processes are really rigid at times. If with 300 million+ guns available (low estimate) we only get 30k gun deaths a year (many gangbangers / drug deals gone bad / low impulse control ghetto freaks) then isn’t that a LOW incidence? Too many, yes, but most folks aren’t psycho and won’t shoot someone they don’t even know (at this point anyway). Why are guns deaths so low when cars and drug deaths don’t require violence? Is it irrelevant to notice we could easily have 100k gun deaths a year but don’t? And who is profiting from all these policies?
We don’t have 100k gun deaths a year; why? Are the “ties that bind” still strong enough to prevent a catastrophe? Will they stay that way?
Anyway, glad to “play”. Another two hours at work and I can go home to sleep!
Guns aren’t legally available to citizens in Mexico and they don’t have a “significant demographic and social issues and lack of a common culture” so shouldn’t they be poster child for gun control by your standards?
You could also consider countries like Brazil using those same standards you want to apply to us.
firearms deaths–look for yourselves
https://www.google.com/search?q=how+many+people+die+each+year+in+the+us+by+firearms&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS775US775&oq=how+many+people+die+each+year+in+the+us+by+firearms&aqs=chrome..69i57.30511j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
suicides
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/suicide.htm
So about 35,000 all up, of which 13,000+ are not suicide. Those are big numbers.
Australia has around 40 gun homicides a year. 40! At 1/15 the population. So, if Australia had the same population as the US it would have 600 gun homicides a year, vs over 13000 in the US. Oz has around 150 gun suicides a year, or an equivalent of around 2200 a year populaton weighted, or less than 1/10 of that of the US.
You simply cannot compare anything re Australia and the US when it comes to guns and crime. Australia is safe. The US, not so much. Many issues are at play.
Thank you.
Someone who knows the facts here in Oz and in US has finally spoken some common sense; the one thing missing in the US debate.
Yes guns are controlled in Australia, but I am still able to own pretty well what I need for sport and hunting. I don’t need an UZI, M16 or SLR for hunting or target shooting. They are in fact quite bad choices for these uses compared to good purpose built hunting rifles available.
Would I like an SLR or M16?
Yes actually. I used them extensively in my time in the military, and grew quiet fond of them. (Both since been superseded by the Aus-Styre) Reliable, rugged and fairly accurate. Fact is I don’t need one, and if me not being able to easily own one makes it less likely some drugged fucked junkie, religious nutter or mentally unstable outpatient is going to get one at the local shopping mall and shoot up the nearby school I am happy for it to be so. It is more difficult to own semi auto firearms and hand guns in Australia. This severely restricts the ability for mass shootings to take place.
Yes it is too late for US, that horse has absolutely bolted.
John of Oz.
But you don’t have to worry about things like a Muslim invasion there.
Or illegal immigrants with their drug and other violent gangs.
Your government actually protects you from such things.
I haven’t been to Australia, but I think you would have the same problems and gun crimes as America if you were burdened with the same savage throwbacks and libtards we are suffering. When your inner cities are full of savage, ignorant, uncivilized, incoherent mutants who can’t grok civilization and subsist on govt handouts, you’ll have the same issues as America. And you will find that laws and regulations can’t stem the flow of arms. Just look to your neighbors in the Philippines who can turn out any weapon in a few hours in their backyard sheds. Just look at the folks in the US who have shown you can 3d print a gun. I saw a guy online who banged out a functional AK using a shovel blade to create a receiver flat. Just look at the Afghanis who have crafted rifles by fireside for generations. Just look at the free flow of arms around the world. The PRC was caught smuggling AK47s to Californian gangs in 1996. Your laws don’t matter. Your culture matters. Once that slips, you will look like us. Hell, look at England, which also has gun crime and their own thriving underclass of terd world savage weirdbeards. They never stopped the IRA from getting weapons, either. Considering how easy it is to carry weapons on a boat of any size (I’ve done it, myself, with a PPSH41, but that’s another story…), I bet your country has a lot of unknown weapons floating around.
Laws are things law-abiding people apply to themselves. Everyone else is free to do what they want until they’re caught.
The statistics just uncovered, the CDC reported in 2015 firearms were used 2.5 million times for self defense in the USA. That is getting almost close to 1% of the population staying out of crime statistics. We must also factor in the propaganda effect of poor concert goers, and the children.