Constitutional Conservatives

Guest Post by The Zman

In response to my latest podcast, a listener asked why I was hostile to the “constitutional conservatives” given that I would prefer to live in a society that abides by something close to the old American constitution. After all, the tricorn hat crowd just wants to return to the old order as defined by the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. That’s a fair question and it is certainly true that most people in dissident politics came from some form of official conservatism or libertarianism. As such, most everyone here prefers ordered liberty.

The first problem with self-identifying as “conservative” in any way is that the label has been thoroughly corrupted. When someone like Jonah Goldberg is considered the face of conservatism, the label no longer has meaning. Goldberg started out on the far Left working for Ben Wattenberg at PBS. His “journey” to the Right got him only as far neo-conservatism, which has always been a Progressive heresy. The fact these people are allowed to call themselves conservative says conservatism is a meaningless label.

Even if you want to tease out the neocons on the grounds that they are fifth columnists with loyalties that transcend American politics, what’s left is nothing more than 1960’s left-libertarianism and some ostentatious Bible waving. The self-styled “Bible believing Christians” are about as Christian as Hinduism. Their bespoke brand of religion is a product of the therapeutic culture, not Western civilization. Of course, Left-libertarianism has always been little more than the accounting department of Progressivism.

The point is that like the word “fascism” the word conservative carries with it baggage I have no interest in totting around. Any effort to “reclaim conservatism” is either a waste of time or doomed to subversion and corruption. Dissident politics is as much about rejecting the people who man the barricades of the prevailing orthodoxy as it is rejecting the orthodoxy. The problem with Buckley conservatism was never just about ideology. It was the sort of people who saw it as a useful vehicle that was always the problem.

As far as the argument in favor of “returning to our constitutional principles” is concerned, it is important to understand that one reason why we are where we are now is those constitutional principles. The men who wrote the document and assembled the political order at the founding, did so to lock in their positions in the elite. Winners not only write the history books, they write the constitutions. What those men of the 18th century did not contemplate and maybe could not contemplate, is the rise of American Progressivism.

A small child alive at the time of the Constitutional Convention, if he lived a long life, could have seen the birth and death of the American Republic. Within one generation, it was clear that the constitutional order created in 1789 was not going to hold together. The Hartford convention was in 1815. Of course, not long after the issue of slavery and the irreconcilable difference between the American South and Yankee New England made clear that the constitutional order was untenable. That order ended at Gettysburg.

The point here is while those “constitutional principles” sound appealing to our modern ears, the people who actually lived them did not like them very much. Interestingly, the romantics for the 18th century politics have the same problem as fascist romantics, in that they never wonder why their ideal was a complete failure. The fascist ideal can sound pretty good, until you look at the actual results. The same holds for the constitutional republic, as designed by the Founders. Whatever its merits, it collapsed in a lifetime.

Even if you can argue that with some modifications, the old order can be made to work, accounting for Progressive efforts to undermine order, the problem is the same one faced by libertarians. That is, short of a violent revolution followed by a good bit of genocide, there is no going back to the old system. The people in charge will never permit it. That’s why they are tolerant of constitutional conservatives. They merely function as the court jesters of the neoliberal state, keeping the people busy with pointless political activism.

Putting all of that aside, ask a constitutional conservative if he would like to bring back slavery. Ask him if he would like a return of freedom of association, where citizens are free to discriminate. The best you will ever get from these people is a willingness to limit the vote to tax payers or property holders. They can’t even talk honestly about the role of women. Most of what the Founders believed is now considered disqualifying racism, sexism and ethnocentrism and the conservatives would agree with the Left on it.

The simple truth is that conservatism has been utterly worthless in stopping the march of Progressivism through the institutions of America. If the Founders came alive today and gained power, the first people they would hang would be the conservatives on the grounds they collaborated with the enemy. For as long as I’ve been alive, the Left’s greatest weapon in the culture war has been the so-called constitutional conservatives. In every fight, it has been these people who have counseled surrender and accommodation.

Just as mobsters wrap a victim of a hit in a carpet and toss him in the nearest dumpster, the goal for us it to wrap the so-called conservatives in their constitution and dump them into the dustbin of history. If there is to be a society in North America where white parents can raise white children, white people have to stop thinking there is an orderly solution to a lawless society. The people in charge have no respect for the spirit of the laws, much less the letter of the laws. When enough white people figure this out, real change is possible.

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curtmilr
curtmilr
September 10, 2018 9:53 am

It is as simple as any constitution that is cobbled together by a series of compromises, such as the 3/5s Compromise, is not sacrosanct. That is why the Founders added the possibility of ordered revisions, clarifications, and improvements via the Amendment processes.

I’d argue that the original Constitution “failed” with Marbury vs. Madison. It was decisively buried by Lincoln when he demanded enforced union and disabled the states. The Constitution says “the united States of America”, not the United States of America, which is a unitary corporate, monolithic assembly.

The Progressives continued the dismantling of the remaining ordered liberty structure up to today, as we approach anarchy.

Whether Trump is attempting a return to a purer form of the Constitution remains to be seen, but he is definitely neutering a series of the Progressive horn-dogs that have besotted the free and productive individuals of American society for the last hundred odd years.

That is an improvement. But his deep, but necessary, ties to the military to achieve this reveals the military industrial complex being the puppeteer again, about which we have been warned repeatedly from George Washington to Dwight Eisenhower.

The tilt between the military establishment and central backing cabal is what we are living thru now, with no clear outcome yet visible. Nor do we have a clue as to what the effect of a victory for the military would be for the individual citizen. The central bankers would institute socialized tyranny, as been made plain by history.

Interesting times indeed! There’s an ancient Chines curse about that!

None Ya Biz
None Ya Biz
  curtmilr
September 10, 2018 6:01 pm

Dammit! Chaos not anarchy! There is a difference! Use the language as it is intended to be used and not how obfuscationist want it used!

Fleabaggs
Fleabaggs
September 10, 2018 10:39 am

“White people have to stop thinking there is an orderly solution to a lawless society.
There, somebody finally said it. It’s about time.

Uncola
Uncola
September 10, 2018 10:40 am

The simple truth is that conservatism has been utterly worthless in stopping the march of Progressivism through the institutions of America.

Perhaps it should be phrased thusly instead:

“The simple truth is that morality has been utterly worthless in stopping the march of immorality through the institutions of America.”

Due to varying perspectives (or separate “movies in the mind” according to the cartoonist Scott Adams) morality means different things within the current two Americas.

Liberty requires that morality cannot be legislated. Although progressives passionately legislate their particular brand of values, they cry fascism when conservatives do the same; or when laws (disliked by the left) are enforced.

To where are we progressing? That is the question.

At the same time, neocons are lawless as well.

The author Viktor Frankl was correct: The Statue of Liberty on the right coast, should have been paired with a Statue of Responsibility on the left coast.

starfcker
starfcker
  Uncola
September 10, 2018 11:10 am

“Liberty requires that morality cannot be legislated.” Bullshit. It has to be. Or guys like me would just kill you and take your shit. Why do you think the Ten Commandments was ever on Courthouse walls to begin with? That was the first legislation of morality, and our entire civilization is built upon it. That’s why the left hates it so much

Uncola
Uncola
  starfcker
September 10, 2018 12:17 pm

Star – You are conflating morality with law.

Morality is a code of conduct. Laws are written rules that are enforceable, or not, depending upon a society’s morality; which can’t be legislated

starfcker
starfcker
  Uncola
September 10, 2018 2:34 pm

Semantics, dude. How do you enforce a code of conduct? Laws are a code of conduct. You don’t have laws because of the good guys, commentary on this site notwithstanding, you have laws because of the bad guys. There is no liberty without men willing to enforce that code of conduct or law, whatever you want to call it. Without enforcement, the bad guys win every time. The only thing that ever keeps the barbarians outside of the gates is strong fearless man willing to do whatever it takes.

Uncola
Uncola
  starfcker
September 10, 2018 3:22 pm

Only the military and dictatorships can enforce a code of conduct.

This is why the philosopher John Locke said:

The end of law is not to abolish or restrain, but to preserve and enlarge freedom. For in all the states of created beings capable of law, where there is no law, there is no freedom.

And why John Adams said:

Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.

I suppose one could make the arguments that morality is the spirit of the law and there are different spirits behind natural law and secular legal systems.

Either way you cannot legislate a spirit and this is why I said:

Liberty requires that morality cannot be legislated.

Either we are moral and free or we are not free. In a land of unjust laws, I can choose to defy them and remain moral. Conversly, in a land of just laws, I can choose to defy them in immoral ways.

Therefore, the more immorality, the more laws; and hence less freedom because you cannot legislate morality and retain liberty. Immorality to a libertine appears as freedom, but society always pays the price. That price is tyranny.

Sadly, over time, populations tend to descend into immorality.

This is why the philosopher Thomas Hobbes believed a “benevolent dictatorship” to be the best form of government.

Yet, the problem with that is benevolent dictators are always replaced by their counterparts.

Only a moral people can be free.

What Is the Difference Between Law and Morality?

starfcker
starfcker
  Uncola
September 10, 2018 4:11 pm

“In a land of unjust laws, I can choose to defy them and remain moral.” OK, I like that one. But I would have roughed up John Locke. I’m not a utopian person. Again I see these kinds of arguments as just semantics. I do agree that at the root of a good democratic government is benevolent dictatorship, if you want to call it that. Ideally,and the way it’s set up, is those benevolent dictators are our elected representatives. In any situation you have to have decision makers. But like Hobbes says, you always end up with the other kind sooner or later. Hence the lousy run we have had over the last three decades.

Free Speech Forum
Free Speech Forum
September 10, 2018 10:53 am

Americans want to have a civil war over homosexuals, abortion, and illegal immigrants, but no one cares that the USA is a bankrupt warmongering police state.

jamesthedeplorablewanderer
jamesthedeplorablewanderer
  Free Speech Forum
September 10, 2018 3:57 pm

I don’t want a civil war over homosexuals; I really don’t care who / what you screw, as long as it’s consensual and doesn’t involve children (under 18, say). I don’t want a civil war over abortion; your sorrow is your sorrow, whether you choose it or require it for medical reasons or are preventing the birth of a horribly disfigured, mindless or otherwise defective child. I don’t want a civil war over illegal immigrants; they should be deported whenever / wherever found, end of policy.
THOSE WHO WANT TO CONTROL ME are the ones who want a civil war; THEY DEMAND I not only tolerate but celebrate homosexuality, which to me is a mental illness. THEY DEMAND I not only tolerate but celebrate abortion, when all I see is sorrow. THEY DEMAND that I not only tolerate but accept and encourage illegal immigration.
When I get tired of their demands, the will learn why it is foolish to make them.

wholy1
wholy1
September 10, 2018 12:03 pm

“Labeling” is a key element to the identification and resolution of a TARGET.
And BTW, who was – still IS – the greatest “socialist” [FOR]E-V-E-R?
Answer: JC – “where TWO or more are GATHERED . . .”; Bible Verses About Helping Others

robert h siddell jr
robert h siddell jr
September 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Traditional American Conservatism stands strong across America in spite of communist word termites (usually urban youth). Americans know pornography is not freedom of speech (a Big Lie that don’t fly); that the pursuit of life, liberty and happiness does not mean government and corporation censorship of supposed politically incorrect speech (all we need to know about PC is contained in the First Amendment); that freedom of choice becomes murder in liberals hands; that social justice means discrimination and robbery of the Right to liberals (Conservatives ended that with the 14th Amendment: Equal under the Law); that liberals twist Freedom of Religion into required oppression of Christianity. Liberals are grinding their subversive axes, Prepping for Revolution; but when you bring it to America like you did to Spain in June 1936, you will meet the same fate.

AC
AC
September 10, 2018 2:37 pm

‘Constitutional conservatism’ is merely the latest attempt by the left to set a hard boundary on acceptable behavior within the right. The communists are losing. They are losing because we are no longer playing by their rules. They don’t like this, and are attempting to steer us back onto the losing course they want us on.

Only winning is important, because losing means our complete destruction. We have, collectively, finally grasped that we have been losing a war that most of us were completely unaware of until quite recently. It has been a total war, waged against us by an utterly foreign people which we welcomed into our societies. In pursuit of their total war against us they deployed every tool at their disposal – just as they have done in the past, against every society that has ever tolerated their existence.

gatsby1219
gatsby1219
September 10, 2018 4:40 pm

Most people don’t have the stomach to fix this country.

Hollywood Rob
Hollywood Rob
September 10, 2018 5:39 pm

Stop calling them Progressive. Call them what they really are – communists.

Per/Norway
Per/Norway
September 10, 2018 6:49 pm

“Even if you can argue that with some modifications, the old order can be made to work, accounting for Progressive efforts to undermine order, the problem is the same one faced by libertarians. That is, short of a violent revolution followed by a good bit of genocide, there is no going back to the old system. The people in charge will never permit it. That’s why they are tolerant of constitutional conservatives. They merely function as the court jesters of the neoliberal state, keeping the people busy with pointless political activism.”

Wise words and true.