Guest Post by Hardscrabble Farmer
Human beings require faith in their lives the same way a fish needs water. We are the only animal species that creates it’s own reality based upon belief rather than the physical limitations of our environment. This system is so powerful that in order to function our ‘soul’- the part of us that is neither body, nor mind, but the sentient passenger that speaks to us when we have done something good or bad-demands that we acknowledge it’s existence.
For almost all of human existence we have relied on one form of God or another to explain this manifest phenomenon. If we were simply animals with needs what could possibly explain the voice inside that says ‘No!’ when we are offered the opportunity to steal something that we need to feed ourselves? Why feel guilty for attempting to procreate with any available partner when we are married? These are the correct choices in the animal kingdom because it promotes survival and to survive is the prime directive. Humans are driven by a more complex set of drives that are frequently at odds with our physical survival and at times threaten it, yet they prevail as a motivating force.
Why?
Because human beings have become a form of domestic livestock, partially directed by our own path, but also directed by other species that require our protection. By becoming a domesticated species we entered into a new line of adaptation- stable societies that remain rooted to place rather than as wandering clans made up of offspring and progenitors who seek resources where they find them. We learned how to create sustenance despite seasonal cycles, how to remain in locations permanently that should have exhausted available resources and to actually improve the long term viability of those environments to become useful and productive year round.
It was that shift in our behavior that likely created the soul as a modifier and limiter to our animal drives. To explain it we either created gods or God and used that exterior motivator to help us understand why we should limit the much deeper, older and more pressing drives of our animal nature- so that we could continue to enjoy the bounty provided by living domesticated existences as societies by not being excluded.
Therein lies our present dilemma.
A powerful set of gods or God himself served as a check and reinforcement of our developing soul/conscience until it could serve itself through wisdom and self control. As anyone who has ever raised a child can tell you, it is a skill rather than an inherited trait and it must be developed under the guidance and tutelage of those who are older and wiser and exhibit the kind of self-control that leads to a stable society. The only way to insure it is to have a proxy for God or gods on hand throughout our development and maturation process, namely parents.
Our current society- for whatever reason- decided that stable two parent and extended generational family units were fungible with any form of “parenting” be it single motherhood, repeated reformation of family structure through divorce and remarriage, village style rearing as exhibited in inner cities and even foster and surrogate families or homosexual unions as if they were in fact the same thing as the form of family that has been in existence as long as we have been a species. Add to this the move towards and human centered society that has abandoned the gods/God almost wholesale in less than a century and you have the explanation for 90% of our problems.
The voice hasn’t gone away- the conscience/soul/God- only it’s source. Hence the desperate need of those who no longer have been raised in stable households who no longer believe in God to understand what is causing that voice inside their head and why they are so fundamentally disquieted by anyone whose understanding of the world and approach to living is at odds with their own. The State and the ones who control it’s power are absolutely aware of this reality and have done everything possible to manipulate it in order to become- in their view- managers/herders, human farmers of a livestock that is not that much different than cows, pigs or sheep.
They understand that the most powerful tool that they have to maintain control is to rely on the much older and powerful drives of survival; food, shelter, sex and comfort. And so they have have supplanted the religion of the gods/God with the religion of The State wherein man himself is the soul, where this conscience is interchangeable with our mind/emotions and it’s soul purpose is to be fed, protected from the elements, sheltered, sated sexually and entertained in the time between those activities.
Anyone who tries to minimize the effects of conscience, of ideas like right and wrong, and to replace them with similar though completely contradictory concepts like laws and compliance to public perception is either ignorant of the reality of humanity and it’s adaptive course or very aware and manipulating that reality to their own ends.
The people you see in WalMart riding in heavy-duty baby carriages to shop for even more empty calories and pharmaceutical remedies for their existential woes are the same as the crowds of people clawing at the doors of the Supreme Court, tears of anguish rolling down their cheeks. They are starving for something that they cannot quite fathom, their hunger is deeper and more profound than that of a shipwreck survivor and the only solace they have, the only means of speaking back to the voice inside is not an appeal to God, but a petulant demand to the only parent they have every known, Uncle Sugar/The State.
It’s all so easy to understand if we could only have the tiniest bit of perspective or if we knew even the smallest shred of factual reality concerning our origins and history, but as we have seen history is something that if it offends can be pulled down from it’s pedestal and smelted and our origins hidden in a web of lies by those who understand quite well how we function and how to control the livestock under their control.
Read the Talmud. You will find that many jews consider us “gentiles” (goyim) to be no better than livestock–to be used and abused for the benefit of the jews.
This vile text (intended for jewish eyes only) shows an air of supremacism that would make a Ku Klux Klansman blush. In it are proscriptions (and permissions) that allow jews to take advantage of those who are not of the chosen “tribe”.
Islam has many of the same proscriptions against “infidels”, but is less supremacist in nature, showing a respect for Jesus Christ and his mother Mary, unlike the jewish talmudic texts that declare that Jesus Christ is an apostate, “boiling in excrement for eternity” while his mother Mary “conceived Jesus with a Roman soldier”.
I encourage all to read the talmud and koran and see for yourself what the “chosen” think of us “goy”.
Indeed. The Talmud, Koran, and Torah are not the same and it’s up to the readers to discern the differences.
At the same time, and as previously stated, secularism and/or erroneous ideologies should not be conflated with genetics.
Thanks for posting this. Because it caused me to go back and reread HF’s article more slowly … and that is a good thing.
And guess what I discovered? Nowhere does he mention Jews or the Talmud!
Which leads me to my question of the day: — why the fuck did you feel it necessary to post your diatribe … one that we’ve heard hundreds of times already?
You took a great article and decided to take a fucken shit on it! You must be so proud of yourself.
The truth hurts, doesn’t it? Are you a member of IDF unit 8200 or hasbara? I am merely pointing out the (not so) obvious source of many of our problems…
I love truth.
You are also an Idiot of the Highest Order. You absolutely positively know my views about (((them))) …. I am certainly no fan of the nation, or the religion. Therefore, your “IDF unit” accusation is beyond weak and pitiful.
Your problem is that you have no understanding whatsoever of the following concept; — there is a time and a place for everything.
Your Talmud rant had nothing to do with the article. Again, you demean the thread with your rant. You demean even yourself … as you come across as an unhinged Loon. Is that what you’re trying to accomplish? Look, I’m only trying to help you. I normally charge $25 for this kind of advice.
Your name-calling exposes you as a small-minded individual who appears to be afraid of the TRUTH.
Look around you.
Look who runs the media, has infected our government with “dual citizenship Israelis” and directs our “foreign policy” from Tel Aviv and Jerusalem.
The “chosen” are directly responsible for the debasement of our American culture.
You offer to “Help me?” You’ve got to be kidding…
Stuck, $25? BB charges $50 – that means his advice is more valuable.
What if God was one of us? Just a slob like one of us? Sometimes I wonder if all the pain, suffering and evil on earth are because God went on a bender and he’s laying somewhere sleeping it off. If we are made in his image he must have some weaknesses, faults and flaws.
“For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways,”
declares the Lord.
“As the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways
and my thoughts than your thoughts.
Adam was made in Gods image. Adam sinned. We are made in Adams (not Gods) image.
Genesis 5:3 KJV… “And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:“
We need to be put back into that original image.
1 Corinthians 15:21-22 KJV… “For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.“
So let me see if I have this straight, as you have obviously thought about this adam thing more than I have. You are suggesting that Adam lived a long time, most likely with eve. And in that time he had a son. I guess he was Seth. So now there appear to be three people on the whole of gods creation. Adam, Eve, and Seth. So help me out here. Who is Seth supposed to have fucked? His mother?
I’m just a little confused and I am sure you can help me out.
Hollywoody makes the same mistake a moran like Dung would make. There are details in the bible which are not mentioned but are intuitive. At a later time, people are prohibited from marrying their sisters (excepting some states in the South). So, if you use some deductive logic, err. Anybody, anybody?
“…people are prohibited from marrying their sisters (excepting some states in the South)…”
I assume you meant some countries south of the US border EC.
I was going to say Kentucky but out of respeck for Bea…
Thanks Gringo, we may be inbred but at least we ain’t commies. 🙂
Sorry maggie. Nobody is gonna touch that one with your ten foot pole. And no matter what you intuit out of the bible. Seth was left with one woman to boink. Unless, of course, there were other women on gods creation. But then that kinda blows away your creation myth.
There were other children from Cain and Abel, both “brothers and sisters.”
Actually, Cain and Able (perhaps twins – my own speculations) were before Seth. Cain had a family by his sister. As genetics were perfect and uncorrupted at creations dawn, that was not a problem.
Genesis 5:4 KJV… “And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters:”
Again, devolution. Not evolution.
Ok, I’m with ya on this. So is it that your god, the god of all creation who made heaven and earth and created man in his own image, that god, decided that incest was the answer and that he wouldn’t bother to mention the daughters of Adam and Eve?
It took him, what, 180 years to pump out one kid, and then after 950 years he had cain and able. I admit to having quite a dry spell but geebuz, how can you go eight hundred years without tapping old eve. I realize this was before menopause, but don’t you think he would want to father some kids? And all he had was his sons, whom he could have sex with and his daughters, who don’t even merit a mention. Sounds pretty inbred to me.
I must have something wrong here. Help me out man. How do we avoid all of the pitfalls of inbreeding? After all, there was nobody else on the planet – or have I missed something?
You’ve missed a lot and it doesn’t take a bible scholar like Stuck to explain to you that the mass of people who drowned in the flood had to be, lessee, 1000 years divided by 20 equals, carry the 5, hmm, 50 generations each double (conservatively speaking) the size of the previous generation. Remember, nobody had died in those nearly thousand years so that was a shitload of people. Do you really think all those names would fit in a small compendium concerning beginnings?
So you and your horrible attempt at math humor (not that we don’t need more math humor) still glosses over the fact that the first son, is it Seth, had to do his mom if he wanted any kids. And if he didn’t do his son, he had to do his sister. If he didn’t do either his mom or his sister/sisters then he was pulling one off for the team. And this lasted for 800 years. Poor old Seth must have had one impressive forearm. Or maybe he was just pious and forgo the pleasures of the bed for his god. But then, after 800 years Cain and Able, now they had 800 years of sisters to procreate with. The limiting factor here appears the ability of Eve to spit out daughters. Let’s do some maffs. She theoretically could pump one daughter out every nine months. That’s probably kinda like one a year. 800 daughters for Cain and Able to have sex with. Let’s face it, there was nobody else around. There was Adam, and Eve, and Seth, and Cain, and Able, and 800 to 900 daughters. (None of whom rated a mention in the big book of god.) Nobody could go anywhere else to find a husband or a wife.
No matter how you do your maffs, they were fucking their sisters. Now I can see the need. Ya gotta get some. But after a few generations of that wouldn’t they all be sitting on the ground trying to figure out how to put on their hats? It’s not a shitload of people. It’s mom, dad, and the 803 kids. That’s all you have to work with.
Well according to the passages that GCP has provided. Maybe there are more passages that I have not taken into account.
You are getting confused. Adam made kids with his sister or himself, however you see it. So it wasn’t a problem for the kids to do the same with their own sisters. After a few generations, they could also choose from their cousins and distant cousins. How is this different from a place where everybody is said to be related to the emperor? A small village has the same problem, sooner or later everybody is related by blood.
The problem you are having is that you apply modern morality to a time when such things did not exist. Back then, people were not constrained by the flag, Trump or the N word, they were free. Free to marry their sister. (Even in the early days of Christianity, some morans were marrying their mom) It was only after the flood or the exodus that it was proscribed.
“Maybe there are more passages that I have not taken into account.”
It is a most readily available book. The first 11 chapters of the book of beginnings explain a great deal of human history that has been obscured from the “enlightened” man of today.
I can’t recommend it highly enough.
But in the end, you have to admit that incest was best. So your god created a world of the heavans and the earth and then set his creation free to participate in incest. No matter what you think about genetics, and I know you don’t believe in genetics, there is no way this doesn’t devolve into morons. And don’t try and say that they had better genes. If you don’t believe in evolution and genetics then you can explain away how an entire population of inbreds wasn’t retarded. The clinical term not the pejorative.
I will defer to GCP on that after the flood thing, but you are right, if god erased all of the mark 1 mod 0 people with a flood, then you have exactly the same problem all over again. You have a total world population of roughly four people (I didn’t watch the movie.) It is essentially the California Condor problem. Too few sperms and too few eggs.
But in the end, you have to admit that incest was best. Hollywood Rob
Your mind is definitely twisted. Nobody has to admit anything. Maybe you never read Paul. He said everything was kosher until the law was handed down. Therefore, what you relish is not the actual incest but the disobedience in flaunting morality.
There was that story of two orphans who met while researching their background hoping to meet their real family. They fell in love and got married. Then they learned they were brother and sister. Did they say incest is best? No, they decided to live as brother and sister. They had not the warped mind that you have even after they had lived as husband and wife.
A damn cow is less sinful than you because it knows not the difference between right and wrong, you do but you lust after wrong.
DNA 1.0 was much more stout than 2.0, 3.0, and so forth. It took time to degrade after the fall.
El Coyote, I wish I could give you 1000 thumbs up for that comments.
You can send the thousand thumbs up to my electronic wallet, Admin has my email
Hollywood Rob, perhaps you should read the Bible yourself because you definitely have everything backwards and have no idea what the Bible actually says.
The Bible. especially Genesis, isn’t something like the US Census. In other words, you have no idea how many women were available for Seth to boink. It cold have been thousands. Follow along here.
1. There was Adam and Eve. That’s two people.
2. Their first son was Cain. That’s three people.
3. Their next son was Able. That’s four people.
Got that? At this point, according to the Bible (if it is a Census) there are JUST FOUR PEOPLE on Earth.
4. Then Cain kill Able. We’re back to just THREE people. Right? Wrong!
5. You see, God punishes Cain by cursing the ground. Cain objects and says;
““My punishment is more than I can bear. Today you are driving me from the land, and I will be hidden from your presence; I will be a restless wanderer on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me.”
In other words, per the bolded text above, Cain believes there are MORE THAN THREE PEOPLE on the earth!
6. Now, God could have said; “Listen ya dumbfuk, there’s nobody else on earth!”. But, no, God confirmed Cain’s believe that there were other people alive on earth when God said;
“Not so; anyone who kills Cain will suffer vengeance seven times over.” Then the Lord put a mark on Cain so that no one who found him would kill him.
=========================
In other words, your theory of Limited Boinking Material has been discredited.
Excellent Stuckmiester. But in discrediting the limited boinking material theory, you have completely blown away GCPs creation myth. Truly you have exposed the inconsistency at the base of the christian creation myth. In the very book that they claim as the truth of the one true god, lies the words which destroy the entire christian faith.
Now I don’t consider myself a biblical scholar like you are and I am definitely not a man of god like GCP so my comments might be misguided. It would be great if some of the more deeply religious among us would help us out here with some more informed insight.
Adam and Eve’s first children were Cain and Abel. Seth is the last child. However, the Bible states that Seth had “brothers and sisters,” and that’s after Abel was killed. We have no idea how many children Eve could or did have. Because the human race was genetically pure, the brothers and sisters were able to marry and produce healthy children. But later, the rules are changed and sisters and brothers can’t marry due to genetic deterioration, meaning birth defects. Later, cousins couldn’t marry for the same reason.
You do not understand what you quote from the Bible. Knowledge is not understanding. I notice you quote from your knowledge but you do not quote from your own understanding. Eternal life is life outside of time. We are all eternity blind. Jesus was the man and Christ is the eternal life way. When Christ returns it will be felt in consciousness of those destined for eternal life. Christ will not return in the body of Jesus. That is not the eternal plan. Jesus came to show us the way. Christ consciousness is the result of the perfected man who will gain eternal life.
Your preaching is obsolete.
“You do not understand what you quote from the Bible.”
There’s a bold statement. You’re welcome to try and explain it to me.
My preaching is based solely on the Bible. Nothing more, nothing less. You’re free to either take it or leave it. How does the Bible describe Christ consciousness?
Philippians 2:3-8 KJV… “Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.”
There’s a lifetimes worth of work!
You write… “Jesus came to show us the way.”
Actually, He came initially to show Israel the way. Are you Israel?
Matthew 15:24 KJV… “But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
Edit: you write… “That is not the eternal plan.“
How are you sure?
Have you contemplated on the eternal? The eternal contains all the patterns of existence both possible and impossible. You are still stuck in the writings of the Bible; written for people 100 generations ago that had a very limited vocabulary. People back then were mostly illiterate and very limited in abstracted ideas. The Bible was written for them. And now you are trying to use this form of writing to convince people of the truth when you yourself don’t even understand what is being said.
You think Christ is coming back in his body to rule the world. Have you seen anybody come back? No you haven’t but you are willing to believe Christ will come back in a body.
But actually people do come back in a new body. It is called recurrence. But you have not seen it because you are not observant enough to see it.
You cannot get away from quoting verses in the Bible because you have not moved into direct experience. The eternal plan with it’s patterns are in plain sight. All you have to do is look. Observe yourself and how mechanical you are. Observe your thinking patterns. Observe your reactions to the people around you. Jesus was the man who was born with all these traits. Only Jesus showed the world that these traits was not the Christ in him.
“You are still stuck in the writings of the Bible; written for people 100 generations ago that had a very limited vocabulary. People back then were mostly illiterate and very limited in abstracted ideas. The Bible was written for them.“
Well then Thunderbird, I stand with them. The Bible was written for me. A foolish man…
1 Corinthians 3:18 KJV… “Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.”
1 Corinthians 1:21 KJV… “For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.”
“You think Christ is coming back in his body to rule the world.”
Yes sir, I do.
“Have you seen anybody come back? No you haven’t but you are willing to believe Christ will come back in a body.”
No I have not. I am willing to believe that Christ will however because (my) God cannot lie and He said He would. My God is Christ.
Have you personally seen anyone come back from the dead?
“You cannot get away from quoting verses in the Bible because you have not moved into direct experience.”
True. I have a more sure Word than that of limited human experience. From the man (Peter) who physically experienced Christ’s transfiguration come these words regarding scripture itself as more trustworthy than his own eyewitness account.
2 Peter 1:16-21 KJV… “For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty. For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount. We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.”
“Jesus was the man who was born with all these traits. Only Jesus showed the world that these traits was not the Christ in him.”
And you learn these things by direct experience or do I have that wrong? As far as I can tell there is a single source of information regarding the Lord Jesus Christ on earth and that is the King James Bible. That’s my foundation.
You seem to be preaching a different Jesus. From the foundation upon which I stand I warn people away from such “new age” teachings. Some will head such warnings, some not.
2 Corinthians 11:3-4 KJV… “But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him .”
I preach the Jesus Christ who died for me while I was yet a sinner that I might enter into eternal life with my Creator in His good time.
Romans 5:8 KJV… “But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.”
Amen.
Husband and I just watched this very old documentary about the Philadelphia Experiment, Montauk Project and the Phoenix Experiment. Are you familiar with that particular conspiracy theory?
“Your preaching is obsolete.” —————– Thunderbird to GCP
+1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
You also forgot to mention that GCP is a pompous know-it-all asshole. But, that’s OK.
That’s not fair Stucky. GCP quotes his bible. I have not looked but I am pretty sure that he would not misquote his version of the bible. Tbird and GCP are facing off over differing views within the christian religion. You can agree with either one but that does not mean the the one that you disagree with is wrong. He is right for the version of Christianity that he believes in.
I would be willing to bet money that even if they have different versions of the bible, you would find GCPs quotes in Tbirds bible and visa versa.
Once again, thanks for the dig on Cain going outside of the tribe. I didn’t know that.
Grizzly, we were made in God’s image, but he did not make us gods. There is only one God. And he sure is NOT Allah.
So you’re saying that Allah is the one who went on a bender and is laying somewhere sleeping it off?
@ Hardscrabble,
I do believe we’ve been drinking from the same cistern.
I enjoyed the perspectives and thought they rhymed somewhat with this article that was linked this morning on another site:
Good stuff Unc. Well worth reading.
“the chirping fledgling of the New Dark Ages.”
That proverb you obliquely refer to has to do with being faithful while HF is speaking about faith.
Drink water from your own cistern,
running water from your own well.
That was a great piece, I agree with Grizzly, Doug. (Betty’s).
Ought to be required reading for mother’s of high school daughters with intentions of heading off to college.
Even that move (furthering education via the many flawed ideologies pushed at universities) is coming under more scrutiny.
Especially if their major is in a field of study that is useless, or worse, not having any idea or career goal, other than just ‘getting their degree’.
Red flag: if the daughters at high school age already are infected with “boys are toxic” and their best friends are girls who admire feminism.
Which we know is getting taught to them even in grade school.
Funny how that’s not taught too much in parochial schools that are faith based.
Yet even there, radicals get moulded.
Sigh…
So summing up, keep your kids out of public schools or they’ll end up loony or guilty before proving their innocence.
Seems to be a theme today about the deranged leftists religion of “post-modernism/humanism”
An interesting thesis that focuses on the continuing consequences of the “death of God” as identified by Nietzsche over a century ago. As societies become increasingly decoupled from their “mythological” moorings the fragility of their various infrastructures will become increasingly evident and they will be ever more prone to sudden collapse. When SHTF day comes it will likely seem almost instantaneous, literally a matter of a few days or weeks at most.
Powerful wrap up.
Some lesser animals are monogamous unto death.
Rewriting history has been eternally en vogue, as has the burning of libraries, effectively interrupting, redirecting the hierarchy.
The loss of this knowledge presents interesting questions in terms of belief.
“The State and the ones who control it’s power …. have done everything possible to manipulate it in order to become ….. managers/herders, human farmers of a livestock that is not that much different than cows, pigs or sheep.” ————– article
Plus one gazillion!!!
There is absolutely positively 100% a GRRRRREAT example of what really happens when faith replaces faith …. (cuz, there is ALWAYS faith in something) …… specifically , when faith in God is replaced by faith in The State.
That would be, Russia.
Russia was once a bastion of orthodox Christianity. Russians have been a DEEPLY spiritual people since it’s very beginning hundreds of years ago. And then came the Marxists. God is dead, they said. And so, they killed God to the best of their ability, and those who wanted to continue their faith in God.
And the result? We know the result. The ruination of a nation. Millions killed. Suffering of every kind. Once (relatively) free people became total slaves.
But, Russia is slowing returning to her roots. Orthodox Christianity is making a comeback. You can kill God … but, the thing is, you can’t keep Him dead forever.
Hopefully, the same will be true for America. I just don’t think I’ll be alive to see it.
Absolutely terrific article, HF. It is good to see the “soul” of our Farmer”, however briefly.
In a book about escaping a Gulag in Siberia, the Long Walk Back became The Way Back for screenplay.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-11900920
Brief to the point: They were helped by small communities they saw living in the Mongolian regions and the Himalayas. Those communities managed to survive and even thrive in their own ways, hidden almost Galt-like in the unknown areas of Russia.
I read that book many years ago. A truly epic story that left a mark on my soul.
Mine as well.
[Am trying a newish (pun intended) moniker. (Edit: I don’t like Anew as Aname. Am thinking perhaps there is no need to be Amagnet for negativity when there are dogs to brush and music to hear and play.]
What I found astounding in the Journey were the men’s desire/goal to return to their units and rejoin the fight! Talk about commitment to duty! Some of them actually did return to the war in some way, even if just to support and promote. I think a couple of them went on to just live out their lives.
I do not understand how the Polish got all the jokes directed at them when one encounters such courage, bravery and true grit in so many Polish characters.
Post-edit: I won’t be “Anew” again. If that inspires I won’t get fooled again to start running in your mind, so be it.
Not one of your best Marc. There were a couple of left turns with a right turn signal and your closing was weak. I am not saying that I think you are wrong, just that you seemed to be less focused (and less eloquent) than you usually are.
Actually, it was one of his very very best. I’ll tell you why; it is because the Farmer has opened his heart to talk about faith …. and that takes courage, especially with all the shit-flingers here.
You’re not fooling anyone. We ALL know why you you think this wasn’t one of his best, indeed … even “weak”. It’s because you get a enraged engaged blood filled hard-on that explodes all over your keyboard whenever someone dares talk about the f-word … in your case, that would be “faith”.
You just need to shit on those who have faith, and even those who just talk about faith. The damned shame of it all is that you aren’t even capable of seeing how offensive you’ve become; Hollywood Rob, yet another One Trick Pony.
Stuck
He’s just irritable because he can’t get the gerbil out of his butt.
Hollywood Handjob is the latest moran to succumb to lameness. Having no game, he resorted to the old Billy tactic, accusing several commentators of being sock puppets of his ‘lone’ critic.
In his latest defensive ploy, he has become a snob literary critic, finding fault with TBP’s bard. Handjob’s got the credentials, a stack of rejected movie scripts. He should have stuck to writing scripts for porno films.
To be fair it was posted as comment, not as an essay so it was a one off thought fresh out of a hard night’s sleep (took down a massive five stem maple yesterday, must be six cords in it and it took the better part of eight hours to do it without killing anyone or wrecking the adjacent structures).
I’ve been dwelling on the livestock/domestication issue for obvious reasons and now ten years into this there are some obvious realities that always eluded me before. And the behaviors we’ve been seeing lately are far more reminiscent of religious manias than they of political discord. The big question, for me, is where does conscience fit in to all of this? I know I can’t even get away with a fib any longer without hearing the silent passenger start to talk me down, but the rest of the time? When you’re doing what you should be doing? Silence. And that seems to be the time when there is real communion with whatever it is that gives us our center. These people with their profanity laced melt-downs seem to be caught in some kind of internal struggle and what they do in public appears to be a lashing out against their own self-struggle.
And if you don’t believe in God, then what’s the purpose of behaving in a civil manner since all that is left is our animal nature? I may be misanthropic, but I’m not cynical.
Marc. I don’t see your post as in any way religious. You mention many beliefs in the supernatural, but you don’t use them as your central point. Your central point appears to me to be in your last paragraph above.
And if you don’t believe in God, then what’s the purpose of behaving in a civil manner since all that is left is our animal nature?
I would suggest that what you have missed is that all life on earth is capable of accessing that which you seem to ascribe to humans alone. Animal nature to you is amoral. But animals have morals and exhibit moral behavior in many subtle ways. You have cows. You lamented the death of your lead cow a while back. How do you account for your having a lead cow without realizing that all of the other cows had to have considered that they were not the lead cow. Your chickens have a pecking order. You know they do. How can you describe the existence of a pecking order without realizing that all of the chickens had to determine, for themselves, and remember where they stood in the pecking order. How do you account for your dogs loyalty? How do you account for chimpanzees going on war parties and killing opponents.
My point is that you are asking a question about the moral character of all of this worlds inhabitants and you are ignoring the most obvious answer. The one that is staring you in the face. The animal nature that you claim is less than your own human nature is most likely not even slightly different.
And there is the nub of it. I stand against religion because it confuses you and causes you to assume that you are in some way divine. Created in the image of god. The receiver of divine knowledge while all of the rest of life around you is there to serve you in your magnificence. Take a minute to consider the morality of those who share your world. The animals who live with you. The liberals who scream on your tv. Their morality is not your morality. It is different. But it need not be less moral.
If you can’t distinguish between humans and animals, then there is no debating with you. Your anything goes amoral mentality is warped. Society has functioned for centuries based on a common moral code. It’s so simple even you should understand. Humans are rational. Animals act on instincts.
In the Nicomachean Ethics I.13, Aristotle states that the human being has a rational principle (Greek: λόγον ἔχον), on top of the nutritive life shared with plants, and the instinctual life shared with other animals, i. e., the ability to carry out rationally formulated projects. That capacity for deliberative imagination was equally singled out as man’s defining feature in De anima III.11. While seen by Aristotle as a universal human feature, the definition applied to wise and foolish alike, and did not in any way imply necessarily the making of rational choices, as opposed to the ability to make them.
Having a moral code, and I would add – sticking to it…
“…This above all: To thine own self be true, for it must follow as dost the night the day, that canst not then be false to any man…” — Sir Henry Neville (aka: William Shakespeare) from; (Hamlet) inspired by Socrates – ‘Know thyself.’
(In Act I, scene III of Hamlet, the character of Polonius prepares his son Laertes for travel abroad with a speech (ll.55-81) in which he directs the youth to commit a “few precepts to memory.” Among these percepts is the now-familiar adage “neither a borrower nor a lender be” (l.75) and the dictum: “This above all: to thine own self be true, /And it must follow, as the night the day, /Thou cans’t not be false to any man “(ll.78-80))
I would like to thank both Jim (I assume) and Steve C for so eloquently making my point.
To thine own self be true…. the ultimate in moral relativism and yes, selfishness.
That is pure animalism. If humans thought like that we would be without charity, compassion, empathy, sympathy..all elements that elevate humanity.
Neither Shakespeare nor Socrates intended this advice for people like Hillary Clinton that lack the morals of a civilized society. It doesn’t suggest that such people should go ahead and just follow their sociopathic lifestyles, although as you allude to they would be being true to themselves. As twisted as that might be.
It is directed at those people that have developed the morals of a civilized society and advises them that just having these morals is not enough. They must follow them.
@ Javelin…
The single satanic commandment: “Do what thy wilt, shall be the whole of the law.”
Ain’t that the worldly truth?
Humans are animals. They act on instinct. They are frequently “irrational”, for some values of “rational”.
Cows have morals. That’s some crazy fucked up shit right there, I don’t care who you are. 🙂
Dude, I didn’t say that they were your morals. But yes, they do have a moral understanding of the world around them and they do behave morally. Unlike your sister, who is most clearly not at all moral and who drives you crazy. Or was it your sister in law?
Cows react to life with an in-bred survivalism given to them by God. That’s why certain birds will cover their eggs and camouflage them with leaves to discourage snakes from eating them. It’s why female cats roll on the ground when they’re in heat to send signals to a male cat. These are not taught by their parents. They are given these instincts by God, which is passed down generation to generation through their DNA.
For example, I’ve had a chance to observed cats since I feed a lot of outside cats. Even female cats that have never seen their mothers prior to breading will exhibit the same traits during the heat period as their mothers. That can’t be a learned skill.
“I stand against religion because it confuses you and causes you to assume that you are in some way divine.”
Funny… I stand against religion for the same reason.
I’m not religious. I KNOW I ain’t Divine; not even good enough at my very best to please the Divine! But I do know that He is Divine and that only the Divine can help me. Go figure.
Here again GCP I am going to have to rely on your knowledge as this particular topic is not one that I have thought about. So, as I understand it, and I could be wrong, you expect, as a true believer in the one true god, to be taken up to heaven so as to sit on the right hand of the lord, your god. You don’t expect to come back down here. You will, and on this point I am somewhat unclear, be an angel in heaven. How is that not divine. You become immortal.
At this point HR runs off to look up divine…
of or relating to a god, especially the Supreme Being.
addressed, appropriated, or devoted to God or a god; religious; sacred: divine worship.
proceeding from God or a god:
Yep, looks to me like you expect to become divine even if you don’t think that you are divine at this time. That is the reward that you offer. Suffer in this life for divinity in the next.
At some point in the future, I don’t know when, I will be transferred out of this flawed mortal physical body which I currently reside in, into an immortal body. We all will someday have immortal bodies because we all are eternal beings. Our “inner man” is eternal. Very simply… Some bodies will go into everlasting life. These are the people who chose God over self. Some bodies will go into everlasting death. These are the people who choose self over God. Says Paul…
Philippians 3:17-21… “Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample. (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.) For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.”
1 Cor 15:35-44… “But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain: But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body. All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory. So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.”
“Yep, looks to me like you expect to become divine even if you don’t think that you are divine at this time.”
At NO point in time, even after this supernatural glorification process which I do fully long for and expect, do I become God. I become sinless. As I stand right now here on earth, as a saved Christian, I am freed from sins penalty. Christ took it for me. That is Gods gift to me and to you if you want it. It’s offered absolutely freely with no strings attached. We’re too pathetic for there to be any strings… At some time in the future, when God has had enough of this fallen world, He will rescind His most generous offer of grace and peace and will return in judgement and war. The purpose of that judgement and war is to begin to remove sin from this world. The world which has chosen to forsake Gods free gift of grace and pay its own sin debt.
As I am currently saved from sins penalty (God poured out judgement and wrath upon His Son on my behalf); I’ll be spared this war.
1 Thes 5:9… “For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,”
When I am glorified by and with Him, I will at that point be saved from sins presence. My current spiritual “standing” is sinless, my physical “state” is sinful. In the future my standing and my state will be sinless. That does not mean I will BE God. I am/will be still, a created being… as Adam was before the fall. He is still the Creator!
“That is the reward that you offer. Suffer in this life for divinity in the next.”
Suffer? Not really, though some days do kinda suck… (sin is).
2 Cor 4:17-18… “For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory; While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.”
Paul even gloried in his daily tribulations. He was a spiritual giant! Talk about STRONG…
Rom 5:1-5… “Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; And patience, experience; and experience, hope: And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.”
It’s so easy. I think that’s why it’s so hard… Deal with this sinful life trusting God not self, for a sinless existence in the next; whatever the next life entails.
“You don’t expect to come back down here. You will, and on this point I am somewhat unclear, be an angel in heaven.”
My home is (will be) in the heavenly places. It is the future nation Israel’s function to deal with the earth. I will not be an angel, I will be in a position to judge those angels who have fallen and left their first estate.
1 Cor 6:3… “Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?”
“you expect, as a true believer in the one true god, to be taken up to heaven so as to sit on the right hand of the lord, your god.”
Spiritually speaking, I’m already there…
Wild, huh!
Nice reply. But you misinterpreted what I said. I did not say that you would become god. I said that you would become divine. See the difference? You expect to become immortal, and stand in judgment, on the right hand of the lord.
Oh, and I don’t understand how you can say that you won’t become an angel. I thought that everyone who walked through the pearly gates got their wings and a golden harp. You know, to join in the celestial choir and sing the praises of the one true god.
But like I said, it’s not something that I have given a great deal of thought to and I could be confused about some of the finer details of heaven and angels.
What separates humans from animals is our awareness of our mortality. Animals avoid danger out of survival instinct and to avoid pain. I doubt they fear death itself the way humans do. It is our cognizance of death and mortality that drove us to construct religion. We cannot accept that this is all there is and when it’s over we are finished. There has to be something more. We have a persistent need to also be reunited with those who have passed on out of our lives.
I myself believe in a higher power. Not from teachings from my elders or some ancient manuscript, but out of awe. I am in awe of nature, the beautiful planet we live on, the cosmos. I just find it too hard to accept that this is all by lucky chance. I also have a feeling of a soul inside myself. Do animals also have souls? I think probably. My dogs have all seemed to have it. I also can’t shake the feeling that we all have a purpose and this life we are in is a lesson.
Obviously it is impossible to know for a fact what lies beyond death. Or even if the bible is actually the word of God. A lot of people pretend to know what is unknowable. I just have to accept that there are mysteries that I don’t have answers for. Maybe when I die they will be revealed. Maybe not.
Deep Bear. Very deep. I like it.
GB… the Bible is there for your personal examination. Come to your own conclusions. It takes time and effort and both will be well rewarded.
peace…
GCP, Though my faith in a creator doesn’t emanate from the book, I don’t discount the value of the bible, and I do identify as a christian… as far as organized religions go. I have a problem with some of the dogma. Original sin for one, and Jesus dying for that sin for another and the concepts of heaven and hell also don’t work for me.
Original sin; I wasn’t there, I didn’t do it, I haven’t been consulted and I didn’t give my consent. Don’t try me for a crime I didn’t commit. That’s like telling me I owe reparations to black folks for something someone else’s ancestors did several generations ago. You didn’t pick no cotton and I didn’t own any slaves.
Jesus dying for my sins; I was raised to be responsible and accountable for myself and my actions. I don’t want or need someone else taking up my slack. I don’t have a problem standing up for whatever I have or haven’t done and I ain’t gonna lay my shit on someone else. I own it.
Heaven and hell; That’s just people giving themselves a pay raise and putting people they disagree with in the dungeon.
I try to read the bible as time permits, though my knowledge of it is minuscule compared to yours. I’ve been re-reading Revelations lately, since it would seem we are in the end times. I thoroughly enjoyed Jordan Peterson’s examinations of the first few books of the old testament. As he professes, these stories have great meaning and value and we discard them at great peril. I also enjoy very much discussing the bible with the local Jehovah Witnesses who visit me regularly, though I have made it clear I have no intention of becoming a member.
Is the bible the actual word of God? Possibly, but would God really be giving us advice on how to treat our slaves, when we should stone our wife to death and when it is proper to have multiple wives? Just a few questions I had after reading a few short chapters of Deuteronomy.
Grizzly, I hate to say it, but if you don’t accept Jesus as the savior, the sacrificial savior of your sins, then you are not a Christian. That’s what it’s all about.
I am a Christian, but I’m a Preterist. I don’t believe in a tribulation and I don’t believe in a future anti-Christ, unlike other Christians on this thread. I believe Nero was the anti-Christ and that Jesus returned in the first century, just as he told his followers he would do, saying, “In this generation.” I believe Jesus returned in the guise of the Roman army that obliterated Jerusalem in 70 A.D.
I like Gary North for Biblical interpretation. Not everyone on this forum likes all he says, and, unlike me, he’s a partial Preterist, meaning he thinks there will be some tribulation before Jesus returns. I suggest reading his works. “God and Pharaoh” is one of the best books I’ve read on Christianity and explained a lot to me that I didn’t’ understand about the Bible.
On Revolutions, I suggest “The Book of Revelation Made Easy” by Kenneth Gentry.
I hope this will be helpful on your quest.
Do you think it possible that the entire interpretation of the Bible was skewed by some very clever and intelligent men (and perhaps women) who studied the suffragette and anti-alcohol movements and decided to destroy the family as a societal unit? An early co-opting of a Populist movement by TPTB?
There were quite a few very important decisions made regarding communications and communicating to the masses in the 1910s through a war or two.
20Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture comes from the prophet’s own interpretation. 21For no prophecy was ever brought about through human initiative,
Sister VV… I would also greatly appreciate the opportunity to speak more privately with you regarding your end times views should you have the interest to explore a possibility you may have not yet explored. The best book to read regarding the Bible is the Bible itself!
My email is a click away from my name. Very glad to see you speak bold truth to salvation!
Grace and peace to you and yours as well…
VV, I understand all that quite clearly. I had a bit of a Southern Baptist upbringing. I went to church four times a week for a good long period of time. I used to consider myself born again. I just happened to have an epiphany that a lot of the dogma is horseshit. I might sound confused, but I’ve reached my conclusions largely on my own using my own life experience, my own senses and my own reason. While I don’t mind expressing my beliefs I’m really not interested in telling someone else what they ought to believe nor am I seeking someone else to tell me what I ought to believe.
Thanks for the reply GB, I appreciate it. Without involving a thread hijacking of monumental proportion, addressing your many questions would be my pleasure and a great challenge I hope to have the opportunity to meet.
Perhaps on my own site if you have the interest in meeting me there… What we know of Christianity emirates from a single book and in this VV is absolutely correct… without original sin from which all subsequent sin comes, you don’t need a Savior. If you don’t recognize your need of a Savior, you may identify with the idea of Christianity but you are not Christian.
That statement should NOT nor ever be taken as an insult. A Christian is by definition a person who has trusted in the Lord Christ and NOT themselves or their own actions to pay their sin debt to a Holy, Just and Loving Creator. We are ALL sinners; none better or worse than another. The price owed is eternal death. Someone must pay that price. If you choose to, so be it. It is your choice to make. God in Christ offers to pay it for you however, offering eternal life in return. A no-brainer if you ask me…
To begin to explore further I’ll recommend getting out of the book of Revelation as we cannot be in the “last days” and reading chapters 3-8 in the book of Romans. In those chapters you will find the foundations of Christianity laid. I welcome any and all questions that reading might generate.
Most of the Bible regards the Law given specifically to the nation Israel; what you see in the book of Deuteronomy for example. What most do not realize is that the Law and it’s myriad tenets was given to man to prove to man that it was impossible to keep. Thus the need for the Savior.
Romans 3:19-20 KJV… “Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.”
This is a dilemma only God can remedy and remedy that dilemma He does!
Romans 3:21-28 KJV… “But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; To declare, I say , at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.”
Some of the most amazing words ever spoken by God to man!
Grace and peace to you and yours.
It may be a no brainer for you pastor, but I’ll still be accountable for myself and take whatever lumps I have coming to me. Thanks anyway, but there ain’t no free lunch.
I said I identify as a christian, as that was my childhood indoctrination and I haven’t dabbled in other religions. I did not say that I am a christian. I will however confess to being a former christian. I do believe in a creator, though in what form that creator exists I will accept as an unsolvable mystery. You can answer that mystery through your book, which I’m sure gives you comfort. There are a lot of different people with claims to a lot of different answers. Is yours the correct one? Maybe. Maybe not. You obviously believe it to be so, but beliefs are not necessarily truths.
The concepts of original sin and salvation make for a rigged game that I don’t have the desire to play. To what end? So that I can sit up in heaven and scoff at the less fortunate who are burning in hell? I’d rather go to hell than be among the pious.
“I’d rather go to hell that be among the pious.”
That sir is a request God will honor.
What exactly is original sin?
Did Eve commit the first one or was that the flaw of choice the Creator put into our nature?
In spite of knowing Vixen Vic is correct about Christ, I want to tell you I read your comment with relish, feeling you’d touched upon a couple of Bible questions I’d not seen expressed quite so well.
For example: How does crucifying one’s child remove the sins of the world? (The anti-sacrificial lamb theory might suggest the sins of the world are actually flaws of the creator.)
And, I enjoy Peterson’s discussion of almost everything, yet I sometimes find his discussion of archetypal motifs a bit pedantic. But, technically and ironically, Jordan is the ultimate Pedant (formal, male teacher) to me.
I would qualify my use of the word by reminding the reader(s) how words acquire meaning to each of us. The word “means” what you infuse into its meaning. The first “male” teacher I ever met was a retired military man who taught sixth grade. He did not teach me, but the “other” class in the middle school I attended. Since it was the first time I’d heard the term “pedant” and male teacher, I attached that obscure meaning to the word and being “pedantic” has no negative meaning on its own.
Have you ever misread or misheard a word in context, then misused that word and gotten a bit embarrassed? I can remember feeling like an idiot when corrected by a Calculus professor about the pronunciation of the word parabolic and what it meant. A humiliating day for a 19-year-old student long ago.
I agree with much of what you say GB.
I don’t know how the Good Lord is ever going to sort it all out.
“For example: How does crucifying one’s child remove the sins of the world? (The anti-sacrificial lamb theory might suggest the sins of the world are actually flaws of the creator.)”
The “child” was God Himself. He became one of us because it was us who messed up His perfect creation. Instead of making us pay for our mistake; a Love only a perfectly Just Creator could demonstrate came into play and He offers to pay for our mistakes Himself.
Always best to simply allow the Bible to speak for itself.
John 1:1,14 KJV… “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.“
Philippians 2:5-8 KJV… “Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.”
Romans 5:12-18 KJV… “ Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam’s transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come. But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many. And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification. For if by one man’s offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.) Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.”
gcp… I grew up in a country hick Baptist church community.
Those were rhethorical questions and your constant sermonizing here is offputting.
Hope springs eternal… ?
Awareness of the future is at the very heart is sentience.
In fact an argument could be made that the first sentient thought that ever occurred (a staggering concept no matter what to believe about the nature of existence) was not about discovering the self but discovering the future.
If I may ask, on what thread was it posted? Because I must have missed it and now can’t seem to find it anywhere. I was just curious regarding how you were so inspired – because your thoughts above and mine on my “Slough” post have much in common.
I came back to read your post again because of the humans as livestock comparison. I’ve never actually thought about ancient man and his animals domesticating around the same time until you wrote about it here some time ago. Since that time, I’ve read more than one assessment which concurs and it does make sense.
In my piece, however, Malcolm Muggeridge appeared to view secularist faith as (ultimately) seeking power in order to corral other men like livestock. Whereas you appear to view man (in his natural state) as being in harmony with other (lesser) animals, and the land.
Not to steal overly much from R.W. Emerson here, but I wonder if nature acts as a reflection of something more, in the way astronomers can see invisible gravity by viewing its effects on distant planets. In other words, viewing what is unseen by its direct manifestation.
Perhaps this explains why so many folks living in urban areas view man as “the alpha and omega” because, after all, everywhere one looks in the city are other men and man-made material things.
I’m glad Admin posted this comment and I can’t believe I almost missed it, but it sometimes happens when I’m writing myself. Thanks again Hardscrabble (and Admin).
Love ya Doug.
As an addendum: I always found it interesting that great leaders of men in the Bible were shepherds first. For example, Abraham the Father of Faiths, Moses the Lawgiver, and King David; to name a few. Just an interesting little side-note there
I thought Moses was a prince of Egypt.
Yes.
He was before Egypt, Inc experienced a hostile takeover by the owner’s son. Then, after an extended sabbatical at a desert retreat, Moses, literally, found God in the mountains; or so they say.
And, now, the TBP blessing for you, my wayward son:
Ripples in the pond of the random universe. Forest Gump’s feather on the wind. Who knows what surprises tomorrow may bring? Let them be discovered in the company of friends.
“If I may ask, on what thread was it posted?”
It was originally posted on the Wizards thread.
Thanks, Stuck. It was hidden in plain sight.
Jason A has a nice video on this: Scientists Discover Something Biblical(the soul)
Withdrawing from a society as messed up as ours is not misanthropy… it is simply wisdom.
There are many levels ro these ideas… I’ll try and fail to Express a few thoughts coherently:
faith has incredible value to the individual… how can it not to society at large?
There is certainly a distinction to be made between the transcendent and the supernatural… but it rarely is made. The supernatural is by definition beyond us and an unknown. The transcendent is absolutely necessary to the function of society and its existence is not debatable.
I don’t know who said “if you don’t believe in God you don’t believe in nothing.” But it is profound and vital. Faith forms so much of our world that it becomes invisible… like (to use Wallace’s analogy again) water to fish.
The real question of God is not about form and function but about purpose….an over-arching purpose to existence. Maybe the highest ordered pattern in a cosmos built of self-similar patterns. The song from which all other songs flow?
Is reason the opposite of faith? By which i mean it’s dipole… the two opposites between which we must always balance?
Ok. Enough. It’s late and my brain hurts from running in such circles. Nice post HSF. Thanks.
Having read the series of books in “The Earth Chronicles” I wager that man has been controlled by government ever since he settled down by way of agriculture. Lots of argument as to what government means, control mind, control men, the act of controlling, etc. Or to direct, rule, guide, govern, from Greek, kybernan, to pilot a ship.
https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/160026/does-the-etymology-of-the-word-government-mean-to-control-the-mind
We have all been little more than revenue-generating livestock since Wilson and company enslaved us all on Uncle Sam’s plantation with the creation of the Federal Reserve and the alleged ratification of the 16th Amendment (read “The Law that Never Was” for more information as to how that amendment was NEVER properly ratified by the states).
I apologize for this here, farmer dude, but I just stumbled across this and had to bring it here to 1) Admire it and 2) Decode it.
“And so they have have supplanted the religion of the gods/God with the religion of The State wherein man himself is the soul, where this conscience is interchangeable with our mind/emotions and it’s soul purpose is to be fed, protected from the elements, sheltered, sated sexually and entertained in the time between those activities.”
Here is my attempt to translate that 56 word gem into short sound bites for the lengthy sentence impaired.
They supplanted gods/God with State, where man equals soul equals conscience equals consciousness. Since man’s (soul/sole) purpose is to eat, drink and be merry unmolested by judgmental bastards with silly rules set in stone tablets, it is no wonder we prefer the State be our nanny (the state and the motherland became one and the same to Stalin, who called for the Kulaks to fight for the motherland, then sent them to Siberia for re-education upon their return* giving their ancestral farmland to communal farming agents, who squandered monies and seeds in ways that led to massive starvation in Lithuania and Estonia and other provinces.) After all, the State only demands a portion of our labor in taxes and controls all of the means of production. When was the last time you saved your own seed for flowers or tomatoes, much less for food and breadgrains?
But, the Nanny does feed us, doesn’t she?
How far away from your point do I wander, HSF?
HF
Do NOT answer an “Anon”. They are evil.
Et tu Brute?
Stuck, you were just calling on that anon for help yesterday, regarding the silver bandages.
Really?? I don’t think so!
I was calling on my long-time friend …. MAGGIE. (who twice refused to help).
I don’t know squat about all this Anon bullshit. I’m sick and tired of trying to figure it out … so, I won’t. I am not kidding. I’m going back to my previous policy of ignoring Anons as much as is possible. If a person doesn’t have the courage to use a name, I almost certainly won’t take time to respond.
Now that I’m on a role, I gotta tell ya I think your new “Andrea blah blah blah” moniker is total bullshit. Just being honest. But, at least I know it’s you, El Coyote. Did you know that in Hebrew “El” means —-> GOD??!! I think you should go back to El-something.
Stucky… too much muddy water under some bridges to even contemplate. I read many of the posts here when I stop by but I rarely read comments unless I’ve made a comment such as the one above.
Like you, I have gone through a great many changes in my life with the loss of parents and family members, once beloved and treasured, turning into strange caricatures of themselves.
Recently, I came to accept there is an increased need for many of us to be careful about who we share information with. I’d always known it, of course. I just didn’t want to accept it.
Some people should never be trusted with the code.
And, I don’t post under a name any longer because it attracts nonsense like the “… doesn’t post here…” crap and I really do not have time for the nonsense.
I have work to do.
I do have a mountain of silver bandages.
Well, you do what you gotta do. But, again, I’m not gonna spend time for each anon post trying to figure out who it really is. Maybe you an use some secret code … like inserting code 38D … somewhere randomly in the post?
The pharmacy didn’t have silver bandages. But, they did have a silver spray specifically for wound care. The pharmacist said to clean it first with H-peroxide and spray with silver. We’ll see how that works.
Haha
I bought some colloidal silver gel at the natural/organic food shop and put it on the wound dressings. What is most important is that you make sure the dressing is clean. I know that sounds like something you tell an idiot but in all truth, we are not always careful about what we touch with sterile gauze.
The dressings come from the PolyMem dressing company and while there are many sizes, shapes and even textures (I started with silvery looking gauze and am using a dark silver sponge now), they all appear to be ridiculously priced.
https://www.vitalitymedical.com/ferris-polymem-silver-4-25-x-4-25-inch.html
Next Friday I visit my surgeon who will close this wound and send me on my way, if all goes well.
Thank you for the update and link. Ho Lee SHIT …. fourteen dollars PER BANDAGE?? I’m guessing that simply spraying a bandage with silver, or schmearing it with silver gel, will accomplish the same thing … a helluva lot cheaper. Thank you for the reminder to make sure the dressing is really really clean.
BTW … Anon 38D works just GRRRRREAT!!! 🙂 🙂
Then I will stop trying out other monikers. Perhaps I can comment and engage in dialogue here on the rare occasion.
yes… $14 per bandage. Some are even more.
Now, riddle me this: Why the hell would a little square of foam infused with colloidal or microbial silver (whatever that is) cost so much? I can get some 9v batteries and make my own colloidal silver for a few pennies and that will kill bacteria. Hell, I imagine putting a silver coin or bar in my wound cleanser might help.
So, who pays for all of these things? Not MY insurance company, which is actually the Veterans Administration right now. I don’t get to see what they pay for the things they order per my doctor’s order. I know what the company WANTS to charge me if I order directly, but NOT what the VA pays. I don’t get an EOB (explanation of benefits) from the VA like I do Tricare.
Tricare simply would read (Billed: $389 Paid: $85 Copay due: $12)
That’s a made-up example. TriCare does NOT pay for the wound dressings and I’m a bit confused as to WHY they are paying for some things and the Veterans Administration is paying for other items.
Nick and I are bumfuddled beyond belief with the kind of (excellent) service I’m getting from the VA. It is almost like they are punishing me for badmouthing them.
Oh Maggie Maggie Maggie, nobody cares if you make lunatic comments. It is the 50 and 60 comment conversations that you carry on with your other names that clog up the comment stream. One of your posts was absolutely nothing but you talking to yourself. Waste of bloody time.
Do you really think I post as many people other than Maggie, Agnes or Anon? Are you that nuts?
I just thought you were so busy sucking your own dick you weren’t paying attention to the real conversations around here.
HAHAHAHAHAHA. You are one truly crazy dude.
Hollywood Nutjob, please look up Billy’s comments from 5 years ago so that you can refine your ‘sock-puppet’ assault. I hate to have to wait for you to finally get original. Heck, even his spelled out laughter is better than yours. And do tell us how you used to win logic battles with your siblings.
I have to say, whether Maggie comments on subject or not, I always enjoy reading them. What is a comment section for if not commenting? It doesn’t say it has to be on subject and succinct.
VV… I have pretty much stopped rambling around on TBP. I don’t care about thumbs or even comments, but the mean spirit behind some operators (code for the verboten word) here toward me caused me to pause.
Am glad I stumbled back here. I thought about a new “clean” moniker because, like you, I enjoy posting comments as responses to various points made by the original post and other commenters. It is what draws us to tbp and the few other platforms that allow true interaction between readers and authors and allows the two to exchange roles.
I stepped on a couple of big toes here which are not going to stop throbbing at the inkling of my presence. Even limiting my presence to a few minutes a day doesn’t seem to alleviate the pain for some. Since I already became a new person when the Lord called me His own, I can’t do much more than just stop.
So, I will.
Okay… will try this one and see if I am allowed to comment.
Reading your interactions is as exasperating as reading a Don Juan novel – a touch that was barely a touch – would you two love birds get it on? I mean, Maggie, send Stuck the bandages!
Posting as a anon has NOTHING to do with courage Stucky. Don’t read El’s post if he is being somewhat stealthy at the time, I admire his spunk.
OK, dude, maybe I don’t have your law size library or gigantic theology learning but I know what El means. However, as I have often noted, el in Spanish is simply an article meaning ‘the’ although it is gender specific. I’m not sure you would say el chapo is some sort of diety.
It’s a low class signifier, much like calling yourself ‘the Donald’ but it is used a lot in the vernacular. This is particularly so because Mexicans love monikers. I seem to have inherited that trait, I have one or two monikers. Even Mexico’s new president has held several (5) nicknames.
I am not responsible for any anons. Maggie can make her own choices.
“…judgmental bastards with silly rules set in stone tablets…”
Romans 6:14-15 KJV… “For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.”
Do you need a law to keep you from murdering your neighbor? Is the law the thing which prevents the murder?
When the religion fails; its purpose re-directed, the population desperately seeks another religion, someone to believe. Honesty is such a lonely word, the god of football has fallen, politics is the new religion. The seekers want the new god to be shaped in their image. The enemy always wants to stand in the way between the believers and the god entity. The violent shall take it by force.
EC- Your prediction is coming true!!! On ZH today, there is a article about kanye being in the oval orifice bear hugging DT, during which Trump OPENLY gave support for Kanye to run for prez in 2024.
Stop debating morals, we won’t need them when we go over the cliff.
Ladies and Gentlemen…..President Kanye West….Sheeeeit!!
If you ever wondered why the Grand Cheeto threw himself body and soul (and ownership) into WWE, this is exhibit A. Idiocracy will not be in the future, it is here today. Rock on Donald.
I wonder if Admin will endorse Special K?
That article on ZH should cause people to reflect on what the hell is happening here and now, so far as Special K goes, believe it or not that cartoon bubble-ass joke is a bloodline actor. WHEN do people intend to join reality again.
Please elucidate. Also, is Megan Markle bloodline too?
Gringo- Yes, Markle is the 23rd great-granddaughter of King Henry III and also 5th cousin (15 times removed) to King Henry VIII. Her pedigree is as long as your arm.
She is definitely no random cur half-kneegrow out -the-hood.
The list includes presidents,royals, A-list actors, writers etc, etc.,the usual suspects.
The royals never marry outside of the royal clan. That’s true. They are all descended royalty, yet they call them “commoners.” They tried to even say “Lady” Diana wasn’t part of the aristocracy and was a “commoner.”
I’m a fish out of water, without a system of religious or political “beliefs”.
How anyone can “believe” there is a compassionate God is beyond me. How people can “believe’ their political affiliation makes them superior to others is proof positive that reality is subjective experience requiring no facts to declare its existence.
I’ve never met a belief system (religious or political) that I couldn’t lampoon with its obvious hypocrisy.
Posing belief as our individual fishbowls is a decent allegory, but nobody’s beliefs survives Socratic examination, the questioning its underlying assumptions. Few dare, because questioning prevailing beliefs invites a Hemlock happy hour. Clinging to beliefs after they have lost popular support empties one’s fishbowl.
After Emperor Constantine dismissed Rome’s “belief” in Pagan Gods to embrace Christianity’s “belief” in The One God – how long did it take for Romans to stop feeding Christians to the lions and for Christians to start fires under Pagans? Those fires still burn.
These days, even Houdini couldn’t escape the societal snares that, one way or another, make everybody a heretic Gulliver tied down by Lilliputian beliefs.
Interesting. YOU have a belief system (religious or political). Oh, yes, you do. We ALL believe in SOMETHING.
Just curious … have you ever lampooned yourself with your own “obvious hypocrisy” …. or are you not able to see the beam in your own eye?
I thought about submitting a reply to Dung but he’d only scoff. It’s easy to be a scoffer. Faith is not a measure of intelligence, beauty or popularity. It’s a personal choice like gender preference maybe. I mean, if you suck dick because of peer pressure, what good is that? All it proves is that you’re a fool.
I’m liking the creative monikers. I see you.
Oooooo Maggie, your eloquence is astounding.
Oh, come on, give it a slap. Make it hurt good.
Dragging sacred cows to the slaughterhouse is the work of scoffers, and I try not to be haughty about it, just irreverent.
I expect the same and more back at me.
We all have “systems” we live by, some rational, some not.
My political system is (would be) tribal. Anything larger in scope doesn’t last long. Knowing everyone in one’s circle of governance is impossible today, but it won’t be for much longer.
I don’t have religious beliefs.
I only know what I’ve learned/found to be true about higher consciousness from searching within. I know that any political or religious restraints on behavior that does not injure or take from any else limits everyone.
Every day, I spend some time looking inside myself for “beliefs” to question, particularly when I am tempted to “believe” that ANY effect in my life is a result of anyone else’s cause.
I alone am responsible for every circumstance in my life. That is my credo.
It’s not a belief, it’s the only rational way I’ve found to know myself better. Questioning which choice(s) I made that have brought me to this juncture in life – is a very bright beam.
I squint all the time.
You’re beliefs rest on tradition and from those who came before you. If those who came before you were cannibals, you would be defending cannibalism. If those who were Christians were your ancestors, you would know right from wrong, whether you embrace the religion or not.
“I don’t have religious beliefs.”
Sure you do. Even not having a religious belief …. IS a belief.
I did enjoy the rest of your post. We are similar in a number of ways.
God is compassionate. It’s man, who puts forth religion, that is uncompassionate.
Yes ma’am…
“…We are not human beings on a spiritual journey. We are spiritual beings on a human journey…” — Stephen Covey
I’ll drink to that statement Steve. We are here to experience BEING HUMAN/ HUMAN BEING.
Signed, Evil Anon (not same evil anon above)
That’s a keeper.
HSF – I think that you had mentioned previously that you traveled some with Bill Hicks when you were on the road doing your comedy stuff. He is high on my list of people that I would have liked to have known – for good or bad…
Bill definitely had some interesting thoughts on the subject though. I wonder if you ever talked about it with him?
“…The world is like a ride in an amusement park. And when you choose to go on it you think it’s real because that’s how powerful our minds are. And the ride goes up and down and round and round. It has thrills and chills and it’s very brightly colored and it’s very loud and it’s fun, for a while. Some people have been on the ride for a long time and they begin to question: “Is this real, or is this just a ride?” And other people have remembered, and they come back to us, they say, “Hey, don’t worry, don’t be afraid, ever, because this is just a ride.” And we kill those people…” — Bill Hicks
“…Life is only a dream and we are the imagination of ourselves…” — Bill Hicks
Wayne Dyer used that a lot.
WOW!!! “The people you see in WalMart riding in heavy-duty baby carriages to shop for even more empty calories and pharmaceutical remedies for their existential woes are the same as the crowds of people clawing at the doors of the Supreme Court, tears of anguish rolling down their cheeks. They are starving for something that they cannot quite fathom, their hunger is deeper and more profound than that of a shipwreck survivor and the only solace they have, the only means of speaking back to the voice inside is not an appeal to God, but a petulant demand to the only parent they have ever known, Uncle Sugar/The State.”
Nice prose.
No Kevin, the people clawing at the doors are paid actors.
Sorry i missed this thread… it’s a goodun. The post brings my nature of evil question back to mind. We know that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely..
But we don’t really ever really drill down into the whys and the mechanisms.
Taking power as the ultimate addiction, which seems reasonable, it then stands to reason that it’s simply a downward spiral of diminishing returns and the need for ever greater doses to get their dopamine hits. But at some point the person becomes servant to the addiction. Seeing a street junkie in this light makes perfect sense to us…but the idea of the ultimate corrupt, malevolent king (or billionaire magnate) as nothing more than helpless junkie doesn’t quite compute.
Just what is it that is being served?
That is not meant to be rhetirical. I’d love to hear some thoughts.
Pride? At first I was going to say sex and thats why phalluses have been erected like church steeples throughout every nation on earth:
But, I believe it was C.S. Lewis who said sex was of the flesh, whereas pride was spiritual. The former is satiated easily enough. But the latter will never be. It’s a hole that empties itself; it can’t be filled.
Pride. Definitely… but it’s another abstraction just as evil is most often thought of. I think i’m driving at the internal/external question. And what’s the difference? How would we know?
At least heroin is a real, measurable thing.
You nailed it Unc. Envy and pride seem the most basic, powerful and prevalent human emotions. Human nature is ruled by emotion.
Speaking of the Washington monument and “church” steeples… fascinating stuff!
Another great article, HSF.
Byw… rating genesis or about other book of the bible as a scientific document is ludicrous. As it was written thousands of years before science even became a concept.
Does that render it valueless or “untrue?” Not in the least.
Should be “reading”
How does the order of creation in Genesis so closely pair with Darwin’s theory of evolution? Coincidence?
Pointless rituals and mindless superstitions created by mankind to place controls upon mankind .
Doing the correct or right thing should be easy for those men & women of intellect and good conscience . The lower IQ beings in our society see kindness and compassion as weekness to be exploited because they have no ability to think at a higher level of being .
Politicians take full advantage of both sides of this human condition .
Doing good for your fellowman should bring pleasure to you , not for some recognition from a cosmic entity engulfing all of creation . Those incapable of giving and receiving generally find their way to some shithole of their own making , Hell perhaps ?
The true translations of many ancient texts do not proclaim the meek will inherent the earth but that those who know how to use the sword and keep it in its sheath by their intellect will !
There are times where brutal deadly force is necessary !
Pointless rituals and mindless superstitions created by mankind to place controls upon mankind .
Is that a sentence or a haiku?