Invading Mexico: More Brilliance from Washington

Time: “You have a bunch of bad hombres down there,” Trump told Peña Nieto, according to the excerpt given to AP. “You aren’t doing enough to stop them. I think your military is scared. Our military isn’t, so I just might send them down to take care of it.”

With Trump it is difficult to tell bluster and carney-barker showmanship from serious consideration or actual intention.  While clearly a threat, the remark  may have been intended only to intimidate, and the ascription of cowardice to the Mexican army only ill-bred. Trump’s military record leaves no doubt as to his own courage. Given his administration’s threats of military action–war–against China and Iran, the possibility that he will send troops southward may be worth pondering. Whether the President has the faintest idea of what would be involved in very much worth pondering.

If troops are sent, what will they face in Mexico? What would they do? How many would they be?

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To begin with, the narcos look exactly like everybody else in Mexico. They do not carry ID cards saying “Narcotraficante.” They can easily blend into the general population. If GIs try to operate here, the inability to distinguish narcos from everybody else  will quickly lead to intense frustration. Frustrated troops become angry. They begin to hate the locals as in all such wars they hated the dinks, gooks, slopes, zipperheads, sand niggers, and rag-heads. Mexicans will begin to seem treacherous to them, as always happens when US troops go to countries they do not understand. All Mexicans will come under suspicion.

Soldiers, being young, usually not too bright, poorly educated, with no experience of other cultures, will start knocking people around. It always happens. Always. It is exactly what happened in Viet Nam, Laos, Cambodia, Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia. There will be beatings, people slapped about, mistaken raids with the man of the house handcuffed, thrown to the floor, and humiliated in front of his wife. This is what happens when when you chase willothewisp narcos or terrs or mujaheddin or VC or commies on the basis of shaky information from unreliable sources with agendas of their own.

American forces will be called “advisers” or maybe “trainers” by the Pentagon, but Mexicans will see them as invaders. Since the Mexican constitution forbids the deployment of foreign forces in the country, they will indeed be invaders, although the Mexican government will be pressured into “inviting” them.. No country well tolerates arrogant, blundering, heavy-handed alien myrmidons with the power to push them around. GIs will not be regarded as friends or saviors.


Drug territory, Sierra Madre. Dense cover, fog, enormous rocks, steep escarpments. Phredfoto. 

Much of the narco culture springs from the Sierra Madre Occidental, very rough mountainous land traversed by trails and dirt roads that the narcos know well and GIs  never will. People here are tough, leading lives harder than any in modern America. For many of them the drug trade is a miraculous thing allowing them more than a very hard-scrabble existence. American troops bumbling about here would accomplish nothing. The Pentagon, again, would rely on drone operators with no way of knowing who they were killing.

Many of the narcos are in cities, such as Culiacán, capital of Sinaloa, home of the Sinaloa cartel. What do foreign troops do in a large busy city?

To make things worse, much worse, the narcos are neither helpless nor poorly armed. They have AKs, RPGs. They have years of experience in combat, with each other or the Mexican army. They are skilled at ambushes. When you look exactly like the rest of the population, and the American soldiers look like space aliens, they are easy to ambush. The American reaction to a few dead GIs will be hysterical. The narcos will use ambushes in populated areas to make troops fire wildly, killing children, grandmothers, young women. This will turn the country further against the invaders. Not nice, but effective.

The US will rely on its new toys, drones, and on helicopters to try to compensate for the fact that Mexico is a huge country with lots of very nasty terrain. Drone operators don’t know who they are shooting at. This means that, as always happens, always, they will kill a lot of innocent people. The American media will suppress the these killings, as they do in America’s other invasions, but the Mexicans will know. The military doesn’t care as long as killings do not result in bad publicity. The Trump administration will refer to these slaughters as “isolated incidents.” An isolated incident is business as usual that has been detected.

It takes very little killing of innocents to generate hatred. The public will regard the invaders as worse than the narcos and withhold cooperation,  which will make the invaders yet more angry. Further, cooperating with the US will be dangerous. The narcos respond very badly to such things. The Mexican army will be compelled by the US to assist the invaders but will be unenthusiastic. Soon the Americans will be complaining that they are getting little help in what the GIs will be told is a campaign to help Mexico.,

This too is routine and inevitable. In all of its invasions, in Southeast Asia, in Iraq, in Afghanistan, the Pentagon makes a show of training local forces to “defend their countries,” to stand up and fight whatever it is that the United-States doesn’t like. This means encouraging, or forcing, citizens of a country to kill other citizens of the same country. Only the Pentagon could be surprised when this works poorly. Picture China’s invading the US and forcing Virginians to fight Texans. And so in country after country the Americans complain about the indigenous army, of its poor fighting quality, low morale, desertion, payrolls padded with ghost soldiers, theft of weapons, and troops going over to the enemy.


Northern Mexico. You actually find towns and homes in and around this sort of landscape. Phredfoto.

Mexico is very large, about 2000 miles across the northern border and about 1200 driving miles from Laredo to Tuxtla Gutierrez. Much of it is godawful for infantry operations. Necessarily the troops will be able to operate only in small parts of the country. The narcos will easily go around them. Since a small number of troops will accomplish nothing, there will be calls for more troops.

In short, a few GIs will be pointless. Large numbers will be pointless while killing large numbers of people and reducing yet another country to chaos. Maybe it isnl’t a really bright idea.

 

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34 Comments
BSHJ
BSHJ
February 9, 2017 3:49 pm

We do not need to go there….they just need to quit coming here.

Iska Waran
Iska Waran
February 9, 2017 4:12 pm

Like there’s anything in Mexico we want. Fred is so stupid.

travis
travis
  Iska Waran
February 9, 2017 4:55 pm

Yup. Man had diahrea. Put words to it. We have run anti cartel operations insmall batches for 40 years or more. Still are in bolivia at a minimum. And we dont suffer casualties in most of those tight delta and sf missions.

A.B. Prosper
A.B. Prosper
  Iska Waran
February 9, 2017 8:04 pm

Mexico has vast resources of metals and all manner of useful things

That said we can’t take them in any effective way without removing the indigenous population or occupying them.

We don’t have the spine for the former nor the manpower for the later.

What we do need to do is find a way to seal the border and expel a lot of people , millions and millions of them. Its doable with effort and would resolve the bad hombre problem.

starfcker
starfcker
  Iska Waran
February 9, 2017 10:49 pm

Iska, that’s an enormous piece of incredible real estate, with an insane amount of coastline and an endless supply of housekeepers and gardners (ok, yes, I am trolling you EC). Back to serious, the real estate. Just like Cuba, Mexico is right there, with a climate better than here. And a whole lot of waterfront.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  starfcker
February 9, 2017 11:43 pm

Starfuck, did you not see my earlier comment last month that the USA effectively has already invaded Mexico? It’s more of a reservation with different laws that don’t require US companies to pay great wages, social security or healthcare. And the environment be damned.

Imagine if we could set aside a couple of states in the interior of America, somewhere in the Appalachia. We could have the folks working in unsafe conditions and consign them to an early grave. Wouldn’t that be business friendly?

starfcker
starfcker
  EL Coyote
February 10, 2017 8:05 am

EC, we have let corporate America turn Mexico into a failed state. I think Trump will be the best thing for Mexico. Mexico is an easier fix than most people imagine. Twenty years ago, gringos could bang around the place without any real degree of caution, and it wasn’t any more dangerous than roaming the US. I’m not going to say much more, I’m trying to save it for an essay, but I can’t think of a better country for us to have on our southern border

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  starfcker
February 10, 2017 3:13 pm

They never heard the Greek aphorism: beware of gringos bearing gifts, NAFTA.

If Trump wants to re-negotiate it, it is because he sees that Mexico has thrived under the trade agreement and now, like Laban, he wants to make the original deal more in his favor.

Your the guy to discuss deals, Starfuck. Looking forward to it.

Anonymous
Anonymous
  EL Coyote
February 10, 2017 12:19 pm

Isnt that west virginia? If we did try and invade, I bet those mexicans would have a wall of their own in a big damn hurry

Anonymous
Anonymous
February 9, 2017 4:29 pm

One alleged sentence that was supposedly leaked out of context from a confidential transcript of a conversation between our President and a foreign head of state continues to provide a source of fake news even after all credibility behind the original spin of the leak has been lost.

Not surprising, it seems to be the order of the day today.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  Anonymous
February 10, 2017 7:42 pm

Anonymous, are you and Suzanna in cahoots to downplay the aggressive stance of Trump vis a vis Mexico? The wall was his opening line in the campaign. Now you want to pretend it was all for show. An opening gambit in a political game of chess.

I don’t see that, I see his announcement as a predetermined plan to deport millions of aliens from the US regardless of clean or criminal records. The same was done in the 30’s when the crisis was more overt than it is today. There will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth but the deportations will not make the US secure.

Before the images were flushed down the memory hole, we saw white folks, women, picking through garbage for food to eat, the subscript explained that the woman took off her glasses so that she didn’t see the maggots crawling on the discarded meat.

You will look on the deportations with smug satisfaction that your sins have been cleansed. All that is happening is what always happens in business; when things turn south they fire the janitor first.

The fourth turning is not prophesy, it is a study of the interaction of society’s actions and government reactions.

To quote FM, it ain’t over, snowflakes.

Fergus
Fergus
February 9, 2017 4:30 pm

Fred has been smoking way too much of that stuff Obama orders. Other than that Fred should stop drinking Mexican water, it not only gives you the trots, it gives you strange ideas.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  Fergus
February 10, 2017 7:50 pm

Fergus, don’t you have a couple of gays to blow? Ratdawg and Dutchman haven’t been laid for a while.

Edwitness
Edwitness
February 9, 2017 4:49 pm

What does the project for a new american century have to say about it? That would express the plausibility of such an idea.

Not Sure
Not Sure
February 9, 2017 5:05 pm

Nothing happening with military action in Mexico, after all, this was just a leaked, taken out of context conversation; although if it were to happen, it would go down with the cooperation of and to the benefit of, the Mexican government.
Going a little further, the author seems to be saying we would not meet our goals should we go in, if this were headed up by the former commander in chief I would agree; but with the current administration and secretary of defense, victory would be achievable in spades.

SONNY JIM
SONNY JIM
  Not Sure
February 13, 2017 9:53 am

JUST TAKE THE FIRST FIVE HUNDRED YARDS OF MEXICO…. TWO HUNDRED YARD NO MANS LAND BACKED UP BY US ARMY WITH RULES OF ENGAGEMENT …. ” SHOOT FIRST DON’T EVEN BOTHER TO ASK QUESTIONS LATER ”
OVERWHELMING FORCE BACKED UP BY US AIR FORCE ..
THE BORDER WOULD BE SEALED ( NOT JUST CLOSED )

hardscrabble farmer
hardscrabble farmer
February 9, 2017 6:33 pm

“With Trump it is difficult to tell bluster and carney-barker showmanship from serious consideration or actual intention.”

I have read a version of this sentiment more times than just about any other. Is it possible that every one of the writers expressing this opinion really can’t tell? They really think he’s stupid, or clueless, that he’s sitting in the Oval Office because he’s a giant doofus?

He told everyone what he was going to do in the simplest language imaginable and then proceeded to do just that and at every step of the way these geniuses keep getting blown out of the water, time and time again and they are still asking the same questions. It’s like coyote and the road runner.

I feel like asking Fred if that’s what he’s up to with these essays.

Llpoh
Llpoh
February 9, 2017 6:59 pm

Mexico’s problem is very simple. It is corrupt top to bottom, public and private. For instance, the govt sold the Mexican telecommunications business to Carlos Slim for $20 million, by memory. They sold a business worth tens if not hundreds of billions to Slim for $20 million. Let that sink in. Who benefitted, I wonder.

The only way Mexico comes out of its issues is via wholesale slaughter of anyone found to be corrupt – which is just about anyone with any corporate or govt power. It is too endemic now. The people have boots on their throats, and no way to fight. It really would take them going out with pitchforks and scythes, because until they do that, nothing will change.

That is unlikely. More likely they will elect an insane strongman like Chavez to lead them into total oblivion.

Iska Waran
Iska Waran
  Llpoh
February 10, 2017 12:58 am

So the problem with Mexico is the Mexicans. That’s what A.B. said above.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  Iska Waran
February 10, 2017 6:44 pm

That’s the problem anywhere you go, the inhabitants.

Dixie
Dixie
February 9, 2017 8:00 pm

Fred Reed’s essays, have entertained me for years. Always with tongue in cheek. Having been around when they were written or written about, he’s always spot on.
When Fred Reed gets serious, I get worried.
I doubt President Trump would send “advisors” to Mexico. That’s always how it starts, right?
Mexico isn’t half way around the world. Mexico is right next door. Too many Mexicans live here. Too many Americans live there. Fred does. I’d like to.
The MSM wouldn’t ignore it. They’d LOVE it! What a great stick to beat the Prez with. Over and over. There would never be anything else on the news and talk shows.
President Trump just threw a punch and look at all the bobbing and weaving. Be on the lookout for what he’s really going to do while everyone is incessantly babbling about this. Someone earlier said something about the “chess” formula.

overthecliff
overthecliff
February 9, 2017 8:37 pm

The 9th Circuit Court will soon invite the Mexican Army to the USA to help enforce law that our law enforcement will not enforce. The only solution is for the do nothing pussy Republican congress to limit the jurisdiction of the courts. That won’t happen. Trump can’t stop the USA from a death due to malignant communism.

That is the real issue and not Fred’s Mexican bullshit.

Smoke Jensen
Smoke Jensen
February 9, 2017 8:48 pm

“GIs will not be regarded as friends or saviors”. -Fred Reed
Nonsense. They will receive us with open arms while laying a bed of flower petals beneath our soldiers feet. And with the drugs and money confiscated by the DEA the war will pay for itself. Remember the Alamo! /sarc

MN Steel
MN Steel
February 9, 2017 8:53 pm

To all these dipshit idjits in the District of Criminals that want to send the young’uns of the peasant class to get killed in various countries around the world:

You are being paid $174,000 a year salary. That does not include perqs like free travel, food, housing, drivers, staff and security.

An Army private gets paid $21,078 per year to start. They are on-call 24/7, have to pay for most of the shit that you get for free, and have no choice but to follow the lawful orders of the officers above them once they’ve signed the papers and took their oath.

I know you assholes think you’re better than that private due to your shamming of thousands of people to “vote” for you, putting you in a position of power, but you also took an oath of office, charging you as well to uphold the Constitution of these United States.

Either follow the Constitution, or take all that gear the private carries and invade those far-flung countries you want to conquer your own damn self.

Capn Mike
Capn Mike
February 9, 2017 9:30 pm

I don’t think the majority of commenters above realize that Fred is using the Mexican example to show how very very fucked up U.S. policy has been for just about all our lives.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  Capn Mike
February 9, 2017 10:28 pm

Thank you Capn! I thought LLPOH was the only one up to that point that had anything to say. Everybody else is a victim of Trumpismo, the idea that since he is opposed by everybody in power, he must be right.

Apologists even claim he is playing a game of chess. I’m not sure this guy is up to the great game. I don’t play chess or even Chinese checkers but I understand that one move by a player induces a counter-move by the opponent.

Trump has been used to playing with himself, barking the orders to his yes-men. Now that he has folks opposing him and confronting him, he retreats to his tweet castle. Uncle Ronnie must be spinning in his grave. Nixon was known for jaw-boning the jaded press, Uncle Ronnie took his message directly to the public. Trump tweets from the safety of his panic room. Sad.

Reading the comments above gives me a new respect for that idiot savant, pardon me – engineer -Dutchman. At least he never pretends to understand the issue or the message.

MMinLamesa
MMinLamesa
February 10, 2017 6:44 am

Great straw man argument Fred. Make up an entirely implausible scenario(invading Mexico) and go off from there.

Our intel can probably pinpoint 100s of vital drug resources. We also have no need to engage the rank & file with boots on the ground and also probably know where the higher ups are.

Finally, a careful examination of finances would be in order.

All of these are things the Mexican government, if they were serious, would be undertaking, with or without our help. Obviously they’re not as the government derives great benefit from the cartels.

Build the damn wall, expel the millions of criminal illegals and cut off the bennys to the millions of others here. Mexico is living off of an estimated ~$500 Billion a year in tax fraud schemes, bad trade deals and a river of narcotics. They know Trump knows this and are shitting bricks.

They know he has no intent of sending troops into Mexico when he can make their world miserable in other ways.

Fred is good when he’s taking it lightly but not with this crap.

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  MMinLamesa
February 10, 2017 12:54 pm

Lameass, it is so implausible and yet the US has invaded Mexico twice. The US also took half the land from Mexico. So, yeah, I see where your coming from, your mamma’s basement.

I wish folks would post their references after their moniker like PhD in Geology did at one time. You could add Moran in Mom’s Basement to your moniker.

Montefrío
Montefrío
February 10, 2017 10:01 am

I lived for one year in México and that was enough. I’d agree with Fred that it’s not a place you’d want to conduct military operations. I disagree with any assumption that Pres. Trump would contemplate such a move, bluster aside. I agree with nearly all here that the best plan is to drastically limit or end emigration from México to the USA and to firmly secure the border. Among the main reasons I decided not to stay there was my near-certainty that sooner or later the country would explode, given its enormous population, the deeply-embedded systemic corruption and the abject poverty in which no small part of the population is mired.

Anonymous
Anonymous
February 10, 2017 12:28 pm

Why don’t they simply adopt our constitution?

EL Coyote
EL Coyote
  Anonymous
February 10, 2017 1:00 pm

They could. The last revolution they had in 1910 ended in a communist type government which ended nearly 40 years of the Porfirio Diaz dictatorship. Even the US paid the price of war to adopt its constitution.

MN Steel
MN Steel
  EL Coyote
February 11, 2017 9:29 am

Adopting a Constitution just like the one in the US is a sure way to get your gubmint toppled by the US power interests.

The minute the US Constitution is made to work as intended in a foreign country is the moment the sham oligarchy in the US is exposed, and they can’t have that, eh?

SONNY JIM
SONNY JIM
February 10, 2017 5:56 pm

I think the wall will not work very well … troops stationed on the Mexican side with a dead mans zone of a couple hundred yards would do it … rules of engagement ” shoot first, don’t even bother to ask questions “

Robert Blake
Robert Blake
February 14, 2017 2:47 pm

The US military could conquer Mexico easily, same as they did Iraq (Mexico’s military forces pale next to Iraq’s circa 2001), and yes I’ve been to Mexico. The problem would be much as it was with Iraq, what to do with it afterwards.
The solution is actually simple, if anything but conventional: Make Mexico part of the United States. 2/3rds of Mexico said in a recent poll they wanted to immigrate to the US anyway, so that pretty much takes care of it. The (formerly Mexican) economy would benefit massively from the transformation and infrastructure buildout that would follow, and US legal framework/enforcement would drive the narcotrafficante’s underground, if not out of the country all together.