The Christmas day wind storm that hit the Philly area did a number on my 22 year old roof. One section of the roof had lost a few roof shingles to previous storms, but this one crumpled up about ten shingles into a big ball. I had been postponing replacing the roof as long as possible, but the time has come.
I called a roofer who was recommended by a friend. He nailed down the crumpled tiles and told us he would have a crew out this week. We rarely check our home phone voicemails so we missed the call that they would be here this morning. I guess they aren’t proponents of MLK day.
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The doorbell rings at 8:00 am on the dot. The temperature is 16 degrees. The guy at the door was a heavily bundled Mexican guy telling me he was here to replace my roof. At least I thought he was telling me that. I could barely understand a word out of his mouth. There were about a dozen other Mexican guys getting out of trucks and assembling their equipment. I have no idea whether these guys are legal or illegal immigrants. That’s not my concern.
The stereotype of guys who do roofs is a dozen Mexicans scrambling around and working like mad. I can attest to the truth of this stereotype. Within minutes, they were up on the roof ripping it apart. It will be a one day job. Not one white or black person in the crew. What happens if all illegals are kicked out of the country? Would white or black guys be scrambling on my roof in 16 degree weather for low pay?
All I know is there are no lazy guys in this crew. They are working their asses off in pretty tough conditions. This stereotype is true, but I’ll have a new roof by the end of the day.
We have few full Mexican crews around here, they generally are about half-white/half-mexican.
I think its the area culture. I live in a red state with a steady rural influence. You live in a blue state and despite the existence of Pensatucky and the Amish, would still be considered urban influenced.
After years of fixing houses the mexs will work and show up on time good people
For whatever reason the residential asphalt shingle style roofing jobs seem dominated by the “hard working Mexican.” Not saying they do bad work but the speed at which they work has me questioning the quality control. It is interesting to watch them for sure. Few years ago my neighbors house was getting done. One guy was spray painting the furnace flue vent and all the overspray was going right onto another guy stapling down shingles. I wouldn’t put up with that shit but these guys were acting like it’s business as usual.
I will say commercial roofing, at least what I’ve seen, is still done by white guy crews. It’s a lot more technical with the membrane systems and the mfr’s require specialized training for the crews to get the warranty. My guess is that understanding English and having legal status is a requirement for the training.
There’s a lot more to a roof than shingles. Bad boards should be replaced. It should have a drip edge. The utmost importance is the flashing around chimneys, dormers, valleys. In a northern climate you should have 6′ of ice shield rolled down. Then also, the proper number of staples/nails per tab.
In order to get a guarantee on this roof, you need certified installers. Otherwise if there are problems down the road, you won’t get satisfaction.
unfortunately most people know nothing about ANY labor intensive job and think that because a bunch of Mexicans are running around and moving really quickly and talking loudly that they “work hard”… if you plainly believe this you need to reevaluate your pre-reqs in determining hard working (ever see a Mex cleaning crew, they do the same thing and always miss cleaning places)… if you know anything about labor intensive jobs and inspections you would know to look at the details and construction isnt measured in the day it takes to complete but the YEARS it needs to last and the ELEMENTS it needs to hold against…. but hey, those who can pay for it figure thats all there is to there concern.
Every job that requires lots of hard work is being dominated by Hispanics. Roofing and agriculture are the two best examples. If you are a farmer and you need your fields harvested, you’d be waiting forever for white or black people to apply, no matter how high unemployment is. If you are a roofing company and you need employees who always show up and get the job done fast, Mexicans are your only choice.
I have nothing but respect for Hispanics. They work hard and maintain strong families. Kinda like European whites 100 years ago before we got fat, dumb, and lazy.
Plus the food served up by Mexicans is outstanding.
The problem is called a market clearing price. Mexicans, especially illegals, will work for less. Remove them and the wages must increase to attract Americans to do the work.
Let me clue you in on something. You may like tomatoes for .50/lb but you’re paying for that cheap tomato in dozens of different ways.
The abuse of our infrastructure, open spaces, the over use of hospitals, schools, prisons, these and many more are by people who are mostly net tax receivers. Those of us paying taxes are paying for them. It’s bullshit.
Plus, I’m fucking tired of people coming ILLEGALLY and and then demanding I change to accommodate them. Stay in your fucking shithole or get in line and do it legally.
Mexicans are the next antiquated farm equipment, as the only reason field work is not mechanized is the remittance-senders.
As to roofs, why would it have to be a white roofer?
There’s plenty of porch monkeys that could do the job, but get paid better to sip 40s than lift bundles.
Now you are gaining personal experience with why Hispanics are popular employees.
Their children are in public school being propagandized that they must go to college to have a good life, they are assimilating, and they will be unwilling to do roofing in 16 degree weather.
If their options are college or “roofing in 16 degree weather” then it’s not propaganda.
I’m not sure roofing is done in 16 degree weather. It’s mostly done in the summer in 120 degree weather.
It’s done in 16° weather when your insurance company has no problem with you getting fucked by a fly-by-night contractor because the tabs don’t seal due to the cold, you get water infiltration, your roof starts to leak and your corn-field-palace rots in the next 5 years.
Other than that, you get a helluva deal having it done!
The original post included “16 degree weather for low pay?”.
I don’t think any amount of Job Corps government training or union scale pay could get a crew of Blacks to even do that job period. The myth that Blacks built this country is shithole history.
I’ve never given it a thought before: I’ve never seen a Black or a group of Blacks doing roofing jobs.
I’ve never seen blacks working period.
in 1969 when my grandfather built a house for his daughter ( my aunt ) I worked on it as a grunt laborer. He hired a wirey black man to shingle the roof. 1 man. I, at 18 years old , carried 18 square of 320 lbs. /sq/ shingles up 2 ladders to supply this man with material. This was before nail guns , and I barely kept up. I thought I was going to die. I’ve ripped off and shingled 6 roofs since then . It’s hard work.
RHS: The myth that Blacks built this country is shithole history.
Untrue – they built the ghettos.
“Untrue – they built the ghettos.”
More like “UN-built” the ghettos.
Ya many of the areas that are now ghettos weren’t always like that. Many of those places that are now mired in squalor and dependency used to be occupied by white working class families. They houses were well maintained, as were the yards. The streets were safe and kids could play in them at night. Schools nearby gave kids an education, and there weren’t fights, drugs, or guns in any of them. Now that blacks have taken over these areas, all of that is gone, probably for good. Give a group of whites a pile of bricks, they’ll build you a civilization. Give a group of blacks a civilization, they’ll leave a pile of bricks.
I didn’t realize that was even a myth….
Admin, 7 years ago when i lived in your neck o the woods it was a crew of no english russians who did my roof. My pool was replastered by a massive crew of no english mexicans. I got em good and drunk after and we had a jalapeno eating contest. None of those types in my new location. Nothing but white guys, even though there are blacks a plenty. Some of the fattest slowest laziest white guys i ever seen. We had some hardscaping done, and 400lb guy managed to work in the shade of a pine tree all day, by doing zilch. And the pool guy is so fat he cant bend over far enuf to set the pool pump on the ground. We are so fucked.
“Would white or black guys be scrambling on my roof in 16 degree weather for low pay?”
Wow, you have a depressing view of America’s future. A land of progressively harder work and lower wages. No thank you!
If you haven’t realized, the site is called The Burning Platform. I deal with reality, not your idealized view of how things should be, but never will be.
WTF is wrong with hard work Mr. Lawyer? If houses exist, roofs must be put on, repaired and replaced. I guess that work is beneath your white collar sensibilities.
Admin,
We bought a house with a busted bad roof (costs lowered on sale).
My buddy had a roofing contractor boyfriend/quoted 12 K for all
the required boards replaced, flashing, and that water-proof rubber
edging…larger than code. A few days later he said he had a crew out of Chicago…Eastern European, and not a word of English. The crew
supervisor came sev. times/ per day to check on the work. The
workers’ radio played classical music. No smoking, swearing, fights
…just steady work. One day job! 90 X 30-40″ for house and garage.
Final cleanup the next day. No piles of nails/stables or scraps.
Fabulous. My only c/o was the massive dumpster in my driveway
stayed there way too long. No worries really/circular driveway.
Plus the contractor said we could dump items into the dumpster
because it wasn’t full. Win-win.
The neighbor behind us (1/2 acre lots or more) wanted complete
landscaping renewal. I could only see the back initially…at one
point, watched in awe. Mexican workers hired by top local firm
swooped in and hustled. Old stuff out and new stuff in. Paths
(stone) and some woodworking (repair “patio” and add stairs.
They did work out in front too. End of light about 8 pm. If they
came back, I didn’t see them.
Hope your roof is perfect!
Suzanna
“WTF is wrong with hard work”
Nothing!
The problem is the inverse correlation between more being demanded of employees while remuneration deminishes.
“I guess that work is beneath your white collar sensibilities”
It is now, but I wasn’t born a lawyer. And if a worker falls of that roof, the employer’s worker’s comp premiums had better be current, or I coming for his truck/boat/etc. lol
The roof is done. The workers pulled off the old roof and put on the new roof in seven hours. They used safety equipment and appeared extremely competent. The roof looks great. The company is getting a large check from me. I assume they are paying these men a fair wage and paying the required taxes. You automatically assume the workers are being mistreated. You envison what you want to envision.
I did roofing for two summers when I was in college. No big deal when you’re young. It’s like any other construction work. A good workout and you get a suntan. Fat paycheck on Friday, what else does a young man need? And the rest of your life you have some idea how a building goes together. Do you want to raise a nation of wimps, or confident practical men?
Live in CT; not flyover country or near Mehico (important distinction).
Two years ago a neighbor’s house had old shingles removed and new asphalt shingles installed. There were a dozen Hondurans doing the job, one of which spoke English and he was the boss. All younger guys.
Soooo, you advocate illegal immigration?
If the pay is good enough, employers can find employees.
I’m not fucking advocating anything. I have no fucking idea whether these guys are legal or illegal. I have no idea what they get paid. You are the one making assumptions and making an ass out of yourself. I’m writing a big fat fucking check for a new roof. It’s up to the roofing company to distribute those funds to whoever needs to be paid.
Easy there, WIP. You could get that hand bit off. It’s Monday morning.
Admin
It just came across to me as a pro Mexican/illegal article is all. I believe I know you better than that though. Had I known it was you who wrote the article…
Even though Strfcker would attempt to foment discord between you and I, I will not take the bait. I hope you have/had an enjoyable roofing experience.
Btw, I will never believe any other race can outwork a white. I’m not saying there aren’t lazy white people. I’m saying with proper pay, America doesn’t need illegals.
We wouldn’t have an illegal immigrant problem if the onus was put on employers to prove their employees are legal citizens. If companies were held accountable with big fines, the self deportation would begin immediately. But, big corporations still control the field and will not allow this simple solution to be implemented.
I guess all we can do is hope our government will help in this regard.
I know, I know…bwahahahahabababa.
Btw, I’m out working today like a Mexican. Well, a white hard working guy anyway.
1st, stairmaster-o-typing exists for a rank ordered series of reasons, with numero uno being laziness & numero secondo being fear of conflict (&\or presumed higher likelihood of conflict).
Personal problems, iow.
Well, there’s no shortage of half-assers, in all melanin profiles, creating conflict. But being fucked over by someone who ‘looks like you’ seems to be much the preference, & telling anyone to fuck off for poor performance has less preference.
I enjoy doing it because I am always curious as to what will happen after I do (even when i know exactly what will happen, as with made guys, like doctors) – & whatever happens satisfies that curiosity, but also my responsibilities. Liberty = take your best shot; Security = I’m unarmed, please don’t shoot…&, please sir, may I have another? Snowflakes in the lexicon already, but I think there’s room to add pussywillows.
2nd, whatever the market will bear – up or down – is ‘good enough’ for all prices, including pay\wages. Not only that, it’s as good as it gets.
‘Illegal’ immigration is color of law – just rules – not law.
Current context, which covers my time on planet so far, there are lots of gigs whites won’t do, or won’t do well, & the “argument” that those jobs are stolen from whites is bogus.
Cherry on top bogus is the notion that if those ol’ minimum wages are maximized then white power will power up & do the jobs & do them well. Bullllllllllshite. And stupid, with the contradiction right in yer face 24\7: keep up the chanting, even after all gigs (thought experiment) are being handled by “illegals” & robots.
Don’t fire until you see the whites of their eyes is the only white that matters, & everybody’s got white eyes, tattooed irises.
The “argument” that “illegals” unfairly mooch the “transfer pmt” (robbery) system indicts the transfer pmt system – incl *every* moocher, whatever color of law status, or color of skin. The transfer pmt system is part of the taproot…the tap-your-ass-root. The boring stuff that gets lather-emphasis is just leaves – not even branches – of “evil” (criminality).
If you work for me, or on my behalf, the only “illegality” – law breaking – is to not do what you’ve contracted with me to do. That’s it.
All the rest of the gripes is nada – as regards me & my business; you are of course free to comport yourself however you like. But only yourself. Leave me out of it. Else you’re breaking the law, throwing away your person status, opting yourself into a thing… and making me wanna’ satisfy my curiosity.
Are you for open borders?
I know where you’re coming from, Admin. I hired my house painted last summer. The contractor was white and said his lead guy was “Joel”. I didn’t know there were Mexican guys named Joel. Apparently so. They worked their ass off in blazing heat, but the overall job wasn’t cheap. There was one young white guy on the crew – who took a few minutes to pump me for info about business (since he wondered how I could afford my neighborhood). He won’t be a lifelong house painter. I think Wip’s point was that the line “they do the jobs that whites and blacks won’t do” is a line used by the open borders people. Whites – and even blacks – would do that work if the pay were high enough and if they weren’t able to sit on their ass and get SSDI and food stamps.
“and if they weren’t able to sit on their ass and get SSDI and food stamps.” Yeah. Especially that part.
It’s the black market for labor, illegals have few options other than joining a crew, are they going to hang around in an apartment with 6-12 others watching TV? They send huge amounts of cash back to Central America just look at how busy the wire transfer “stores” are. I’m sure natives would rise up to the challenge of this work AND wages would increase across the board if the US was serious about enforcing immigration laws. Nowadays we turn a blind eye, 30-40 years ago we would have called the INS and they would have done something. Enjoy your discount roofing job admin but I’m sure you are aware that YOU are part of the problem, ask yourself is it worth it? You run this site but are you willing to pay 1-3k more for a legit law abiding contractor?
Fuck you dickhead. I’m not paying some discounted fee for this roof. This is a roofing company in business for 30 years and gets 5 star reviews on all the contractor evaluation websites. I’m paying the going rate for a new roof. Go fuck yourself you fucking douchebag. You have no fucking idea whether these are legal Mexican American citizens or illegal. Neither do I. WTF would you like me to do, make a requirement that an all white crew replace my roof?
I love when know it all assholes think they know WTF they are talking about when they have no facts or proof of their assertions. If I didn’t make myself clear. GO FUCK YOURSELF.
That’s the problem with making reasonable, pragmatic arguments, Admin…you get attacked by the angry and unreasonable from all sides.
Jim
Sounds like you had money on the Saints yesterday.
Whenever I hire a company to do work, I tell the I want no illegals on my property. You could merely have done that and see how they responded. No disrespect, but at least a part of the onus is on those who hire the company to do the work. Oh man, go easy on me Admin.
One Christmas holiday when I was 14 or 15 I helped my father and grandfather shingle a large commercial garage they had built the previous month. It was below 10 degrees F the entire first day-
that was a tough day, and we didn’t even have to remove old roofing- it was just felt and shingles. I still see that garage occasionally whenever I drive up to my now dead grandparent’s home and I wonder if those are the same shingles I helped lay down 35 years ago.
Nothing like working outside in the cold to make you figure out that you need a different plan. A buddy of mine spent the first three years after high school building pole barns. As the young guy, his job was to scamper 20 feet off the ground and nail through corrugated sheet metal into the framework of 2×2’s. Nothing like hammering your thumb when it’s twenty degrees. He figured out a way to go to college. He still can’t spell “loser”, but he isn’t one.
Jim. Is there any concern about getting your roof shingled with asphalt shingles in very cold weather? My understanding is those shingles shouldn’t be installed below 40 degrees due to the possibility of cracking and breaking.
As far as Mexican, v. White? Here in the East Valley of Phoenix, if you aren’t using Mexicans you can be pretty much assured that you’re getting shit work.
I was surprised when they showed up in this weather, but I get a guarantee from a company that has been in business for 30 years.
I’m surprised you could find any Mexicans to work on your roof. According to Fred they are all high IQ, high tech, IT specialists?
Living in the West, Mexicans assimilate rather well. They are just part of the community. I have no problems with them as they are friendly and are good neighbors. That said, Sweet Baby Jesus, don’t let any more immigrants from anywhere of any race come in. We are already far more overpopulated than is safe. As for jobs, low to no pay immigrants have been with us for hundreds of years. Ain’t nothing new.
+1, Jim. Nice hair!
Also notice that the crews are all male. Women want “equality” but there are jobs better suited for young males. I am a woman who owns her own home in the country. I do what I can myself for the farm work and repairs, but some jobs need a male because it requires strength. (I live alone so no husband/boyfriend to help me.)
I have learned a lot in the 12 years I have been doing this, and know many things about farming and repair work so I can monitor a worker for competency.
When my husband and I began the transition from suburban life in the MIC to our log home in the suburbs of podunk, I moved here first and lived in a little shack on stilts (barn posts! 10x10s at least ten feet tall in cemented holes on the rocky bank of a creek at the base of a hillside full of trees on the corner of the land we call “no man’s land”) we call the treehouse. I became the General Contractor for the preparation and hiring of subcontractors to build both our barn to store our construction materials through the weather and then our log home, which was under contract for deliver in a Three-Year-Same as Cash Layaway plan with the log home company.
Although I was here alone, it became well known that I was not ever on this land without Lt. Beretta, Col. Remington or that Buckshot guy locked and loaded. However, I still had to deal with the occasional weirdo and, one night, it was the guy who bulldozed our lovely driveway and dug the foundation both for my barn and my basement. After that week’s work, which I paid him $5,000 cash, he stopped by my cousin’s with his bulldozer “on the way” to clean his pond. I showed up there and this scumbag had the audacity to ask me to unbutton my shirt so he could look down my blouse while he talked to me. I almost broke his hand, which he’d put on my shoulder in a sinister sort of way.
I told Nick and he don’t work for us no more. As a matter of fact, Nick went all Italian and when I see the guy, he looks down and doesn’t even talk to me. Interesting.
I was really pissed that he couldn’t treat me with the same respect he would treat anyone paying for his labor. Really pissed. My cousin’s wife said “Oh, he tries to put the moves on everyone… get used to it.” I said, “Uh. NO.”
Much admiration to you for doing it alone.
I learned a lot about a lot. It was a real privilege to be on site for the entire project, from the ground up. I actually helped dig the plumbing lines in the basement and when the septic was dug for the house, I placed 50 feet of 4 inch sewer line behind the barn using the guy’s bobcat to make a trench. Yikes that was backbreaking work, but it saved us $500 if the guy didn’t have to dig the barn trench and place the hose. So, I did it.
I was glad when Nick made the move and was able to take over, but it was quite an education and experience dealing with the process from day one. And, I know everything was done the way it was supposed to be.
In the 80’s I was a carpenter, and, Joe Jones did the roofs of the houses we built. And is wife. A small woman with fast hands. They had a helper who kept her fed with shingles and she just nailed shingles. I’ve never been able to lay half as many an hour as she could –all day long.
Thank you for being honest. Men and women are different. Who knew?
Boys and girls are not the same. Viva la difference!
Here in NC, Mexican crews are common for roofing, flooring, masonry, insulation, drywall, painting. White guys seem to be the preferred framers and finish carpenters. I do use a crew of “good ole boy” white guys for some painting projects – good guys but they are always late to the job, take lots of smoke breaks, have to be watched pretty closely for quality. They are very reasonably priced and stay booked all year. A lot of jobs are spec’d and priced by a gringo but done by a Mexican crew. Don’t actually see many black guys doing regular construction here – but 99% of the appliance/furniture delivery you see is a couple black guys in a Ryder truck.
I live in NC and concur 100% with TC
@Administrator
Lots of foul language does not look very professional. You lost a reader today. ( Probably more than one).
I was a contractor in California. I had some good Mexican laborers, all my licenses and insurance. It was about 20% of my overhead for licenses and insurance. I would often have non Licensed Mexicans offer to do the job for half of what I bid if paid in cash. I somehow doubt they declared the income.
I’m not trying to look professional. This is a fucking blog dude. Don’t let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
I was going to bring it up too. The language here seems to be deteriorating rapidly for some reason. It’s like some of these people grew up in shitholes.
I was hoping we could recruit not only a bunch of grammar policemen but a pack of pithy preachers who might get to work on the broken souls and hearts of my TBP brethren and sistern. Perhaps we could gussy up the wardrobe around here, as well.
Someone gave these newbies the false impression this was some sort of website where there are no consequences for saying something so fucking stupid they deserved to be pummeled into submission.
Admin, you need the .gif Fast Eddy is rockin’ at Gail Tverberg’s joint:
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Damn, TT somehow came to the conclusion that this was a friendly professional place where everyone is handled with Kid gloves. I can only guess this was his/her first visit or they tend to be slow on the uptake. Maybe they will return when their skin toughens up a bit.
Whats up with that pitchfork stuck in the apex of the roof?
I don’t know. It’s a generic picture, not an actual picture of my roof being replaced.
Probably to hold the electric cord in place.
It’s a spading fork (4 flattened tines). It’s perfect for getting up underneath shingles on a tear off. There’s always a gap at the apex of the roof to let warm air vent out of the attic, easy place to stick it.
Sincerely,
A non-Mexican who has done his fair share of roofing jobs.
Pay peanuts, get monkeys.
Good for you on getting your roof fix. Hopefully you’re in a township that isn’t anal about inspections on roofing. I blame the schools and the matriarchy for our need for foreign workers. The only native roofers are Amish, Mennonites, and a few 50 something boomers.
I had to pay $110 to my township for the permit to replace my roof.
Talk about being robbed. That takes the cake. Who would even know you had to pay the township?
Seriously, how did you know?
The contractor told me they couldn’t start the work until they got the permit from the township. They are just following the rules. That’s why I wouldn’t doubt that the crew are citizens. A company with a top notch rating and in business for decades wouldn’t risk their business by using illegals as their crews. Should I ask them for proof of citizenship?
When my Mennonite builder came to take deliver of the logs and inspect the basement prepared for the logs by another subcontractor hired by me, he asked me if he needed to talk to any local officials before starting the build. I told him there weren’t any building codes in our neck of the woods. He said that would probably save us another couple of thousand dollars in fees required for each stage of his work. Same went for the plumber, who is now retired from “union” plumbing in St. Louis. He said the permits and inspection fees are simple extortion by government to allow people to transact business. They protect NO ONE
inspections protect you. and by setting minimum standards, protect whomever buys your place. Structural standards protect the community at large.
Sounds reasonable Karl……and it is at first. As time goes by codes are updated and expanded and the administrative costs explode. In California, it can cost 100k for all mandated drawings, studies, and inspections for a residence. It is nuts and it is a costly, corrupting cycle. That is why I fight it tooth and nail. The platitudes all sound fine at first.
I’m not saying that. I was asking how the hell would any reasonable person would know you had to get a permit to fix your house.
It’s getting to a point where the average citizen will have to pay or ask permission to take a shit.
I think that’s reasonable, up to, and including photographic proof. It’s a good rule at 76 degrees. At 16 degrees at 8 AM, I believe I can waive the rule….I’m flexible…
Here’s the one caveat with this scenario: If a permit was not pulled on the roof, then if/when you go to sell the house, this could be problematic. Why? Well, unpermitted work like this MIGHT not be covered by homeowner’s insurance. That means a new buyer might have problems getting a policy. If something happens to your roof, via a storm, and there is no permit, the insurance company could deny the claim. I see unpermitted work all the time and many times it’s not done correctly. I am not saying that’s the case here, but it usually is. No tar paper underneath, no ice and water shield, not all the tabs nailed down. In MA, due to snow load requirements, 2 layers are no longer allowed, so a lot of unlicensed/unpermitted work includes a second layer put over the first. I don’t know the codes in your state so it’s worth checking out. The reason a GC charges more is because they do the work to code, are supposed to carry insurance, and are liable if something is done wrong/not to code. Someone falls off the roof and gets hurt, the GC is supposed to have the insurance to cover that person, otherwise the homeowner could be on the hook.
The roofing company got the permit from my township. The picture is not my roof. It’s what you get when you google “Mexicans replacing roof”.
Just for parity…we hired a top notch moving firm out of Milwaukee.
Family owned and long term business. An owner did the bids and
the particulars.
My husband was in the city directing traffic and items were labeled.
I was in my/our Northern WI. “new” 100+ yr. old farmhouse. The
2 men were black. Older guy was the boss, younger man strong as
an ox and looked like one too. They loaded the massive van precision-
wise. First items in for the third stop. They collected items from my mother’s
just sold home, they loaded up many big pieces from our home, they
delivered to my husbands new apartment, (not retired yet by 5 years),
then 3.5h north…no complaints from them/good humor and steady
work. Up our narrow stairway to 2nd floor with items without
problems. We also had dozens of boxes of books.
My husband gave them both cash “bonus” $. Prob. $100 each/more?
It was getting on dusk, and they were very eager to get on the road.
The North Woods environment was just not their bag, a bit scared, I
think they even said so. Anyway, Blacks are certainly capable of some
crazy hard work, and those men earned a bonus.
Yes, some blacks are capable of working like proverbial mules. But many you would not ever want working for you. Ones from the ghetto fit that bill.
I have said here before many times that the stereotype of low-paid Mexicans doing skilled work is NOT supported by the facts. Yes, they do a lot of unskilled work very cheaply. But skilled Mexican workers get paid well. As well as skilled workers in general.
Admin paid the going rate. My guess is that the crew got well paid, in that event. Especially seeing as they are willing, fast, and skilled. Those types do not grow on trees, and the roofing company would know that. If they underpay, they will eventually lose their crew.
Do not make the mistake of thinking skilled Mexican workers are poorly paid. That is not the case. Bean pickers and such, yes. Skilled workers – no.
Fruit and veg. pickers are not necessarily “unskilled”. A lot of Jamaicans come up to VT for the apple harvest. You don’t want people wrecking your trees, and the orchard owners have valuable longstanding relationships with their immigrant teams (who then go back home or find other gigs for the remainder of the year). From what I understand, they are paid well.
I can’t wait until the day that Trump kicks out all the immigrants. I’ll be standing in the middle of my suburban driveway surrounded by houses with blue tarps on the roofs, three foot high lawns all around, six foot high garbage mounds at the curb, and so on. I will be LMAO at the wise decision by our Commander in Chief.
Colin – Trump is never going to kick them all out. Not even a significant portion will ever be kicked out. If it were going to happen, it could be happening now. But is it? Ummm, the answer to that is no.
I know. It’s such a fucking let down.
I call bullshit on that. What you’re saying is there is no entrepreneurial spirit in America. I call bullshit.
We never had any Latinos or any other illegal aliens in Minneapolis until about 1990. We managed to cut the fucking grass, paint houses and install shingles. I still do all of that stuff myself. I guess Colin can’t push a lawnmower. Maybe eat less soy.
I have worked around small crews of Mexicans and crews of Guatemalans in industrial electrical construction. They were always 10 minutes early to work, worked hard the whole day. 10 minute breaks were 10 minutes and half hour lunches were a half hour. As long as they had someone leading them, never had any issues. It was all DOT covered work
I believe Booger. I have a friend living in central Fla. during Winter. Did a complete remodel of a double wide in a nice Senior community w nice benefits. Hired Guatamalans, and they busted their ass. Older ones humped 20 cases of porcelain tile flooring off a truck & into the place, then installed it well. Local cops said they work hard, at reasonable wages, & don’t behave like animals, and worthy of consideration for labor.
Based on the comments I think I should get an Ancestry.com test because apparently I’m Mexican.
Somebody used the idiom ‘work like a Mexican’ – as Mexicans, we say ‘work like a negro’. Go figure. Since everybody is flapping their lips, I would like to say, we American raised Mexes are not so tough. I was talking to my mom about an illegal, she said if he’s a Mexican national, he knows how to work hard. I thought that was unfair but I must admit, I do not have wiry, steel rope muscles like they have. Even at almost 100, my grandpa was a wiry little dude.
The whole premise of the comic La Familia Burron was that Mexicans are burros bred for hard work. 500 years after the conquista, native Mexicans are only good for manual labor, it’s what they’ve been bred for. Of course, if banditry pays more, they’ll opt for that.
What I find surprising is that in the several decades I have been in America, the image of Hispanics has not advanced beyond that of Ricky Ricardo. In fact, it has gone backward. Despite the fact there are quite a few Hispanic WW2 veterans, a few more Korean war veterans and a lot more Vietnam veterans, the image of Hispanics is still one of illegal alien lettuce pickers and gangbangers.
I’m pretty sure that bitch Ann Coulter cited a figure of 55 million illegal aliens in the USA. The only way that would be true would be if she were counting all Hispanics as illegal. Fucking bitch.
German cockroaches are a bitch…
Its 20 degree high here in CO, all my guys are working, all are mostly white. We roof all year every year, we show up, just like the bills. I have and will hire the Mexicans occasionally, they almost all have legal corporations set up. How do I do a citizenship check on a Corporation?
You don’t.
Mostly their work is standard to sub-standard, and I always have to send ‘my’ guys back through to bring the job up to ‘our’ standards.
There are 3500 roofing ‘companies’ in the CO Springs-Denver-Ft Collins metro plex. Virtually every one of them is a white guy with a truck pimping Mexican labor. We are maybe 1 of 10 Roofing Company’s that use citizens, pay taxes and worse, pays workers comp.
We don’t do shingles. Unless your friend or family. There is no money in it. We can only pay our bills by servicing the top tiers of the industry.
My teams are every bit as tough and hard working as any Mexicans, and I have a decent amount of Millenials getting it done.
Those Mexicans up on the roof in the cold probably have no Workers Comp, get no overtime, no health insurance, no job security and still send 40-60% of their pay back to Mexico.
God bless them, they bring it, and help me keep my game tight, cuz fuck them, no freshly minted boarder hoppers are gonna show us how its done.
Otto says “all are mostly white”. The part that is not white – what race would that be?
Italian
Alright Iska Waran…that was cute…but half of me is searching for my garrote…
My main guy and another are half breeds, Mexican American I guess.
You know, Irish or Finns. 😉
I personally could give one tenth of a rat’s ass what someone’s ancestry or color or gender is. All I want to see is assholes ands elbows. Work hard, do it right or get the fuck out.
I do believe anyone caught dealing with illegals, (employers; it ain’t the customer’s problem) should get fucked and fucked hard. At the same time, any decent hard-worker that just wants to have a life should have head-of-the-line privileges for immigration. Close the border, get the shit straightened out and move on.
Nice concept, but I really doubt it’s going to go my way.
I can guarantee you one thing. Those guys working 16 degree weather will take that any day rather then being on a roof mid-July in w Texas.
We had a crew of Mexicans do our roof last year. They did a great job. I live in a small town that’s 70% latino-fine with me, my neighbors are hard working and quiet(expect when the Cowboys are playing).
Yeah, no shit. I’ve done the So Cal bust-your-ass in mid-July in the Mojave. About 2 pm, it gets real. 140 dg + on the ramps.
It is wild how the contractor landscape can change from season to season. The best guy/team three years ago can be the worst to call this year. The biggest struggle those guys have is finding and keeping good help; especially the roofing, siding, and concrete contractors, it seems.
Whenever I need a job done for roofing and the like I will ask other contractors, homebuilders, etc and who they would use for their own house. So many times they have strong opinions on the matter and, quite often, several separate contractors will recommend the same guy/team. That’s who I choose; even if I have to advise them how to get the low bid for insurance purposes (wink, wink), wait a little longer, and/or pay a little more.
But I live in a far less populated area, and usually, know and trust the people from whom I seek advice and these things can make all the difference. It used to be the only Hispanic roofers came through after hail storms and tornadoes. That has changed.
After the Mexicans left their beer bottles and trash where it fell when they stayed in the gHetto house, I had a crew of roofers, white ones, staying in my Hurricane gHetto house working the neighborhood. One of the crew even had his wife and 4 month old baby staying in the house. I lived mostly in my palatial dental office and shacked up in my then unfinished garage apartment. One Friday night at 2:00 am I was fast asleep in the apartment when the cops banged on my door. They has received a 911 call from the mother of the child. It seems the crew had been paid and en masse went to the strip club in town. They came home drunk and mostly broke. The woman went nutzo with cause. Push and shove and the baby gets its head mildly slammed into door jamb.
I put on some cloths and went with the cops to the house where the baby was just fine, no harm, no foul except drunken white boys being dumb. I was glad to see that crew go. I always wonder who holds a lower rung in construction, the framers or the roofers?
My standing seam metal roof withstood Ivan with no problems as did all my vinyl siding. Upstairs was untouched by a cat 4 and a 12 foot surge. The downstairs was totally gone, every wall, fixture and even the 2×6 tongue and groove flooring was gone. The appraiser asked if I had blow out walls when he came. I looked over and said “Evidently”.
My brother had done my siding, windows and roof 6 years previously, hence why I received no wind damage. EVERY OTHER HOUSE on the street had wind damage above the water line. And is why a neighbor contracted him to build a big house on my street in the wake of Ivan. My bro once pulled more permits in Tallahassee than everyone else combined. This was post 07-08 crunch. He uses mostly known white guys. His crew that did my metal roof were true backwood boys. They did not care to sleep under a roof inside. Rather they would go sleep out on the dock on hard pine decking – and polish off a case of beer while enjoying their beach vacation.
Since I “was doing my own roof repair” a simple permit was all I needed to get ‘er done. When the inspector came by I was up there on the roof. He said everyone should have standing seam roof in hurricane alley.
When I did 2000 square feet of concrete instead of rebuilding the lower floor of my house, I used the lowest bidder, a couple of black guys. I shoulda used the white guys. My bro uses a black guy for all his jobs in tally town and I wish I coulda hired him here. First class work and ethics all the way. He was a joy to fish with when he went fishing for yellowfin tuna 90 miles out.
I have a cousin who went into the Federal Witness Protection program. He was a plumber. He did work with a Jew banker and a black politician scamming while rehabbing and building apartment buildings – all sub code at rip off prices. It was an equal opportunity fraudulent scheme. He came out after someone went to jail.
My professional training and experience taught of some types of stereotypes that had practical applications. While I never did the surgery rotation at Grady Memorial Hospital in downtown Atlanta our professors warned about the density of bone in black males. 35 years of experience bores out the warning. Also Asians, mostly wives of service men for me, are not prone to cavities. The chewing surfaces of back teeth in Asians from the Far East were stereotypically worn down past the cavity prone crevices. And very little decay in-between the teeth. It has to do with diet I think. Lots of chewing of fibers foods, no sugar laden foods and very little protein (meat) in their diets. They did have a much higher incidence of gum problems. and bone loss. Supposedly from a low protein diet but that is only a guess.
Exceptions to the stereotype exist and do not invalidate the cliché.
One client of mine was a 90 year old gent from Great Britain with stereotypically bad teeth. I teased him when I said that for a Brit his disheveled dentition was not too bad. In reality there was an easy 20 grand of work I coulda sold to an American. I could tell he had once been a foreign agent type person. Very educated and articulate for an aged dinosaur of a man. As part of my joking I told him his mouth was kinda like the Austin Powers character in those ‘Hey Baby lets shag’ movies. It took a minute for him to get it. He said “you mean that cheeky guy in the movies?” He told me an ancestor with my last name was a British Royal Navy Destroyer commander in one of the WW’s. I told him George Washington descended from someone with my last name.
MI5/6 had great fun toying with me when I stopped off in London in ’76 with the beautiful blond on my arm. I was kidnapped by two burley cabbies and took me to two different pubs to quaff strong brew. After one I was shit faced but not in a shit hole city thank goodness. They took me to another pub and was forced to drink more, while on my back under some kind of military paraphernalia. They said lets go and I had to walk under raised and arched swords held aloft by men in fancy uniforms – for them to pour me back into the hackney carriage and return me to the hotel. They said it had to do with the Duke of Wellington or some such nonsense…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rW56cJiDJdc
“Exceptions to the stereotype exist and do not invalidate the cliché.”
Exceptions invalidate assuming the cliché. Besides clichés are preferred wheels of tritecycle riders.
I agree about stereotypes, on a larger scale. There’s a reason behind most, even though they get skewed to fulfill agendas.
When I was in Germany, at least then, they really were generally industrious efficient law-abiding trustworthy people. We could leave windows open with whatever on the car seat and not worry about theft. In most places. And Ayinger Special – sigh.
In Italy, southern at least, you had better leave the windows open because if not and the car was locked you had broken windows when you returned. Very emotional for good and bad.
In Spain, very laid back in the south, a strange combination of fiery and mellow. In the north the Basques were very friendly but very cool and distant until they heard you speak at least a few Basque words, then you were almost family.
The French were really nice, but so incredibly arrogantly convinced that they were superior that there wasn’t even a thought in their head about it, it just was. Justified with their pastries/candies, at least.
Greeks were seriously fun, very impulsive; food, food, food. And drink.
Russians were way too much like Americans to be comfortable, sometimes. They do like to party. They don’t always do it well.
Brits and Aussies really don’t mix well, especially in port. Really enjoyed each, just not together.
Egyptians were the model of helpfulness, to the point of servile, to your face, but tend to be untrustworthy behind your back, for whatever reason. Women were more difficult there than anywhere else.
And so on; Swedes, Brazilians, Phillipinos, Kenyans, Somalians, Canadians, Hispanics (southeast and southwest have a lot of differences.) I don’t feel like going any further with this.
As I said, these are general cultural experiences, and I had wildly varying experiences with individuals in each place.
And you only drink Dos Equis, too….cool….
Why thank you. I didn’t know I was so…riveting.
Lol, just been to a lot of places.
You’re a good egg TS, but my reply was to KS…Stay thirsty, my friend..
Hey, nutskit, TS is a member of the 100 club, 200 in fact. Lighten up, ok?
Blow me, El Guapo…I’m gonna start the 500 club muchacha..watch, Short Round… and I don’t wanna hear about de plane Herve
Nutsy, are you trying to imply your some towering inferno? What’s with the short-stack jokes? Are you insecure? Mamma didn’t love you like she did your black step-brother?
Easy there, your ECness. Thanks for the thought, but nkit was there. Even offered a pack of cigs.
Incidentally, I’m keeping a close eye on Uncs pending 300.
I think I might go kick-start it here in a bit.
Black Stereotype: One of my best friends in HS was black. It was an all boy NJ inner-city trade school and Jimmy was one of coolest in the school. A natural leader yet a bit of a loner, extremely intelligent, good looking, tall and lean, raw boned muscular. He had a a biting wit and a great sense of humor. He broached no disrespect from anyone, tremendous fast hands and a skilled street fighter that bullies, clicks and the ruling school mixed race gang of seniors left completely alone. He was admired and popular. He had a rep.
Jimmy had quit school for 18 months to work, no Father and he had to support his Mom for awhile, then he came back to learn a trade. I had started school early so when we graduated in 67 I was 17 and he was closing in on 20.
I never reached school wide popularity like he did but as someone who would never back down and a berserker street fighter who took on all comers, I was completely left alone by the middle of my junior year and even more so when Jimmy took me under his wing and we started hanging out.
He lived in the projects I lived in a modest middle class white Burb, a cut under Levitown. He would escort me into the projects (the cops only went in with multiple cars and serious back up) and I was one of the rare whites allowed in and not immediately set upon. I was under Jimmy’s announced protection. I was small, they called me Chicklet. Jimmy laughed at it but he always called me Mark.
We double dated a number of times in our senior year and our girls got along great! Both were knockouts.
We went to the prom together (it was three county trade schools: one all boys, one all girls and one mostly girls) and after sipping brandy and ginger ale in the parking lot with our dates I got the bright idea of switching dates when going in through the receiving line!
Now this was 1967 and it was a scandal and we each danced the first slow song still doing the switch. Some of the teachers faces in the receiving line look stunned when I introduced Jimmy’s girl and he mine as our dates. It was a great night and the four of us went to Staten Island together and partied until 3 am!
Here is the stereotype: We both got apprenticeships out of school and if anyone would succeed in our trade it would be Jimmy, he could do it all better then anyone in the class. We didn’t stay in touch but I heard he had disappeared into the bowels of the Big Rotten Apple. A year later I went in the Marines as planned since I was 13. I completely lost touch with Jimmy.
Jimmy 1980: I’m married, have a three year old, solid job in a pharmaceutical company in their in-house Security department, starter house in a good neighborhood and working part time as a Store Detective apprehending shoplifters in a grocery store in the black area of the same town we went to HS together.
Then I meet Jimmy in the store. I was taking down 6 to 10 shoplifters a week! He looked like shit. Thin, gaunt, just got out of prison – drugs. He never got drafted, got married, had a girl, then went down the drugs, arrest, drugs arrest, drugs, arrest drugs prison road. Lost the apprenticeship. As far as I knew he never even smoked a joint in HS, I never did. Now he was divorced, unemployed, back with his Mom in the projects. He was bitter, sour, looked broken and then finally asked me what was I doing there.
When I told him I was plainclothes security popping shoplifters…I saw it in his eyes. That’s why he was there…to shoplift.
He stepped back, spouted off some racial victim blather out of no where and left the store giving me a hard dirty look over his shoulder.
I never saw Jimmy again and worked part time there for four more years. He never came back in when I was there. I’m glad…I didn’t want to have to take him down.
A 16 degree day on a roofing job is much better than a 100 degree day! You can always work harder to get warm but once it’s Hell hot there’s not much you do but sweat and suffer. I’ve done my fair share of roofing and hope I don’t have to do anymore.
From a homeowners perspective cold weather is not conducive to asphalt shingle roofing because the shingles need to heat up to get stuck down properly. A windstorm before the weather warms up could result in losing lots of shingles but you did the right thing and hired a respected contractor so no worries.
If you know what you’re doing – SERIOUSLY know what you’re doing – you can use a weed-burner to warm the shingles up. I personally wouldn’t do it professionally, but we’ve done it many times in winter temps when it was really necessary.
A weed-burner? What’s that, somebody that smokes pot?
It’s not a bad thing to pay for a local gov permit for a roofing job. It means that the contractor knows it will be ‘inspected’ to meet code.
I’ve done many tear-offs and replacement of asphalt shingles on the farm. I have the highest respect for those who know the trade.
A good friend was in the roofing business for 15 years. I always remember two things he said: the new shingles will degrade quickly because of environmental laws regarding their manufacture, and that he had to pay $110 for worker’s-comp insurance for every $100 he paid his workers. That is why new roofs are so expensive. Thus the incentive to hire illegals to avoid such an insane expense.
To many illegals and to many shithole contractors willing to hire illegals . Companies like that are known as down and go artists ! I rank them right up there with Irish Travelers .
Choose contractors carefully there is a poor job waiting for someone .
As for hard productive workers , yes many bust ass and stay at it all day so with such a great work ethic why is the country they come from typically a shithole ?
Now THAT is a good question.
Because the USA has been fucking every country for so long that they’ve been reduced to shithole status? Do you even know any history you bloated bitch?
I wish I could refute that, but it’s true. Some African countries have been left mostly untrammeled. Gabon comes to mind. Apparently whitey didn’t think there was much to exploit there. It’s still a shithole despite having been left mostly unmolested. Haiti and some Latin American countries would probably be shitholes even without American fuckery, but that can’t be proven. Nevertheless, I personally wouldn’t have kids if I didn’t have a plan for how to feed them something other than mud cookies.
Because most of the shitholes come about from the assholes running them. Most of the peons bust their asses just to survive, so to get luxury money is paradise.
I worked on the docks for 27 years, along with being a contractor. A fair number of assholes there too. I’ve had my fill of asssholes so I don’t need to read a blog run by an asshole. How thick is your skin?
Fuck off. Asshole.
Or maybe shithole is the word of the day.
Assholes trying to collect money for their blog. That’s funny.
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Man, I fucking LOVE this place. Seriously!
Ow, the sun hurts my eyes when I stare at it. Fucking sun needs to dim. Fuck you, sun, I’m going to quit staring at you. LOL!
Geez, Tantrum Tommy (or Tina; we want to be correct here) its your eyes and your mind. If this is such a waste, you’re the one doing the wasting. Own yourself.
TiTty – hahahahahahaha! A union drone for 27 years comes around here and gets his ass kicked in 1/2 second, then complains about how someone funds the site! Oh TiTty, when someone like you, a union parasite that makes their money holding the public to ransom, complains about TBP, we know we are doing it right.
Get along home, TiTty TiTty, get along home, TiTty TiTty, we will bury you someday!
Who pissed off TwaT? This is why we can’t have nice visitors.
I thought it was my random pictures and annoying comments.
No, TwaT found out what it feels like to walk into a propeller. He stewed over it and finally got the nerve to tell off Admin.
30 years of supervision in meat industry taught me that most Mexicans have the qualities of a good employee. They come to work and work like hell.I might add that I appreciated the same qualities in white employees . Seldom saw a black that was worth a shit.
It was time to re-roof the house in Salt Lake City, and I went up and down the residential streets until I saw someone who was obviously competent. Found the foreman and got a business card, looked them up with the BBB, they were better than nearly all the rest.
They got the bid, showed up at my place just like the other one, a crew of Mexicans with an Anglo foreman (probably mostly for communication, the Mexes knew their stuff). It took them three days, but it was complicated: they took off FOUR layers of shingles ON TOP of the original cedar shakes! Put down sheathing / decking, new shingles, left it solid and looking good.
That was 2007, and it’s still there, looks just like it did originally. Haven’t lost a shingle yet, in ordinary weather. It will probably outlast me, at this rate, but it was supposed to be a 25-year roof when it went on, so it probably will anyway.
It wasn’t all that long ago that those were Poles or Germans, or even Irish or Italians before them. And Chinese before them. THIS is the way the U.S. has always worked. Immigrants do the hard work and want better for their kids. Their kids do well in school and go on to be successful white-collar professionals, sometimes in one generation, sometimes in two or three.
We are all human beings. We all want the same things.
Ann Coulter said all those immigrants cheated the black man who deserved special treatment because of slavery. She said as much, bitches, don’t try to cover that up with thumbs down. She’s a SJW now.