This list could grow to 1,000 ideas, but I’ve kept it down to ten. In the future, I might update it and add some more.
There are a lot of bad ideas that dominate the world we live in today, most of which are uncritically accepted as the norm and fully embraced by society.
As a millennial myself, I’ve noticed my peers seem to accept most of these as conventional wisdom. Hook, line, and sinker.
Here are some ideas I was propagandized with that I hope my children will never have to “unlearn.”
1. Violence is normal.
Presidential candidates today are fighting over who can kill better by using drones or boots on the ground. By constantly threatening the use of violence against other countries, statists have conditioned the population into thinking that killing tens of thousands of people is normal behavior, instead of the immoral, dangerous provocation it is. Rather than being charged with murder, politicians and others that help support this behavior are often paid $250,000 or more a speech after they leave office, and referred to as Mr. President or former Chairman of the Federal Reserve.
Video games, movies, television shows, and even toys all have a common theme: death and destruction. For example, there’s nothing like teaching your child about policing in 2015 America via these Playmobil toys:
This isn’t normal; this is psychotic. And the sociopaths that rule over us are murdering and imprisoning people every day because “we the people” are not only allowing it, but often times, cheering it on.
Outside of self-defense, respecting other peoples’ property should become the new norm.
2. Political parties govern differently.
As a former Republican, I used to hate the Democrats. Now I see these two parties as just two wings on the same beast.
It’s true that they run with different themes and talking points, but in the end, they govern the same. They share the top donors, vote yes on the same wars, and never roll back a single thing the other does once in power.
Bush picked Bernanke to run the Fed, and Obama re-nominated him. Republicans like Nixon ran on an anti-war platform during the Vietnam era, until Reagan/Bush took over in the 80’s. Then the Democrats were anti-war in the 2000s, until Obama took over in 2008. Clinton, Bush, Obama… looking back at the last 25 years, I don’t see how anything has changed in the U.S. with regard to foreign policy, spending, or lying about U.S. economic data.
The oligarchs have us all fooled. Political parties are nothing more than spectator sport for a dumbed down public.
3. Patriotism is a virtue.
Why? It was an accident that I was born here. Am I grateful to be living in the U.S., surrounded by family and friends? Yes. All the same, I owe the U.S. government nothing. I am a sovereign man, and shouldn’t have to subscribe to any group or nation just because I happened to be born in a part of the world called North America.
I love everyone in this world, and I am not going to express loyalty for a specific region like a sports fan who loves his team only because it’s in the same city he resides in.
Governments are dangerous, and the U.S. is the most dangerous one at the moment. My love for the U.S. is no more than my love for the Bahamas or Europe.
4. Illegal aliens are evil criminals who desire to collect welfare from taxpayers.
For a long time, I couldn’t stand these people. Nevertheless, if I wasn’t randomly born in Los Angeles and was instead born just 144 miles south, in Tijuana, I would be doing the exact same thing the illegal aliens are doing. I would be attempting to better my life and my children’s lives by migrating north. Humans moving to different regions is a natural event; the only unnatural thing is the imaginary lines we call borders.
As far as the welfare, that’s a symptom of the disease we call government. It’s like me taking a tax deduction. While I don’t support the income tax, I’m not stupid, and I’m going to do everything I can to game the system and benefit myself.
5. Taxes are justified at gunpoint.
Taxes with the threat of jail or violence is wrong. I’m sorry, but I don’t owe you or anybody else a portion of the fruits of my labor – especially not under the threat of violence.
6. War is good for the economy.
I was told at a very young age, and even in high school, that war helped the economy boom. When you think about it, it makes no sense. Using production lines to create products that blow up into nothing is a tremendous waste of resources. Looking back, after WWII the U.S. cut spending by 50% and reduced the military from 12 million to 1.5 million. The evidence from the late 40’s and 50’s is that the economy boomed when we had less war.
7. Terrorists hate our freedom and culture.
Are there extremists? Absolutely. But the fact is the U.S. has troops in so many countries (see: The Golden Age of Black Ops – In Fiscal 2015 U.S. Special Forces Have Already Deployed to 105 Nations), and has a horrible track record of toppling democratically elected governments, supporting sociopaths, and arming rebels who later become “terrorists.” It’s no wonder than these policies occasionally come home to roost.
For one second, imagine that a nation bombed your neighbor and killed your son. What would your reaction be? These are the situations thousands across the world face on a consistent basis.
What if Iran had troops in Mexico and Canada, ships off our coasts, and drones over our air space? Would we want a nuclear bomb for defense?
George Washington was a terrorist in the eyes of Great Britain. If you want to know who’s dishing out much of the tyranny and chaos in the Middle East, as an American, you don’t have to look far from home.
8. The U.S. has a free market economy.
This is seriously stupid, but college professors and politicians repeat this mantra every day. In reality, the economy is so centrally planned that if the Fed alters one sentence in their statement, the Dow Jones could rally or fall by 200 points in an hour.
Here’s another fact. Nearly 50% of America’s EBT program in Oklahoma went straight to the coffers of one company: Walmart.
Meanwhile, regulations in some industries have forced business to have an entire division dedicated just to compliance. Even worse, many of these regulations are pushed by the larger corporations in order to drown out the competition with bureaucracy they can’t possibly afford.
There is no free market in the U.S. – only crony capitalism, manipulation, and a centrally planned system manned by busybodies.
9. U.S. troops are dying for my freedom.
This is a tough one, because you want to naturally love and respect anyone who does something for you, especially if it’s to protect you from harm. The only reason I even bring this up is because many of the troops are honest, decent young men looking to serve their country or be a part of something greater than themselves. Nevertheless, these men and women are merely being used and abused in a Game of Thrones-esque battle for global wealth and power. They are often just collateral damage for large corporations looking to expand their businesses into territories and countries that, without U.S. military intervention, would likely be thrown out by the locals.
I genuinely think the troops are willing to die for my freedom, but the corrupt American Empire poses a much greater threat to my freedom than any outside enemy we are constantly taught to fear.
10. My vote matters.
Remember in 2006 when the Democrats were going to get our fiscal house in order? Or was that in 2010, when the Republicans were going to do the same? I don’t know, but your vote doesn’t matter. The populace is easily manipulated and/or asleep when it comes to matters of importance, so why bother.
The vote counters and the media have already decided who’s acceptable and, of course, at the end of those strings are the oligarchs who run the world. See my post from last year: Election 2014 – Why I Opt Out of Voting.
Edward Snowden sacrificed his freedom to alert voters of high crimes in the U.S government, and many Americans have no idea who he is. Meanwhile, most politicians want to try him for treason.
Llpoh, I googled heibloem. He’s still at it. Sort of an aussie tony robbins. Crazy fuck, used to travel the world collecting obscure plants from places no white man should ever tread. Could size up anyone in about 5 seconds. He used to come through florida once in a while, would take me out to eat so he could pick my brain about plants. The guy is a sponge
Star – will look into it.
Stuck – you read like Billy. The key word was “advance”. It takes superman to advance from poor to top one percent in a single bound. Usually requires generations of incremental progress.
Stuck – I do not understand the concept of owing previous generations, but I do owe the future ones.
The previous ones owed me. And others now alive. And fucked it up for the most part.
To tell the truth, I’ve always thought billy’s highly annoying petulant braggadocio was due to low self esteem – his behaviour is the greasy diarrea one gets after eating a lifetimes worth of abandonment burritos, and I don’t see him takin a self awareness kaopectate, and uh case uh ding dongs, sleepin til noon and his call of duty and meth addictions ain’t exactly a recipe fer success.
Metaphors is a vehicle fer the expression of abstract thought. I’d better apply ter Mensus.
Admin – thank you. It has been a tough few days.
The young man had a an aneurism burst three weeks ago. He went into a coma and never came out. He had several surgeries, but it never looked good.
His parents held on to hope, but went through hell, as did we, for the entire time. I told my wife to prepare for the worst. She thought I was probably being too pessimistic. Early on the docs said “he has considerable brain stem damage”, which as when I knew it was going to and poorly, and honestly it is probably best he did not wake up.
Very, very sad time.
Mensa? Really? I beat their qualifying mark by around 30 IQ points.
Yeah, if you say so.
And you want to quibble over lower vs solidly middle class? Really? And would there have been any difference in Mexico, when you were born? You would have been poor, either way.
You ran your fucking mouth, called me lower middle class, got proved wrong, and you call it “quibbling”. Then you double down on the stupid.
Whatever you say.
I stand by my comment that you are not intellectually gifted. Did not say you were stupid. But gifted? I do not see it.
Well, then I guess you – Mr. Sooper Genius – got chumped by a “lower-middle-class”, 90-IQ-having Kentucky redneck. Still are being chumped apparently, being as you’re still making judgement calls based on what I’ve allowed you to see.
How’s it feel?
Few rich kids enlist, especial as non-officer types.
I never said we were “rich”. I did, however, qualify to attend OCS. It was right across the street from Airborne School and I had the credits. I chose not to, intentionally. Hard for you to understand, but there it is.
I said he, in my humble opinion, lacked gifted intelligence, which I defined above, which I explained was a prereq for advancing from poverty to top 1%. I indicated he was not stupid.
And Billy takes this and says I fired a full spread at him.
You’re full of shit.
You: “Billy seems to be from a lower middle class background with slightly above average intelligence.” This was 29 May @ 9:48
I defend against that, prove you wrong, and then you post this: I stand by my comment that you are not intellectually gifted. This was 30 May
Then this: But I have not and do not see he has exhibited an advanced capacity for abstract thought.
So, we have:
1) slightly above average
2) not intellectually gifted
3) no “advanced capacity for abstract thought”
Well, which is it? Which standard is the right one?
And you have the nerve to say I lack in “reading comprehension” when you keep moving the damn goalposts. YOU don’t even know what multiple versions of bullshit you yourself have written, or don’t bother to read them, then turn around and tell me I lack reading comprehension.
Feh…. seems like someone who by their own admission had an IQ of 160, could at least stay on message and keep with one theme or one standard…
You have my sympathies for your recent loss, but that doesn’t mean I’m going to back off. You’re still making assumptions based on what you think you know, and that is completely dependent on what I have allowed you to see. Same as me making assumptions based on what you have posted – and not posted.
You have no idea what my IQ is because I’ve never been tested and I don’t even know what it is…
I never said I was a genius, but I’ll be damned if I’m going to sit here and allow you to tell me what I am or am not…
Takes a “superman” to advance from the ghetto to the 1%?
Uh uh… Like Soros? The Jew who got his start ratting out his people in the ghetto during WWII in exchange for his own skin and a couple bucks? Who then made shattering piles of money by destroying people’s lives and other underhanded, heinous things?
More monster than “superman”….
NB This is NOT “Godwin’s Law”… it goes directly to the argument – for who else could be the representative face of the 1% today? – and I am not comparing Llpoh to Soros.
Llpoh,
Let me ask you a couple things.
If I walked into your office with a bag full of parts and dumped them on your desk, could you tell just by looking at them what they made, if anything?
Could you tell if anything were missing? If there were extra parts that didn’t belong?
Could you see, in your minds eye, what the missing parts had to look like based on the surrounding parts? Moreover, knowing what it had to do, could you tell me what it needed to be made from?
Then could you blueprint the part based on what you know, walk over to the mill or the lathe and make the part from raw material and have it work?
I can. It’s why I was good at Mechanical Engineering. And maths. And metallurgy/materials. And heat treating. Tempering. More…
Here’s an anecdote: About 10 years ago or so, I was offered a job by Heckler & Koch. (Yes, that Heckler & Koch). For political reasons, the job fell through (H&K has many clients. Some are not friendly to the US. Some are outright hostile. It was deemed to be in the companies’ best interest to rescind the job offer in light of my history and where I would have been assigned to go. No hard feelings. I’d rather be here than kidnapped in the Middle East or the Philippines and held for ransom).
While I was talking with the guys from H&K, I passed over some sketches I had made for a brass deflector for their 90-series rifles, specifically the PSG-1. I allowed them to keep the sketches after the interview (conducted entirely in German, which is not my first language) broke up.
A couple years later, H&K came out with an issue brass deflector that looked a great deal like my sketches. I couldn’t prove they took my design, but it taught me a valuable lesson.
So… you go on thinking whatever it is about me you want. I don’t care anymore. Truly.
Enjoy life outside the United States.
bb, nice of you to apologize. No, I am not a faggot. When I was younger, women swooned over me for my blond hair and blue eyes. Now, not so much. I was going to call you an asshole, but that seems inappropriate since an asshole has a function. You seem to have no function at all, except to stir shit in a juvenile and illiterate way. I would say you’re more like a rectal itch, no, a painful rectal itch.
I have thus far ignored you. No longer. I shall address you as PRI from now on.
At about the :50 second mark…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbChPmxEP7k
AP: May 30,2015: Somewhere in Amerika: by Oompa Loompa–“Injun Massacre on The Burning Platform, Suspect is Fat Little German Kraut. More details soon.”
Soros, whatever else he may be, is no doubt a very smart motherfucker.
Re calling you lower middle class – I said “seems to be”. So I missed it by one segment. Yet you quibble.
So, you take offence at being labelled not gifted? But nowhere do you say what your IQ is. Gee, now there is a surprise. University of Cincy? Wow. Guess the community college was full up. All of those things – abstract thought, etc. are signs oh high intelligence.
You dispute my Mensa comments. Mensa is IQ of 130. Lowest I ever tested was 145, highest 160, generally 155ish. What about you, big boy?
You do not need to tell me what you are or are not. I already know.
You are a low to modest achiever from a middle class background with slightly above average intelligence who lacks the ability to actually project and visualize why people respond to their environments as they do, and who meets any perceived threat – generally imagined in your case – with extreme aggression.
My initial comment was because you are too fucking stupid to understand why a poor Mexican would make the decision to try to jump out of abject poverty and illiteracy by crossing the Rio. You cannot fathom that those poor Mexicans do not have access to the value system that you do, and without such access cannot make decisions the way you do. They may know right from wrong, but cannot even frame the question re hopping the fence – it is a matter of survival and taking care of their family.
You well understand the concept of taking care of your family. And despite your bullshit, we all know you would hop the fucking fence before seeing them starve.
Chumped by you? I just lack the time to bitch slap you properly.
But sure am pleased I am no longer your meal ticket.
Billy – I really do not wish to fight with you, but you tend to blow things out of proportion. And I am not alone in assuming things.
For instance, on several occasions you have “assumed” I got a big leg up because I am Indian and would have gotten preferential treatment. I explained why this was not so above. This was not the first time you said that about me – effectively you are saying I have not earned what I have. It does not get much more insulting than that, especially given your assumption is not true re me getting preferred treatment.
Additionally, Indians get little preferential treatment. Most of the rumored benefits are simply not true.
I have no doubt that you are a very capable person. Self-sufficient comes to mind when I think about you.
Re me – I am extremely capable in a lot of areas. You would be surprised at what I can figure out. I am able to diagnose/fix complex bits of equipment that I do not know the first thing about or have never seen before. I have created/conceived more little inventions than I can possibly remember – none with any market value, save for the efficiencies created. I have overseen design of large software development projects without writing a line of code, have created automated material handling design without knowing the tech, etc. i define the answers in such a way that programmers and techs then have the plan to follow. Because programmers and techs generally do not understand what computers and tech actually do, strange as that seems.
For instance, what does a computer do? Ask a programmer that, and you almost always get the incorrect answer. The answer is that computers manipulate data. I give programmers the data that needs to be manipulated, and how, and the outcome. Without that, programmers are oft like headless chickens.
My skill is in figuring things out. If there is an answer to a problem, I can find it. It is what I do, what I have always done. i am also an extraordinary planner.
I would have been a poor soldier – too much time thinking and not fast enough reacting.
I also can predict the effect of various actions quite accurately.
My major weakness is that I am generally blissfully unaware of how others perceive me. It is why I was never going to run a large megacorp, and so abandoned the attempt.
I apologize for getting so pissed off. The issues being discussed do jot warrant it.
Jeebus Fukin’ Krist …. a big swinging dick contest! Speaking of which …. that appears to be the only thing you two have left out … THE most important thing of ALL !!! ………. which one of you two has the BIGGEST DICK? Get out your rulers, or tweezers (if necessary) and get to measuring boys!
Really. We all want to know. Which one of you two is this young lady singing about?
Stuck- my dad had a saying, more or less as follows:
“When I was young, I had to piss under the fence rail to keep from peeing in my face. Now that I am older I have to hang it over the rail to keep from peeing on my feet.”
But to answer your question, I got more dragging than most have hanging. Its just I got to drag it around more than I used to.
Re calling you lower middle class – I said “seems to be”. So I missed it by one segment. Yet you quibble.
No, you made a judgement call that was wrong. I called you on it. You attempt to be dismissive – as if you being wrong was of no importance and my pointing out you are wrong is merely arguing minutiae – “quibbling”….
You don’t like being wrong, do you? And you don’t like being told you’re wrong by someone like me, who you probably view as “beneath” you…. It’s why you attempt to blow it off as being of no importance.
Well, you’re fucking WRONG and I’m calling you on it. Suck it.
You: “So, you take offence at being labelled not gifted? But nowhere do you say what your IQ is. Gee, now there is a surprise.”
Me, @ 7:37 : “You have no idea what my IQ is because I’ve never been tested and I don’t even know what it is… “
Your attempt at trying to make me look disingenuous or dishonest by holding back information that could possibly undermine my position has FAILED, Red Man…
In point of fact, I stated that I do not know what my IQ is, since I have never been tested.
YOU – Mr. “Reading Comprehension” – apparently chose to ignore that.
Once again – you’re WRONG. I’m starting to notice a pattern…
University of Cincy? Wow. Guess the community college was full up.
I chose UC because
1) They have a well-respected engineering program
2) It was close to home, the importance of which will become apparent momentarily
3) My father recommended it.
4) I didn’t get a scholarship and Daddy made too much money for a grant. So, I had to rely on student loans. Which meant if I lived at home and commuted, it would cost less.
Your snark aside, if you knew anything about engineering, you’d know that UC was ranked in the top 10 at the time. Hardly “community college”… Your remark comes from a position of ignorance.
Moving on.
You dispute my Mensa comments. Mensa is IQ of 130. Lowest I ever tested was 145, highest 160, generally 155ish. What about you, big boy?
Already addressed. Again, you’re just wrong.
And I didn’t “dispute” your Mensa comments. You’re putting words in my mouth, then attempting to get traction on you intentionally making things up. Reading comprehension indeed…
You are a low to modest achiever from a middle class background with slightly above average intelligence who lacks the ability to actually project and visualize why people respond to their environments as they do, and who meets any perceived threat – generally imagined in your case – with extreme aggression.
Heh… keep digging, Chief. You’ll dig your way out of that hole sooner or later…
My initial comment was because you are too fucking stupid to understand why a poor Mexican would make the decision to try to jump out of abject poverty and illiteracy by crossing the Rio
I know why you made your initial comment. You have a soft spot for Mexicans, and you viewed my comments as some sort of an attack against them, so you thought you’d ride to the rescue – but, not by defending them, you’d ride to the rescue by attempting to chop me down a few notches.
You’re predictable, Llpoh. Also predictable is that you attribute to some mythical moral superiority to the invaders because they were born in another country to abject poverty. I know why some of them invade our country – it just doesn’t change the fact that they are invaders, are defacto criminals by breaking into our country, and therefore deserve to be sent back.
Plus, you haven’t established that the vast majority of them are here solely because of economic hardship. In point of fact, it is well known that a great many of them are convicted criminals, pedophiles, political agitators, dissidents, etc, who are being jettisoned by the Mexican government itself so they do not have to deal with or pay for them.
Moving on.
And despite your bullshit, we all know you would hop the fucking fence before seeing them starve.
You now speak for the majority of TBPers? I guess you elected yourself Grande Poohbah Sooper-duper Genius Potentate King Shit of the Site… My bad for missing the elections.
You have no idea what I’d do. Or, the fact that I wouldn’t break into someone else’s country under cover of night is impossible for you to conceptualize. You yourself said you had no damn value system, no compass. I expect someone without a moral compass or a value system to be incapable of understanding how someone else could have something as basic as respect for another countries borders or not being a parasite.
Chumped by you? I just lack the time to bitch slap you properly.
Heh… you got fuckin’ PLAYED and you hate it. Worse, you got played by someone you think you’re above. And it burns your red ass, doesn’t it?
As far as bitch slapping me, well, here I am, bitch. I ain’t going anywhere. Anytime you feel like getting froggy, just come looking… I’ll be here.
But sure am pleased I am no longer your meal ticket.
Heh… I expect a low crack like this coming from someone with no moral compass and no value system.
Enjoy the ass of the world.
Billy’s way more likely to git uh job on Hector’s Cock than Heckler and Koch. Here’s what I don’t git. If yer so smart, why is yer backside a pimple rash of bedsores and candida rot from never gittin outta bed? Yer back hurts my ass. I’m gonna slip arsenic inter yer 44 oz mountain dew manana and put an end ter yer miserable low class average brain power waste of uh life.
Billy – I really do not wish to fight with you, but you tend to blow things out of proportion. And I am not alone in assuming things.
Not wanting to fight? Well, judging by our recent posts back and forth, that ship has fucking sailed…
And speaking for others again? Howsabout you speak for YOU and leave everyone else out of it for a change?
For instance, on several occasions you have “assumed” I got a big leg up because I am Indian and would have gotten preferential treatment.
I assumed only because I was left to fill in the blanks due to a lack of information on your part. Your claims about you “not knowing” about a CID card by the time you were a postgrad? Ehh… seems to me if you have as much mental horsepower as you claim, and had been around for awhile (a postgrad) it seems you would have sought out a CID card for yourself long before that point…
But then, I’m just spitballing… it could just as easily happened as you have said. And, since I am not going to call you a liar, I’ll let it stand.
I explained why this was not so above.
Yeah, after I had to draw my own conclusions based on what little info I had.
Sort of what you did. Only difference is, I’m willing to admit that – given the information you’ve provided (albeit a bit late) – I was wrong. You won’t admit you’re wrong. Or, you might just to spite me and keep me from winning that point… either way, you wouldn’t willingly admit you are wrong on your own. You have to be forced – trapped – into doing it.
Additionally, Indians get little preferential treatment. Most of the rumored benefits are simply not true.
Doubtful. My best friend growing up was – believe it or not – an Indian. Cherokee. His mother had a CID card. Which she played when some negro female tried to play the minority card.
“Well, she’s white and I’m black. I’m a minority so you have to hire me”.
“Oh, we’re playing the minority card? Here. I’m a smaller minority than you” (shows CID card)
Guess who got the job?
I apologize for getting so pissed off. The issues being discussed do jot warrant it.
Yeah, well, okay… fair enough.
We are pretty far afield from the OP… it’s what happens when two strong personalities clash. For what it’s worth, I wouldn’t have liked working for you, and you would have hated me as an employee.
I’m filing this post under “shit fests” …. this one should go in the Hall Of Fame …. no fuck you, fuck this, fuck that … very little swearing …. just a bunch of gut wrenching blows to the solar plexus
Although that might change since Billy said “red man” and “red ass”. Things could escalate, folks. “Fuck” may make a more forceful appearance.
But, Llpoh seems to indicate that he is winding down … with that “no time” comment. A weak excuse, if you ask me. While Billy is gearing up for a long battle … ” just come looking… I’ll be here” ………….. translated; “here kitty kitty, here kitty kitty”
I don’t know if I would have liked working for Llpoh or not. I am certain he would have liked to have had me as an employee because I would have made him money, as I have for all of my employers, even if he may have considered me a pain in the ass at times.
Stucky,
Yeah, okay…. Red Man and red ass were borderline….
Llpoh’s a big boy… can tie his own moccasins and everything, all by himself… Even pees standing up, I bet.
I’m sure he can handle it.
Billy, a more correct term is redskin, usually shortened to skin, but it’s kind of like nigger. Only skins are allowed to say it.
I typed a long fucking comment and it disappeared. Fuck me. But the high points are:
Billy is unable to understand that being born into poverty stricken family with little education makes it difficult to develop the type value systems he has, and leaving to help your family would not be seen as right vs wrong – it would be seen as necessary. It is impossible for such folks to even frame the question “is this right”. Even today, I make no bones about it – I can hardly think of a thing I would not do to keep my family from starving. And my frame of reference is vastly more developed than the poverty stricken Mexicans.
That yes many illegals are criminals, but that is a red herring. The vast majority are not, and many are actually highly skilled – welders, mechanics, electricians, etc. I agree that the US should control its borders.
I mocked him that he does not know his IQ. He would have a damn good idea. If nothing else he can take his SAT score and look it up.
I derided his suggestion Cincy was a top ten engineering school, given that they are currently #81. Why, that is one HEFTY fall from grace, sure ’nuff. And given that anyone can reel off a list of perpetual top tens, or close thereofs – MIT, Cal Tech, Georgia Tech, Harvey Mudd, Rensalear, Princeton, Harvard, Stanford, etc., I call bullshit on his top 10 claim.
Re his latest comments re me not having the CIB – before the internet, you actually had to go in and physically examine the microfiches or hard copies of the Dawes rolls. And had to find a way of getting birth records for great granny – who was born in a fucking covered wagon. That made finding her birth record a bit difficult, you see. And not knowing how the record showed the spelling of her name was a bit problematic. And me living a couple thousand miles from the fucking rez did not help either – but he suggests I could have come up with it by the time I was 24. Oh, yeah, that would have been a snap – from my job in Puerto Rico. For fuck sake. Had I had it, I would have gotten preferential selection for grad school, probably. Did not need it for undergrad as I got in everywhere I applied. Harvard included.
Re the preferential treatment, Indians get some medical bennies, and preferential treatment for some govt jobs, and there are a handful of Indian colleges that provide cut price tuition, but where grad rates are in single digit per cents. More a reflection on the mindset and values of Indians than the schools.
Re Stucky thinking that red man and red ass would bother me – not generally. Probably less than Billy being called an inbred hillbilly.
It is very difficult for folks to understand how hard it is for people to rise above poverty and illiteracy. It is damn hard, and can take generations for families to progress.
As one example, I was so socially inept at Dartmouth, and has ridiculed for it (which spoon/fork to use? Fuck me – was that really something people would know?) that on more than one occasion I pinned the ignorant ridiculer up by the collar and threatened to beat shit out of them. To my surprise, that was a unique and new experience for them! They had never been threatened before, much less had shit beat out of them. I could literally see the thought flash across their eyes – this guy is serious and is about to make me bleed. It was an awakening for them, and they always cleared a path for me thereafter. And eventually I more or less learned what fork to use, and what clothes to wear when.
But it took a severe awakening.
As mentioned, I could not care less generally re redskins, dirty injuns, etc. Context is the thing. Depends on the situation. In a heated argument, up close, certain things could get someone grabbed – but motherfucker or cocksucker is probably more inflammatory.
Grabbing was always step one. That is why boxers are not allowed to hold and hit. A trained fellow like Billy could probably defend that real easy. But hold them by the collar with the left hand and hit them with the right worked really, really well.
I am just tormenting Billy to take my mind off the stuff that is happening.
That is why I have been so nice!
Llpoh, I have worked with many engineers over my career, being one myself. I don’t know what schools the majority of them graduated from but the two smartest of them were from respectively MIT and Montana State. The Stanford graduate was a good project manager but less than creative. The few projects he assumed to himself were very mediocre, as he was fixated on cost and not value. His degree was in industrial engineering which is sort of a bullshit engineering degree anyway…on a par with general science.
I also don’t think a global ranking of engineering schools is very useful. Better to look at them by discipline. Billy has not mentioned his but maybe Cincy is fairly good at it. Mine was mechanical, but I have always been a process engineer, which is closer to chemical engineering.
Z – you may be right re Cincy. They may be number one in his field. But, my job was to contradict his claim. I was dead sure I could find some discredited ranking system that would do that. Turns out it was US News and World or somesuch.
I tolerate engineers. They are a necessary evil. Most have the imagination of a gnat, and no sense of urgency whatsoever. There are the odd good ones out there, but they are rare.
My pet peeve re engineers is when you ask “when am I going to get such and such done?”, the answer is universally “well, I am having trouble with x,y,z and the part has not arrived, the drawing needs to be updated, the electric needs upgrading, the circuit board is shot, etc etc etc.”. No mention anywhere of when. At which point I tend to get annoyed “ok, asshole, what part of when do you not understand?” In manufacturing, when is everything. Without knowing when, you are screwed. And most engineers cannot even spell the damn word.
Engineers annoy me. But quality control supervisors and managers I hate. I have fired every single one that ever had the misfortune of working for me. I refuse to employ them. My customers get very unhappy when they find out I do not employ quality control/assurance specialists. They cannot understand how it is possible to have industry best quality but zero quality personnel. It blows their tiny little minds, that have imbedded the idea that personnel and all the work they create for others and all their stats and charts and reports they produce, are not required for producing quality products.
If there has ever been a bigger waste of money than quality personnel, I have yet to find it.
Llpoh
IF you have a few minutes … doesn’t need to be a long post … can you explain HOW you got by without a QE on board? I’m off to bed … look forward to reading the answer tomorrow, if you choose to answer.
g’night mate
PS; At least you two fuckers haven’t sung kumbaya tonight., while holding hands. I hate that shit right after a shit-fest. At least wait a fuckin day or two
Llpoh says:
Z – you may be right re Cincy. They may be number one in his field. But, my job was to contradict his claim. I was dead sure I could find some discredited ranking system that would do that. Turns out it was US News and World or somesuch.
I tolerate engineers. They are a necessary evil. Most have the imagination of a gnat, and no sense of urgency whatsoever. There are the odd good ones out there, but they are rare.
My pet peeve re engineers is when you ask “when am I going to get such and such done?”, the answer is universally “well, I am having trouble with x,y,z and the part has not arrived, the drawing needs to be updated, the electric needs upgrading, the circuit board is shot, etc etc etc.”. No mention anywhere of when. At which point I tend to get annoyed “ok, asshole, what part of when do you not understand?” In manufacturing, when is everything. Without knowing when, you are screwed. And most engineers cannot even spell the damn word.
________________________________________
This just means that your business was very different from mine. Mine requires continual customer contact, pre and post contract. In my world, the salesman may open the door, but it is the engineering department that closes the deal, based on our reputation in the industry and our designs.
http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/GREIQ.aspx
http://tutorfox.com/oldsattonew.html
A year ago, I visited a very advanced mozzarella cheese plant in Idaho, to look at a couple of projects.
Upon returning to my office I received an RFQ from one of their engineers. One of the parts of it specified a heat exchanger that would regenerate heat from two fluids of different flows at the same temperature. I responded to him that there had to be a difference of temperature for any heat transfer to occur. He didn’t like my email and suggested the difference of flows would suffice to achieve his design. I politely said it was impossible. I guess I fucked up that sale. I wonder where he got his degree.
Llpoh says:
Engineers annoy me. But quality control supervisors and managers I hate. I have fired every single one that ever had the misfortune of working for me. I refuse to employ them. My customers get very unhappy when they find out I do not employ quality control/assurance specialists. They cannot understand how it is possible to have industry best quality but zero quality personnel. It blows their tiny little minds, that have imbedded the idea that personnel and all the work they create for others and all their stats and charts and reports they produce, are not required for producing quality products.
If there has ever been a bigger waste of money than quality personnel, I have yet to find it.
________________________________
Were you an ISO 9000 shop?
Stuck – Ok, here is how to get buy without quality managers.
First, it is important to understand why most companies have them. Big companies tend to have to set up their corps so as to avoid or minimize impact of idiots. Idiots are everywhere, and never underestimate how ingenious idiots are. So big companies put in systems that control everyfuckingthing. And guess what department overseas the development and promulgation of systems? The quality department. Of course, working to systems kills innovation and initiative. And the reliance on systems is a de facto admission that companies cannot control their business.
BTW – this is another major reason big companies outsource their work overseas, and to smaller companies: they cannot control their businesses, so give up and give the work to someone else to control.
To control quality without a quality department, the employees must be given responsibility for the quality of the product they produce, and enough autonomy and support to allow them to do that.
Layers of management must be kept to a minimum. For instance, when I have 150 employees in my factory, there are exactly 3 managers, and zero supervisors. And only 1 of the managers is really involved minute to minute with production.
We divide the workers into teams, and the teams have areas of responsibility. There are “team leaders” , but they do not supervise, and actually do production work 95% of the time. They communicate and assist those with lesser experience, and train new folks when they come along.
The skills/knowledge required is embedded within the team. We rotate team members so that we have people with embedded knowledge in more than one area, so cannot lose that knowledge. I suppose it is similar to the way culture and tradition is passed down through generations.
Our teams have the authority to talk to each other. As product flows along, if one team or operator finds a mistake, he or she goes back to the previous team and points it out – sometimes very bluntly. I do not mind. The team where the error occurred takes corrective action. If they need new tooling, machine repairs or alterations, and cannot handle it themselves, they find one of the three managers, who allocates/assigns resources to address the issue.
This process permeates the ENTIRE factory. Every single person is involved. Each person either signs their work, or puts an identifying marker on their work. If their work is faulty, it goes back to them. Every time. By signing their work, they take more pride in it. And know they cannot avoid responsibility if they make a mistake.
I insist all errors are highlighted – every one. As I have said, I do not believe in mistakes. I understand they are made, that people are human. But I do jot believe that mistakes should ever be made. I do not punish people for mistakes (unless it is a pattern or is due to gross negligence).
As a result, the culture of the business is one where mistakes are frowned upon by every employee. If I have an employee not doing the right thing – guess how I find out? The teams tell me. After trying to fix him/her on their own.
The other thing we do is that we do jot screw with our employees, nor allow anyone else to do so. Their work is not the best type, and is often dirty and repetitive. We retain people for a very long time because we do not allow them to be screwed with. And that is more valuable to them, often, than money.
We have some very high caliber employees. They occasionally get lured away for much more money, but generally come back because of the freedom and autonomy offered.
Another thing is that errors are addressed instantly – no middlemen. If a manager gets a call or report of a quality, they immediately go out on the factory floor and address it. No reports, stats, etc. are generated – it is simply immediately acted upon with the team involved.
So, that is how 1) you avoid the need for quality departments, 2) eliminate the need for managers and supervisors in large numbers, and 3) retain employees.
You need good managers, though, who act immediately, and know how to problem solve and manage people.
There are many other complexities, of course.
Big corps can do it too. Japan has long done similar things. But most cannot get past the issues generated by idiots, and good managers are very rare.
I have done this, more or less, everywhere I have ever been.
Z – yes ISO certified. Put it in place myself. One day a quarter we get a consultant in to update required paperwork.
It is a fallacy that ISO requires enormous paperwork. ISO is not a quality system, nor does it guarantee quality. It simply checks that you are doing what you say you are doing – ie it verifies the system you say you are running is being run. So the smaller you can make your systems, the less ISO checks. Document control is the biggest issue it causes – so we of course minimize documents.
We hear a lot of “that is it? That is all you got?” when auditors come. Have never failed an audit.
“However, I will say that the longer you are in (the armed forces), the more the brainwashing and conditioning wears off.”
—-Billy
Interesting conversation in this thread, especially between Billy and Llpoh about IQ. So let me say this about that. I entered the Air Force in 1962 at age 17. I reject Billy’s use of brainwashing, but I heartily endorse the word conditioning. It is there, in all services.
At age 27, as a captain, it was all over. I had separated the rat shit from the coffee beans and started to throw the bullshit flag. A lot. And I bet Billy did, too. Maybe even earlier in his career (officers are usually a little bit slower than NCOs, heh).
That takes an intellect, and guts, few here will understand. My outspoken views were noticed. Generals called in you in for a “private conversation,” while the long knives of the colonels whom you are criticizing are waiting for just one mistake from you. I never lost.
That may have nothing to do with IQ, but it may have everything to do with people you want at your back.
As usual for these types of threads, lots of good nuggets. Billy-the officers being purged are the ones loyal to the republic. That can’t see enough daylight, and could take a generation to repair. Llpoh, talking about not having social graces, or a roadmap to succeed. Living in paradise, and having businesses that catered to the high end, you encounter some interesting people.
We did some work for wayne heizinga, who founded waste management, and auto nation, and owned the dolphins. Probably the wealthiest person I’ve ever had contact with, but socially awkward doesn’t cover it. I wouldn’t call him a bad guy, but the amounts of money he would take you to the mat over were trivial. He just didn’t have another gear. From what I undersrand he found grace late in life, but I never saw it
SSS – I am guessing that you never made general?
Same reason I am not running GM. Could I have done it? Hell yes. Had the numeracy skills, the people management skills, the planning and foresight skills. But lacked the political skills.
I was wanted for my ability to run plants, to turn loss into profit. But the upper echelon jobs required political skills, and also social graces.
Just where the fuck was the redskinned son of a dustbowl Okie supposed to come up with those?
Before I struck out on my own, I was able to set my own rules re the jobs I took – I got full autonomy over the plants I ran, including all hire and fire with no check-off clearance from above.
The big boys hated that shit, but they loved the fact I saved their asses by turning the plants around. I simply quit even trying to play the politics/social graces game. I was either captain of the ship, or they could kiss my ass goodbye.
But no CEO job for me.
That winner take all attitude wayne took into every deal was strikingly different from any other highly successful person I’ve ever met. It also struck me as unusual how hands on he was, considering the size of the projects. Most are quite aware that timing and luck are big parts of any success, as llpoh has noted. I believe wayne was convinced that was his formula for success, so he stuck to it. An exhausting situation, but a learning one.
Star – I do not know the guy you are talking about, but my experience is either you fight or you do not – the amount involved does not matter.
When you stop fighting, even over five cents, it is time to quit the game.
The fight is not really about the money – it is because that is the attitude one needs.
In my experience from my background, that is. Rarely do I lose – but I often chose to let folks think they have won. Maybe Wayne did something similar – it is sometimes hard to tell.
Star – just looked Wayne up. He is Dutch. That explains a lot, if you have ever dealt with Dutch businessfolk.
He reminds me of you, llpoh, that’s why brought him up. I never minded fighting over a deal, but i hated refighting it. At that time, 5 grand could be make or break for me, lunch money for him. I do think he liked me for standing up for myself, I was young, it was hard. He was always fair in the end, but he made you work for it.
2 days in a row my identity has vanished
Deal is a deal. Gotta stand by it. The Dutch are funny, pedantic, volatile, tight-ass bastards, in my experience. Even tighter than Scots, which is saying something. A lot of Jewish business influence in the Dutch. But I never had a Jew try to back out of a deal or re-negotiate it. But tough nuts negotiating before hand.
As a rule, I not only honor the deal I make, I try to honor the deal the other guy thinks I made. My rep in business is based on being hard but honest and fair. I do not think I have ever been accused of dishonest business dealings of any sort. A deal is a deal.
Nothing dishonorable about wayne. And he paid promptly. But he kept you stressed. Funny about the dutch. Jews I’ve been around my whole life. I went to jewish kindergarden, my girlfriend in high school was jewish. She was murdered in thailand couple of years ago. They just finally caught the guy. Jewish biz is easy, tough on the front side, but straight up